barry lyndon's page

Organized Play Member. 199 posts. No reviews. No lists. 1 wishlist. 1 Organized Play character.



2 people marked this as a favorite.

Titled: "Let's surprise the GM and screw over all his prep for this session"

Previously in the AP:

During the Stone Giant attack on Sandpoint, Titus Scarnetti's grandson was one of the townsfolk abducted during the retreat of the invaders. Titus posted a reward for returning the boy, plus bonuses for each giant head returned. The race to rescue him was on.

The party however had other ideas. Instead of tracking the giants, they took a completely different route to Jorgenfist, ignoring the rescue mission altogether. In downtime, I duplicated the party and played out a rescue that succeeded.

By the time the players returned from Jorgenfist they were notified that the grandson had been returned by other means. Titus refused to pay the players either the reward or the bonus for the heads and the heads sat in a sack in their lockup for a couple of weeks...

Last session:

Instead of attempting to find a way to Xin Shalast, they announced they were going to exact revenge on Titus. They retrieved the decomposing heads, went to The Rusty Dragon and got drunk and then headed to Scarnetti Manor in the dead of night. Casting invisibility upon themselves, the rogue managed to unlock the front door and they crept in, in a conga line of stumbling, invisible, but mostly blinded idiots, led by the one party member with darkvision.

By this point the players were giggling hysterically and I announced that every time they laughed in real life, they had to roll a stealth check to attempt not to make a noise in the game. This of course made it worse and they were stuffing their hands in their mouths to try and keep quiet. The gnome sorceror decided to play a prank by silently casting an image of a stone giant standing in the Scarnetti reception hall. The players were confused and shocked into silence whereby the sorceror's player himself convulsed with laughter, blowing his stealth check and the house awoke. Scarnettis and guards came to investigate, immediately attacking the stone giant illusion.

The players threw the heads out across the floor like horrific bowling balls appearing from nowhere to the guards' terror and then fled stumbling and laughing into the night.

They've rated it one of the best sessions they've played, which I guess is a damning indictment of my interpretation of the AP, but I guess I'll take what I can get.


6 people marked this as a favorite.

I have had a lot of fun making use of his secretary/assistant Valanni Krinst, who is the medieval equivalent of a bored P.A. He is constantly referring to his schedule in the manner of a teenager on their Iphone and when he summons the P.C.s to the mayor, or they seek him out to ask for an appointment, he is generally sarcastic. He is always the first point of contact, to show the players how important the mayor is/unimportant they are in a big city.

When my players completed the Clocktower they immediately began selling loot and returned to their inn (I think in the excitement of the battle with Xanesha they had forgotten they were actually on a mission from the mayor; to absolve them from an earlier debacle taking out Ironbriar, ending up with them in The Hells) so I had Valanni enter the inn, look around in mild disgust, and suggest they might want to give the Mayor an update as soon as possible.

The party felt like they had achieved something that would switch the power balance. They were, after all, heroes in Sandpoint, why not here? One of the party hand-waved him away, saying they would go the next day whereupon Valanni replied "Of course, of course..you must have been through quite an ordeal and be absolutely exhausted. Why not have a bath and carouse the night away in a local brothel? Or perhaps a little holiday? Maybe take the rest of the year off, start a family? After all, it is only the %$#*ing LORD MAYOR OF MAGNIMAR."

[As I hissed this through clenched teeth, rising in volume, they sat open mouthed a little stunned. Very satisfying]

Then he clicked his fingers and 6 guards came into the tavern to form a line leading to the door. "SHALL WE?".

They left immediately.


1 person marked this as a favorite.

I made the mayor a big deal. A lisping, fat, greedy man with a keen mind. I introduced the players to The Hells in Magnimar after the sawmill, and then the mayor gave them an ultimatum to do as he wished them to, as per the AP.

I introduced a little "cut scene" of 2 hell knights interrupting the meeting to demand the PCs AND Ironbriar put to death, after which the corpulent mayor rose up and told them where to go. The players got a very dramatic introduction to just how lazy, uninterested but powerful the mayor is in that bit.

Further on in the AP they are terrified and yet excited every time they have to meet the lisping, corrupt mayor. It is, after all, an election year. They have a very clear idea that while they think themselves powerful, the bureaucracy of Magnimar is currently far more scary.


2 people marked this as a favorite.
NobodysHome wrote:

Well, I'm not a rules guru by any stretch of the imagination, but I'm not finding any feats whatsoever that allow a non-ranger or druid to get an animal companion, with the arguable exception of "Leadership".

So since he can't pay for it, it's going to have to be played for fun. And fun it will be!

** spoiler omitted **

Feel like there's a joke about the "Mounted Fury" archetype there somewhere but I'm not going to make it :)


9 people marked this as a favorite.

Since it's halloween...

A few sessions ago the party was in Foxglove Manor. I was wrapping up the session which had been satisfyingly creepy. We play on Roll 20 and as I was close to calling it I saw something. Behind the Barbarian player's shoulder, in his cam, a creepy clown doll slowly rose up facing the camera and then slowly went back down.

I spluttered while drinking my bourbon, and said "What's THAT?". Everyone was laughing, including the barbarian and then he said "Ok, so catchya next week?". I said "Wait! What was that clown?! Everyone saw the clown, right?" And they all were laughing and confirming.

Barbarian player was smiling as if he was it was a shared joke but started looking confused. "What are you taking about?" "Dude", I said "There was a %$#^ing clown puppet thing behind you". He briefly turned around and looked back, and seemed to be getting slightly annoyed. "Whatever. You're just trying to freak me out because [wife] is away".

