Kingmaker 10th Anniversary Campaign Begins!

Grumpus wrote:

xris wrote:

Grumpus wrote:

Do we know how much the hardcover will cost for non-backers when this releases to the general public? I assume more than $80

Well, the $80 pledge also includes the cost of the PDF, so it's possible that it will work out cheaper than $80 when it reaches retail. Mind, it wouldn't be in Paizo's interest to state what that cost will be now since it might dissuade those interested to pledge now.

True, but if this crowdforging program is a big enough discount on the regular price, it will get me to buy it NOW without even seeing the 2E rules. As it stands now, I'll wait to see if I like 2E, and then decide in 18 months whether they get my money.

I did most of the pricing for the add-one and I tried to give a nice discount to the backers on GameOn Tabletop. So if a product is normally $25, I listed it at $20. So buying it now will definitely save you a few dollars on each product that we are later selling into retail stores later in 2020.

-Lisa

Likewise, the Forest Kingdom Campaign Compendium is normally $30 but is only $25 if you purchase it as part of the GameOnTabletop Kingmaker project, plus you can then buy the hardback after the fact at half price (i.e., $25 plus shipping directly from Legendary Games).

I wonder, is the Kingmaker Map Folio going to be a straight-on reprint of the original or will it be somewhat different?

Grumpus wrote:

xris wrote:

Grumpus wrote:

Do we know how much the hardcover will cost for non-backers when this releases to the general public? I assume more than $80

Well, the $80 pledge also includes the cost of the PDF, so it's possible that it will work out cheaper than $80 when it reaches retail. Mind, it wouldn't be in Paizo's interest to state what that cost will be now since it might dissuade those interested to pledge now.

True, but if this crowdforging program is a big enough discount on the regular price, it will get me to buy it NOW without even seeing the 2E rules. As it stands now, I'll wait to see if I like 2E, and then decide in 18 months whether they get my money.

I did most of the pricing for the add-one and I tried to give a nice discount to the backers on GameOn Tabletop. So if a product is normally $25, I listed it at $20. So buying it now will definitely save you a few dollars on each product that we are later selling into retail stores later in 2020.

-Lisa

Since the retail price of our books depends on the page count, and some of the products have the potential to increase in page count as we hit later campaign goals, we won’t actually know what their retail prices will be until after the campaign ends. Which is to say, the more of those goals we reach, the better Lisa’s “nice discount” will get.

We can specuate about prices and what comes next now:

-It looks like each 16 page increase to the "adventure path" hardcover costs $50K.

-A flip-mat or poster map folio costs $30K.

-Each 16 page increase to the "companion guide" is $20K.

And the steps (so far) are always:
+50K
+30K
+20K

This allows to speculate when the maximum book sizes will be reached:

As the main book seems always to increase at a full 100K step, it would reach 720 pages at $1 million.
This is likely the point, up to where this project has been planned in my opinion.

The companion would reach it´s maximum of 160 pages at $850K.

I hope that the $330K add-on will include a reprint of the "Bandit Outpost" flip-mat of "Fort Drelev" or that this will get the "flip-mat classics" treatment in 2020, as that one has long been sold out and is the next chronological place to need a flip-mat.

Personally, i love to have flip-mats for adventures and it will be interesting to see if we can get one multi-pack (really a double pack of two mats showing four different areas) for each of the six (or now seven) adventure path volumes. :-)

Good luck and keep up the great work!

And the "Noble Manor" flip-mat multi-pack is unlocked!

The site hasn´t been updated properly and the price isn´t showing yet.

The next unlock needs $20K more and adds Amiri and her side-quests to the ""companion guide".

I'm really happy with PF1 support, but since I've seen 20 lvl expansion, now I want that badly and I'm afraid they'll not reach it with unfamiliar platform and short funding time (I get why they wanted this platform, but not why the short funding time, this is a big one). Also I think they need to step up their advertising of this, I'm only familiar because I follow Paizo and LG, and I see advertisements for other gaming supplements from all those Facebook adds and sidebars commercials.

I'm really happy with PF1 support, but since I've seen 20 lvl expansion, now I want that badly and I'm afraid they'll not reach it with unfamiliar platform and short funding time (I get why they wanted this platform, but not why the short funding time, this is a big one). Also I think they need to step up their advertising of this, I'm only familiar because I follow Paizo and LG, and I see advertisements for other gaming supplements from all those Facebook adds and sidebars commercials.

The campaign will easily reach the $200K needed for the level 20 expansion.

Honestly i'm really excited about this. Kinda crazy a little while ago
I though it would be a smart move to re-release kingmaker for 2E.

