Iron Dragon

Lurion Coravoss's page

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First off I aplogise if there are typos in this post, I'm working off my phone. That said, I would actually love to see a hardback Absalom with;

1) A more detailed look at its government structure, including at least names for all of the high council seats. This isn't the decimverate people, what those roles are and who fills them should be common knowledge in arguably the most important city in the inner sea.

2) A map with a scale that fits. People who've lurked these forums long enough should remember at least one thread where James had to chime in on the disparity in scale between the latest map and the first given population density at the time.

3) A working setup for doing arena fights in the Iorium, give us something to at least mold to our liking if not outright use to go along with that tasty morsel from the inner sea combat faction.

4) I seem to recall somewhere long ago a mention about a perhaps mythic Gyr. I would love to see this happen with a full stat write-up.

5) Maybe an adventure playing with the political shadow war to slake the thirst of our cloak & dagger / rp happy groups.

6) For that matter why not do a line of stand alone modules each to show off a diffrent section of the city. You started this once long ago. Did those two modules not sell well?

7) speaking of hangman's noose could be a great way to start in on a kingdom building / downtime heavy campaign where the players must rebuild precipice quarter and become it's council.

8) Wet our tongues some more about the starstone. Outside of a mythic snipit that well has been so dry for such a long time it's bleeding dire dust mite army units by now.

9) Give us army units for Absalom for people who want to stage a new siege of Absalom.

10) Full actual city stats for that matter, latest one is missing a population breakdown btw. Also, given that more and more new city qualities keep piping up, might be nice to give Absalom a unique one of its own.

11) Bust out with your Occult Mysteries and give us one or two NPCs that DMs know for a fact are veiled masters.

12) Detailed floor plans for the Forae Logos, Azlanti Keep, Irorium, and Pathfinder Lodge.

13) For the mage school fans give us a write-up on the Arcanamirium. There are precious few fully fleshed out mage schools we can rip off out there. I would love to see it get its due.

14) more notes on local festivals, I feel like there would be a number of these within a city so large and so old.

15) more NPCs/places to flesh the districts out. I would expect to find an NPC of just about every class in Absalom.

I guess the big point is, Paizo has unleashed a whole lot of extra flavor / optional systems and classes over the years and Absalom seems the perfect place for them all to come to light. A new book embracing this would give tons of options for DMs/players and in no way would it prevent DMs from adding custom content. Even with a Ptolus sized book there would still be buildings left unfilled, entire streats even. This city is just too big to fill in all the cracks. So I say embrace the system and it's natural evolution and make Absalom a cornerstone piece showing off how all these things can come together and be part of a greater whole. No game should require all the extra rules and subsystems but every game should allow for them if the Dms/players wish to use them. Give us a city of passion, of political integue, of roaring stadiums, lost urban ruins, magical academies, adventuring guilds, clashing armies, and more, then let us choose which of those stories we want to tell/experience.


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Alexander Augunas wrote:
This is a good idea. I can make that happen.

Glad you liked it. ^_^ And its good to see weighing in as always there Chemlak. You throw some interesting ideas there. Never thought of perk chains but those could be neat, might be hard to pull off though. Racial perks might be cool too.

Teamwork feats with perks would actually be very nice. Unless a class has them as a bonus feat I've never known anyone to take them outside of me and my brother for cooperative spellcasting. They're nice, but few of them are worth two or more people sacrificing precious feat slots, or that at least seems how everyone I've talked to about them seems to view the whole of that particular sub-system. Allowing the party to get some of them or even enhance a few with perks might make them more appealing however.

As for the loners, I have no problem with them getting a few more perks, because they really are missing out when opting not to use followers/cohorts. I've sort of come to see the leadership deal as an extra subsystem just like downtime or kingdom building. The fact that you've made it so that it can mesh well with those systems makes it even more awesome. If I'm doing a game with downtime but no kingdom building I just tell players don't take any kingdom perks. Its that simple. But with that in mind, not every PC is going to want to invest in kingdom building, or downtime, or even followers/cohorts. So how do you keep them feeling not left out while everyone else is getting cool stuff? Loner perks. I would however add in a bit of warning to DMs that this is meant to please a niche, not the whole. If most are all but one of your PCs are taking the loner perks, they might want to just not use the system. Unless they want to give their players an arbitrary power boost that is, but there are plenty of other ways to do that; extra stat points, extra feats, bonus gold/items, gestalt, and more.

