I can understand that it rubs some folks the wrong way, but this is the rules forum, not the gut feeling forum. Guess I'll flag it for faq.
I don't see how that quoted text is relevant, as Monstrous Graft is a different mechanism than all three restricted there. It is not adding a natural attack to a vestigial limb, nor is it modifying the limb. It is removing the vestigial limb entirely and replacing it with a new monstrous graft limb. The vestigial limb is gone, it does not exist. My core argument is unaddressed, which is simply that the vestigial limb is not present.
Ok, but all of those examples pertain to trying to add things to or otherwise employ a vestigial limb. Monstrous Graft replaces them entirely with different limbs, which that faq doesn't address. Thus it is not a matter of trying to get extra attacks with vestigial limbs so much as getting rid of them as fuel for more monstrous grafts, which by my reading results in sidestepping the extra attack restrictions entirely by removing any valid target for then. Seeing a lot of flat denial here, with a marked absence of explanation or argument.
Ok, so I've got a question about a couple of Alchemist discoveries that happen to add/replace arms. Specifically, I'm wondering if I could, as an Alchemist, take the vestigial arm discovery, then take the Monstrous Graft discovery to replace my vestigial arm with one from another humanoid. In the answer got his I'd like to know: 1. Can a vestigial arm (as an arm) be replaced by Monstrous Graft?
My reading thus far is a yes to both, as Monstrous Graft only requires that you swap out an arm without further restriction, and the rules governing vestigial arms would cease to be applicable as the vestigial arm is replaced by a different one with different governing rules. Am i missing something here, or is my four-armed, four-slam-attack alchemist build a go?
If you are looking for a cg piracy option, Sam bellamy might be a good real-life basis for a good or at least non-evil pirate
"Liberation Theology" is more about leftism than about actual liberty, so I would say the ideology of Rahadoum, rather than a deity, would fit best. As a theologian, I can assure you that you are vastly over-simplifying a broad category of systematic and public theology. OP, I think Milani could work well, but any deity with a strong anti-slaver or anti-oppression bent could work. Halfling gods might be a good choice in-setting if you are near Cheliaxian territory.
On the other hand, the SRD offers very weak transparency on what comes from where, usually due to setting copyright problems—a lot of GMs, myself included, like to know where a spell option comes from. Some, like the Summon Monster variant that allows you to summon tigers, are decidedly overpowered without the original context. Let the forum-dead lie in peace, you heartless monster!
So for as long as the rules subsection of the Pathfinder forums has existed, threads have perennially popped up with folks trying to combine vital strike, spring attack, and charging in some combination. Throughout the years, folks have told them "no, those don't stack", and everyone has left saddened and/or frustrated. So let's have another one of those, 'cause I think I may have finally found a RAW solution to this age-old problem, and while I'm sure there's some nuance im missing, it looks solid to me. EXHIBIT A: Divine Fighting Technique in the Weapon Masters Handbook entitled Gorum's Swordsmanship. Relevant text reads as follows:
EXHIBIT B, YOUR HONOR: A feat from the Advanced Race Guide entitled Martial Versatility. Reads as follows: Benefit: Choose one combat feat you know that applies to a specific weapon (e.g., Weapon Focus). You can use that feat with any weapon within the same weapon group. This feat will be used with Gorum's Sowrdsmanship, which applies to the greatsword as a weapon, opening the feat up to all heavy blades. EXHIBIT C IF IT PLEASE THE COURT: The Horselord Archetype of the Cavalier, relevant abilities read as follows, bolded for emphasis: At 6th level, a horselord gains the benefits of the Mobility feat so long as she is mounted. Additionally, the horselord deals double damage while using a one-handed slashing weapon from the back of a charging mount, as though using a lance. This replaces the bonus feat gained at 6th level. At 9th level, a horselord gains the benefits of the Spring Attack feat so long as she remains mounted. The horselord uses her mount's movement for this action and neither the horselord nor her mount provoke attacks of opportunity from the target. When making a single attack with a one-handed slashing weapon while using the Spring Attack feat, the horselord treats her mount as charging. This ability can be used to qualify for other feats that treat Spring Attack as a prerequisite; however, the cavalier can benefit from those feats only while mounted. So, we combine these three things (in a level 4 titan fighter/6 horselord cavalier worshiping gorum) with a mount and spirited charge and we get: A charging spring attack with a bastard sword applying vital strike damage, which is tripled from the horselord ability and spirited charge. Is this an actually functional combination of these three oddities, or am I missing something? I'm a little worried that the horselord text might be a bit weird re: spring attack, but i'm pretty confident about the other stuff enabling a vital strike triple-damage bastard sword charge.
