RogueMortal's page

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While I wonder about the wisdom of including goblins as a core race, I do rather hope this trend continues so we can get further "monstrous" races as PCs, something Paizo had somewhat avoided in the past. Perhaps kobolds, gnolls, apallies, mimics, and a properly undead or frankensteiny construct option?


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Somehow I just end up expecting lots of shortstack goblin bards with a Con bonus, ranks in Profession: Courtesan, and InCase character art. They really seem an odd choice for a core race, plus step on both halfling and gnome toes by being sneaky tinkers. At least kobolds have tended to be reasonable in a couple APs, and would present some neat ideas in focusing on either draconic heritage (whether magical or mighty) or traps, which have always been a bad spot in terms of PCs wanting to set their own.


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It's nice to see the class getting some buffs to get it up to par, but I must agree with others showing concern over damage output and too limited a list of forms. Had a player try out the Shifter in one of my games and found that:

The claws bypassing lots of DR types fails to impress, since other martial classes tend to be picking up weapons to beat DR anyway, leaving the Shifter as 'the class without iteratives' and while it can pick up maybe a bite attack in wildshape/major aspect... it really doesn't keep up.

Aspects, Wildshape and Chimeric Form also fell rather flat compared to other classes with similar abilities. Perhaps a more flexible option would be better, with full Wildshape and blending Aspects and Chimeric Form into something more akin to eidolon evolutions or being able to apply extra traits from the Beast Shape line?


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Sounds like a fair cost. Little faster, but stops a few other tricks.


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Also true. Still, I'm tempted to give them a 'Sugar Rush' movement bonus at 1st that goes up at their other empty levels. Say a ten foot speed bonus for one round, costs a sparkle point, at 7, 13 and 19 they add 5 more feet?


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Heh, an interesting point. I suppose I took the class more to be "Fiends? In my dungeon?! KILLITKILLITKILLIT..."


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So, the Sparkle Princess class from Little Red Goblin Games'book, Gonzo 2, gets a pool of "sparkle points" at 1st level, similar to ki or grit or panache. The issue is that this is their only class feature at 1st level, and they get nothing to spend these points on until 2nd, meaning they have no functional class features at 1st.

They also have empty levels at 7, 13 and 19.

So is there an update I'm misding or something? Is the class supposed to have a class feature or two that got left out?


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Rysky wrote:
RogueMortal wrote:
Rysky wrote:
RogueMortal wrote:
Rysky wrote:
We were not promised a class that out shapechanged the Druid
Really, the greatest frustration I ever experienced in playing has been learning that a class I enjoy is not only outdone at their specialty by another class, but that the other class has a multitude of further features. Claiming that the Shifter as a class shouldn't even match what the druid has as a class feature is insulting to new players and quite a discouraging path for designers to take.

I made no such claim. I was pointing out that Paizo also made no such claim.

The Shifter doesn’t outdo the Druid, just like a Warpriest doesn’t outdo the Cleric. But give it some feats and Archetypes and we’ll see. Look at everything the Fighter’s gotten over the years. Look at everything all the classes has gotten over the years.

It appears you did say that, and as for the Fighter... what has the class gotten? A few options that slightly alter your fighting style, but nothing to really improve the class overall. Fighter hits things, often not even as well as other classes, and outside of hitting things it has.. what? I mean sure, if they were undeniably the absolute masters of combat I could see a case for not doing anything else, but again, Fighter is a decent combatant but hardly a show stopper.

“Claiming that the Shifter as a class shouldn't even match what the druid has” I did not say this. I said we weren’t promised such a class. And Paizo hadn’t promised such a class. I then followed it up with give it Time, and Feats and Archetypes, just like every other class.

As for Fighter look at the Advancing Training options.

True, you merely said that a class which is built around shapeshifting was never promised to be better at it than a class for which shapeshifting is one of many abilities, as if the lack of a promise somehow makes the shifter situation fair or sensible.

It has archetypes, each of them finding a different way to insult anyone who may have been interested.

Advanced Training Options. Now this thread isn't really about fighters, but okay at least they can at least trade out some features for others?

And once again, doing this in the name of making an easy to use class for new players seems disingenuous, because the biggest lesson to be learned will be that others can easily outdo them at what they thought was going to be their niche, and those others continue to have more and stronger options.


