|
Heh. Well, with the Teros I was hoping for something a little more than a namedrop, but I can see how that would be inappropriate without basically having to provide an entire secondary "build" for them, given the nature of PFRPG Derros.
The Egyptian mummy thing is just the simulationist realism nerd in me; I get that in movies like Abbott and Costello Versus The Mummy, the reasons why Egyptian mummies were created the way they were and the theological baggage associated with them are entirely irrelevant to "creepy super-strong guy in bandages menaces our protagonists", and really that's what Mummies in the old World's Most Popular Fantasy Role-Playing Game are all about. There's just an evil, niggling part of my brain that wonders why Osirion (to pick an example completely at random) with its ties to Sarenrae and Pharasma, and absolutely no (known to date) tradition of needing the physical body to continue on to the afterlife, would manufacture Egyptian-style mummies. And naturally occurring mummies would be, as you say, just Wights with a disease-power instead of level-drain.
And thank you for your response to the hag question. It clarifies some of the design goals regarding this book much better than the general goals for a series, or the cover blurb, ever could. Horrors Revisited is aiming to be something more strongly about themes and niches than Classic Monsters or Dungeon Denizens would be. Makes sense - expecting something like Classic Monsters and then seeing the Hags all put in one chapter might have been jarring. Knowing that the larger intent is that the various Hags are all just illustrative of the role of The Hag in an adventure-horror story, and Gargoyles are illustrations of The Lurker, and so on, puts a whole different spin on the proceedings.
I can't wait!
Oh...Aberzombie...you've probably set off the one of the wife's psychic alarms.
Cappa, isn't it funny that we give mummies disease ability, but our forbears ground them up into medicene? Yeah, I definitely want the theology and the technology behind mummification in Osirion (and on Golarion in general).
|
|
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
The Egyptian mummy thing is just the simulationist realism nerd in me; I get that in movies like Abbott and Costello Versus The Mummy, the reasons why Egyptian mummies were created the way they were and the theological baggage associated with them are entirely irrelevant to "creepy super-strong guy in bandages menaces our protagonists", and really that's what Mummies in the old World's Most Popular Fantasy Role-Playing Game are all about. There's just an evil, niggling part of my brain that wonders why Osirion (to pick an example completely at random) with its ties to Sarenrae and Pharasma, and absolutely no (known to date) tradition of needing the physical body to continue on to the afterlife, would manufacture Egyptian-style mummies. And naturally occurring mummies would be, as you say, just Wights with a disease-power instead of level-drain.
One option would be to connect it with prehistoric Greece. There were some cultures that appear to have regularly revisited tombs, placing bodies in different positions and different areas of shared tombs and eventually just keeping the skull.
A variant of that could see the body preserved so that it could be used for various cultural rites without the diminishing that occurs if the body decays.
plus...
If the corpse has been subject to speak with dead within the past week, the new spell fails. You can cast this spell on a corpse that has been deceased for any amount of time, but the body must be mostly intact to be able to respond. A damaged corpse may be able to give partial answers or partially correct answers, but it must at least have a mouth in order to speak at all.
As long as they don't animate you've got the wisdom of the ancients right there.
G.E., you've got an interesting idea there at its roots. Under the right conditions (hallowed or desecrated area) in a place where other effects (perhaps Gentle Repose) might have gotten mixed in over time, what effect might a regular, ongoing practice of casting Speak with Dead have on a corpse?
In the case of the Chinchorro mummies (South America), the process was universal and not just limited to the higher socal levels. There is some debate as to whether the bodies were mummified to make the corpses less frightening or to assist the soul in reaching the afterlife.
Regardless, the process could well be culturally driven as suggested by G.E.
The process could also be used to create a tomb guardian by mummifying a loyal soldier or pet.
|
|
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
There are those buddhist monks who mummified themselves as well (Sokushinbutsu is the name: thankyou, internet).
Mummies dedicated to Irori?