More mass combat would be cool too. I've been a but busier tonight than I initially thought, so I'll think about some specific ideas like my earlier suggestion tomorrow.


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Makes being attacked by an Inevitable yelling at you in complex equations very frightening to most... Suggest that the number 42 is the meaning to life and even the Axiomites have forgotten the original question. ;P


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Kalindlara wrote:

Planned Spontaneity, from the Pathfinder Society Primer, may be what you're looking for. ^_^

I seem to recall a few similar abilities - that's just the first that came to mind.

I could kiss you right now! Thank you very much, this was driving me nuts, been searching for it for awhile now.


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Kalindlara wrote:
Lurion Coravoss wrote:
Kalindlara wrote:
Hmmmmm...

Oh I know about that Kalindlara, I've also been playing since 2nd ed, and have a bookcase full of things including hundreds of dragon & dungeon magazines. "Tashanna" is one of my favorite old school big bads. I just don't think we'll ever get to see her directly in Pathfinder. Lilth knows who I'm talking about though ^_^.

Speaking of which I'm about to run a few players through a pathfinder updated savage tides using the mythic ruleset, should be fun.

I see. I don't think they can use ** spoiler omitted ** though. ^_^

Now you're getting it, and yeah you're probably right. I was sad to see her and the other great wizard names fall off their spells. To this day my brother still calls it Mordenkainen's Disjunction, etc. He refuses to rename them. But it was a price that had to be paid and nothing stops those of use who still love such characters from updating / restoring them, so I can / have lived with that. Besides Pathfinder has already produced a good number of strong NPCs that seem to be really popular. Hmmm that gives me an idea.

Hey James if you're still reading this, any chance we might ever get to let our players actually meet Count Varian Jeggare? I ask because meeting Eando Kline went over extremely well during the Serpent's Skull AP with my group. Three out of four of my players actually knew who he was, kinda made it a big deal, like the good old days of getting the artifact key for Maure Castle from Mordenkainen.


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Ross Byers wrote:
There's also the naughty succubus statue that turns up pretty frequently as loot in low-level adventures.

Which ties in just nicely with Ayavah in Magnimar


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Been a crazy weekend on my part, but glad to see this thread still going.

To answer a couple of things:

I'm a guy Silver Griffin. ^_^

Jason Nelson wrote:
What did you feel made that particular book so good?

On a number points I agree with Chemlak there Jason. But vagueness is no path to take here so let me crack open my copy and the Ultimate Campaign and compare.

1) First things first construction materials. Ignoring rarer materials like Mithral, with the stronghold builder's guidebook (SBG) I can make a Defensive Wall made out of Iron to protect the open parts of my theoretical dwarven mountain fortress. Ultimate Campaign (UC) gives no support for this. My defensive walls are wooden or at double cost stone. On top of that, SBG also covers wall augmentations very well with over two dozen options. UM we get a single option for a guard post to make it walkable, that's it. To continue with this line of thought, in SBG we also get rules and tables for a variety doors and windows.

2) Lets look at some rooms for a sec. UM I can get a book repository that gives a +3 to a single knowledge check, and that's it. I can buy some furnishings for it and make it look a little cooler but that money sink has no bonus to it. SBG I have a choice between three grades of libraries that come with varying book lot spaces, with a side bar on book lots and how to create scaling ones for better bonuses on specific or general topics. The higher the bonus, the more it costs and the more lots it takes up. Simple but effective, and a system I dearly wish you guys at Paizo would adopt. You have so many different setups when it comes to pricing your book collections that grant circumstance bonuses to knowledge skills. It honestly makes me wana rip my shirt off and go Tarzan in the trees outside. Which sucks, because in a fantasy game with Wizards, Sages, and more you'd think book collections would actually make good nonmagical player loot and great additions to player strongholds. Heck books come up so much in this game there is a reoccurring thread that shows up in the Houserules/homebrew where people have posted hundreds of unique/interesting books they've created. But now I'm getting off topic. Its this kind of extra info and rulesets that turn SBG from a decent product into a great one. And considering Paizo did a Dragon Magazine with extra rooms and a huge example castle I'm inclined to think that some of you, at least at the time, agreed. I'd like to see this kind of scaling available for other rooms as well if possible. Better tiers of forges, alchemy labs, etc. Oh and more room types Is always awesome. I can come up with a list of some I'd like to see if you want.

