Pathfinder News From PaizoCon Online

Friday, May 29, 2020

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Each day during PaizoCon Online, we’re taking a look at upcoming products, revealing new art and details, and diving deep into the day’s focus with a livestreamed Marquee Event panel and Q&A session. Today’s Marquee Event panel focused on Paizo’s forthcoming Pathfinder Advanced Player’s Guide. This blog is a recap of some of the previews covered in that session as well as a compilation of other Pathfinder announcements from throughout the show. Don’t forget to check out the PaizoCon Online Stream Schedule to stay on top of the latest Paizo news in real time!

As we approach the end of the first year of Pathfinder second edition, we are excited to showcase some of our upcoming Pathfinder rulebooks, adventure paths, and world guides, while also announcing where the game is headed in 2021.

The panel that just concluded offers a lot of great previews of the Pathfinder Advanced Player’s Guide, coming out at the end of July. If you missed it live, you can check it out as a video-on-demand on twitch.tv/officialpaizo and archived on our YouTube channel in the near future. We’ll also be presenting the usual series of preview blogs and media partner appearances in the coming months, but if you just can’t wait, here’s a glimpse at a few pieces of art from the book:

The book’s gorgeous cover by Wayne Reynolds, depicting Feiya, the iconic witch, and Jirelle, the iconic swashbuckler, fighting (or fleeing from?) a colossal sea serpent

A tiefling, just one of options for characters with the planar scion versatile heritage presented in the book, by Pedro Kruger Garcia

An exciting scene of an oracle fighting some hell hounds by Valeriya Lutfullina, featuring a brand new tengu iconic (you’ll get a chance to meet him soon!) Other classes included in the book are the investigator, swashbuckler, and witch.

“But what,” you may ask, “do I do if I’m not an ‘advanced player?’” Have no fear, neophyte Pathfinder, because we have you covered this fall with the Pathfinder Beginner Box! Completely compatible with the Pathfinder Core Rulebook, this all-in-one box pares down the options available to players to make their first steps into the exciting world of Pathfinder as straightforward as possible. With 4 pregenerated characters, a series of character and monster pawns, a 1st-level intro adventure, and more, this is the perfect starting point for new players of any age.

The Beginner Box’s adventure takes place in the sleepy town of Otari just a few days’ travel from Absalom, but your troubles in Otari are just beginning! Picking up at 2nd level—right where the Beginner Box’s adventure leaves off—and taking your player characters to 5th level, Pathfinder Adventure: Troubles in Otari is an anthology adventure designed to introduce new players to a variety of playstyles and ease their transition into the world of character options presented in the full Pathfinder game.

For groups looking for a longer campaign, we are proud to announce the first 3-part Pathfinder Adventure Path, The Abomination Vaults! This dungeon-based campaign, also set in Otari, takes a group of 1st-level adventurers to 10th level, and tells a parallel story to that in the Beginner Box and Troubles in Otari. The first chapter of Abomation Vaults, Ruins of Gauntlight by James Jacobs, will be available in January, 2021.

I can hear you now: “But, Paizo, you can’t do just one 3-part adventure path without throwing off your entire release schedule!” You’re right! That’s why we’re following Abomination Vaults up with a second 3-chapter adventure path: Fists of the Ruby Phoenix! This campaign starts at 10th level, allowing your Abomination Vault PCs to pick it up after that campaign concludes, or it can stand alone as its own story. We first saw the Ruby Phoenix Tournament—a worldwide test of martial arts and magic held every 10 years—in 2011, so it’s fitting that we’d check back in and see what’s happening with it on the next go-around. Look for more information on this adventure path later in the year.

A few months ago, we released the Pathfinder Gamemastery Guide, and just this week the Pathfinder Bestiary 2 hit shelves and online retailers worldwide. Now, we’re thrilled to announce the Pathfinder Bestiary 3 for a March, 2021 release to fill in the gaps of any iconic Pathfinder monsters that didn’t make the cut for the first two bestiaries. Let us know what you’d like to see included after checking out the newly released Bestiary 2.