But I am generally more in favour, especially with the current state of Galorian religion, of a desire to preserve corpses so you can carry on doing stuff with/to them. That can go in many directions depending how kindly or depraved you want to be.
I can imagine a new Pharoah having to consult every single one of his ancestors before taking the throne and having to plan very carefully the single question that he was traditionally permitted to ask before the pyramid/tomb was resealed.
Hey, this is my first good idea in years. How do you cast Summon F. Wesley Schneider?
I probably need his true name - what does that F stand for?!
|
The Egyptian mummy thing is just the simulationist realism nerd in me; I get that in movies like Abbott and Costello Versus The Mummy, the reasons why Egyptian mummies were created the way they were and the theological baggage associated with them are entirely irrelevant to "creepy super-strong guy in bandages menaces our protagonists", and really that's what Mummies in the old World's Most Popular Fantasy Role-Playing Game are all about. There's just an evil, niggling part of my brain that wonders why Osirion (to pick an example completely at random) with its ties to Sarenrae and Pharasma, and absolutely no (known to date) tradition of needing the physical body to continue on to the afterlife, would manufacture Egyptian-style mummies. And naturally occurring mummies would be, as you say, just Wights with a disease-power instead of level-drain.
i respectful disagree
as a Ravenloft fan I need a reason for them to be... ok I know there are natural made ones, and cultures different from the Egyptians... still I expect the reasons behind it :)
But I am generally more in favour, especially with the current state of Galorian religion, of a desire to preserve corpses so you can carry on doing stuff with/to them. That can go in many directions depending how kindly or depraved you want to be.
I can imagine a new Pharoah having to consult every single one of his ancestors before taking the throne and having to plan very carefully the single question that he was traditionally permitted to ask before the pyramid/tomb was resealed.
interesting concept, i like it
Very cool though it is coming out a month late though. Really should be a Oct release.
I have to agree. October would have been very appropriate.
I do so hope it will be October. I'm already planning a spooky candle-lit, sound-tracked adventure for my nephews on Halloween, and would love to have this to enrich it.
I'm a bit worried since I'm not sure if/when I'll ever switch from 3.5e OGL to PFRPG, so I'm hoping the creatures are still extremely mechanically compatible.
Don't worry. While this uses PFRPG, you'll see that it's super compatible.
2) Will the Mummy chapter talk about how to use them in a world that doesn't have the very specific bodily resurrection concepts that led to "bandage" mummies in Egypt?
Well, expect some changes. As in, the world for this is loosely Golarion (though still applicable to any world). So as to the question of will this have mummies for non-"Egyptians?" Yes.
3) Will Kapoacinth have to share with the Gargoyles, or can I reasonably wait patiently for the possibility of an Aquatic Monsters revisited book?
Don't expect "Aquatic Monsters Revisited" to hit any bestsellers list any time soon. The kapoacinth are discussed, but the focus is on the race as a whole.
4) Are we really cramming all three (four, if we count Night Hags) Hags into one chapter? Poor old biddies.
Few designers like hags more than me, and yes, the three primary mortal races of hag are going to together get the same number of pages as the other creatures. Breaking them up either separates the information across multiple books or causes one monster to dominate a single book, neither of which is any good. So they get their racial overview same as any other beastie.
I have to agree. October would have been very appropriate.
Yeah, I think all of us would, but when we came up with this, we already had work on October projects underway. It ultimately just came down to realities of our schedule outweighing the sync-up of spooky stuff coming out in October. And we decided we didn't care that much because that kind of shtick preciousness for maybe about three weeks before everyone forgets about when the book came out.
There are those buddhist monks who mummified themselves as well (Sokushinbutsu is the name: thankyou, internet).
Expect this kind of thing to feel right at home. While Egyptian mummies remain the classic go-to for this creature, the mummy section is foremost a discussion of faith, not merely embalming practices.
Sigh...I wonder how many subscriptions I can get away with...
All of them. ^_~
Mairkurion {tm} wrote:
Sigh...I wonder how many subscriptions I can get away with...