We all were laughing but still wanting to know what the deal was. "So [wife] is away in new York, are the kids in bed?", "They're not here. They're at their grandparents. I'm alone and you're trying to freak me out!".

"We're not! Look, a weird clown puppet was behind you just now! You're freaking US out!"

He sighed and rolled his eyes, turned in his chair and and began to stand up and...his camera feed went dead.

He didn't reply to text messages for 15 minutes after that. Finally a simple "LOL ;)"

I still have to get him back for that.


2 people marked this as a favorite.
Paulicus wrote:
One problem is that rolling can make for very strange weather patterns. In reality, weather can be slow to change, or at least relatively predictable, given the area.

My players are mostly from Melbourne. They would think it odd unless it WAS highly variable conditions :)


1 person marked this as a favorite.
Coffee Demon wrote:

Barry, it sounds like you GM the same way I do. Your OP completely makes sense. I like to make things interesting for my players above all else. How a GM and players decide to build a world together is totally for themselves to dictate. Kudos for making that happen with your group. By the sounds of it, you're the type of GM I'd love to play under.

My sense of Pathfinder (at least on these forums) is that the depth of rules (and maybe the more rigid PFS play) attracts a greater proportion of players who think there is a right or wrong way to roleplay. If everyone is having fun in your group, then you're doing it right. I'm amazed by the number of people who are telling you you're wrong, or even seem upset! This is also endemic to forum culture pretty much everywhere though.

Please continue to post here. I for one would love to hear your input more often.

Jay "Uses Goblins at All Levels And People Still Enjoy It" White

;)

Cheers Jay! I think I'm pretty lucky having a group that want to play it in a way that challenges me. If my campaign is a success it's pretty much credit to them for encouraging me to GM it this way, and I have to give a shout-out to NobodysHome for the write ups of their RotR campaign. I defy anyone to read it and not be influenced by that group's RP.

http://paizo.com/threads/rzs2ohja&page=1?NobodysHomes-RotRL-Campaign


1 person marked this as a favorite.

Thanks heaps for all for the advice. I think it's becoming clearer to me that that a combination of some of these suggestions and the rules themselves is going to work best for this group and hopefully will work with the mapping adaptions I'll try out.

Just to address the concerns:

This is the first time Wind Walk will have been cast by this player, maybe by any of them so I want it to be interesting. Future castings may well work better as less of a deal, but what is set up here should carry on as an associated memory/experience.
It's a mostly RP-orientated group, if they don't feel immersed they get listless and get distracted. Previously I've shoved them into the next encounter too quickly and it frustrates them.
I've no intention of actively penalising them for using it.
I'm not going to subject them to hours of tourist description blurb as a real-time commentary.
I'm not going to attack them with a flock of birds.
I fully intend to continue to go heavy on the RP as long as that's what the group enjoy. I want them to feel engaged right up until the end of the end of the final chapter. If they ever don't want that, I won't do it. It's as simple as that.


1 person marked this as a favorite.
Orfamay Quest wrote:
barry lyndon wrote:


Thank you for your advice but as previously stated our group is quite happy with the system. I can't really understand your point about character level having any relationship with experiencing of the world so I can't really answer that question.

Different characters have different capacities and therefore experience the game world differently. A fifty-foot stone wall is a nigh-impassible obstacle to a low-level character, but barely a nuisance for a moderate-level wizard or a high-level fighter with a pegasus mount.

This means that one of the key things a game master needs to do in order to make the game world interesting is to make sure the threats and challenges they face are thematically level-appropriate as well as level-appropriate in terms of CR.

For example, characters should be fighting different types of monsters at level 10 than you were at level 1; this gives the players the feeling of accomplishment. Even better, every so often, let them fight the same type of monsters, but utterly crush them so that the players can feel how much better they now are. ("Hey, remember when we nearly died from that ogre? Now we just walked into an ogre village and slaughtered everyone without even taking a hit.")

You really lose something if it turns out that, now that you're level 10, all of the ogres you face have ten character levels. That's a sign (in my mind) of an unimaginative GM. And a poor one, to boot.

Environmental hazards are the same. The environment hazards that will kill a first level character won't even slow down a fifth level character. The Reign of Winter adventure path handles that well. The first book stresses just how dangerous and deadly adventuring in the snow is, but by the third book, everyone is expected to be equipped with the appropriate gear and spells and it's not an issue any more. Invisible opponents are boss monsters at second level, but by 10th, it's just yet another SLA that some monsters have. The...

What you're presenting is an interpretation of the system that appears to lay bare the system mechanics. I don't run my campaigns like that. If I want a cadre of 12th level goblins then I have them. I can think of nothing worse than my players being so obviously aware that they are now meeting "level appropriate" bad guys, even if they are. And obviously Sandbox games are nothing like so restricted.

The adventure's plot, puzzles and mysteries, the exploration of the world and the characters arcs themselves, provide the motivation and the reward. The levelling and increase in power is not even secondary. If we wanted that we would all play Warcraft. Actually I do play it but much prefer playing PF.

It's just different styles I guess, and there's nothing wrong with that. But don't take offence when I say i don't want to run my game like that.


1 person marked this as a favorite.

Just to let you know ours is still going, the party is lvl 11 now and approaching the Storval stairs.