Illustration by Wayne Reynolds

Lastly, we take a look at the future of the Lost Omens line of world guides, detailing the tumultuous Age of Lost Omens in which the Pathfinder world finds itself now. Following the release of Pathfinder Lost Omens: Pathfinder Society Guide in September, we’ll next delve deep into the uncommon and rare ancestries of the setting with the Pathfinder Lost Omens Ancestry Guide. This indispensable sourcebook for players and GMs presents new character options for the many ancestries that have appeared in rulebooks other than the Pathfinder Core Rulebook, provides everything a player needs to play a member of such fan-favorite returning ancestries as android, geniekin, and kitsune, as well as a few ancestries that have never been available to player characters in the past!

Pathfinder Lost Omens Ancestry Guide cover illustration by Ekaterina Burmak

And that wraps up our week of announcements and previews from PaizoCon Online. Thanks for tuning in to twitch.tv/officialpaizo for our livestreamed panels and Pathfinder and Starfinder games, and stay tuned through the weekend with even more games. PaizoCon Online is the largest convention we’ve ever put on, and so we must send a special thanks to our many volunteer Game Masters offering adventures for players around the world, around the clock. We couldn’t have done it without you. We’ll formally close out the show on Sunday, but until then, stay safe and roll high.

Mark Moreland
Director of Brand Strategy

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Tags: Paizo Twitch PaizoCon Pathfinder Pathfinder Adventure Path Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Pathfinder Second Edition
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Scarab Sages

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Has anyone noticed that the logo for the Abomination Vaults AP bears a resemblance to the 2nd Edition AD&D logo? (The font and color scheme).

I have a feeling that's a clue to what will be in there.


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Rysky wrote:
Shisumo wrote:
Given the well-established demand and their absence from the APG, I really do think we should look for guns(lingers) sometime next year.
Highly unlikely, since again, playtests.

Depends on if they're making Gunslinger a full class to deal with the "drifter"-type characters, or if they're making it an "I use guns" archetype that can be bolted onto any class.

Silver Crusade

4 people marked this as a favorite.
Staffan Johansson wrote:
Rysky wrote:
Shisumo wrote:
Given the well-established demand and their absence from the APG, I really do think we should look for guns(lingers) sometime next year.
Highly unlikely, since again, playtests.
Depends on if they're making Gunslinger a full class to deal with the "drifter"-type characters, or if they're making it an "I use guns" archetype that can be bolted onto any class.

Not really relevant, since the main concern and equal focus of the playtest would be firearms.

Dark Archive

Erik Mona wrote:
Cyfer wrote:
Is the Lost Omens Ancestry slated for January or March? What happened the Lost Omens Absalom book and the big city map?

Both products are currently delayed. I messed up and didn't assign enough pages to the Absalom book to do it right, so I'm holding it back until it's as awesome as we can make it. James Jacobs and I have added about 20 additional locations to the manuscript (the city now has a temple for every core god, for example). We've also been working on an NPC appendix that has short summaries of more than 300 inhabitants of the city. So when you go to a shop, you can cross reference the shopkeeper in an NPC appendix and find out who she is friends with, who she is plotting against, and how all of it might play out into an adventure hook to lure the PCs into adventure.

We're hoping the book will be out by the end of the year. If not, it will be very shortly thereafter. The map folio will come out at the same time as the hardcover.

What does this mean in regard to the dead gods hand release schedule?


Rysky wrote:
Not really relevant, since the main concern and equal focus of the playtest would be firearms.

Don't know how much playtest they would need since weapon design is basically a science in PF2 anyway. They need to make up their minds about how they want them to behave, and just plug that into the system.

"Realistic": simple weapons, ridiculously long reload times, big damage, almost certainly Fatal or at least Deadly.

