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completely coincidental wrote:
Hi, GentleGiant and Selene Spires! The Pathfinder 2nd Edition Gamemastery Guide PDF should now be available to download from your accounts. All the best!

A heartfelt thank you coming your way! I hope to be able to pay it forward some day.


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That's incredibly generous, completely coincidental!
Being located in Europe, physical books are quite expensive (either the shipping cost from Paizo or the much higher prices locally), so I mostly have to rely on PDFs nowadays. The Pathfinder Second Edition Gamemastery Guide would be a great addition, as we're in the preparation phase of our next campaign and from the Twitch streams, where the Paizo peeps have discussed the book, it looks like there are some delicious extra rules we can use to tailor the campaign to our liking.


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I got a huge vibe of Battlestar Galactica from the latest episode:
"The Cylons Were Created by Man. They Rebelled. They Evolved. They Look and Feel Human. Some are programmed to think they are Human. There are many copies. And they have a Plan."
It even speaks to how this has happened before and in the most recent BG series it's shown that

BG spoiler:
they end up on Earth and one of the crew members becomes the "Mitochondrial Eve" of this Earth and then fast forwards to present day, 21st century Earth


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totoro wrote:
GentleGiant wrote:
totoro wrote:
I'm sure you're right about spellcasters being better. My players just didn't make the right choices and I am not smart enough to see what choices would have done the trick, at least for Fall of Plaguestone. No doubt, those spells are awesome when we finally figure out how to play this game. Unfortunately, we are going to move onto Hellknight Hill with new characters now that we have gotten some experience and we are just going to houserule spellcasters to give them A LOT more power. Open spell slots (choose spell on the fly) feels about right. I'll be around to say how that goes.
Now, being true to form you should, of course, not implement any house rules and just have everyone create a fighter. Then come back and let us know how your 4 fighters roll through the entire AP without a problem due to them being so superior to casters at hitting things.
Good call! I don't know if you did a comparison through theorycrafting or this is just a case of a broken clock is right twice a day, but 2 fighters, a barbarian, and a druid rolled through Plaguestone with trivial ease. I made a couple mistakes, like not advancing the party a level when I was supposed to, but because they were martials, it wasn't a big deal. I believe the game designers expected a balanced party, which would have been much harder. In any case, you are correct! Well done!

No, no, no, no, you don't get to cheat. You have consistently said over the last 12 pages that a group of 4 fighters would be much better than a mixed group and that casting a spell would always be the inferior choice to just hitting things with a weapon, so put your money where your mouth is.

Ask your players to play through the AP with only fighters, no multi-classing with classes that gets spells or spell-like powers, as that would be an inferior choice. You clearly said that both the druid and the cleric would have been better off if they had played fighters instead.


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totoro wrote:
I'm sure you're right about spellcasters being better. My players just didn't make the right choices and I am not smart enough to see what choices would have done the trick, at least for Fall of Plaguestone. No doubt, those spells are awesome when we finally figure out how to play this game. Unfortunately, we are going to move onto Hellknight Hill with new characters now that we have gotten some experience and we are just going to houserule spellcasters to give them A LOT more power. Open spell slots (choose spell on the fly) feels about right. I'll be around to say how that goes.

Now, being true to form you should, of course, not implement any house rules and just have everyone create a fighter. Then come back and let us know how your 4 fighters roll through the entire AP without a problem due to them being so superior to casters at hitting things.


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I wonder how many of those who are dissatisfied with the new incarnation of the Wizard (or other casters) have actually tried playing one for 12+ levels to see if they're actually fun to play in the framework of the new system (in the ~ 3 weeks it might have been out for some people)?
Or is it just dissatisfaction due to theorycrafting?