I had fleshed out a bunch of villages and towns with their main occupants that the might pass through tracking the giants but of course they simply Teleported from Sandpoint to Turtleback Ferry and then hired a row boat up the river. Mokmurian is probably going to still be in his pyjamas when they reach him.

Just mentioning as your campaign is still paying dividends for great ideas and foreshadowing how things may play out.

Cheers!


1 person marked this as a favorite.

I like to have an overview of Golarion and recently I've been focussing on gods. They're kinda important for many classes so I wanted to feel comfortable with what they actually were. The whole Starstone Test stuck out as a "thing" so I decided to work out what it meant in my world, the one I GM in.

I thought I'd stick it here to promote discussion or even help out anyone who wanted a backstory without putting the work in. It feels comfortable to me personally as, despite being an atheist, I like the idea of gods in Golarion.

Feel free to rip it apart or comment, nothing's locked in.

*********

Nature abhors a vacuum.

If there is an overarching god, one that created the entire universe, it is unknowable. But what is unquestionable is that there are incredibly powerful representatives of good and evil- and in between- that, while subservient to the immutable laws of the universe, are still unfathomably powerful to the denizens that inhabit the worlds. These facets of creation, these deities, though undying compared to mere mortals, are just as unknowing of the ultimate true nature of the universe. As such they war and strive and struggle to manipulate the worlds for their own ends, and they do this by utilising the flow of energy from the transitory but self-perpetuating and numerous mortal races. And so is the nature of worship. Those that share the alignment of these gods, as such they are known, strengthen them through their acts, be it by intent or accident.

The relationship of some of these power exchanges can be 2 way. Clerics and paladins for instance are directly empowered with a minuscule fraction of these beings' power. But regardless, the ebb and flow of the deities' struggles reflect the balance of the whole of existence, and the wars and power transfers of mortals reflect back to the gods.

Nature abhors a vacuum.

Good cannot exist without evil. Law and chaos each play their part. The wheel turns. The scales counterbalance.

And so, should there be an vacancy in the alignment of these forces it will be filled. It must be so. Some gods are literal forces of nature, only appearing in art or tales as having a design recognisable by mortals, for we cannot relate to that which we cannot conceive. Others have arrived in their own manner, from other dimensions, other planes, for their own reasons. Mortals tell tales of their kinships, alliances and oppositions, but they have no conception of how gods truly conduct their relationships. And yet there will always be found a mechanism to address any imbalance, should it arise.

On Golarion most recently the mechanism became the Starstone Test. A renowned gateway to godhood, the only requirements to enter: the desire to arise. Those that ascended are known, the manner in which they did, utterly unknown. But see: they each conveniently filled a role that balanced the alignments.

Iomedae only needed to prove she was worthy of the role, as did Norgorber and Cayden, with regard to their alignments. Anyone true to an alignment, that was missing in the balance, would have achieved the same result, drunken, lawful or otherwise. Once taken up, their mortal failings were discarded and their essence distilled to fill the role of that alignment. Norgober's infamous secrecy and Cayden's drunkenness are simply colour, embraced by their followers, their human failings long since discarded, for we need to reproduce the gods in knowable form to worship them.

The Starstone Test is not a test to be be passed to become a god, it is not a game. It is simply a gateway that those that can help achieve universal balance pass through. The universe is the ultimate arbiter.


10 people marked this as a favorite.

Players hit 10 last night just before heading to Hook Mountain. Everyone's excited to use their new toys/feats/hexes.

3 players Dimension Door behind the 2 ogres guarding the mouth of the cave complex and attack, failing to kill the ogres outright (we use the facing variant rules). One ogre turns and crits the rogue who then fails his fort save for massive damage and dies.

The party go silent in disbelief.

I attempt to trigger the soft, elven-like character death music I had prepared just for this momentous occasion in the Roll 20 jukebox. Unfortunately, it's right next to an electronic version of the Benny Hill theme tune and I wasn't paying full attention....

The players weren't impressed.


1 person marked this as a favorite.

Does the victim of a Retribution Hex get a save every attack or just when the hex is applied?

Retribution (Su): A witch can place a retribution hex on a creature within 60 feet, causing terrible wounds to open across the target's flesh whenever it deals damage to another creature in melee. Immediately after the hexed creature deals damage in melee, it takes half that damage (round down). This damage bypasses any resistances, immunities, or damage reduction the creature possesses. This effect lasts for a number of rounds equal to the witch's Intelligence modifier. A Will save negates this effect.


2 people marked this as a favorite.

Last night at Skull Crossing, the party had figured out they needed a life force to replace the pile of ash in one of the runic generators.

The Arcane Trickster pulls out an unused scroll of summoning (25g?) and summons.... a rabbit. One surprised rabbit appears briefly in mid-air before instantly imploding. There's a solitary clunk somewhere deep in the machinery and the pit demon faceslaps itself.


11 people marked this as a favorite.

Last game we played of AD&D many years ago. We'd kind of over-binged on it.

A terrible tavern in a cliched and lacklustre village in a tedious homemade campaign (mine). Bored player walks in, almost immediately shoves the barkeep down the cellar steps putting his dagger to his throat and screaming "WHERE'S THE F*&^ING MODULE?!"


1 person marked this as a favorite.
Ian Bell wrote:
You should watch the episode of the X-Files titled "Home" beforehand as it's pretty much the direct inspiration for the Graul house. Will help you get into character!

I found some clips of the episode and thanks to everyone's advice the session went really well. Mammy didn't get a chance to do much sadly, although I think her monologue will be remembered for its imagery.


2 people marked this as a favorite.