All of them. ^_~
Try tellin' that to Mrs. Mairkurion...
Few designers like hags more than me, and yes, the three primary mortal races of hag are going to together get the same number of pages as the other creatures. Breaking them up either separates the information across multiple books or causes one monster to dominate a single book, neither of which is any good. So they get their racial overview same as any other beastie.
Thanks, Wes - I was afraid you'd lump in the Night Hags with the others, although they have entirely different roles in D&D history (IMO). Night Hags fit better with a 'planes' themed book, which is why I hope the esteemed Mr. Stewart will devote some space to them in 'The Great Beyond' :).
Thanks, Wes - I was afraid you'd lump in the Night Hags with the others, although they have entirely different roles in D&D history (IMO). Night Hags fit better with a 'planes' themed book, which is why I hope the esteemed Mr. Stewart will devote some space to them in 'The Great Beyond' :).
Nope! I totally agree. While there's likely some relation, they're very different creatures now. And yeah, they get hit on a bit in Great Beyond, no worries!
Thanks, Wes - I was afraid you'd lump in the Night Hags with the others, although they have entirely different roles in D&D history (IMO). Night Hags fit better with a 'planes' themed book, which is why I hope the esteemed Mr. Stewart will devote some space to them in 'The Great Beyond' :).Nope! I totally agree. While there's likely some relation, they're very different creatures now. And yeah, they get hit on a bit in Great Beyond, no worries!
They're there in The Great Beyond, and they've moved to a slightly different cosmological neighborhood versus the Planescape archetype, but one that I think actually fits them considerably better. I actually went into considerable detail on them and their patron goddess Alazhra the Dream Eater, but as a result of my mangling the concept of a word limit on a manuscript, a good chunk of that section was cut for space.
At least that's what I'll assume was the reason, as opposed to it sucking and the Paizo guys hating it. ;)
Of course it might reappear in something in the future I suppose. And yes, I would -really- like to do something with the Night Hags in the future if given the option to do so. Hint Hint Hint Wesley. Wink Wink.
They're there in The Great Beyond, and they've moved to a slightly different cosmological neighborhood versus the Planescape archetype, but one that I think actually fits them considerably better. I actually went into considerable detail on them and their patron goddess Alazhra the Dream Eater... (snip)
Great, I can't wait to see what you have come up with :)...
And yeah, they get hit on a bit in Great Beyond, no worries!
... although the concept of hitting on a Night Hag ... ugh ;).
And yes, I would -really- like to do something with the Night Hags in the future if given the option to do so. Hint Hint Hint Wesley. Wink Wink.
+1!
OT:
Mrs. M is an accountant...only a fool would attempt hiding anything financial from her! (And Mrs. M didn't marry no fool, just to cut short all foreseen retorts.)
|
And it's not like we can hide it from them. They just....know!Or Mrs. Asgetrion... *sigh*Try tellin' that to Mrs. Mairkurion...Mairkurion {tm} wrote:
Sigh...I wonder how many subscriptions I can get away with...
All of them. ^_~
Yeah... these days I order Paizo stuff to my FLGS, and try to "sneak" the books into our bookshelf. Doesn't work really well, because she seems to have memorized what I already have...
If I would try to get the subscriptions, she would flay me alive!
I loved what F. Wesley Schneider & Paizo did in Pathfinder #8. And if the Nosferatu in that issue was any "omen" of things to come, I'm gonna love this as well.
Dark Mistress is right though. Would've been nice to get the brain gears turning for an all night nail-biting Halloween session! Oh well, all the more planning for next year.
Ravenloft anyone?
Though seriously I'm a horror junkie & I love the classic stuff from the Silents to the Hammer films & I can't wait to see Paizo's take on some of the gothic horror tales.