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Semi-transcribed the part about the Advanced Player's Guide from the announcement panel:
Planetouched are heritages and should be applicable to all/most other ancestries.
Archetypes will be available to almost all classes, only a few that are special.
Archetypes: pirate, acrobat, duelist, beast master, gladiator, poisoner, assassin, bounty hunter, scout.
APG will also have backgrounds (Jason).
The investigator might have gotten "bumped" a bit as it fits so well with the Absalom AP coming out at the same time.
All the classes will not only fill a conceptual niche, but a mechanical one too.
The sorcerer touches on some of the mechanical stuff of the PF1 Oracle, so they're looking at how to make the PF2 Oracle unique.
Oracle will still have curses, but might go more back to its pan-theistic roots. Will have lots of Divine and probably some Occult elements to it.
With the Swashbuckler they're aiming for it to be the ultimate mobility warrior, you will be mobile in ways that other characters can only drool over. Mona mentions that he thinks the 3 action economy is especially interesting for martial characters and how they can marry that with the abilities we already know from the PF1 Swashbuckler.
The Investigator will be the skill heavy class that will be able to solve a lot of your problems through skill use.
The Witch will let them revisit familiars and, of course, hexes.
******

Here's the summarized version of what was said during the Sunday panel:

Paizo sees Core rulebook, Gamemastery Guide, Advanced Player's Guide and the Bestiaries as "the heart, the core of the Pathfinder system". Going forward, from a design point of view, they'll assume that most tables will use these books.
New books after these are out will be more seen as optional, modular pieces you can fit into the system if you so desire.

Reasons for including these 4 classes:
Witch and Oracle were already up for strong consideration in the core rulebook (already revealed long ago). Several of the other PF1 classes you can sort of, almost create with the basic rules already. Investigator needs a suite of abilities that's just really different to make it work the way it's intended to. So they wanted to get that out fast.
The Swashbuckler will be super focused on mobility and skill-use fighting(?). It'll be purely focused on "I'm just here to stab things" with no spell casting abilities what so ever [which could also mean no "supernatural" focus abilities either].

(all this is from the Pathfinder 2e Design Philosophy panel early Sunday)
******

As for some more of my thoughts.
Swashbuckler could get some special movement abilities (apologies if some of these are already possible with attainable feats, I'm still waiting for my book to show up and the PRD doesn't lend itself to methodically going through the book). Like ignoring x amount of difficult terrain. Double-moves. Higher starting training in certain skills (e.g. athletics). Maybe special maneuvers with skill-use.

Investigator will certainly have alchemy abilities (DMW lays it out nicely why above).


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Alahazra (Oracle iconic) does look like she's had a new, upgraded outfit in the latest PF1 offering (Druma, Profit and Prophecy), which could speak against her being replaced.


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Arachnofiend wrote:
Xenocrat wrote:
Shardra, who has been illustrated for PF2 art already previewed, will be the Oracle iconic.
You say this with such confidence that I'm not sure if it's your theory or if there's confirmation somewhere that I haven't seen. I don't think Shardra would work as the Oracle unless they scrap the curse mechanic (which I suppose they could).

They're not scrapping it. Jason even said that he wish in PF1 they could have made a mechanic for the Oracle to "throw/pass" their curse on to others.


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Paizo sees Core rulebook, Gamemastery Guide, Advanced Player's Guide and the Bestiaries as "the heart, the core of the Pathfinder system". Going forward, from a design point of view, they'll assume that most tables will use these books.
New books after these are out will be more seen as optional, modular pieces you can fit into the system if you so desire.

Reasons for including these 4 classes:
Witch and Oracle were already up for strong consideration in the core rulebook (already revealed long ago). Several of the other PF1 classes you can sort of, almost create with the basic rules already. Investigator needs a suite of abilities that's just really different to make it work the way it's intended to. So they wanted to get that out fast.
The Swashbuckler will be super focused on mobility and skill-use fighting(?). It'll be purely focused on "I'm just here to stab things" with no spell casting abilities what so ever [which could also mean no "supernatural" focus abilities either].

(all this is from the Pathfinder 2e Design Philosophy panel earlier Sunday)


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Jason clarified the announcement from yesterday regarding the archetypes in the APG. There's going to be 60 PAGES of archetypes (which would probably be close to 60 archetypes anyway he chuckled).


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Igwilly wrote:

I'm reading the core book, and I'm quite impressed with what I saw.

Even though I'm loving it, there's always something to dislike:
1° What happened to item quality?
2° I think they should have used the Uncommon and Rare traits more often, especially with magic items.
Even then, that's great work, Paizo.

Item quality rules could be some of the optional rules that show up in the GameMastery Guide.