Some great advice, thanks people. And an interesting look into personal toilitery faciliteries


1 person marked this as a favorite.
NobodysHome wrote:
barry lyndon wrote:

Hmm sounds like a bit of a hard sell. I read your awesome account of the farm, did your players show any signs of being confused as to what was going on? Or did they treat it as a technical exercise in trap detection and avoidance?

I could just plough on and hope they don't ask questions. Either that or get rid of them and play up the horror of the Black Arrow bits that remain...

My players simply accepted that the Grauls were utterly sick and twisted people, and didn't question the traps at all. After Shiro got hit in the head by one, they proceeded VERY cautiously through the house.

I just asked Raesh's player, and she says she thought of them as stereotypical inbred hillbilly mooks, and the trapped house just fit her preconception of yokels "trappin' the house to keep the revenuers away".

She said it made perfect sense for the main entrance to be trapped, and for there to be an obviously well-used side path that the yokels used.

So the main entrance is trapped, and there are certain paths through the house that they never take because they trapped them in case of intruders. (Don't forget they're within a few miles of a fort full of rangers who would happily slaughter them all.)

Y
Make sure there exists a "safe" route through the house that the Grauls take. I'm pretty sure there is one.

So in short, the one player I can chat with at this hour of the morning said the house made perfect sense to her.

EDIT: Shiro just popped online. Let me see what he says...
OK, I don't have his permission to use his direct quotes, but I'm going to anyway...
"I will admit to thinking that traps in the house they lived in was stupid. It would have made more sense to have traps in the cornfield OR to not live in that house and to have it to keep prisoners / torture people. The traps didn't protect anything, they were just there to piss with the characters."
So Raesh's player found them "normal", Shiro's player found them stupid.

Yeah I'm with Shiro. Well I super appreciate you checking with your players and your input, thank you for that. I must admit I struggle myself if I have any ...erm... discombobulation or problems with suspension of disbelief. At the same time I am encouraged by Raesh's acceptance of it all. I know I am probably overthinking it but I work from a basis of the world making sense and yet want to present the AP in its classic form.

Ok. I think I'll just bank on my players drinking a lot of scotch. I think that's a safe bet:)

PS. Tell Raesh's player that he/she made me want to play a paladin again:)


7 people marked this as a favorite.

Ok, I've learned my players love playing "identify the film quote". I've been slowly building up the myth of Black Magga for a while now. They firmly believe that it exists and is something to be hugely feared. So the barge captain that took them to Turtleback Ferry had his moment when they overheard the locals talking about Black Magga (from the rumours suggestions in the AP)

He gets up and gives Quint's speech from Jaws.

[scene: The tavern, an argument breaks out]

Jed Trebeck

I know what happened to The Paradise. Black Magga took it!

Prelish Taint

Don't be ridiclus! Black Magga's in the Storval Deep. Do you think she popped down Skull River for a quick card game and lost all her money?!

Bristow Hellen

You're both ridiclus. I've been here since the ferries started. Black Magga is a myth. No one's seen it. Only children and fools say otherwise!

Hopely Quin [barge captain]

No she is not. No Myth, sir. I was on The Varision Queen when Black Magga slammed into our side. We was coming back from the Iron Peaks to the Storval Deep, just delivered some rum. Eleven men went into the water, vessel went down quick, sir! Then Black Magga rose up on us. About 50 foot long she is, know how you can tell? By looking from the head to the tail.
You know the thing about Black Magga...she's got Lifeless eyes...black eyes...like a doll's eyes; when she comes at ye she doesn't seem to be livin... until she bites ye and then those black eyes roll over white. And then....ah.....then you hear that terrible high pitch screamin' and the water turns red and 'spite of all the poundin' and the hollerin' she comes in and rips you to pieces. Eleven men went into the water that day, only 1 came out. Black Magga took the rest.

I love my job:)


2 people marked this as a favorite.

This goes back to earlier messages about feeling what the group wants. I'd rather they got through the AP and had a good time than imposed the way *I* feel they should play on them.


1 person marked this as a favorite.
captain yesterday wrote:

Barry, you rock!

Hello Memory Lane, it's been awhile

I literally just jumped on Ebay and picked up a collectors copy for $50au.

How did that happen?! Someone said something sometime and I'm 50 bucks down! I feel like I just got hit crossing the road.

But in a good way!


1 person marked this as a favorite.
Bellona wrote:
Wasn't there a flying invisible purple creature on one of those tables too?

Go to crit tables.


1 person marked this as a favorite.
Tangent101 wrote:

Small note: Skills cannot have Critical Successes or Failures. A roll of a 1 is not an automatic failure for Skill checks - for instance, if a rogue with +12 to Stealth rolls a 1, but the rolled Perception check of a monster totals under 13, then the rogue succeeded the Stealth check. And with a 20, all you do is add the skill to it. That's all.

I hadn't known this until it was pointed out to me. ^^;;

I appreciate that, it was just easier than writing "rolled a natural 20". My players are inexperienced and generally forget to use skills unless prompted so I wanted this to be an important moment for the witch and to increase her contribution to the group. A high skill roll let her "interact" with the illusion (her knowledge vs what she was seeing), which in turn allowed her to try and get a grip on reality.

As NobodysHome says, people react strongly when they see those 2 numbers come up and in Roll 20 it's even even bounded by a little green box just to make it more obvious. It's good to work with that excitement.

But anyhoo the amusement came from the hot mess Xanesha turned out to be. If the Benny Hill theme song was in Roll 20 I would have switched to that.