"Fantasy": advanced weapons, usable reload times (crossbow-like), OK damage, almost certainly Fatal or at least Deadly.

Something like this would almost certainly be balanced, for example:

Pistol - Advanced, 1d8 P, range 30 ft, reload 1, bulk L, hands 1, Reload 1, Group Firearm, Uncommon, Fatal d10

That's basically a hand crossbow upgraded two steps to Advanced instead of Simple, and given the Fatal d10 trait in the process (and having its range lowered a bit).

For a realistic one, I'd probably change it to Simple, drop the damage to 1d6/Fatal d8, and change the reload to 3x3 (three three-action activities). That would essentially make it unusable in regular combat other than as a first-fire situation.

Liberty's Edge

Staffan Johansson wrote:
For a realistic one, I'd probably change it to Simple, drop the damage to 1d6/Fatal d8, and change the reload to 3x3 (three three-action activities). That would essentially make it unusable in regular combat other than as a first-fire situation.

The only extant example of a PF2 firearm we have so far takes 3 actions to reload, but not as a single activity - instead, it's three separate Interact actions (load powder, load shot, tamp down). It's also noted as being in terrible condition, though, which definitely opens up the option for faster reloading in future rules.

Paizo Employee Developer

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Cylerist wrote:

Will the Ancestry book have all new options or mixed reprinted and new.

If the latter what is the percentage?

It will all be new content. :)


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Pathfinder Adventure, Adventure Path Subscriber
Staffan Johansson wrote:
Rysky wrote:
Not really relevant, since the main concern and equal focus of the playtest would be firearms.
Don't know how much playtest they would need since weapon design is basically a science in PF2 anyway. They need to make up their minds about how they want them to behave, and just plug that into the system.

Maybe, maybe not, but Paizo has said more than once they want to playtest guns before putting them in game, and that they're different enough that they didn't have room to put them in either core or APG playtests without feeling like they weren't devoting enough attention to it.

Edit: And the example that Shisumo mentions makes me guess they're not thinking small on this topic. It's entirely possible that the gun rules we playtest will bear little resemblance to the weapons currently in game, and work more like spells. The interact actions Shisumo describes resembles spell components, anyways.

Silver Crusade

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Staffan Johansson wrote:
Rysky wrote:
Not really relevant, since the main concern and equal focus of the playtest would be firearms.

Don't know how much playtest they would need since weapon design is basically a science in PF2 anyway. They need to make up their minds about how they want them to behave, and just plug that into the system.

"Realistic": simple weapons, ridiculously long reload times, big damage, almost certainly Fatal or at least Deadly.

"Fantasy": advanced weapons, usable reload times (crossbow-like), OK damage, almost certainly Fatal or at least Deadly.

Something like this would almost certainly be balanced, for example:

Pistol - Advanced, 1d8 P, range 30 ft, reload 1, bulk L, hands 1, Reload 1, Group Firearm, Uncommon, Fatal d10

That's basically a hand crossbow upgraded two steps to Advanced instead of Simple, and given the Fatal d10 trait in the process (and having its range lowered a bit).

For a realistic one, I'd probably change it to Simple, drop the damage to 1d6/Fatal d8, and change the reload to 3x3 (three three-action activities). That would essentially make it unusable in regular combat other than as a first-fire situation.

And once the Playtest hits expect every single poster to have a different simple plan to solve this to argue and debate.

If it was really as simple as making it up off the cuff and “plugging it into the system” they would have already done so. It’s not.


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Firearms rules also have the added issue that, no matter that the ship sailed back in the 70s, people will insist on trying to disinclude them from the fantasy experience by way of screeching against their existence at all and also trying to convince the designers the rules are "over-powered" unless they are sub-par enough that they can assume no player would want to take them.

...and simultaneously other vocal folks will try to ensure that "use a gun" is the absolute best mechanical choice for weapon users "because realism."

So getting actually satisfying, and fairly balanced, firearm rules is likely to require genuine effort.