Man It looks like I was tapping into some sort of paizo wavelength
Anyway it looks really great, plus its a fantastic slow burn to embrace
The new 2E rules. That beta felt real productive and im looking forward
To the finished product. Anyway hope your taking that time off, cheers

Mike = D

Likewise, the Forest Kingdom Campaign Compendium is normally $30 but is only $25 if you purchase it as part of the GameOnTabletop Kingmaker project, plus you can then buy the hardback after the fact at half price (i.e., $25 plus shipping directly from Legendary Games).

The one for this funding project is just the 5E version of the existing pathfinder book that is available Or is the 5E version already available too?

Lisa Stevens wrote:

Grumpus wrote:

xris wrote:

Grumpus wrote:

Do we know how much the hardcover will cost for non-backers when this releases to the general public? I assume more than $80

Well, the $80 pledge also includes the cost of the PDF, so it's possible that it will work out cheaper than $80 when it reaches retail. Mind, it wouldn't be in Paizo's interest to state what that cost will be now since it might dissuade those interested to pledge now.

True, but if this crowdforging program is a big enough discount on the regular price, it will get me to buy it NOW without even seeing the 2E rules. As it stands now, I'll wait to see if I like 2E, and then decide in 18 months whether they get my money.

I did most of the pricing for the add-one and I tried to give a nice discount to the backers on GameOn Tabletop. So if a product is normally $25, I listed it at $20. So buying it now will definitely save you a few dollars on each product that we are later selling into retail stores later in 2020.

-Lisa

Likewise, the Forest Kingdom Campaign Compendium is normally $30 but is only $25 if you purchase it as part of the GameOnTabletop Kingmaker project, plus you can then buy the hardback after the fact at half price (i.e., $25 plus shipping directly from Legendary Games).

So, it sounds like the hardback for Forest Campaign Compendium isn't available as part of backing the project, only the PDF with the additional discount if you get the PDF? (I don't run things off PDFs if I can help it, so I wouldn't have any use for the PDF itself.)

Otherwise, I'll hope to snag it at PaizoCon.

At the moment the campaign is moving incredibly slow.
Either the initial wave of backers has come to a halt, or the companion guide isn't as interesting as Paizo thinks.
For me, personally it is the only product that doesn't interest me at all, but i think it is a mix of the two reasons.

I am very excited for content increases of the hardcover, the pawns, flip mats and the map folio.

I already know everything about Amiri that i want and have no connection to the computer game NPCs beyond having their miniatures from the "Pathfinder Battles: Kingmaker" set.

At the moment the campaign is moving incredibly slow.

That's usually how it goes.

The first couple days and last couple days of a campaign are the busiest, the doldrums in the middle. The big exceptions to that are things like the old Reaper Bones Kickstarters, which kept exploding because the per-user value kept going up every few hours. Word-of-mouth kept more and more people jumping on because the rewards kept increasing.

This will be a more traditional campaign, which is okay. The highly-connected, highly-informed and highly-motivated jump on at the start, then it creeps because there's no significant change, and finally there's a burst of activity from people who were just waiting for the final days to commit the money.

It’s probably worse with this platform than Kickstarter too, since here you pay when you pledge.

With a Kickstarter, if I’m only interested in the one million dollar stretch goal, I can pledge early to build momentum, then cancel on the last day if it doesn’t make my desired level. Here, if there’s some necessary threshold, it’s easy to imagine someone holding off until they can be sure their desired addon is actually a reality.

Also with Kickstarter, you can overpledge in anticipation of stretch goals not yet reached.

Yeah, i know that the most money is always made in the last 48 hours.
But a slowdown this early and that much seems unusual.

I'm also in the "Kickstarter would have been the better platform" boat.

But it's only been 51 hours and there is still lots of time.

I just feel that the companion guide is very boring and that the "Level 18-20" & map folio add-ons are much more appealing.

...short funding time...

I'm shocked it's only 2 weeks instead of at least a month!

The level-up conditions have been updated. We are getting The Cursed King at $175,00 and Barony at $250,00. At 1000 backers, all backers are getting People of the River and Guide to the River Kingdoms in pdf format.

I have some questions. Are those two books getting converted into 2E, or are they the same 1E books?

Is it possible for a World Guide thematically tied to the adventure in some way to show up or should I expect more pages to the main book if I want more setting content?

Here, if there’s some necessary threshold, it’s easy to imagine someone holding off until they can be sure their desired addon is actually a reality.