So, as many of you may or may not know one of the features of the recent Occult Adventures book was the innocuous little gem that is the Eastern Star Cavalier order. On the surface, this order seems to make the cavlaier a little more defensively focused, giving significant AC and saves, as well as a smidge of DR, to the cavalier class provided that the character in question generally favor defensive fighting and/or combat expertise. After not seeing it used for much since, however, I've decided to do what I can to take this defensive cavalier chassis and dial it up to eleven. "But Sumutherguy," you ask, "what can you do with this? Don't you know that defensive-focused martials are rather silly and ineffective, and that monk-paladins are already the best at AC and save pumping?" "Aha", I reply, waggling my eyebrows knowingly, "watch and be surprised my skeptical friend, as I work arithmetic wonders"* *"arithmetic wonders" here being defined as "i looked up stuff in a book and plugged it into a calculator aren't I so brilliant" So here goes: Race: Halfling
LEVEL ONE!: MoMS Monk. Feats: Imp. Unarmed (duh), Crane Style (bonus feat), Toughness, Stunning Fist "Aha!" you think, "So it is just another monk build!" First of all, shut up, i needed quick access to crane style. Second of all, also shut up. Level 2: 1 Daring Champion Order of the Eastern Star Cavalier, some teamwork feat, challenge, etc. Level 3: monk 1/cavalier 2: cautious fighter, Order, Guarded Alright, so here's our first milestone. At level 3 with Guarded active we have saves of Fort 9, Ref 8, Will 5. A bit lacking in our will save, but strong overall. More importantly, entering into defensive fighting now gives us 2(base)+1(trait)+2(cautious fighter)+1(crane style)+1(acrobatics = 7 bonus AC when fighting defensively for a -2 to attack. Not bad for level 3, eh? With a chain shirt and buckler that brings our AC to 27, or 28 against challenged foes. BUT WAIT, THERE'S MORE Level 4: monk 1/cavalier 2/paladin 1: smite, aura, detect evil. +1 CON "OHHHHHH" You are screaming in your mind, "It's another monkadin, big deaaallll." Why must you always be so negative? Level 5: Monk 1/cavalier 2/paladin 2: DIVINE GRACE BABY. Also, Lay On Hands and Draconic Defender. Now, divine grace adds your CHA to your saves and Draconic Defender gives an ally (you count as your own) a natural armor bonus equal to your dodge bonus from defensive fighting. Which, right now is 7. So this brings our defenses to Fort 15, Ref 11, Will 11 and 34/35 AC. Pretty dang good, but we can GO HIGHER. Level 6: Monk 1/cavalier 3/paladin 2: Nimble! +1 AC! Level 7: Monk 2/cavalier 3/paladin 2: Crane Wing (bonus), Blundering Defense Now, crane wing is a bit of a controversial feat. It gives you an additional +4 dodge bonus when fighting defensively, but that bonus goes away if an attack misses by 4 or less. Normally, that would be a pretty big problem, but we ahve other feats that serve as a force multiplier here. So, with crane wing our dodge bonus to defensive fighting is now 11, with a -2 to attacks. Pretty hefty. This means that our Draconic Defender bonus is now also 11 while crane wing is up, and that on top of this we have the new Blundering Defense luck bonus to AC which is equal to half of our dodge bonus, so 6 if we include fortune's favored. The Crane Wing +4 therefore actually gives us a net +11 AC, more than a sufficient cushion to keep it up consistently. Our last level is Cavalier 4/Monk 2/Paladin 2, for deeds, 1 dex, and a +1 to our order bonus. With this our defenses while fighting defensively end up as follows: Saves: Fort 19 (3 attribute + 10 base + 3 grace + 1 halfling +2 guarded), Ref 13 (4 base + 3 attribute + 3 grace +1 halfling +2 guarded), Will 13 (7 base + 3 grace +1 halfling +2 guarded) AC: 10 + 4 (armor) +3 (dex) +1 (buckler) +1 (Size) + 11 (dodge) + 11 (NA) + 6 (luck) +1 (nimble) = 48 Those are some pretty ridiculous figures, and this is without any magic items! At Level 9 with lower-than average WBL and average HP rolls our Halfling multiclassed monstrosity could also have: Rod of Balance
For the following array: Level 8
Feats: Imp. Unarmed, Crane Style, Toughness, Stunning Fist, Cautious Fighter, Draconic Defender, Crane Wing, Blundering Defense Against the target of a challenge, saves and AC all go up by 2. Against a smite target, AC goes up by 4. Also, Evasion, for what that's worth. Attacks: Rapier +11/+6 for 1d4+8 damage. 1d4+12 in a challenge, +15/10 and 1d4+14 in both a challenge and smite. Not incredible, but not as horrible as some defensively-focused builds. The Cavalier combo of challenge and precise strike really save our bacon here. "But you never really solved the problem of a defensive martial being generally ignorable and ineffective. Anyone can stack Daring Champion damage bonuses." You beam into my brain with your mind-lasers. There's just no pleasing you, is there?