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I hope Vishkanya make it into the ancestry guide.

Grand Lodge

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What are you picks, guesses and/or wild speculation if Paizo announces a playtest for more classes at Gen Con like they did last year? If they follow last year's template then I'd guess four more classes, five tops.

The Gunslinger, Magus and Kineticist all seem to be good bets.

As many have noted the gunslinger depends on the firearms rules and they may not be ready to tackle that just yet but I'd like them sooner than later.

The Magus would get a significant upgrade if it became a full ten level caster and was the spontaneous arcane class. I really see the spontaneous arcane place going to the Arcanist but I'm not really sure the Arcanist has enough to really warrant a full class anymore since there's less of a need for their blend of spontaneous/prepared casting now and reservoir, exploits and "I eat magic" thing could all be part of a archetype.

The kineticist seemed to be a really popular class. I was never really sure that I understood how it all worked but the pure flavor was awesome. I'd be interested in playing a 2E version kineticist since there's really nothing else like it.

My wild card would be the Psychic as the prepared occult. The psychic is another class were Paizo really made their mark on the game. I stopped caring about psionics once we got the Psychic. I'd like to get my mind-melting, head exploding action on earlier in this edition.

The shaman could also be a wildcard as the spontaneous Primal caster. I'd like to see them step into the role of mediator to their communities and envoys to the spirit world. There's a lot of room to explore here!

I honestly like to see a "class" book that just gets it all out of the way. Update all the legacy classes as 2E classes and archetypes or lay them to rest so that 2022 can be the year of moving on with 2E as its own thing.

Paizo have come a long way from salvaging what they could of 3E D&D just to survive to bringing bringing their own vision to life with the second edition of Pathfinder. I'm sure they have such sights to show us.


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Paizo Charter Superscriber; Pathfinder Companion, Pathfinder Accessories Subscriber; Starfinder Charter Superscriber

I don't know, I see both the magus and the gunslinger more as a concept for an archetype in this game. The magus could actually be opened up to the other magic traditions, similar to the new eldritch archer, and there is even an estabilished, fitting name for this archetype: eldrtich knight.


Zaister wrote:

I don't know, I see both the magus and the gunslinger more as a concept for an archetype in this game. The magus could actually be opened up to the other magic traditions, similar to the new eldritch archer, and there is even an estabilished, fitting name for this archetype: eldrtich knight.

So the question then becomes - is there a new arcane chassis to add “eldritch knight” to in the same vein as the people suggesting a “drifter”/“stranger” class to apply gunslinger to? (Although that one I believe some people would like a a gun pathway for)

Could it be something like a spontaneous “arcanist” where exploits and magus arcana become the same thing? But perhaps that be what is not called the “magus”.

What does the term magus really mean? Is there something in that?


thenobledrake wrote:

Firearms rules also have the added issue that, no matter that the ship sailed back in the 70s, people will insist on trying to disinclude them from the fantasy experience by way of screeching against their existence at all and also trying to convince the designers the rules are "over-powered" unless they are sub-par enough that they can assume no player would want to take them.

...and simultaneously other vocal folks will try to ensure that "use a gun" is the absolute best mechanical choice for weapon users "because realism."

So getting actually satisfying, and fairly balanced, firearm rules is likely to require genuine effort.

I appreciate your second paragraph. I tend to often fall into paragraph 1 usually BECAUSE of paragraph 2. And this stretches back to warhammer fantasy where black powder tore things to pieces with ridiculous ease

I have come round on their inclusion - especially with their lore links in golarion where the main location is somewhere where their invention makes sense.

But it is the insistence that they must be more powerful than every other weapon by at least a vocal minority that gets me.