3) Mobile strongholds (sequels in delight) I can list a number of times in pathfinder that mobile bases have shown up so far, such as cloud castles or how about homes that walk around on legs. SBG gives us the rules and costs. UM does not.

4) Magic item uses for, and interactions with rooms is another good point for SBG which I find very odd to be lacking in the UM considering even the kingdom building rules got magical street lamps and everflowing springs using decanters of endless water. On top of that they brought out a bunch of new magic items and room enchantments designed to augment strongholds. These are concepts you're already using in Paizo adventure paths but not giving us a way to recreate them for player homes. Point in case: Serpent's Skull #42 Sanctum of the Serpent God, pg 44-45 the Tower of Preservation room. The entire massive room has been enchanted with a levitate effect that can be used by anyone who makes a DC 25 spellcraft check. That's honestly an awesome idea and our group's battle in the room was kinda epic. So how do I recreate that effect? My players really wanted to use that idea for their own base in several rooms.

5) Portal creation/costs. Other than teleportation circles I can't find rules for creating permanent portals in pathfinder yet. Would love to see something like what they had in SBG.

I'm sure I could think of more things but I'm running out of time here. I'll check back later tonight or tomorrow.


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1. Ultimate Plug-Ins
2. Kingdom-Building AP Plug-Ins
3. Far East AP Plug-Ins

And to answer your NEXT question for the Ultimate Plug-Ins, I have 3 proposals:

1. Ultimate Strongholds - Back in 3.0/3.5 the stronghold builders guide book was crazy popular with just about every DM/player I ever encountered. That being said, ultimate campaigns had a nice section dedicated to building but as with everything in that book, the systems were great, yet felt lacking in overall depth/coverage. As such, your ultimate plug-ins have been much appreciated by this DM.

2. Ultimate Factions - I'd like to see more tools to assist DMs/PCs in making their very own factions from thieves guilds, to bardic colleges, to magical academies, to fighting schools, to secret societies, and more. Inner sea combat/magic and occult mysteries have definitely hooked my group in on the faction/organization ruleset, and left us wanting more. So give us a robust tool set for making that happen, and maybe a few plug & play examples ready to throw right into the mix.

3. Ultimate Downtime - Same line of thought here. I'd like a more robust system for setting up and running shops / businesses.

Besides that, more material for each of the existing ultimate plug-ins, like more settlement attributes (no joke, before I was doing my morning check of the paizo forums I was stating up a small city for some home-brew and I still have the Ultimate Rulership pdf open sitting at the civic attributes XD )

Also, that reminds me, Well Educated now has the exact same modifiers as the Brod-Minded attribute introduced in Numeria, Land of Fallen Stars pg 11, minus flavor text. Though I think Brod-Minded would be an attitude. Would you leave Well Educated alone or tweak it in light of that?


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Woot! Actually very psyched for this path. I'm a bit curious though, do you have any other paths in the works as well?


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Can't wait for this book, and I'm very curious to see what they did for the skills section.

I've been doing 25 point buy, feat every odd level, ability point every even level, new retroactive skill point every four levels since pathfinder came out for my games. The skill points / extra ability points was something proposed back in beta. Personally, I've found that setup to work extremely well. Players actually tend to spread out ability points and pick up craft/knowledge/preform/profession skills, giving their characters much more depth.

On the monster side, it just means that I can on the fly add a few skills here and there, and advanced monsters get extra ability points at the same rate. Otherwise no change, and truth be told more than half the time I don't even bother to modify them at all. Its more of a "Oh this guy survived and had/has some good rp potential, lets tweak things a little a bring him back around at some point." which again has worked out very well.

Starting with item creation feats has always been a bit clunky, though Paizo's suggestion of extra gp worth of starting gear for mid to higher level characters with item creation feats has eased this greatly. Currently going with 1-2 items creation feats = 20% extra gear, 3+ = 50%, with the extra gear being limited to items that are made via that character's chosen item creation feats.

I do feel that rogue is still viable, but underpowered in comparison to investigator/slayer. So I really hope to see some good changes there.

All in all if everything goes really well, I'd like to see additional unchained books over the next few years. Is there any chance we might start seeing paizo blog previews within the next month or so?


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I live! kind of.. :P Stats are up, and I will get the rest up later tonight or early tomorrow.