1 person marked this as a favorite.
captain yesterday wrote:

The middle earth role playing game had some awesome d100 critical fail tables for everything, spells and all!

Best part of those were the lil sarcastic quips at the end

I loved Merp! And you're right, those tables were hysterical!


1 person marked this as a favorite.

Spent a long time prepping Xanesha. A great map on Roll 20 with varying graphic levels and sound effects etc. Custom token. Strat all laid out. The Golem almost kills the tank and the Stalkers almost manage to throw them off before the stairs collapse. But they make it through.

I had decided to have the final battle on the roof, wind effects playing, and as they climbed up she was waiting for them. The Trickster's raven knew she was up there. She knew they were coming. She WANTED them to come. She would toy with them first and then end the pitiful threat.

As they climbed onto the roof an unfeasibly HUGE shadow demon arose laughing maniacally at them as Xanesha moved into position behind the barbarian.

The Witch crits Knowledge: Planes (she usually forgets) and I have to admit to her that it's a shadow demon but unrealistically large. I allow her a will save against the spell. She makes it. She knows it's an illusion and yells out. I allow her as she's first in the Initiative list.

So far I think: that's ok. They're not super savvy. This kind of levels the playing field for what's coming up.

Pause for a drink break while they discuss tactics.. Come back feeling pretty genial.

The Barbarian runs around deciding that the illusion is a distraction and there's an invisible creature.

Stupidly Xanesha makes an AOO as he passes, put it down to hubris/DM + whisky. She reveals herself. She's up next. She hits hard, then rolls 1 and another 1.

For some reason everyone's in a particularly jovial mood. "Why DON'T we use the critical decks?" Someone asks. "Hmm ok, but it goes both ways". "Fine" they say.

We roll the fumbles. She's now blind, prone and nauseated. The Sorceror fireballs the area for fun. He makes the SR. She makes her reflex save but takes a lot of heat. Literally. They then basically whack her to pieces and kick her off the tower.

I think I broke something internally laughing at it all but yeah, I think that will be our first and last look at the critical decks :)

Here's the The Shadow Clock


1 person marked this as a favorite.

So many good points made in this thread.

I am prep-crazy, I've made so many more maps then they will ever visit. I keep excel sheets of NPC activities on any given day. I read as many companions as I can get hold of. I make custom tokens for almost every boss.

And all of that is pretty much for my own enjoyment because my players simply don't care.

Running this campaign I thought I had to be as correct and precise as possible but the group aren't interested. They get excited by the fluff they add to their RP and combat actions. They are happy to be railroaded to the next big events. They love it when an NPC speaks in a crazy accent or the mayor lisps while trying to be arrogant. And they love smashing the bad guys to pieces as if they were cheese.

What I have slowly learned is what THIS group wants, which is different to what other groups have wanted. And within the group, what the individual players want. And so I've learned to tailor the style to them as individuals. So I will be strict with the rules as to what the NPCs can do in combat but for the players...meh..if they're struggling then maybe an imaginative/unfeasible tactic is just as good, and the look of triumph on their faces is worth more than all the preparation and rule-learning put together.

It's been a slow learning process for me, but I think I'm getting there.


1 person marked this as a favorite.

Ah soz, maybe this will work here

Will update some of the pics right now.


1 person marked this as a favorite.
the Lorax wrote:
barry lyndon wrote:
I found/am finding that the players don't get anywhere near to finding out the info from the chapter intros. There's so much back story that there is almost no way of them finding out.

I've found that the background is really more interesting and useful to the DM. The DM needs to KNOW that information so that when players do stray he has some guides. Running the campaign is about the actions of the players - they are not just characters in a novel along for the ride, destined to just play their part and follow a linear flow chart.

Running an AP does a MASSIVE amount of work for you. Feel free to let the PCs wander around, pick up snippets of information, and follow red herrings. Every encounter does not need to be challenging or part of the main plot. Heck most of Burnt Offerings is not part of the main plot of Rise - the whole point is to introduce the players to the town and to get them to have a connection to it.

Let the PCs follow red herrings.
Let them get entangled romantically.
Let them interact with helpful, competent, useful NPCs.
Let them explore Chopper's Isle.
And buy it - nothing says connection to town like owning a part of it!
Let them meet NPCs and like them, and then do awful things to the NPCs.
Or let the NPCs help them out of a jam.
Or let the NPCs chase down some of those red herrings.

With my group it's not that I'm reluctant to do the work, I have Choppers Isle, Paupers Graves, The Old Light, and many more, all mapped up ready to go should they want to. It's more that I already have to lead them as it is, subtly remind them to loot, search rooms, etc. I don't think they're played a campaign this detailed before.

The players are quite invested though. Ameiko's pregnant (the Barbarian father doesn't know it yet), The oracle's Haunted curse, actually led to her investigating an incident that occurred 40 years ago that resulted in solving a spiritual puzzle with the gravedigger's help, the Gnome wizard's cousin was found suffering from The Bleaching and almost mute, working as a scribe in Zantus's care and the Barbarian has plans to take down the Sczarni who have designs on expanding operations to the other Inns, the Rusty Dragon is next on their list. When a session is resolved and they're in Sandpoint I let them know they have some free days between sessions. Then they can work on their individual Sandpoint-related missions in private sessions or even over email.

It's like a season of Dynasty here.


1 person marked this as a favorite.