That's what I'm doing. I want either the General or the Ruler, plus certain add-ons, but without really knowing what is entailed with the Ruler, I'm not ready to make the decision. I realize that this sort of mentality is just going to make any reveals for the Ruler level take longer, but... *shrug*

I'd go General now and just do add-ons for the extra stuff that I want, but there's been statements that only most of the unlockables for the Ruler level will be available as add-ons.

I'm not a fan of this model. I'd much rather pledge or buy at the level of what I want, and if freebie level-ups occur, great! If level-ups that I have to pay for unlock, send me an e-mail about it so that I can consider if I want to buy it or not. I'm not willing to drop an extra $50 now for fancy covers with the same content and some unknown that might show up later. (No judgement against those who do want that, though.) And I hate to sound arrogant, here, but I'm busy; I don't want to check in on this campaign multiple times to see if I can parse out what new things have been added.

The level-up conditions have been updated. We are getting The Cursed King at $175,00 and Barony at $250,00. At 1000 backers, all backers are getting People of the River and Guide to the River Kingdoms in pdf format.

I have some questions. Are those two books getting converted into 2E, or are they the same 1E books?

Is it possible for a World Guide thematically tied to the adventure in some way to show up or should I expect more pages to the main book if I want more setting content?

I'd assume both the free PDFs are the original 1e. I think they would call out if it were being converted. (and for a backer number stretch goal w/o funding tied to it, it needs to be cheaper for them to offer, which matches for an existing PDF)

The level-up conditions have been updated. We are getting The Cursed King at $175,00 and Barony at $250,00. At 1000 backers, all backers are getting People of the River and Guide to the River Kingdoms in pdf format.

I have some questions. Are those two books getting converted into 2E, or are they the same 1E books?

Is it possible for a World Guide thematically tied to the adventure in some way to show up or should I expect more pages to the main book if I want more setting content?

Hey The Gold Sovereign, the books you mentioned will be in PF 1E and no, we do not have a World Guide style product planned for Kingmaker.

Umm, in kickstarter you aren't supposed to overpledge to reach stretch goals better ._.;

Umm, in kickstarter you aren't supposed to overpledge to reach stretch goals better ._.;

Why not? I’ve had creators explicitly tell me it’s fine to do exactly that.

CorvusMask wrote:

Umm, in kickstarter you aren't supposed to overpledge to reach stretch goals better ._.;

Why not? I’ve had creators explicitly tell me it’s fine to do exactly that.

Yeah on a few smaller projects I've gone over a little bit to help meet a goal.

And the "Amiri companion guide extension" is funded!
Now to bring the campaign to level 20! :-)

CorvusMask wrote:

Umm, in kickstarter you aren't supposed to overpledge to reach stretch goals better ._.;

Why not? I’ve had creators explicitly tell me it’s fine to do exactly that.

I have heard the exact opposite, usually surrounding the very last stretch goal. Sometimes that last one is something of a joke or an outlandish request on the part of an outspoken backer. I wouldn't put it there myself if I was running a kickstarter, but that's just me.

Steve Geddes wrote:

CorvusMask wrote:

Umm, in kickstarter you aren't supposed to overpledge to reach stretch goals better ._.;

Why not? I’ve had creators explicitly tell me it’s fine to do exactly that.

I have heard the exact opposite, usually surrounding the very last stretch goal. Sometimes that last one is something of a joke or an outlandish request on the part of an outspoken backer. I wouldn't put it there myself if I was running a kickstarter, but that's just me.

I just dont understand why anyone would object to me pledging more than necessary in the hope of driving the project forward.

It seems like a weird rule to me. Who loses?

I find the goals in this to be confusing.

I'll preface this by saying I've already backed the project - but if money were tight right now, I'd hesitate to buy in based on the current information. So I'm providing this as feedback in hopes that some of these points can be clarified.

Will the 5e book include conversions of the NPCs (and any other rules-crunch items) from the companion book? (I believe it should, but there's no evidence that it does.)

The "Ruler" level currently says it includes the Kingdom Management Screen, but when pledging, selecting your rewards and add-ons, that information isn't visible as part of the Ruler reward. I am concerned that some people may buy this without realizing they already receive a copy.

Does this platform include an after-the-campaign pledge manager? That is, if there's an add-on that becomes available mid-campaign and I don't get back to add it to my pledge before the end of the campaign, will there be a window of time where I will still be able to add it at the campaign pricing?

Is there a reason why we are required to pay the upcharge for a leather cover in order to get stretch goals? This alone made deciding whether to commit difficult, because if I don't care about a leather cover, the value add for choosing Ruler is definitely lacking at this stage. If this platform didn't charge until end-of-campaign, it would've been fine, because I would have been able to switch the level without worrying how the platform will handle it...but with pay-as-you-pledge it seems more like you're locked into a decision now, whether or not that's really the case.