I can assure you that powergamers in this game are not overly concerned with check penalties and max dex bonuses on armor.
Is there anything in this book that will help me make an effective "martial scholar" type, who utilizes high int and knowledge checks?Isn´t the Investigator already this ? Only partially. The "knowledge to combat effectiveness" talent they get is very limited, and they utilize intelligence in a clearly magical way that goes beyond "martial scholar" into "magician-scholar" territory. I'm thinking something more like the Student of War PrC.
Oh, excellent! I've been wanting to make a smarty-pants spear fighter for awhile.
Alright, so I've recently been looking into the treat deadly wounds bit of the heal skill in combination with skill unlocks to see if there's any way to make this thing useful. Unfortunately, it seems that this action has a hard limit on the one-hour duration that it takes to apply such care. The skill unlocks, however, make the healing provided useful, if not ideal, come late levels, enabling healing for 240 hp each use by level 20 (natural rate of 2/level/day, three effective days, x2 for long term care effect). This healing still presents a problem, however: it can only be done after someone has been hurt, and the time required means that it must be away from any fighting where a character could just heal naturally anyway. Enter the preemptive surgeon. Have you ever been elbow-deep in some yahoo who got himself cut up, thinking "boy, tending to dying people is a hassle. I wish there was some way that I could fix them before they get themselves all messy." Well, dream no longer, because with occult powers there is a way! For this advanced and new technique of surgery we need the following:
This last one is the real cornerstone of this combination. The Psychic Healer feat, you see, allows you to make a Treat Deadly Wounds check, and add an additional number of temporary hit points to your Meatbag equal to the amount healed. This seems a little underwhelming at first, given that you still have to take an hour to do this, but these temporary hit points last for a further hour, plenty of time to find mortal danger! Know you are going into a fight soon? Lay your Meatbag onto a table and sew him up, before the injuries even happen! The temporary hit points gained will be as follows at each skill unlock tier, assuming that you beat the DC by at least 5: Levels 1-4: 1/level+WIS (4-9, assuming 16 Wisdom)
That's a pretty respectable chunk of temporary hit points for your lucky Meatbag! But wait, there's more! Let's say that your Meatbag is level 10. Said Meatbag buys an otherwise rather unassuming item called Comfort's Cloak. This cloak does many things, but we only care about one effect here: "When taking a full 24 hours of rest, the character regains 5 times his Hit Dice in hit points instead of twice his Hit Dice in hit points." This means that when your Meatbag "recovers hit points and ability damage as if it had rested for a full day" it is multiplied by this effect! This means that if your Meatbag gets a booboo, your level 10 heal check on said Meatbag will heal them for 10 times their hd, giving them 100 temporary hit points to run around with for the next hour. We can add Bandages of Rapid Recovery to this to make it 140 instead. Now, 140 temporary hit points for an hour sounds pretty powerful at level ten, but why stop there? Your Meatbag can purchase a Periapt of Wound Closure at the very next level and double that healing rate, bumping the total heal and the total temp. hp to 300! At level 20 this would cap out at a whopping 1200 temporary hp, no small benefit for two feats! Even at level 5 some simple Bandages of Rapid recovery will give them 18 temp hit points to soften up the first blows that they take, or 27 if they are a werebear-kin with the Reviving Rest trait. Treating others not enough? Be a tiefling with the Friendless trait! Want to do this multiple times a day? take the Battlefield Surgeon trait and pump your Meatbag up an additional time! Healing wounded companions is a practice for a more primitive time, be a modern medical practitioner and heal your patients for wounds they will receive in the future! Unlock the potential of Psychic Surgery™ and leave those silly divine healers in the dust! Remember, their