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Semi-transcribed the part about the Advanced Player's Guide from the panel:
Planetouched are heritages and should be applicable to all/most other ancestries.
Archetypes will be available to almost all classes, only a few that are special.
Archetypes: pirate, acrobat, duelist, beast master, gladiator, poisoner, assassin, bounty hunter, scout.
APG will also have backgrounds (Jason).
The investigator might have gotten "bumped" a bit as it fits so well with the Absalom AP coming out at the same time.
All the classes will not only fill a conceptual niche, but a mechanical one too.
The sorcerer touches on some of the mechanical stuff of the PF1 Oracle, so they're looking at how to make the PF2 Oracle unique.
Oracle will still have curses, but might go more back to its pan-theistic roots. Will have lots of Divine and probably some Occult elements to it.
With the Swashbuckler they're aiming for it to be the ultimate mobility warrior, you will be mobile in ways that other characters can only drool over. Mona mentions that he thinks the 3 action economy is especially interesting for martial characters and how they can marry that with the abilities we already know from the PF1 Swashbuckler.
The Investigator will be the skill heavy class that will be able to solve a lot of your problems through skill use.
The Witch will let them revisit familiars and, of course, hexes.


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Arachnofiend wrote:
GentleGiant wrote:
APG will also have backgrounds (Jason).
I am very curious to see what bonuses the (Jason) background will give.

It gives you the Control Matrix skill at Master level.


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Semi-transcribed the part about the Advanced Player's Guide from the panel:
Planetouched are indeed heritages and should be applicable to all/most other ancestries.
Archetypes will be available to almost all classes, only a few that are special.
Archetypes: pirate, acrobat, duelist, beast master, gladiator, poisoner, assassin, bounty hunter, scout.
APG will also have backgrounds (Jason).
The investigator might have gotten "bumped" a bit as it fits so well with the Absalom AP coming out at the same time.
All the classes will not only fill a conceptual niche, but a mechanical one too.
The sorcerer touches on some of the mechanical stuff of the PF1 Oracle, so they're looking at how to make the PF2 Oracle unique.
Oracle will still have curses, but might go more back to its pan-theistic roots. Will have lots of Divine and probably some Occult elements to it.
With the Swashbuckler they're aiming for it to be the ultimate mobility warrior, you will be mobile in ways that other characters can only drool over. (I misremembered that it was actually Jason talking about the class). Mona mentions that he thinks the 3 action economy is especially interesting for martial characters and how they can marry that with the abilities we already know from the PF1 Swashbuckler.
The Investigator will be the skill heavy class that will be able to solve a lot of your problems through skill use.
The Witch will let them revisit familiars and, of course, hexes.


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Arachnofiend wrote:
GentleGiant wrote:
My best guess at the iconic that'll be changed, it's probably Jirelle, the Swashbuckler - mostly based on how Erik Mona talked about how the class would function, which seems to fit a slightly changed iconic.
Could you give us some more details on this? I'm very curious to hear what the new Swashbuckler is going to look like, given that the old one was... not great.

He said something to the tune of it being the most mobile and agile class, being able to do things all the other classes would be envious of. And that it was going to be great to see all that in the 3 action economy.

His description sounded more like an acrobat-type character.


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PossibleCabbage wrote:

I did not have Investigator and Swashbuckler on my bingo card for "added in the first round of classes"... but honestly this probably comes down to more "we have a clear idea how to do this" than anything else.

With Aasimar, Changelings, Dhampir, and Tieflings being announced as ancestries, does this mean we're not doing them as a "heritage for any ancestry" option? Or perhaps we're doing both.

They did specifically mention that with the new ancestries you could make e.g. an elf-aasimar (or a dwarf-aasimar).


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July - Advanced Player's Guide
- Investigator, Oracle, Swashbuckler, Witch (October playtest)
- 8 new ancestry - Aasimar, Catfolk, Changeling, Duskwalker, Dhampir, Kobold, Orc. Ratfolk, Tiefling, Tengu
- New spells, archetypes (60) and other fun stuff
(pirate, acrobat, duelist, beast master, bounty hunter, poisoner, scout, assassin)


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Made a few extra notes for some of the products:
January - Lost Omens Gods & Magic
- details on all gods
- index of deities with domains, favored weapons and more
- new domains, feats and spells to customize your character based on their faith

January/February - GameMastery Guide
- Subsystems like chase rules, research, vehicle combat and more (or how to take certain elements out of the game, like no "+ level" to things etc.).
- How to design monsters, adventures, campaigns and more
- Extensive NPC stat block archive

February The Dead God's Hand
- 128-page hardcover adventure
- Enormous dungeon crawl designed to launch a new campaign set in Absalom.
- 1st level to 7th(?)