I don’t see how that can possible be the case in PF2 given the way weapons are designed. There is no precedent for weapons to be better than the current advanced ones. And I am not sure we want that path walked down because it would open a new can of worms e.g. Katana should be in the “super advanced “ group because it’s a katana . And stuff like that


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Lost Omens, Starfinder Adventure Path Subscriber
Kevin Mack wrote:
Erik Mona wrote:
Cyfer wrote:
Is the Lost Omens Ancestry slated for January or March? What happened the Lost Omens Absalom book and the big city map?

Both products are currently delayed. I messed up and didn't assign enough pages to the Absalom book to do it right, so I'm holding it back until it's as awesome as we can make it. James Jacobs and I have added about 20 additional locations to the manuscript (the city now has a temple for every core god, for example). We've also been working on an NPC appendix that has short summaries of more than 300 inhabitants of the city. So when you go to a shop, you can cross reference the shopkeeper in an NPC appendix and find out who she is friends with, who she is plotting against, and how all of it might play out into an adventure hook to lure the PCs into adventure.

We're hoping the book will be out by the end of the year. If not, it will be very shortly thereafter. The map folio will come out at the same time as the hardcover.

What does this mean in regard to the dead gods hand release schedule?

Listening to the Adventure Panel, looks like they're shooting for an end of 2020 release of Lost Omens Absalom book and then an early 2021 release for Dead Gods Hand. Eric said he had like 70000 of 80000 words done on it. And something about how the writer was notoriously unreliable. LOL! The rest of the spoilers on it, make it sound awesome!


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If looking at the major holes in the system as of right now, I would say the following are the single biggest holes:

Guns
Advanced tech (necessary for Numeria)
Mythic (Necessary to figure out high level demigod threats work)
Mass combat

Guns seems the most reasonable thing in the above list to bring into unannounced hardcover, and you could do so via a equipment book (which PF2E still needs), or a more general book focused on class options. I am not actually terribly convinced we will see the latter options as soon.


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MMCJawa wrote:

If looking at the major holes in the system as of right now, I would say the following are the single biggest holes:

Guns
Advanced tech (necessary for Numeria)
Mythic (Necessary to figure out high level demigod threats work)
Mass combat

Guns seems the most reasonable thing in the above list to bring into unannounced hardcover, and you could do so via a equipment book (which PF2E still needs), or a more general book focused on class options. I am not actually terribly convinced we will see the latter options as soon.

I believe troops were confirmed to be in Bestiary 3, and we'll probably get a peek at mass combat when Kingmaker releases.


Pathfinder Adventure, Adventure Path Subscriber
Lanathar wrote:
What does the term magus really mean? Is there something in that?

Magus just means “priest” or “wise man” essentially. You’ve heard of the Three Wise Men in the nativity story? They’re also called “Three Magi”.

Zaister wrote:

I don't know, I see both the magus and the gunslinger more as a concept for an archetype in this game. The magus could actually be opened up to the other magic traditions, similar to the new eldritch archer, and there is even an estabilished, fitting name for this archetype: eldrtich knight.

Possible, but why not just do it in the APG then? If Horizon Walker and Duelist made the cut, I can’t see how Eldritch Knight would have been less a priority, given how popular Magi are, unless they already had a plan for introducing the concept somewhere else.

Level 1 gishes aren’t the same level of contentious that gunslingers are; there’s no faction that wants that to not happen, only arguments on how necessary a class dedicated to the concept really is, or if the current Proficiency paradigm means they’re already here.

Another problem is that archetypes aren’t good for starting a character at level 1 with your basic concept, and that should be a design goal for Pathfinder. A class archetype might have worked, but it doesn’t look like we’ll see those in the APG.

Edit: lest you think I’m ignoring you’re very good point that an archetype would allow Magi of every tradition, I’ve been an advocate since the playtest that the PF2 Magus class should ideally have versatile casting. I’d really prefer it work like the witch or sorcerer than be a strictly Arcane caster.