cries of "abomination!", "monster!" and "unethical!" are just envy of your intellect and medical prowess. PS: I realize that some among those who may read this may say "wait a minute, you can only get as much temporary hp as was missing from your Meatbag in the first place!" To that I say that from my reading of RAW, excess healing may be lost but the healing still technically occurs (just normally without effect) and therefore permits the gain of temporary hit points beyond what missing hit points were regained in the healing process. PPS: even if that's not the case, just poke your Meatbag with a scalpel for awhile (I hear those Zon-Kuthon types are into that sort of thing), and give him/her/it extra temporary hp equal to their total hp-1. TLDR:
Ah got it. Sorry I misread that as has potential to be in the Hall of Shame. It's p. dang great for a rogue archetype if you mix in monkey shine and a level of mouser.
How about the Ectochymist? Trade out all of the Alchemist's bombs for a weapon blanch! Seem a little less than pwoerful? Don't worry, at level six it upgrades to a swift action that still only lasts for int modifier attacks, leaving it still strictly inferior to just getting a ghost touch weapon! Truly genius.
...what world do you live in where sneak attack is a powerful martial class feature, even doubled? There's nothing special that a sap master rogue can do (high dpr against 1 target in the first round that doesnt work against anything that notices him first or has uncanny dodge because it only works against flat-footed opponents) that a bomb alchemist, any magus, Rage-Cycling barbarian, cavalier, instant-enemy ranger, warpriest, inquisitor with bane, paladin with smite and/or litany of righteousness, zen archer, gunslinger, blaster caster, anyone with pummeling charge, wizard who decides to be relatively ineffective andThe whole sap master feat tree is so munchkin. if I was GM and a Rogue wanted to pull that munchkin routine I would throw in some powerful undead. Something like Mohrgs, paralysing a Rogue is pretty easy to pull off. And... 1. the highest dpr builds for sap master are alchemists, not rogues. That's not even scratching the highest dpr an alchemist can get (see: level 15 ratfolk grenadier dual-wielding double pistols with kirin strike, conductive weapon ability and alchemical weapon. Up to 14d4+36d6+48xint damage before any magical equipment mods). Heck, you can get MoMS monks swinging in the range of 40ishd8 base weapon damage all the time. 2. 764 damage is only ever achievable in a sap master build if every single attack hits, a very unlikely event for a rogue. Further, those dont really qualify as actual dpr builds as they only function anywhere close to reliably in a complete vacuum of ideal conditions. 3. All of these direct damage builds are still inherently weaker than any half-decent wizard who has access to 5+ level spells. single target damage is neat, but can never match bending reality for defining the terms and results of both combat and narrative. Said wizard can also cast three or four transmutation spells that he learned in his spare time and rival said builds for straight single target dpr if he wishes. he won't though, because direct damage is a weak form of power projection compared to the shenanigans he can pull. He has spells that literally say "you make the save or you are dead" and they aren't even the most powerful ones available. So no, 764 nonlethal damage in very specific conditions at level 20 is not game breaking, not when by that point wizards don't even have to care that their enemies have hit points. 764 damage is a lot of burst when it happens, yes. But it is comparable to lightly optimized dpr builds for most any class given that the accuracy that it would be hitting at is going to drop it down by at least half, and is pushed out of the running entirely by the sheer unreliability of the bonus damage. Even in ideal conditions, it cant keep up with the highest martial damage outputs, what with fighter (arguably the worst optimization potential among full BaB martial) builds that can do over 900 average damage with a much higher to-hit. The question then, is this: why is it cool and fine that 9th level spell-casters can rewrite reality and make or break nations daily, or hourly if they choose? Conversely, why is a 20th level rogue, who has based his entire concept and build on being able to kill one dude at a time who he catches unawares and hits perfectly dead to the point of completely neglecting all other important aspects of combat (mobility, defense), utterly unacceptable?
