Starfinder Society Guide 1.1

Wednesday, October 31, 2018

A new update to the Starfinder Society Roleplaying Guild Guide is due... well, right now!

That's right. As of now, the guide has been updated to include a variety of updates put together by the Organized Play Team and built from the feedback of countless players and organizers across the world. I'd like to also give a special thanks to anyone who contributed to the thread that was started months ago on this topic as your comments were invaluable in coming up with these updates.

So, let's hop into a summary of the major changes:

  • A new playable faction has been included: the Second Seekers loyal to First Seeker Jadnura. This includes a table of associated boons, including numerous new boons unique to this faction.
  • The list of always available playable races has been expanded to include the legacy races included in the Starfinder Core Rulebook.
  • The required resources necessary to create a character of a new race have been clarified to accommodate special rules reference handouts included in certain scenarios.
  • The rebuilding rules for characters and personal boons has been clarified.
  • Numerous faction-associated boons have been clarified or expanded, including hirelings, basic purchases, and improved faction champion boons.
  • Details are now available for the Exo-Guardians and Wayfinders capstone boons, providing playable statistics for a new race and starship hull.
  • The instructions for filling out a Chronicle sheet have been updated, including when a PC can purchase and sell gear.
  • Rules for applying credit have been relaxed slightly when using pregenerated characters in adventures that require the use of such characters.
  • Information about the Vehicle scenario tag and the Vanity boon descriptor has been added.
  • GMs' Chronicle sheet rewards have been clarified.
  • UPBs are now purchasable in single units rather than only in lots of 1,000.
  • The Tier 2 and Tier 6 Drake starships' shields and armaments have been updated to better match the hull's intended function.
  • The list of Regional Venture-Coordinators and regions has been updated.

From this list, there's a few points I'd like to highlight:

Second Seekers (Jadnura): Ohhhhhhh a new faction! For those who've been interested in seeing how we're going to handle multiple Second Seekers factions, then Jadnura is our first example of that. I suspect a lot of the boons are going to interest some players out there, especially the ability to replay content and earn full credit for it. Similarly, if you like your growing stable of ally boons, then this faction is a great opportunity for those of you who want new characters to earn even more ally potential.

New Capstones: Veteran Exo-Guardians can bestow a new ship on new Starfinder recruits: the Gorgon. This vessel is essentially a murderboat intended to render opposing starships down to fine particulate matter—have fun with that. The Wayfinders also reveal their associated new race, which shouldn't come as a surprise to players who've been playing Starfinder Society since the beginning.

A More Toothy Drake: The Drake base hull has received some further updates. The Tier 2 version of the ship has had some weapon upgrades to make it more in line with the type of starship role we wanted it to have (at a small cost to its shields). Meanwhile, the Tier 6 version of the ship had its erroneous linked missile weapons replaced with a potent torpedo launcher.

Legacy Races Always Available: It may not be uplifted bears (don't worry, I'm working on that) but players can now enjoy all the Starfinder Core Rulebook legacy races as being always available. Go forth and populate the universe with dwarves, elves, gnomes and all the other legacy races!

Quality of Life: We've eased some of the Additional Resources requirements on new races, allowing players to play their new races with handouts provided by scenarios. We've also allowed players to apply credit to a character of any level within the level range of a pregenerated character scenario, which should ease up some of the credit discussions around Starfinder Society #1-00: Claim to Salvation. There's also been some tightening of language around GM Chronicle sheet rewards and how a GM can apply character boons during the course of a scenario they run. Finally, you can now purchase UPBs in single units rather than in lots of 1,000, which should further encourage crafters to build equipment!

I'd like to give a big shout out to our editors, art and layout folks, and Managing Developer Adam Daigle for helping out in getting everything ready for distribution to the masses.

This update to the Guide should last us until the start of our next season, currently slated for June of 2019. Of course, feel free to continue posting feedback about the Starfinder Society Guide on the Organized Play forums, and we'll do our best to keep compiling all the information for future updates.

Note: The following additions have been added to clear up some of the questions we've seen about the new "always available" status for legacy races in the new update to this guide.

Legacy Race Clarification

There have been some questions about how players who'd previously unlocked legacy races should handle them now that legacy races are always available. The following are official clarifications on how players should handle legacy races previously earned in the campaign.