MMCJawa wrote:

If looking at the major holes in the system as of right now, I would say the following are the single biggest holes:

Guns
Advanced tech (necessary for Numeria)
Mythic (Necessary to figure out high level demigod threats work)
Mass combat

Guns seems the most reasonable thing in the above list to bring into unannounced hardcover, and you could do so via a equipment book (which PF2E still needs), or a more general book focused on class options. I am not actually terribly convinced we will see the latter options as soon.

Guns, yes.

A necessity to play in one specific nation that is not universally loved isn't actually a priority.

High level demigod threats work like Treerazer in Bestiary 1. No special rules required.

When has mass combat ever been required or particularly desired in Pathfinder outside of narrow custom AP scenarios? This is a game of individual heroes fighting enemies face to face. Bestiary 3 will have troop rules for making groups of weaklings collectively a threat to your walking tanks.


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While I was happy to hear about special cantrips for the Witch class, the video left me awfully worried about the state of Patrons in the final rules. When I heard Lyz say Patrons were, “As mechanically important as you want it to be,” I couldn't help but interpret that as saying Patrons were going to remain almost entirely cosmetic like the Playtest. Am I the only one who got that impression from how they were talking about the Witch class? Because if so, I'm going to be incredibly disappointed (& miserable when trying to homebrew unique Patrons without any built-in tools to make them interesting rather than downgrades).


Pathfinder Rulebook Subscriber
Charon Onozuka wrote:
While I was happy to hear about special cantrips for the Witch class, the video left me awfully worried about the state of Patrons in the final rules. When I heard Lyz say Patrons were, “As mechanically important as you want it to be,” I couldn't help but interpret that as saying Patrons were going to remain almost entirely cosmetic like the Playtest. Am I the only one who got that impression from how they were talking about the Witch class? Because if so, I'm going to be incredibly disappointed (& miserable when trying to homebrew unique Patrons without any built-in tools to make them interesting rather than downgrades).

Lyz mentioned in her AMA on the PaizoCon Discord server that they're publishing one example of a definitive Patron. The quote:

"(As for the witch, I can also tease that there's already one additional specialized patron that is being printed RIGHT NOW, but you'll have to wait until it comes out to find it. :stuck_out_tongue_winking_eye: )"


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Pathfinder Adventure, Adventure Path Subscriber

My money is on that being in Lost Omens Legends, not the APG.

Liberty's Edge

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Charon Onozuka wrote:
While I was happy to hear about special cantrips for the Witch class, the video left me awfully worried about the state of Patrons in the final rules. When I heard Lyz say Patrons were, “As mechanically important as you want it to be,” I couldn't help but interpret that as saying Patrons were going to remain almost entirely cosmetic like the Playtest. Am I the only one who got that impression from how they were talking about the Witch class? Because if so, I'm going to be incredibly disappointed (& miserable when trying to homebrew unique Patrons without any built-in tools to make them interesting rather than downgrades).

I do not expect Paizo to disappoint. My guess is that there will be a generic Patron similar to the Fury totem for the Barbarian. So that those who do not want a Patron to be anything more than cosmetic can enjoy the Class as much as those who want strong Patron impact.

Come to think of it, anathema depending on the Patron might be there.


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Pathfinder Adventure, Adventure Path, Lost Omens, Maps Subscriber
Xenocrat wrote:
When has mass combat ever been required or particularly desired in Pathfinder outside of narrow custom AP scenarios? This is a game of individual heroes fighting enemies face to face.

Perhaps Paizo has decided to make mass combat more broadly available than just one "narrow custom AP scenario".

Maybe they want to expand the ways you can play Pathfinder to include a broader array of stories than "individual heroes fighting enemies face to face"


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I'm really, REALLY hoping we can finally play a satyr or even a faun as an ancestry in Pathfinder.

It would also be great to get some 2e stats for the Grays in b3. They are weirdly fun to GM.


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CrystalSeas wrote:
Xenocrat wrote:
When has mass combat ever been required or particularly desired in Pathfinder outside of narrow custom AP scenarios? This is a game of individual heroes fighting enemies face to face.