The whole sap master feat tree is so munchkin. if I was GM and a Rogue wanted to pull that munchkin routine I would throw in some powerful undead. Something like Mohrgs, paralysing a Rogue is pretty easy to pull off. And... what world do you live in where sneak attack is a powerful martial class feature, even doubled? There's nothing special that a sap master rogue can do (high dpr against 1 target in the first round that doesnt work against anything that notices him first or has uncanny dodge because it only works against flat-footed opponents) that a bomb alchemist, any magus, Rage-Cycling barbarian, cavalier, instant-enemy ranger, warpriest, inquisitor with bane, paladin with smite and/or litany of righteousness, zen archer, gunslinger, blaster caster, anyone with pummeling charge, wizard who decides to be relatively ineffective and turn into a dragon, druid in wild shape, slayer, investigator, or two-handed fighter cant do just as well/better with more consistency. The rogue is weakest in protracted engagements almost categorically, and you want to punish a player for trying to build so that he can occasionally end a fight before his weaknesses show? If I want to make a street-smart watch detective who fights dirty and takes people alive, and wants to in uncommon, specific situations be able to take a guy out without drawing attention or killing him, it is not your job as a DM to ruin me because you arbitrarily smell a "munchkin". If a player wants to grab the feat because it can net them a decent nova round once every few encounters and it doesn't clash with their character concept, then it is not your job to punish them for building to be good at combat, and even if it were the sap master rogue should be at the back of the line behind every single 9th and 6th level caster in the game. Power-gaming exists. Power-gamers do not play rogues unless they are very bad at power-gaming. also re:power attack, the reckless abandon/beast totem barbarian gets -0/+9 at level 9 from power attack on every single attack they make with a two-hander. That is a considerably better bonus than sap master due to its far superior applicability.
Well, i had been thinking about playing a duelist and/or free hand fighter recently as a defensive specialist. Guess its back to sword and board or two-hander only.
I am flabbergasted at the prevailing attitude in this thread that a utilitarian approach to ethics is by nature impossible to be good. The ethical debate between teleology and deontology is by no means finished, and to presume that a consequentialist approach to morality and ethics is by its nature incapable of being righteous or good is both arrogant and narrow-minded. OP, it could run the gamut, though it depends on how faithfully the character in question follows this approach. If he/she is willing to do whatever is best for the most in every situation regardless of the effect to themselves then I'd say likely NG, possibly LG. If his approach is clouded or corrupted by bias or imperfect application, or if he uses it simply as an excuse rather than a motive force, then the other alignments are all possible.
He is certainly altruistic in his approach; he gives himself no more value than anyone else, and is willing to do what he believes to benefit the world the most regardless of his own reputation, image, or well-being, nor that of any individual that he may have affection for. He does what he feels is best, denying himself the luxuries of acting on sympathy or emotion, and in doing so arguably sacrifices far more for the sake of his moral code than anyone who simply lets benevolent whimsy direct their actions. He didn't like laws because they applied constrictions that interfered with the greatest benefit to the most people and he was neutral because he was not motivated by good or evil, but instead by pragmatism. But he WAS motivated by good, that is the entire point, that he worked toward the good of the world. What is "good" and what is "nice" are not and have never been synonymous, just as "terrible" actions and "evil" actions are likewise not synonyms. Now such a character would likely commit evil acts he would also likely commit good acts. How exactly would be operating for the good of everyone be an evil act, unless we are speaking of such things as the arbitrary "always evil" labels on stuff like raising undead?