March/April - Bestiary 2

July - Absalom: City of Lost Omens
- huge poster map of the city

August - Absalom: City of lost omens poster map folio
- 32-panel mega-poster

July - Agents of Edgewatch Adventure Path
- Heroes are members of Absalom's City Watch, and must solve a series of bizarre murders, thefts, and destruction carried on a crime wave during a World's Fair-style celebration to re-open the city's Precipice District

July - Advanced Player's Guide
- Investigator, Oracle, Swashbuckler, Witch (October playtest)
- 8 new ancestry - Aasimar, Catfolk, Changeling, Duskwalker, Dhampir, Kobold, Orc. Ratfolk, Tiefling, Tengu
- New spells, archetypes (60) and other fun stuff
(pirate, acrobat, duelist, beast master, bounty hunter, poisoner, scout, assassin)


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UncleG wrote:
A decided nerf. The playtest gave such hope, TK Projectile offering a d10 combat spell, electric arc a d6, chill touch a d 8, and all scaling comparable to other classes in capability. In the release this has all bewn castrated, d4 and d6 instead, and only one scale to 2 dice. Basicly it's back to twidling our thumbs unless the martial type pause long enough to cast a 3rd level or higher spell. back to begging the gm to start at 3rd again, sigh....

Erm, the "Heightened (+1)" means that for every level you add one damage die and cantrips automatically autolevel

"A cantrip is always automatically heightened to half your level rounded up—this is usually equal to the highest level of spell you can cast as a wizard. For example, as a 1st-level wizard, your cantrips are 1st-level spells, and as a 5th-level wizard, your cantrips are 3rd-level spells. "


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Diego Hopkins wrote:
This thread has seriously derailed, and grown rather rude. Magnuskn and I are allowed to dislike the changes to magic, and disliking it doesn't invalidate our right to be here. Geez. It's an open forum.

No one has said that you're not allowed to dislike the changes. The manner in which these complaints are worded, by some, is the biggest issue people seem to have.

Diego Hopkins wrote:
I get a limited number of non-cantrip spell slots, and then I'm pretty much done for the day.

Erm, same as PF1.

Diego Hopkins wrote:
In PF1 I could do that by pumping my spell DCs.

At higher level, yes. Now your DC automatically rises with your level, actually making your lower level spells more impactful even at higher level.

Diego Hopkins wrote:
I could cast mage armor at the entrance to the dungeon and fire off one of my three spells per encounter knowing I'd made an impact.

How is that different than now? Well, except that now your Mage Armor lasts all day, vs. the 1 hour at 1st level in PF1.

Diego Hopkins wrote:
So I have less of a limited resource, it has a smaller/weaker effect, I can't be certain that it will be impactful, and the adventuring day is longer. That doesn't feel wizardly. That doesn't feel heroic. That doesn't fit with the narrative of most fantasy literature, nor with the feel of about 20 years of 3.x. This is why we're upset.

You potentially have the same amount of your limited ressources (actually more, if you count over the whole day as you can regain your focus points).

You couldn't be certain that you would be impactful in PF1 either. In other words, you actually have more options now at 1st level than in PF1, so how do you feel less wizardly and heroic?

Diego Hopkins wrote:
Yes, if you sit down and do the math on the d4 cantrips they aren't as horrible as they seem, but the d4 is a bad first impression. Especially when casters in the playtest were rolling d8s, and in 5e they're rolling d8s and d10s. I said before, that's bad PR. The d6 isn't that much more damage, isn't as off-putting, and hurts less when you step on it. It would have been, in my opinion, a better decision.

Acid Splash is d6 + 1 damage, with the possibility of persistent damage.