Perhaps Paizo has decided to make mass combat more broadly available than just one "narrow custom AP scenario".

Maybe they want to expand the ways you can play Pathfinder to include a broader array of stories than "individual heroes fighting enemies face to face"

Maybe they’ll open a car dealership.


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Xenocrat wrote:
When has mass combat ever been required or particularly desired in Pathfinder outside of narrow custom AP scenarios?

It is a traditional D&D trope that high-level characters start settling down and build a stronghold, from which they engage in more political adventures. Mass combat is a part of that trope. It might not be to everyone's tastes (particularly if you also consider the trope's colonialist roots), but it's been part of the game for ages.


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Pathfinder Adventure, Adventure Path Subscriber

There’s been 3 or 4 APs where the hero’s wound up in charge of a citywide revolution, and another where they ran an army, and another where they decided a civil war.

Whether or not our players directly lead in battle, and I can see a few times where that would have been useful, running an organization is clearly a well they like diving into over and over.


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Pathfinder Maps, Starfinder Maps Subscriber
Erik Mona wrote:
Cyfer wrote:
Is the Lost Omens Ancestry slated for January or March? What happened the Lost Omens Absalom book and the big city map?

Both products are currently delayed. I messed up and didn't assign enough pages to the Absalom book to do it right, so I'm holding it back until it's as awesome as we can make it. James Jacobs and I have added about 20 additional locations to the manuscript (the city now has a temple for every core god, for example). We've also been working on an NPC appendix that has short summaries of more than 300 inhabitants of the city. So when you go to a shop, you can cross reference the shopkeeper in an NPC appendix and find out who she is friends with, who she is plotting against, and how all of it might play out into an adventure hook to lure the PCs into adventure.

We're hoping the book will be out by the end of the year. If not, it will be very shortly thereafter. The map folio will come out at the same time as the hardcover.

That doesn't sound like messing up to me.

To my mind, you've inadvertently made it even more awesome.
Good job! :)

RPG Superstar Season 9 Top 16

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Hoping androids and geniekin will be heritages so we can make ifrit kitsunes.

Fire foxes!

...

And maybe android kitsunes.


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They did specify that Androids can only be humans, unfortunately. It makes sense lore wise though


Pathfinder Rulebook Subscriber

Androids are human? I thought they said Androids were a full-fledged ancestry, not a heritage...

Dark Archive

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Sporkedup wrote:
Androids are human? I thought they said Androids were a full-fledged ancestry, not a heritage...

They meant which species their appearance is based on


Androids are based on Androffans, who were humans (Just ones from a different planet) right?


Pathfinder Rulebook Subscriber
PossibleCabbage wrote:
Androids are based on Androffans, who were humans (Just ones from a different planet) right?

Yeah, my understanding is that they are humanish-looking but completely alien.


Sporkedup wrote:
PossibleCabbage wrote:
Androids are based on Androffans, who were humans (Just ones from a different planet) right?
Yeah, my understanding is that they are humanish-looking but completely alien.

No, I mean Golarion has humans and Earth has humans- same species, same pathfinder rules. Androffa has humans too, or had them at least.

Dark Archive

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Yeah Androffans are humans from another planet, same way humans exist on multiple planet in galaxy for reasons unknown but probably related to gods being lazy :p


Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber

Geniekin, on the other hand, make a lot more sense as a versatile heritage.

Paizo Employee Developer

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We said during the panel that androids are their own ancestry and geniekin are a versatile heritage. :)


So I heard that Orcs are getting a pretty big rewrite; is that true? Because I’m definitely here for it!


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VixieMoondew wrote:
So I heard that Orcs are getting a pretty big rewrite; is that true? Because I’m definitely here for it!

A lot of things have changed in Orcdom since the Whispering Tyrant woke back up and said "serve me like your ancestors did" and the Orcs declined, aggressively.