  • Characters who've earned a Legacy Race boon from RSP or a special convention boon prior to the publishing of this blog can create or continue playing a Legacy Race and increase one ability score that is 14 or lower by 2. These characters retain their Personal boon slot but cannot slot in a Personal boon that would augment an ability score (such as any of the admittance boons.)
  • Characters who've earned a Legacy Race boon via a scenario prior to the publishing of this blog can convert the Personal Boon from the "New Character" option to the "Existing" option and earn the +2 in one ability score that is 14 or lower. This occupies the Personal boon slot.
  • Characters who earn a Legacy Race boon following the publishing of this blog can slot the Personal Boon onto their character and select the "Existing" option to earn the additional ability score boost. This occupies the Personal boon slot.
  • For Characters who've applied two legacy race boons to a character (one for race access and one for the stat boost) those characters now only gain the benefit of the "Existing" portion of the race boon. The initial "New Character" application of the boon is ignored. In no circumstance, can a PC ever earn more than one +2 increase to an ability score modifier.

So how about making some new characters?

Thurston Hillman
Starfinder Society Developer

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Tags: Organized Play Starfinder Society
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Grand Lodge ***** Venture-Captain, Arizona—Phoenix aka TriOmegaZero

Huzzah!

Sovereign Court *** Venture-Agent, Minnesota—Champlin

Dang. I haven't even had a chance to make use of my Legacy Race boon that I donate a ton of money for at a local con. I never should have outbid Michael that last time. Oh well, at least it went to charity.

Sovereign Court **** ⦵⦵⦵⦵ Venture-Agent, Georgia—Atlanta aka The Masked Ferret

So, is the Tier 2 Gorgon only supposed to have 1 weapon forward, and none in the turret?

Sovereign Court **** ⦵⦵⦵⦵ Venture-Agent, Georgia—Atlanta aka The Masked Ferret

@James Don't forget that the Legacy Race boon gives a +2 to one of your stats that is under 16, and that boon is the only way you can have that on an Elf, Half-elf, or Gnome.

*** Venture-Agent, California—Folsom aka avagdu

Hmmmm... I'm not seeing this:

Quote:
Rules for applying credit have been relaxed slightly when using pregenerated characters in adventures that require the use of such characters.

Are we still only allowed to drop credit to a brand new character, or is the rule supposed to be the same as the Pathfinder Society Guild Guide, where it can be dropped to any level 1 character?

I'm not seeing any wording changes from 1.0 to 1.1 on the use of pregens and applying credit.

Sovereign Court *** Venture-Agent, Minnesota—Champlin

That new starship option is really bad at tier 2, but it actually gets a lot better as you go up from there. I also like the changes to the Drake. Previously, I would never bother with it, but I might actually argue in favor of it after this. Both are still not anywhere near as well built as you can make a ship by the rules, but they're improvements.

Sovereign Court *** Venture-Agent, Minnesota—Champlin

Glen Parnell wrote:
@James Don't forget that the Legacy Race boon gives a +2 to one of your stats that is under 16, and that boon is the only way you can have that on an Elf, Half-elf, or Gnome.

Sadly, the GM boon I got from a charity auction doesn't have that +2 text in it. The ones you can earn by playing certain scenarios do, however.

⦵⦵ Venture-Lieutenant, California—Orangevale aka Harrowed Wizard

Really nice to see the instructions clarified for filling out the chronicle sheet, especially with the Faction reputation increases!

Starfinder Society Developer

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Glen Parnell wrote:
So, is the Tier 2 Gorgon only supposed to have 1 weapon forward, and none in the turret?

Sure does.

Sure is a really big heavy weapon :)

Sovereign Court *** Venture-Agent, Minnesota—Champlin

James Krolak wrote:

That new starship option is really bad at tier 2, but it actually gets a lot better as you go up from there. I also like the changes to the Drake. Previously, I would never bother with it, but I might actually argue in favor of it after this. Both are still not anywhere near as well built as you can make a ship by the rules, but they're improvements.

I take back my praise of the changes to the Drake. In comparing page for page with the old guide, I can find only 1 or 2 changes. The Tier 2 is an improvement, but you should have continued that emphasis upon turrets for all the higher tiers, as well. Anything that isn't all that maneuverable should have more emphasis upon turrets.

For that matter, when I upgrade or build a ship in our Dead Suns game, I just strip off all other weapon mounts and put the 3 biggest weapons I can in turret mounts. And crank up shields as high as they'll go. Forget about AC, computers, sensors, and the rest as they aren't worth the points.

Shadow Lodge *****

For those of us who have been using a race boon to unlock a legacy race, does this mean that those characters are no longer required to slot that particular personal boon every scenario?


Jason Rapp wrote:

Hmmmm... I'm not seeing this:

Quote:
Rules for applying credit have been relaxed slightly when using pregenerated characters in adventures that require the use of such characters.