I found/am finding that the players don't get anywhere near to finding out the info from the chapter intros. There's so much back story that there is almost no way of them finding out and I'm already avoiding the red herrings just because each false clue could easily lead to a whole session that, if done properly, would take a lot of preparation to go nowhere.

When you're reading through it as a GM it's not easy to imagine how confusing it all is for players. There are many NPCs, some important, some not. For instance, making Jervis Stoot too interesting will have the players investigating that area which you then have to find resources for, even though he's almost inconsequential to the story. And finding out Nualia's back story is not likely.

I have begun keeping it as simple as possible and concentrating on making the important NPCs memorable.


5 people marked this as a favorite.

Shadow Clock

I wanted the Shadow Clock in Magnimar to have the impression of increasing height/danger and also be circular like the art in the book. So I made multiple levels of simulated height and employed them in Roll 20 as a table which I put on the background layer.

(The technique for using tables as background is the same for randomising tokens
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-bL8GklIh7U)

By right clicking and selecting the next level as the PCs progressed I avoided having to move them to another map.

(I made a couple of adjustments especially in the last 2 levels. I wanted the PC to fight on a treacherous roof which is why I left it mostly intact.)

Here's an animated gif to show the effect.

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/5306136/output_f9iscF.gif

The files are here:

https://www.dropbox.com/sh/4y1rs9hjiz8o2p5/AABvGhqew1mnbC7eKpfajyaNa?dl=0


5 people marked this as a favorite.

I actually was potentially facing a similar situation actually in chapter 2. They managed to subdue Ironbriar and wanted to call it a night. I didn't want to leave the session so weakly so I had them all arrested by guards, including 2 hellknights who didn't care at all that a Justice of Magnimar was involved (this impressed the players as to the autonomy of hellknights, useful later to make Grobaras more impressive). At the beginning of the next session I read/acted out the following to set the scene of the guy that was going to ask them to do something:

Spoiler:

The Hells in Magnimar comprises 9 levels of increasing wretchedness as it descends deep under the city, masquerading as a prison system. You've possibly just spent the worst night of your lives on level 3.

Underground, with little or no light, with the smell of faeces and vomit, lying on damp bunks barely filled with straw, listening to the sounds of torture lulling you into fitful periods of sleep. While being plagued by a relentless chill breeze that seemed to be purposefully directed at every corner of your cell, the one meal that was thrown in front of you was a mysterious substance that defied identification, wriggling with some kind of life until it suffocated in hardening pools of fat. And that was only one night of what might be a long stay punctuated by torture sessions, the result of being arrested apparently having slaughtered innocent sawmill workers.

In the early morning, one by one your cell doors are unlocked and you are released into the company of 4 menacing-looking guards accompanied by a dour, dispassionate man with a countenance that speaks of having seen all the atrocities that can be committed by something to something else.

You are escorted still bound and gagged up to the top floor where an effete clerk with a clipboard joins you. He is all business and regards you in the manner of a weary tour guide.

Valanni Krinst:

"My name is Valanni Krinst, you have already met my associate Khonderian. You are to meet the Lord Mayor. Come. And don't dally, he's incredibly busy".

New map: Mayors office- impressive

Lord Mayor Groboras:

"What is it now Valanni? What petty annoyance have you contrived to demand my attention this time? Aaah The Sawmill situation. Very well."

[he inspects the party]

"How are you all by the way? Did you have a lovely evening? I prefer to stay at home in my sumptuous mansion, But, each to their own!"

"Justice Ironbriar is not only a pre-eminent judge but also the leader of the respected Brothers of the Seven society who do quite a lot for charity. And yet, according to his report, while he was preparing the minutes of the last Seven's meeting you four broke in and massacred the workers at the mill. While he was attempting to protect these innocents, you overcame him and would have murdered him as well, had it not been for the timely intervention of the City Guard. That may have been the end of the matter had not some Hellknights decided to take it upon themselves to bring him in as well, leaving me with somewhat of an embarrassing situation to resolve. Apparently we can also place you at the the house of the missing nobleman Aldern Foxglove. Where instead of mr Foxglove were found two corpses of Faceless Stalkers."

"You must be asking yourselves "But Mayor Grobaras, should we not be having confessions extracted from us, forcibly, by the inestimable interrogation squad? Why are you taking an interest in such wretches as us?"

"Before I allow Khonderian here to remove various parts of your bodies to find out why, or simply let the Hellknights have a chat with you in their playful manner, I thought it expedient to simply ask, on the basis that you might tell me. I'm rather naive like that, always looking for the good in people."

[party chat]

2 hellknights come in, interrupting.

Hellknight:

"Justice is taking too long, All involved in the Sawmill Massacre must face the sword."

Grobaras:

"You have no jurisdiction here, Hellknight. You are in magnimar by her own generosity and my sufference. Your purview is the streets, not our judicial system. "

Hellknight:

"We'll be keeping a very close eye on Ironbriar. And these thugs. And you."

Grobaras:

"You have my sincere gratitude. Please pass on my regards to your demonic overlords next time you're visiting the family."

]Tension release device- this to show the control that the mayor has]

"How dramatic! So, the heroes of Sandpoint stand before me today. Oh yes, of course I know who you are. You've made quite the name for yourselves up north already. Quelling goblin uprisings and the like, now I understand you're investigating these killings for Sheriff Hemlock.

Now, the gods know, I have no love for Mayor Deverin. Her righteous, holier than thou attitude makes her difficult to deal with through the accepted political means: bribery ,etc. But I do having a begrudging respect for Hemlock. Despite being a Shoanti he is not an idiot.