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Rysky wrote:
RogueMortal wrote:
Rysky wrote:
We were not promised a class that out shapechanged the Druid
Really, the greatest frustration I ever experienced in playing has been learning that a class I enjoy is not only outdone at their specialty by another class, but that the other class has a multitude of further features. Claiming that the Shifter as a class shouldn't even match what the druid has as a class feature is insulting to new players and quite a discouraging path for designers to take.

I made no such claim. I was pointing out that Paizo also made no such claim.

The Shifter doesn’t outdo the Druid, just like a Warpriest doesn’t outdo the Cleric. But give it some feats and Archetypes and we’ll see. Look at everything the Fighter’s gotten over the years. Look at everything all the classes has gotten over the years.

It appears you did say that, and as for the Fighter... what has the class gotten? A few options that slightly alter your fighting style, but nothing to really improve the class overall. Fighter hits things, often not even as well as other classes, and outside of hitting things it has.. what? I mean sure, if they were undeniably the absolute masters of combat I could see a case for not doing anything else, but again, Fighter is a decent combatant but hardly a show stopper.


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Rysky wrote:

From what I’ve read the Shifter is neither lazy nor uninspired nor unplayable. Paizo and the designers have failed no promises here. We were not promised a class that out shapechanged the Druid.

The absolutely only promise they gave was “full-BaB shapeshifter”, which they delivered. Making a class revolving around a complicated mechanic easy to pick up and run with is also not insulting, decrying ease of of access and playability in this instance as compared to other classes played by “veterans” with more system “mastery” is just malicious gatekpeeing.

Really, the greatest frustration I ever experienced in playing has been learning that a class I enjoy is not only outdone at their specialty by another class, but that the other class has a multitude of further features. Claiming that the Shifter as a class shouldn't even match what the druid has as a class feature is insulting to new players and quite a discouraging path for designers to take.


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KingOfAnything wrote:


Just don't give them direct orders, and you'd be fine. Phrase everything as a choice between two superficially different options. The same as dealing with young children.

A PC race that you have to treat like children just brings back kender shaped trauma.

David knott 242 wrote:

The problem is that the hive mind in question here is the main antagonist of the setting, the Swarm.

Allow me to rephrase then; will there be any bug race options that aren't shirren? Proud warrior bugs? Chitinous Vulcans? Elegant moth folk? Hard working, philosophical beetles? Interdependant but hardly hive-minded social insects? Anything at all?


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Thanks, will choose targets carefully then!


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Question about the Magical Girl and Tension. They gain tension if their Finishing Move reduces a foe to 0 HP, and can spend tension for more damage with their finishing move, but upon using the finishing move they lose all tension. Does this reduce them to 0 tension, or only to the value of a defeated foe?


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Marc Radle wrote:


Have you checked out the Shaman from Kobold Press? Full 9th-level spontaneous druid is exactly what the class is! Heck, "The Spontaneous Druid" are the very first words in the product's store text! :)

Oh, and regarding the name, this class came out *before* the Paizo class :)

If you want more bang for you buck, the Shaman is also one of the classes in the New Paths Compendium

Starbuck_II wrote:


The 3.5 Spirit Shaman is a 9th caster Druid spell list spontaneous class. In fact, each day it can repick its spells known (it is pretty cool). Thus, it can change which spells its uses spontaneously each day.

It uses pathfinder turning mechanics, interestly (for hurting sprits not healing). Spirits including
-- Incorporeal Undead
--Fey
--Elementals
--Creatures with the Spirit Subtype
--Rakshasas (included in the above)
--Nagas (also with Spirit subtype retroactively added)
-- Outsiders

But I would in Pathfinder grant more spells/day, because it has a lot rate (which is unusual for spontanous casters).

Thanks for the advice, though I'm well aware of the non-Paizo shaman options, I can't help but wish they'd make one themselves. After all, there are already prepped and spontaneous casters that use the Sorc/Wizard list and others for the Cleric list, but we have no full 9th level spontaneous casters with access to the Druid or Witch lists. It just feels incomplete.

And sorry for the slow reply, RL is a pain.


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New stuff I want to see

9th level casting spontaneous druid. Was really hoping the shaman would have been this, not sure what it would even be called with the name taken.