Chill Touch is d4 + spellcasting modifier (usually +4).
Electric Arc is d4 + spellcasting modifier (usually +4) on up to TWO targets.
Produce Flame is d4 + spellcasting modifier (usually +4), with the possibility of persistent damage.
Ray of Frost is d4 + spellcasting modifier (usually +4) with a potential speed penalty.
Telekinetic Projectile is d6 + spellcasting modifier (usually +4).
Sorry, but your complaint seems disingeniuous. Even the d4 cantrips all have your spellcasting modifier added.

(plus the potential for a once or twice per encounter chance of doing a whopping 3d10+8 points of damage at a range of 500 feet - dwarven ancestry using Hand of the Apprentice with a pick)

Diego Hopkins wrote:
There also aren't very many cantrips themed to each school. It's hard to feel like a necromancer if you can only cast one necromancy spell in a day. It's hard to feel like a conjurer if you can only summon one creature in a day.

What? You can summon as many creatures as you have spell slots to memorize Summon spells.

Diego Hopkins wrote:
My preference would have been to make magic weaker, but at will. The kineticist did this very well.

That's basically what your cantrips do! Before you were complaining that they were too weak, now you're proposing that there should be a "weak" option that you can use all the time.


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BryonD wrote:
GentleGiant wrote:
Arachnofiend wrote:
Your mistake was not realizing that wizard players got so used to optimizing the s~++ out of Fireball so that a 20 ft radius spread competes in damage on singular targets that they'd throw a tantrum when it returns to "AOE spell" status.
Indeed, a lot of the grumblings seem to stem from not being able to do the same with the Second Edition core book as you could with PF1 core book + XYZ books (and the sometimes silly feats and combinations between them).

"A lot" of grumblings from former fans is not a good sign.

Telling them they are wrong won't make them go back to being fans.

Grumbling about a false comparison isn't productive either and just seems like it's grumbling for the sake of grumbling instead of an honest look at the rules.

Also, as the peeps at Paizo say themselves, if you want to continue to play PF1, great!
If you want to give PF2 a try, great!


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totoro wrote:
GentleGiant wrote:
Arachnofiend wrote:
Your mistake was not realizing that wizard players got so used to optimizing the s~++ out of Fireball so that a 20 ft radius spread competes in damage on singular targets that they'd throw a tantrum when it returns to "AOE spell" status.
Indeed, a lot of the grumblings seem to stem from not being able to do the same with the Second Edition core book as you could with PF1 core book + XYZ books (and the sometimes silly feats and combinations between them).
That's not my grumble.

Never said it was yours specifically. There are others who have voiced their (negative) opinions in this thread.

totoro wrote:
I am going to use PF2 for my next campaign, so I'm kicking the tires. I don't like the wizard nerf because my players are experienced, so they are going to know when one class is dramatically weaker than another. The roleplayer of our group is going to choose what suits his fancy and I don't want him to be mechanically inferior just because he feels like playing a wizard. I can already guess what the powergamer is going to pick and it ain't wizard; my guess is straight fighter, sword & board. The other classes don't seem as problematic as the wizard, which I find funny because I remember reading in surveys wizards were considered the most boring and second most powerful class. It just isn't true.

You keep claiming this ultimate truth... based on some highly unlikely theory crafting that you keep referencing, but haven't actually showed (and it would still be theory crafting, not how the various classes would actually play in an average game).


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Arachnofiend wrote:
Your mistake was not realizing that wizard players got so used to optimizing the s~++ out of Fireball so that a 20 ft radius spread competes in damage on singular targets that they'd throw a tantrum when it returns to "AOE spell" status.

Indeed, a lot of the grumblings seem to stem from not being able to do the same with the Second Edition core book as you could with PF1 core book + XYZ books (and the sometimes silly feats and combinations between them).


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magnuskn wrote:
In the end I made the call to stay with PF1E after consulting with my players.

One could wonder why you're posting in the Second Edition part of the forum if you've already decided not to play it?

Seems like you're more interested in stirring up trouble (by posting hyperbolic claims about the new edition) and accusing the developers of being disingenuous than providing constructive feedback (positive or negative).
It seems quite clear that you're not interested in Second Edition (as you've also just admitted), so I think it's best to just ignore your grumblings.


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Malk_Content wrote:
I mean have you tried using a scythe? They are difficult to use as a TOOL let alone a weapon.