And I've had my eye on Ironbriar for some time. Although what you tell me is almost inconceivable, it also has the ring truth about it and matches my worst suspicions that he is a worshipper of Norgorber. That might fly in Cheliax or Absalom but not here. Not in an election year."

OPTIONAL
"We have an anonymous journal from the Sawmill. Written in known languages but using a cipher than renders it incomprehensible. Ironbriar says he's never seen it before but we will decipher it eventually. Until that is complete Ironbriar will stay as my guest. Once we decode it we will have no need for outside intervention"

[offer]

"My deal for you then is this: you in your capacity as heroes can finish this macabre affair in your own manner and hopefully find some evidence to prove what you say is true and that Ironbriar is complicit. If you can then you will have the run of the city as heroes and I will sweeten the deal with a reward of let's say 2000 gp. I would be happy to pay that and Deverin will owe me as well for sparing you, as I'm sure you're very good for business in that s~&%hole of a town.
It goes without saying that should you try to leave the bounderies of this city, you won't get far. You will be caught, arrested, tried and executed as murderers. After an extended holiday in the lowest level of The Hells.

[if they ask for more help]

"I have no dog in this race. These aren't the first or even the only serial killings that have taken place in the city, although admittedly the most prevalent. I will not commit resources to chasing up every rumour or conjectured theory. You will be our canaries in the coalmine. Should you persevere and finish this sorry tale, then it will be profitable for you. If not, I can always send in a team using your demise as justification."

[finish with]

"Let us be under no illusion. This is an olive branch for you in respect of your capacities of being deputies of Hemlock. I hope to make use of him one day, and I will go to small lengths to achieve this, although my patience on the matter is not infinite. And who knows, maybe we will become friends"

"Sounds good? I hope so. I get very vexed if my second breakfast gets cold. Valaani, over to you."

Vaalani:

"Your possessions will be returned to you as you leave. You can keep those hideous masks, there were some left at the scene which will be kept as evidence and for investigation. We will also be talking to some of the dead through magical means to see what they have to say. How exciting!"

The mayor is pompous and can't say his Rs but when the hellknights come in the players know he is a serious dude. They responded really well to this character which helps guide them later.


10 people marked this as a favorite.

I set up Hemlock as a stone cold hero from the get go. As another set of goblins leapt at the mayor and other speakers he dispatched them and then grabbed the mayor to take her to safety, leaving the players to deal with the ones depicted.

He's a capable and intelligent Shoanti who fell in love with Sandpoint and sees her as his responsibility to keep safe. Having said that, he has enthusiastic, friendly, but very inexperienced men under his command, who he also cares about in his gruff way, but are totally unprepared for what is coming. While also dealing with the ever present Sczarni threat (trying to always take advantage) and the usual issues with travellers during and post festival.

The idea I wanted to sow is that he is a man to greatly respect but he and the mayor are under massive pressure as each new issue arises. He sees the PCs as kindred spirits and they should see him as a warrior trying to hold this funny little town together, until I had time to establish other relationships. So when he said he needed help it meant he REALLY needed help but was too proud to show it.

I kept Deverin out of the picture, until needed as a motivator. As kind and appreciative as she was after the goblin attack she works 24/7 keeping the town from falling apart financially and politically. When it got to the point that the players were asking Hemlock why they weren't getting paid she finally called them to an audience in her tiny office and made a plea to their humanity

I wrote it below in case anyone needs it or it helps with that side of things

Spoiler:

Deverin is facing the window with her hands behind her back.

"I've lived in Sandpoint all my life. My family was one of the 4 that established Sandpoint as a town 40 years ago. Amid some bloodshed it's true, not everyone played a straight hand. The Varisians who were here before us suffered greatly during what some called "negotiations" and the Varisian council was baying for blood."

Deverin turns to the group

"It hasn't been easy, this birth of a town. You won't know that we're still paying a generous proportion of our profits as compensation to the Varisian council that would have had us destroyed before we got started for a rash act on a stormy evening so long ago.

And yet today, Sandpointers continue to strive and create and supply. Even to help create a new cathedral to put aside the memory of the incidents 5 years ago. And to eagerly welcome visitors with delight, open hearts and joy that travellers such as yourselves would spend time here.

In light of what you have found at [Glassworks/Catacombes/Thistletop], and the terrifying threat that you revealed there, I could send a report to Magnimar. Perhaps this time they would see us as a younger sibling worth sending aid to.

But as appreciative as I would be should Magnimar look upon that request favourably I am loathe to give the insufferable Mayor Grobaras the impression that we are too weak to sustain ourselves. As such, I would like you to take the opportunity to do what you seem to do best and "investigate" the area thoroughly yourself first. Surely this is meat and mead to adventurers such as yourselves?

Regarding payment, and I am aware that my gratitude is all too little in this instance, Sandpoint has no more public spending available. It has barely enough to pay Gorvi and his boys for collecting the trash.
But know this: If Sandpoint lets you into her heart, then you will make a truer friend than you can imagine. And that will have to be payment enough. And of course anything you find at Thistletop. I can only begin to guess what treasures lie in those old goblin tunnels.

Ultimately you can view this either as an opportunity to further your material gains, or as an endeavour you feel unable to conclude. And that is a decision you must make yourself.

In the meantime I will prepare a begging letter to Grobaras, while you consider your position. There is nothing I am too proud to do for my town."

If they turn it down them you can shut the book, smile and say "And that concludes Rise of the Runelords. I hope you enjoyed it".