Any chance that some folklore will be added/taken into account with any of the monsters? The Romanian Strigoi/vampire stuff for example?
|
|
Is this thing mostly written already? If not, may I suggest/request including some ghost classes, a la Ghostwalk. I thought that book had some great ideas and a lot of potential, but fell right at the end of 3.0 and then fell off the radar. But the ability to become a ghost and then get better at it was genius. I also appreciated that ghosts were NOT undead, just restless souls. Wraiths and allips, etc. might be bad, but ghosts just aren't ready to go on yet. Anyway, I look forward to this regardless.
Very cool though it is coming out a month late though. Really should be a Oct release.I have to agree. October would have been very appropriate.
Maybe we'll get lucky and they'll release the pdf on the 31st. This does have kinda a feel of "we where aiming for October but the printer couldn't schedule it."
Creative Director
|
Is this thing mostly written already? If not, may I suggest/request including some ghost classes, a la Ghostwalk. I thought that book had some great ideas and a lot of potential, but fell right at the end of 3.0 and then fell off the radar. But the ability to become a ghost and then get better at it was genius. I also appreciated that ghosts were NOT undead, just restless souls. Wraiths and allips, etc. might be bad, but ghosts just aren't ready to go on yet. Anyway, I look forward to this regardless.
The goal of this book is, like the other Monsters Revisited books, to present 10 classic monsters and revitalize them with new material and to look back at what makes them classic and reintroduce some old material from myth and legend. There'll be some crunch in there as well, but it'll be crunch to support the flavor; new feats or powers or whatever for the monsters to be used as monsters. Details on how to play these monsters as PCs isn't what the book's about.
That said, I agree: Ghostwalk is genius.
That said, I agree: Ghostwalk is genius.
Not to threadjack, perhaps these ideas could be explored in some future core rule book in 2010 or 2011?
They sounded intriquing.
Russian lore also had iron nail through the forehead instead of the stake through the heart thing. I used that once in a Ravenloft game. Surprise the heck out of my players when the Vampire pulled the stake out.Hmm, vampires...
Specific alergies (white ash stake vs generic wood stake)
Vampire detection (In Russian myth, a virgin boy riding a white horse could not walk over a vampire's grave for example)
Dhampires!
I thought that Russian vampires were supposed to be decapitated in a single blow?
And I like Polish vamps for sheer ghoulishness. Not only do they stay active from noon to midnight, they sleep in a coffin literally floating in blood!
And I like Polish vamps for sheer ghoulishness. Not only do they stay active from noon to midnight, they sleep in a coffin literally floating in blood!
Ah, that's how Carmilla does it in le Fanu's story. I had never heard of that before.
I'm hoping the "Vampire, Nosferatu" for Pathfinder RPG will have a Create Spawn ability. I found it odd that it lacked that when the template appeared in the adventure path.
*salivates*
Oh man.
Aww, Seoni vs Hot Female Vampires got changed. At least this cover is cool though.. but I'd have enjoyed looking at the old cover more. Ahem.
Hot female succubi. The art was reused from one of the modules.
I have to say, the new cover isn't doing it for me. I know vampires are big right now, and it's a nice vampire, but it doesn't seem very cover-worthy.
|
Director of Brand Strategy
|
I have to say, the new cover isn't doing it for me. I know vampires are big right now, and it's a nice vampire, but it doesn't seem very cover-worthy.
It's true, there's not a ton of action in the shot, nor any iconics, but it does evoke the classic vampire image. I could see this as the movie poster or book cover for a traditional adaptation of Dracula, for example.
|
Creative Director
|
I have to say, the new cover isn't doing it for me. I know vampires are big right now, and it's a nice vampire, but it doesn't seem very cover-worthy.
It does when you stop to think just HOW hot vampires are these days. Pathfinder loyalists and folks who post here know what's in the book and relatively unlikely to change their decision to buy based on what we do for the cover, but folks who see the cover on the shelf at a bookstore who like vampires (and there are a LOT of them out there) are likely to pick up the book and check it out even if they've never heard of Pathfinder. And presto: New customer, hopefully!