Are we still only allowed to drop credit to a brand new character, or is the rule supposed to be the same as the Pathfinder Society Guild Guide, where it can be dropped to any level 1 character?

I'm not seeing any wording changes from 1.0 to 1.1 on the use of pregens and applying credit.

That isn't what that quote is referring to. It refers to:

Quote:
In the case of the scenarios that require you to play a pregenerated character, you can apply the credit to a character who reaches the same Tier as the scenario, such as a 7th- or 8th-level character in the prior example.

This came up with 1-00 (a scenario for which pregens are required) and whether you could apply the credit from the scenario at 3rd level as listed on the chronicle, or if you had to wait until 4th (the level of the pregens).


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Glen Parnell wrote:
@James Don't forget that the Legacy Race boon gives a +2 to one of your stats that is under 16, and that boon is the only way you can have that on an Elf, Half-elf, or Gnome.

That is actually something I was going to ask: how does this change reflect changes to those boons that grant access. Furthermore, is there a difference if you've both played and DM'd a given scenario that grants this access.

Sovereign Court *** Venture-Agent, Minnesota—Champlin

1 person marked this as a favorite.

Man, it is a challenge to find all the little changes throughout the Guide. I'm literally looking at the old one and the new one side-by-side going one page at a time looking for what headings and paragraphs don't like up the same. It sure would be nice if changes would be highlighted in red like in Additional Resources.


James Krolak wrote:
James Krolak wrote:

That new starship option is really bad at tier 2, but it actually gets a lot better as you go up from there. I also like the changes to the Drake. Previously, I would never bother with it, but I might actually argue in favor of it after this. Both are still not anywhere near as well built as you can make a ship by the rules, but they're improvements.

I take back my praise of the changes to the Drake. In comparing page for page with the old guide, I can find only 1 or 2 changes. The Tier 2 is an improvement, but you should have continued that emphasis upon turrets for all the higher tiers, as well. Anything that isn't all that maneuverable should have more emphasis upon turrets.

For that matter, when I upgrade or build a ship in our Dead Suns game, I just strip off all other weapon mounts and put the 3 biggest weapons I can in turret mounts. And crank up shields as high as they'll go. Forget about AC, computers, sensors, and the rest as they aren't worth the points.

I seem to recall that the number of possible turrets is determined by the frame of the ship, and you can't really just slap turrets everywhere.

Sovereign Court *** Venture-Agent, Minnesota—Champlin

Dracomicron wrote:
James Krolak wrote:
James Krolak wrote:

That new starship option is really bad at tier 2, but it actually gets a lot better as you go up from there. I also like the changes to the Drake. Previously, I would never bother with it, but I might actually argue in favor of it after this. Both are still not anywhere near as well built as you can make a ship by the rules, but they're improvements.

I take back my praise of the changes to the Drake. In comparing page for page with the old guide, I can find only 1 or 2 changes. The Tier 2 is an improvement, but you should have continued that emphasis upon turrets for all the higher tiers, as well. Anything that isn't all that maneuverable should have more emphasis upon turrets.

For that matter, when I upgrade or build a ship in our Dead Suns game, I just strip off all other weapon mounts and put the 3 biggest weapons I can in turret mounts. And crank up shields as high as they'll go. Forget about AC, computers, sensors, and the rest as they aren't worth the points.

I seem to recall that the number of possible turrets is determined by the frame of the ship, and you can't really just slap turrets everywhere.

Yes, but a Medium ship can have 3 turrets, which is way more than you see on any of the ships in the Guide--and is more than enough unless you somehow have 4+ gunners. Here's the text from the CRB:

Tiny and Small starships can have only two weapon mounts per arc (and per turret). Medium and Large starships can have only three weapon mounts per arc (and per turret). Huge and larger starships can have only four weapon mounts per arc (and per turret).

Grand Lodge ***** Regional Venture-Coordinator, Great Lakes aka TwilightKnight

James Krolak wrote:
Starship stuff

Sounds like a lot of philosophical differences that not everyone is going to agree with. Personally, I find the updated version/s to be just fine. I would actually be disappointed if they were simply min-max'ed, hyper-optimized gun boats, even though in character my vesk soldier would prefer that to any other configuration.


James Krolak wrote:
Dracomicron wrote:
James Krolak wrote:
James Krolak wrote:

That new starship option is really bad at tier 2, but it actually gets a lot better as you go up from there. I also like the changes to the Drake. Previously, I would never bother with it, but I might actually argue in favor of it after this. Both are still not anywhere near as well built as you can make a ship by the rules, but they're improvements.