To be fair, a war scythe (which should be the weapon in question) is quite different from the tool version.

But even the weapon version requires practice to use.


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NemoNoName wrote:
lordcirth wrote:
What "RP reasons" prevent you taking the Fighter Dedication? It doesn't require any deity, alignment, anathema, etc.

Because I'm not building a fighter-wizard, I'm building a wizard that wants to carry around a scythe and not a staff. Not better use it any better than they use a staff, just the same.

Frankly, the weapon proficiency feat system is a mess. They need 2 General feats just to get Trained in a martial weapon, and then they're stuck and cannot get to Expert, even though they get Expert with weapons they never use.

Funny, that sounds quite like a fighter-wizard you're describing, what with wanting to use several martial weapons quite capably.


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magnuskn wrote:
Some spells last longer from the start but never scale after leveling past the point you outscale the congruent PF1E level (i.e. Mage Armor lasts 8 hours, but after level 8 you don't get the benefit you'd have in PF1E of it lasting even longer).

Have you even read the finished product?

Mage armor
Duration until the next time you make your daily preparations

Where are you getting 8 hours from?


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Grimmzorch wrote:
captain yesterday wrote:

Yes, Pathfinder 2 is worth the money.

I say that as someone who was EXTREMELY skeptical of the play test.

In fact I only subscribed at the very last moment before they started doing the order authorizations.

I have a tangentially related question. Does anyone know if I purchase the pdf tomorrow will I get an immediate download link or does it have to be processed or something first?

Yes, you'll get a link to download it "immediately" in the digital content section of your My Account link at the top right corner of the page.

It might take a few minutes to go through, depending on how busy the page is (tomorrow it might be VERY busy).


GM zebeev wrote:
kevin_video wrote:
And for anyone who can answer this, what is the design behind the AC? Is that a suit of armor? A shield? I can't tell.
GentleGiant wrote:
I believe it's from an existing piece of art, but I can't remember which.

I believe it's based on the suit of elven chain on p. 356 of the Playtest Rulebook.

Indeed. I just scoured the blogs to see if I could find it. Found it in... the playtest armour blog. ;-)


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For those asking for a character sheet, they've been released here (in case you didn't read the blog or saw the front page at release).

Also, once you receive your book(s) it might be a good idea to take proper care on how you open it the first time. Here's a video showing and describing how to open such a large book to ensure the spine of the book lasts longer.


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Lord Bowser wrote:
Ok, now that you mention it I'm honestly curious... what does the rest of the world do about creature speeds and the expected 5-foot square battle mats? Do people convert to meters or is that just a fight you've given up on?

Distance and length measurements come up in game play much more frequently, so if you've been playing for a while it's fairly easy to convert (although, for me anyway, it's not so much an exact conversion as it's a sort of rounded off number).

1 foot is 30.48 cm.
So 3 feet is ~ 1 meter
5 feet is ~ 1.5 meter
10 feet is ~ 3 meters
30 feet is ~ 10 meters
A mile is 1.609 kilometers, so it's fairly easy to do a "slightly above miles x 1.5" calculation.
As for weight, it's easiest to go with 1 lb ~ ½ kilo/500 grams
A gallon is ~ 4 litres
6' (for height) is ~ 183 cm (I'm 6'6" so the height of other creatures is also extrapolated from that, for me) - yes, I know this "clashes" with the 3 feet ~ 1 meter, like I said, it's rounded off/ballpark numbers.
Volume, however, isn't as easy to just conjure up a sense of.

Temperature, however, doesn't come up as often - at least not as a direct conversion (as temperature rarely shows up in e.g. published adventures) - so it's not something that's kept fresh in the mind.

Mind you, we still use the imperial numbers and such at the table, but for individual visualization it's easier to convert it in your head to the above figures.


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Frames Janco wrote:

Thanks for the input! Looks like landscape may be the way to go.

The Gleeful Grognard wrote:


Be aware that we are getting an advanced screen early next year.
I hadn't heard about that - are there details somewhere for it? Do you know makes it 'advanced'?