I just dont understand why anyone would object to me pledging more than necessary in the hope of driving the project forward.
It seems like a weird rule to me. Who loses?

I'm assuming you all don't mean the same thing when you say "overpledge". I'm guessing Steve means "pledging at a tier higher than the one whose benefits I am most interested in", and like, it's your money. But I suspect CorvusMask took overpledge to mean "Initially pledge higher to artificially boost the KS, and then reduce the pledge before the campaign is complete to be in line with what you actually want."

necromental wrote:

...short funding time...

I'm shocked it's only 2 weeks instead of at least a month!

Something like this needs some time to get out there (especially on a not as well known platform), and since it won't be delivered in over a year it seems like an odd choice to give such a short funding time.

Not to mention that for many people the two-week timeframe will only cover one pay period, which may not be enough time for them to get their finances in order for this, which is unfortunate. It also launched right as a Battles case is released, which is doubly unfortunate. Because of these, I won't be able to pledge, which is a damn shame as this is something I want to support early.

Steve Geddes wrote:

I just dont understand why anyone would object to me pledging more than necessary in the hope of driving the project forward.
It seems like a weird rule to me. Who loses?

I'm assuming you all don't mean the same thing when you say "overpledge". I'm guessing Steve means "pledging at a tier higher than the one whose benefits I am most interested in", and like, it's your money. But I suspect CorvusMask took overpledge to mean "Initially pledge higher to artificially boost the KS, and then reduce the pledge before the campaign is complete to be in line with what you actually want."

Oh i see. Cheers.

Yeah i meant pledge at the high level youre going to pay. Not so you can cut it back later.

Appreciate that First World Bard. :)

I find the goals in this to be confusing.

I'll preface this by saying I've already backed the project - but if money were tight right now, I'd hesitate to buy in based on the current information. So I'm providing this as feedback in hopes that some of these points can be clarified.

Will the 5e book include conversions of the NPCs (and any other rules-crunch items) from the companion book? (I believe it should, but there's no evidence that it does.)

<snip>

Your question* (bolded here in your quote) has been answered by Jeff Alvarez (Paizo Chief Operations Officer) in the other thread (they really should be merged, or all the answers to FAQs in both threads put in their own dedicated thread...):

"...The Companion is only going to be produced for 2E. The 1E and 5E bestiaries will include the stats and such from the Companion book so that content can be run in those systems as well."

As to your other questions... Dunno. Sorry.

Carry on,

--C.

<edit 1> Link.

<edit 2> * It's a good question!

First World Bard wrote:

Steve Geddes wrote:

I just dont understand why anyone would object to me pledging more than necessary in the hope of driving the project forward.
It seems like a weird rule to me. Who loses?

I'm assuming you all don't mean the same thing when you say "overpledge". I'm guessing Steve means "pledging at a tier higher than the one whose benefits I am most interested in", and like, it's your money. But I suspect CorvusMask took overpledge to mean "Initially pledge higher to artificially boost the KS, and then reduce the pledge before the campaign is complete to be in line with what you actually want."

Oh i see. Cheers.

Yeah i meant pledge at the high level youre going to pay. Not so you can cut it back later.

Appreciate that First World Bard. :)

Umm, I did mean what they said, but isn't the other option also kinda bad in case devs actually did need that money to fulfill the stretch goal?

Like, if someone pledges 100,000 and pays only 100, isn't that a problem? Or am I still misunderstanding stuff?

What i meant by overpledging was selecting a $100 tier and pledging $200, planning to use it for addons or whatever down the track.

Its extra cash for the project, not cash you promise then withdraw later.

Sorry for the derail, I'll drop it. It was just an aside. :)

What I find strange that the progression and setup of this project will likely result in people having to pay extra to not get the faux leather special edition.

Currently the Ruler level is at $150 and it gets me the screen for free. If I prefer the standard edition, I have to get the Marshal level at $100 and have to play (maybe) $20 for the screen.

Now if more of these "Ruler level free add-ons" are coming, the moment their total cost passes $50, I'll have to pay more for the standard edition than for the special edition, if I want these add-ons.

Does that make sense?

What I find strange that the progression and setup of this project will likely result in people having to pay extra to not get the faux leather special edition.

Currently the Ruler level is at $150 and it gets me the screen for free. If I prefer the standard edition, I have to get the Marshal level at $100 and have to play (maybe) $20 for the screen.

Now if more of these "Ruler level free add-ons" are coming, the moment their total cost passes $50, I'll have to pay more for the standard edition than for the special edition, if I want these add-ons.

Does that make sense?

Not at all.