I take back my praise of the changes to the Drake. In comparing page for page with the old guide, I can find only 1 or 2 changes. The Tier 2 is an improvement, but you should have continued that emphasis upon turrets for all the higher tiers, as well. Anything that isn't all that maneuverable should have more emphasis upon turrets.

For that matter, when I upgrade or build a ship in our Dead Suns game, I just strip off all other weapon mounts and put the 3 biggest weapons I can in turret mounts. And crank up shields as high as they'll go. Forget about AC, computers, sensors, and the rest as they aren't worth the points.

I seem to recall that the number of possible turrets is determined by the frame of the ship, and you can't really just slap turrets everywhere.

Yes, but a Medium ship can have 3 turrets, which is way more than you see on any of the ships in the Guide--and is more than enough unless you somehow have 4+ gunners. Here's the text from the CRB:

Tiny and Small starships can have only two weapon mounts per arc (and per turret). Medium and Large starships can have only three weapon mounts per arc (and per turret). Huge and larger starships can have only four weapon mounts per arc (and per turret).

You're reading that wrong, I think. It's three weapon mounts PER TURRET. The mediums only get one turret, but you can slap three guns in there. I mean, it might mean something similar, functionally, but I don't think that it's multiple turrets.

Grand Lodge ***** Regional Venture-Coordinator, Great Lakes aka TwilightKnight

Dracomicron wrote:
You're reading that wrong, I think...

Hmmm. Having multiple weapons mounted in the same turret seems odd to me. If they targeted differnt things (energy vs projectile vs area blast, etc) it might be reasonable. The problem is realistically all the weapons will have to be fired at the same target. The time it takes to target is part of the action round. If you allow 2+ weapons on the same turret to fire in the same round but at different targets, that's a lot of turret rotation being added to the "normal" amount of time.

It makes more sense to limit a turret to one weapon mount (unless the ideas above is valid) and use multiple turrets. Have the designers commented on this topic anywhere? Seems like its not really an OP issue.

Dark Archive **** Venture-Agent, Australia—QLD—Brisbane aka YogoZuno

So...if I understand correctly, now that the legacy races are always available, if I were to apply a race boon for one of the legacy races, I could now take up the 'Existing...' option, and get an extra +2 to a stat? Is that correct?


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Dracomicron wrote:
You're reading that wrong, I think. It's three weapon mounts PER TURRET. The mediums only get one turret, but you can slap three guns in there. I mean, it might mean something similar, functionally, but I don't think that it's multiple turrets.

There's only one turret area in any ship, but the amount of mounts you can place is dependable on the frame size.

A medium ship has one turret area with room for 3 weapon mounts, which should be occupied as soon as possible with the best heavy weapons possible.

* ⦵⦵⦵

2 people marked this as a favorite.
Starfinder Superscriber

I'm not seeing adjustment rules for existing legacy race characters.

Can such characters retroactively add a +2 to an ability score 14 or lower? What about such characters that have already added a +2 to such an ability score?

... and how about those of us who earned the RSP GM Incentive #1 classic race boon?

Certainly this isn't intended to simply nullify that boon for all the GMs who helped launch SFS. Some GMs are still working to complete that since anyone who GM'ed prior to the cutoff are still able to continue filling it out until Feb 1 2019.

Wayfinders ***** ⦵⦵

1 person marked this as a favorite.

I want to know what legacy boons do too!


Bob Jonquet wrote:
Dracomicron wrote:
You're reading that wrong, I think...

Hmmm. Having multiple weapons mounted in the same turret seems odd to me. If they targeted differnt things (energy vs projectile vs area blast, etc) it might be reasonable. The problem is realistically all the weapons will have to be fired at the same target. The time it takes to target is part of the action round. If you allow 2+ weapons on the same turret to fire in the same round but at different targets, that's a lot of turret rotation being added to the "normal" amount of time.

It makes more sense to limit a turret to one weapon mount (unless the ideas above is valid) and use multiple turrets. Have the designers commented on this topic anywhere? Seems like its not really an OP issue.

There is no such thing as "turret." There is a turret ARC (just like the forward, port, starboard, and aft arcs), which on a medium ship can fit three weapons. A weapon mounted in the turret arc can shoot in any direction (as opposed to a forward, port, starboard, or aft arc weapon that can only fire in the appropriate arc).

Starfinder Society Developer

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*Between handing out Halloween Candy*

Official Clarification: Characters with any Legacy-race boons prior to the publishing of the Guide can retroactively apply the ability score bonus to a character created prior to this guide update's publishing. The boon no longer occupied a Personal boon slot on your character sheet.

Moderator Note 11/1/18: Since the time of this post, clarification has been made in the above blog post. Please disregard this post and review the updated blog.