Pathfinder Advanced GM Screen (P2)

(slated for February release, but could also come out in January alongside the Gamemastery Guide)
Product description from another outlet wrote:
There can be a lot to keep track of while running a thrilling game of Pathfinder, but the right GM screen can make all the difference. This four-panel horizontal screen has a lavish illustration on one side and a wealth of useful charts and tables on the other, referencing a number of the advanced rules systems first presented in the Pathfinder Gamemastery Guide. This screen will help keep your secret notes and maps hidden from players, while making your job as GM simpler than ever!

So it's a screen containing the extra/alternative rules from the Gamemastery Guide.


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Age of Worms in Golarion?


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Voss wrote:
If you don't want to discuss it, then don't. Feel free not to trivialize things others want to discuss.

But that's just the thing, there's nothing do discuss. You've read something into it that isn't there. If anything, you're the one trivializing the answers you've gotten already, just because they're not from anyone on the design team.


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Voss wrote:
I'd rather not move it to another thread. I'd rather get clarification on the blog in the blog thread.

So you're just looking for someone from the design team to pop into the thread and tell you what everyone else has been telling you for several posts now?


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Voss wrote:

Yes, I understand what Cybermephit was referring to. I understood it the first time. It just isn't relevant to my confusion over the change- xp tracks are functionally the same either way.

Which is- now that its a currency, are there other things to spend XP on? Or plans for such things in the future?

Like others have said, you've seemingly come up with the "currency" and "spend" thing on your own. In the description above it simply says "subtract 1000 xp" - nothing about paying 1000 xp to gain a level or similar wording.

Also, having xp as a "currency" is generally a problematic concept, as you'll have some characters who might do whatever would require xp to be "spent", while others don't, thus probably creating a level disparity that might not be balanced with the whatever it is the xp are used for.


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Voss wrote:
CyberMephit wrote:
Voss wrote:


I'm puzzled by the new XP system. Having it as a spendable currency suggests there are other uses for it (otherwise I don't see the point in changing it from a running total), but this part of the level process got short shrift. What's going on?
I think you may be reading too much into it... I see it as simply improving support for customised XP tracks. For example you could decide to skip the early levels faster, so maybe you needed 500xp to get to level 2 but 800 xp to level 3. So once your character would beat 13x40 XP encounters, they would be 2nd level with 20 XP on their way to next level. Saying "they have 520 XP" would not mean much on its own without also mentioning the XP track they're on.
I'm not following you. Pf1 has different xp tracks now. It doesn't have anything to do with xp as a currency vs an accumulated total.

If you want to put it in a similar context to PF1 you can easily put it on a cumulative chart. So:

1st - 0
2nd - 1000 xp
3rd - 2000 xp
4th - 3000 xp
5th - 4000 xp
It's just important to note at the same time, that at-level encounters will continue to give the same number of xp, while lower level encounters will give continually decreasing number of xp (in order to explain that no, you can't continue doing lvl 1 encounters to reach lvl 20).

The "subtract 1000" is simply an easy way to do the math. When you get to 1040 xp you've gained a level, subtract the 1000 and you now have 40 xp towards the next level. This is the same formula no matter what level you reach.
Cyphermephit's example was just to show that you can change this formula if you want a faster or slower progression.
So a faster could be 800 xp per level:
1st - 0
2nd - 800 xp
3rd - 1600 xp
4th - 2400 xp
5th - 3200 xp
Or, once you've reached e.g. 810 xp you subtract 800 and you now have 10 xp towards the next level.


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DOOMED!

I'm disappointed no one has said that yet ;-)


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Blake's Tiger wrote:
My first character will be a druid Magaambyan arcanist: multiclassing wizard or (fingers crossed) maybe there will be a Magaambyan archetype in Lost Omens before I hit (and play at level 2 in PFS).

Well, the blurb for the Lost Omens Character Guide out later this year says this:

"... presents 10 new archetypes to allow characters of any class to participate in the world's most notable organizations, from the adventurous Pathfinder Society to the rabble-rousing Firebrands to the magical masters of the Magaambya!"


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Crayon wrote:

Not to sound rude or ungrateful as I do appreciate the effort, but at a glance it doesn't seem like much, if anything, has changed in the char-gen protocol since the playtest first dropped 11 months ago...

*confused*

The overall ABC process, no, why would it? The options you have to choose between have changed and/or expanded, though. They've rewritten several of the ancestry options between the playtest and the final version.