The biggest mechanical change is that Orcs now have a stat-line (+Str, +Free) that's amenable to a lot more character concepts than the old PF1 version (with its penalty to every mental stat.)

Liberty's Edge

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VixieMoondew wrote:
So I heard that Orcs are getting a pretty big rewrite; is that true? Because I’m definitely here for it!

Apparently their stats are now +Str and +Any one stat, no flaws. So that's a change.

In terms of culture, I haven't heard anything about Belkzen changing at all, the Orcs there are as unpleasant as ever, but the PF2 books have already greatly increased the information we have about the relatively friendly Orc culture of Lake Ocota in the Mwangi Expanse. I'd hope the APG's Orc entry will include information on both of these disparate groups.


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Well, the cultural change in orcdom in Avistan appears to be predicated on the observation "hey guys, if we're going to fight the Whispering Tyrant, maybe we should have allies".

Liberty's Edge

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PossibleCabbage wrote:
Well, the cultural change in orcdom in Avistan appears to be predicated on the observation "hey guys, if we're going to fight the Whispering Tyrant, maybe we should have allies".

Well, yes, there's that. But that's always seemed more an 'allies of convenience' thing than an actual change of heart on the part of the Orcs of Belkzen, at least to me.


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I mean, is it really different from "can we trust Oprak to be good neighbors, or are they up to something and are only playing nice because of a common threat?"

The answer being "no one knows for sure, yet."

RPG Superstar Season 9 Top 16

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Luis Loza wrote:
We said during the panel that androids are their own ancestry and geniekin are a versatile heritage. :)

Fire fox it is! With a kit ember fox as a familiar.

Dark Archive

Staffan Johansson wrote:
Xenocrat wrote:
When has mass combat ever been required or particularly desired in Pathfinder outside of narrow custom AP scenarios?
It is a traditional D&D trope that high-level characters start settling down and build a stronghold, from which they engage in more political adventures. Mass combat is a part of that trope. It might not be to everyone's tastes (particularly if you also consider the trope's colonialist roots), but it's been part of the game for ages.

Unless I'm mistaken, that hasn't been a thing for at least 20 years. It was kind of a thing in AD&D2e, but even then it was relegated to handbooks and very very very lightly touched on in the main rule books. I think by 2.5 they had gotten rid of it all together.

You still had rules for Henchmen and Followers, but the whole Domain ruling Mass Combat system hasn't really been a thing since... well, I remember it in the Dungeons and Dragons Companion Set (the green box), but that's about it.

Of course, all of this means I'm old, so there's a fair chance I missed it in some core rulebook somewhere. But I'm pretty sure it's always been regulated to some side product.


Keirine, Human Rogue wrote:
Staffan Johansson wrote:
Xenocrat wrote:
When has mass combat ever been required or particularly desired in Pathfinder outside of narrow custom AP scenarios?
It is a traditional D&D trope that high-level characters start settling down and build a stronghold, from which they engage in more political adventures. Mass combat is a part of that trope. It might not be to everyone's tastes (particularly if you also consider the trope's colonialist roots), but it's been part of the game for ages.

Unless I'm mistaken, that hasn't been a thing for at least 20 years. It was kind of a thing in AD&D2e, but even then it was relegated to handbooks and very very very lightly touched on in the main rule books. I think by 2.5 they had gotten rid of it all together.

You still had rules for Henchmen and Followers, but the whole Domain ruling Mass Combat system hasn't really been a thing since... well, I remember it in the Dungeons and Dragons Companion Set (the green box), but that's about it.

Of course, all of this means I'm old, so there's a fair chance I missed it in some core rulebook somewhere. But I'm pretty sure it's always been regulated to some side product.

Wasn't it a major component (or, at least, the ruling fiefdom aspect of it) in the Birthright Campaign Setting?

(Maybe I'm misremembering... AD&D2ed was a weird - but fun! - thing I'd 'inherited', so...)

Carry on,

--C.

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