1 person marked this as a favorite.

Up to Chapter 2 now and favourite bit is still that

Spoiler:
although they didn't know what Elyrium was, they stuffed and mounted her and sold the "curiosity" to the Sandpoint Boutique.


1 person marked this as a favorite.

It's great to read your experiences and see how differently it can play out.

Can I get your feedback on Malfeshnekor as well, regarding my questions?


1 person marked this as a favorite.
Tacticslion wrote:

Oh, sure, but that's the thing - as a player, I'd tell whatever fiend was responsible "No."

It's unreasonable for them to require that. And, you know, if we're going to die, we can at least die doing the right thing. Heaven is it's own kind of reward. :)

Ah, I wouldn't expect the players to actually believe it was real, more like a nightmare* that you couldn't wake up from until certain conditions were fulfilled.

If the players needed more motivation they could simply be compelled to do it, as if under a spell or had dipped a toe into a

Spoiler:
Runewell of Wrath

I've got some players who would probably find the whole thing quite fun. OTOH I know some players that have a hard time refraining from that kind of behaviour while awake :)

* a fun nightmare!


3 people marked this as a favorite.

I'm keen to put in some kind of dream-affecting device (gas, magic, haunt, etc)

The PCs dream they have woken up in an arena/deserted house/same location they are currently in.

A demonic voice says "NONE LEAVE UNTIL ONLY ONE STANDS" and they must attack each other until only one is left alive before the effect naturally ends, otherwise they are trapped there for eternity (in compressed dreamtime).

All players who "die" in their sleep take 1d4 Wis damage and wake fatigued and can't sleep again for 24 hours. If they're woken up before they die they are fatigued and can't sleep again for 24 hours.The winner suffers no ill effects if they remain unwoken at teh conclusion.
No resources are used in the dream and no damage aside from the 1d4 ability damage is taken.

A lighter/riddle alternative is that the effect ends if, after the voice issues the opening speech, everyone but one character sits down


1 person marked this as a favorite.

WotC sorted that out here


1 person marked this as a favorite.

I could sense the frustration in my players during this encounter, it was even pretty frustrating for me. But I figured she was pretty crazy and superior since the PCs were not hurting her in the slightest, and this was to be her undoing. It had been a save-crazy session with very few spells doing any good for anyone and the Sinspawn barely getting to their feet before being dealt with. Plus one of the players guarding the door in case she wanted to make a break for it.

Barbarian decides to try and set the Runewell on fire by chucking a pint of oil in and and trying to light it with a torch. She was so incensed by his audacity she flew down to attack him whereby everyone piled up the stairs to flank her. While she was clawing and biting at the barbarian and everyone was still not hurting her (take ranks in Knowledge: Planes people!), they decide to coordinate in a mass aid on a grapple and he grabs her, gets her in to the pool and drowns her.

Not knowing what she was, they sold the corpse to the Sandpoint Boutique to be stuffed and displayed in the window.

And you know what? I think that's what she would have wanted.


2 people marked this as a favorite.

I'm keen to use the chapter advancement method, but from the Anniversary edition it says the PCs "reach level 4 by the conclusion of this chapter " at Thistletop followed by "The PCs should be very close to level 5 when they begin chapter 2"

Have I misinterpreted this? Or are they in for the longest, most random encounter-filled 2 hours of their lives on their journey back to Sandpoint in-between?


7 people marked this as a favorite.

Haha I like the idea of "eating" an aoo.

"As you know brigand underlings, there is always the possibility that a group of people will attempt to end our highway robbing shenanigans. Often this will group comprise a huge fighter, a guy with a bow- or maybe a sneaky dude with a knife trying to hide in full view of everyone who you can ignore- a religious healer and some devilish practitioner of the arcane arts. I cannot stress enough that if the latter is remotely experienced, they are the prime target. Steve, your job, should this motley crew arrive at our door, is to tackle that wizard.

Full disclosure: you'll probably get slashed by an axe and maybe whacked with a heavy mace, possibly stabbed a bit and knocked with a staff on the way through. And it might actually just turn out to be a follower or someone's curious dad. But best not to take chances "

"Er...I do what now?"

"Right! Any questions?"

"Um...yep! For one ..."

"No? Great. I'll be downstairs busying myself where I won't really be able to hear anything. Hail Hydra!"


2 people marked this as a favorite.
LazarX wrote:

You'll find that most people who like Pathfinder rapidly come to the conclusion that it's in their best interests to stay the hell away from these message boards, like my 5 star spouse.

So don't ever make the mistake of taking the vitrolic population of this venue as representative of the player base as a whole.

Nicely put. When you're starting out it's an easy trap to fall into.


3 people marked this as a favorite.

If players are expected to roleplayer dumb characters' IQs how are they expected to roleplay intelligent ones?

Hello Mr Wizard with 20 INT.

Wiz: I'm going to cast mage arm...
GM: Wait- You realise that's a bad idea and realise the best solution would be to do nothing this round.
Wiz: Great! I'll do that!

Fun times.

The only sense these restrictions and bonuses have are in direct relation to the pertinent skills and abilities, not the combination of intuition, experience, knowledge, inspiration and many other factors than might motivate a character to figure out a course of action. I'm pretty good at 2 and 3d image-based puzzles but I can't remember my bank account number half the time.

I wouldn't be keen to play in such a restrictive environment. Played to that degree, it seems logical that all the low int, melee guys would be dead within a few encounters and all the high int guys would go get a safe job in a Uni somewhere.