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Bookdepository.com has free worldwide shipping
You can pre-order the books here: Link to 2nd edition books (and a few, unrelated, other books due to the search query.


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As for actual "book" requests, I'd like to mirror what someone has already said on the Lost Omens World Guide thread:
Separate sale of the double sided world map!
For extras and/or displaying both sides at the same time during gaming sessions.
Also, an Interactive Atlas!


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Rysky wrote:
Xenocrat wrote:
Rysky wrote:
Ramanujan wrote:

In the cover art — what is going on with Merisiel?

It's like she has an extra arm and her head is twisted backwards.

It's Kyra's leg/foot.
I hope not. She’s standing behind that block with her other leg,
She's bracing with her left leg, you can see all the weight on it.

It's easier to see here, although it does muddle things a bit that it also looks close to Merisiel's studded armour.

But it's clearly behind Merisiel and you can see some of the oval plates on Kyra's shoes/boots.


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Bluenose wrote:
Zaister wrote:
So you want the game to be released before its release? Uh-huh, sure.
It sounds more like wanting the "Open Beta" type of thing you sometimes get in computer game circles where the game is released for people to play and test and review before the final version is settled on (although a lot of those turn into constantly evolving games, Minecraft for instance). So each iteration would be a bit different, eventually coming close to the final version. Easier, of course, for a computer game due to the nature of patching but it would hardly be impossible to do it with regularly updated rulebooks.

Apart from that whole having to actually having the book printed and shipped out to distributors part...


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Since this is a thread about the AP I guess it's not necessary with spoiler-tags.
From the Friday chat with Erik Mona:
Starts out at 1st level, PCs will probably be mostly natives of Isger. If you draw a straight line from where the Whispering Tyrant is to Absalom, that would run straight through Isger (relevance to the AP is uncertain or if it's just a bit of background on Isger).
The heroes start in a small town close to the Hellknight fortress and they go explore it. In the basement they find a network of ancient portals that will take them to various spots all throughout the "new" campaign setting, including places off the map that we've not gone to before, ever, but that people are asking for constantly.
In the course of doing that the players uncover a sort of conspiracy that is geared towards unleashing a flight of dragons to devastate the Inner Sea area.
So, it's a "Draconic conspiracy", it's a wide ranging adventure path that in some ways will make a perfect introduction to some of the goings on in the "new" campaign setting.
The ultimate villain is a character that people who have been paying attention to Pathfinder for a while have definitely heard of (but Erik, of course, didn't reveal who exactly). He thinks it's going to be really interesting and probably very surprising.


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Is there a time frame for when preorders will be available from other vendors outside Paizo.com?
Shipping + import duties and fees directly from Paizo to Europe are, unfortunately, too cost prohibitive, so I'm looking to find a place closer by to preorder, så I can get the books as soon as possible after release.
I saw all the books and accessories up for preorder on a couple of Australian sites (Goodgames and Imaginary Adventures), but haven't found any European sellers yet (Amazon or more local stores).
I don't know if Paizo has any direct say in when these crop up or if it's up to the distributors?


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Qwenlyn wrote:
Again, just completely baffling and frustrating.

7 posts back Vic wrote that he doesn't know why these 88 didn't ship, but he's investigating. Not sure what they should have told you since they don't even know themselves why they didn't ship?


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If you have specific questions about parts of the rules, please put them in the proper subforum instead of here (I know, it's done in the hope of Jason answering them, but it's not very fruitful for the overall playtest to have such things scattered all about).


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Tallow wrote:
Gary Teter wrote:
We've just granted $15 in store credit to everybody whose Pathfinder playtest preorder was sent to Amazon for shipping.
I think the offer of some sort of compensation was laudable. However, when my shipping costs were $15.75, why was I not given store credit equal to the higher shipping costs I paid by ordering it from Paizo?

Not everyone had the same shipping costs as you did, thus they probably gave what they thought was a reasonable compensation to everyone for the extra waiting time - i.e. it's not a refund of shipping costs, but a compensation for the longer wait.

Unfortunately the minimum eGiftcard is $5, otherwise I would have gladly gifted you a giftcard of $0.75 since it seems to be so important to you that you get those last $0.75. I hope the "missing" $0.75 doesn't wreck your monthly budget.

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