The knockout sniper: Goblin Sniper Rogue 10 20 Point Buy:
Feats:
Talents:
Relevant skills: 10 in stealth for a +42 standard bonus (10 ranks + 3 class skill + 4 goblin + 4 small + 5 cloak + 9 dex + 3 focus + 4 stealthy) Alternate favored class option: +1 to first sneak attack/level Equipment: Shortbow +2, Sniper Goggles, Dex gloves +4, blunted arrows, cloak of elvenkind Basically here we use our bludgeoner feat to give our arrows nonlethal damage, and use the sap tree to steroid that single attack. Sap Adept adds 2 to each sneak attack dice, sap mastery doubles the number of dice, and sniper goggles add a further 2 to each. A snipe attack at 30 ft. with this build will be at +20 to hit, doing 1d3+10d6+20(goggles)+20(adept)+10(favored)+2(enhc)+1+10(bleed) for a total of 1d3+10d6+53+10(bleed) nonlethal damage on a single arrow. This is a min of 64 and max of 116, plus 10 per round of lethal bleed. At level 10, this lets us 1-shot most mooks and some minibosses into unconsciousness, who then bleed out over the next few rounds. Our goblin then makes a stealth check at a +32 (-10 for sniping) to remain stealthed. If we want to go full-attack with rapid shot, it becomes +18/+18/+13 for 3d4+30d6+159+10bleed, a 189 min and 348 max if all hit, enough to toast any level-appropriate BBEG that can take nonlethal damage.
Do we want religion to be dumbed down to the point of "pray, get buffs"? I feel it would be more true to the setting to have rewards from gods based upon player actions that fit within their portfolio and are done in their names. Helping farmers with goblin raids near one's home in the name of Erastil, for example, may get rewards from the diety, either temporary or permanent. Otherwise, deities and religious devotion may be reduced to a chore that folks do before hard dungeons.
I feel that if one wishes to field NPC armies, they must be directly drawn from an NPC population, and that losses in manpower will not be easily recuperated. If warfare does not carry great risk of depopulation and ruin to a ruler, there will not be enough weight to one's decisions int he same and armies will be thrown away to quickly. This would additionally make population bases into valuable resources, to be fought over, traded, and rented out. (making possible such entities as mercenary companies) Additionally, players will be encouraged to guard these assets of soldiers, as a tool to be used rather than as a currency to be spent. These together would lend weight and realistic stability to warfare, making it a thing to carefully prepare for and keeps its nature as a massive wealth-destroyer. A nation which enacts war unsuccessfully numerous times should not have anywhere near the economic strength or population of its more peaceful neighbors afterward.
Alright, so I've been looking at the monk class for awhile, and have really wanted to play a monastic character lately. Unfortunately, the Pathfinder monk class only really works, mechanically, for the eastern shaolin variety of monk. With the advanced player's guide and ultimate combat, however, I think that I may have come up with a passable non-martial-art based monk build, who focuses his ability scores in mental stats rather than physical and is much more conducive to a pacifistic monk of a western tradition. My only question now is whether or not I will be useful to a party with said build, and with this I require your sage advice. I'm not aiming to have the greatest build in the world, just to be a character that will actually contribute to a party in a standard campaign. So, here goes: My DM is likely to go for a 20-point buy score system, and im not sure if he would let me start at middle age. If he does, my statline for a human monk should be 10 12 12 14 18 14 at level 1. If he does not, it will be 10 10 10 14 18 14. I will be taking the Ki Mystic, Sensei, and Monk of the Lotus archetypes. These three will sacrifice most of my offensive unarmed strike power, while giving me bardic performance, knowledge and skill check bonuses, the ability to let other party members reroll their actions, a larger ki pool, and a more pacifistic replacement for stunning fist as compensation. Additionally, I will take the vows of celibacy, cleanliness, fasting, and peace, as they fit with the intended western-style monastic character and further increase my ki pool. I would take poverty, but fear that such would be a headache for my DM, who would be less able to balance my character via loot drops. So, at level 4 i will be a monk with a +7 to hit and 1d8 unarmed damage, 12 ki, 16 AC, +1 Inspire Courage, +2 to knowledge checks, +4 to skill check ki power, 28 skill points, no flurry of blows, a no-damage stunning fist that prevents moving or attacking at a higher DC, and 4d8+4 HP. Decent enough as a support/skill-monkey to not be a liability? |