Alchemist archetype that trades away the mutagens for Evolution Points to represent grafted limbs and organs from monsters. Could be restricted to shackle-born tieflings? Might also swap the bombs for Sneak Attack, or not so it can stack with Vivisectionist.

Alchemist archetype that relies on mundane chemistry to build non-magical items. Maybe they can aim at a higher crafting DC to make stronger alchemist fires and acid vials, craft thermite or even chemical ammo packs to power non-magical energy weapons.


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Ok, it sounds like your player/DM is planning to abuse a common misunderstanding of the psionics rules.

Basically psionics run off a point system instead of spell slots. If you spend the minimum points to activate a power, it goes off at the minimum CL needed to manifest that power. But by dpending more points you can make powers do more damage, last longer or even raise the DC.

Some people miss or ignore the rule that you cannot spend more than your level though, leading to 80d6 psychic fire blasts at 10th level. DO NOT allow the player to do this. Psionics have more endurance than spells by operating in low gear and saving their power for big fights. Trying to keep up with a blaster caster for raw numbers drains them fast, and they can't actually outdo them for damage dice.


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Dragon78 wrote:


-A playable Frankenstein's monster-like race.
-A monstrous humanoid race that you can create with a list of monster traits such as horns, claws, webbed feet, wings, tail, etc.

I think that these two would combine pretty well as a race and archetype. Whether constructs or undead, the "Stitched" could have an Alchemist archetype that replaces the Mutagen with a pool of Evolution Points to add on limbs and eventually even organs that produce special attacks.


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Pricing on cursed items. If I'm buying a Helm of Opposite Alignment because I intend to shove it on someone's head, what's it gonna cost? And how much trouble am I in if the supplier turns out to be an undercover inquisitor?

Actually, that makes me wonder about laws regarding Enchantment in general, but not sure if that would fit with the Black Markets stuff.


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Damanta wrote:
The monster universal ability grab has the terrible issue of only being able to grapple something of it's size or smaller, so in case of a druid wildshaped into a large size bear the grab ability wouldn't function unless the succubus would use enlarge person or something before hand.

Grab would work just fine on the succubus, as a Medium creature falls into that "Grabber's size or smaller" compared to the Large bear. It would even work if the succubus could use Enlarge Person to get bigger because the fiend is still only the size of the bear.

Of course, Enlarge Person only works on Humanoids. Therefore, succubi aten't real people, rendering them immune to other spells like Charm/Dominate Person orReduce Person and creating some interesting questions as to their rights or lack of rights.


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Tacticslion wrote:
RogueMortal wrote:
an answer that won't screw a tetori any more than they already are.

I just... I can't... you... perfect... how has no one commented on this before me?!

I... I can't do it. It's... it's too... it's right there.

Right there? What's right there? I just can't seem to grasp your point. Perhaps a few more levels to get Incorporeal Grip so I can lay hands upon these ethereal concepts?


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All of the discussion in this thread just makes me glad my group agreed to swap over to Spheres of Power.

The whole summoner argument has always confused me. Synthesist was called OP when it was the weakest option via loss of action economy. Early access spells were broken because the class that had reasons to buff the summons more than a wizard "made no sense" and because some DMs didn't say No when calculating items. Then again I never had much issue there either. Heck, the spells that allow saves suck to get early because lower DC. And it made perfect sense for them to get summon SLAs up to 9th and Gate because that was their theme.


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So having done some actual wrestling in the past, and running exactly the kind of game this thread belongs in... I have to go with "succubus needs to control the grapple" here. Nothing that happens in a grapple is an "act of passion" unless one is a very frustrated individual, eager to find such acts anywhere that adult movies might try to cram them. I know that such comments are all in jest, but as a question of the rules, I just wanted to toss in an answer that won't screw a tetori any more than they already are.


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I gotta say, I'm disappointed with the Mesmerist. Was looking forward to a crowd controller, and while their gaze ability is neat, they feel far more focused on using those Tricks to set up situational buffs around the party. They don't even get Dominate Monster on the spell list, only as a capstone ability, usable on a single creature at a time, with a DC based on their expended spells and with a likely 5 point DC reduction, that the target gets immunity to if they make the save.