Wayfinders ***** ⦵⦵

Thurston Hillman wrote:

*Between handing out Halloween Candy*

Official Clarification: Characters with any Legacy-race boons prior to the publishing of the Guide can retroactively apply the ability score bonus to a character created prior to this guide update's publishing. The boon no longer occupied a Personal boon slot on your character sheet.

SQUEEEEEEE!

Thank you, Thursty!

Exo-Guardians ***** ⦵⦵

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♫ Nanananana Bat Elf! ♫

The masked crusader swings into the thread after handing out Halloween candy of her own. "Hello, Bat Friends! We are proud to announce that as of today, the Bat Elf show is more awesome than ever!"


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Thurston Hillman wrote:
Characters with any Legacy-race boons prior to the publishing of the Guide can retroactively apply the ability score bonus to a character created prior to this guide update's publishing. The boon no longer occupied a Personal boon slot on your character sheet.

Thanks for the update, Thurston. But, for further clarification's sake:

1) How does this apply to people who have played a relevant scenario but not created a character for it yet?

2) How does this apply to people who have played AND GM'd a relevant scenario but not created a character for it yet?

3) Are the boons for relevant scenarios going to change with the new ruling? (This is why I bolded what I did up there.)

4) As Arc Riley mentioned above, how does this work with the RSP GM Incentive #1 classic race boon?

5) And for the charity boon James Krolak mentioned above, and those like it, which don't have the additional +2, how is that affected, if at all?

(Just trying to put all the questions in one place. And probably failing, but hey, at least I'm trying.)

* ⦵⦵⦵

Starfinder Superscriber
Thurston Hillman wrote:

*Between handing out Halloween Candy*

Official Clarification: Characters with any Legacy-race boons prior to the publishing of the Guide can retroactively apply the ability score bonus to a character created prior to this guide update's publishing. The boon no longer occupied a Personal boon slot on your character sheet.

Ok, so a few more clarifications needed;

RSP GM Incentive #1 doesn't offer a +2 ability score option. Should we treat the boon as if it does?

I know other people also have applied two copies of the same chronicle sheet to one PC to gain the +2 benefit; eg stacking copies of chronicle sheets from playing then GMing #1-09 to create a Dwarf with a +2 ability score.

Since those boons' +2 ability score option says "A character can earn this benefit from this boon only once", should a +2 bonus be applied to a different ability score, or should the player "detach" the second copy of the chronicle sheet (making no changes to the character since the first copy now provides the +2 bonus) and have the second sheet available to apply to a different character of that race?

Shadow Lodge ****

My downloads still displays the old 1.0 starfinder field guide

**

ShadowDax wrote:
My downloads still displays the old 1.0 starfinder field guide

It displayed as the old 2017 release in My Downloads as well, but after I downloaded the guide it was the new one and refreshed the date in My Downloads as well.

Starfinder Society Developer

I don't want to make an official clarification on all the points yet.

But the intent I have in mind is that this only affects Chronicles that indicate a +2 bonus was available as an option. I recognize this penalizes some of the older Chronicle sheets, but those were also the Chronicles that were out in the wilds for the longest period of time.

Overall, I'm concerned that by doing this with legacy boons, we're pigeon-holing ourselves into a position where every future race suddenly gets a similar clarification and suddenly there's a whole bunch of +2 stat bonuses floating around that de-value the appeal of Core Races. The original idea behind the +2 was that we could give some value to these boons knowing that other methods for accessing them would be available. Now, by retroactively giving out this bonus to all people who previously got the boon I'm worried that people will expect it in all future instances.

This is something I'm going to bring up internally as well and figure out how we want to handle some of the specific instances.

Sovereign Court **** ⦵⦵⦵⦵ Venture-Agent, Georgia—Atlanta aka The Masked Ferret

Any word on what the 5 nova requirements are going to be? It would really help to know...

* ⦵⦵⦵

Starfinder Superscriber

The easiest solution for stacked up chronicle sheets for the classic races would be to clarify that "A character can earn this benefit from this boon only once" means you cannot stack two +2 boons on the same PC, allow players who did that to "detach" the 2nd sheet and apply it to a different future PC.

That would result in no change in stats for PCs already using two copies of a chronicle sheet and nothing "wasted" compared to players who applied two copies of chronicle sheets to different PCs.

RSP GM Incentive #1 isn't an old boon - there's lots of GMs who ran games last Fall and put a lot of the early recruitment work that's made SFS the success that it is, but who are still working to unlock the boon. Again, that boon applies to games until Feb 1 2019 - its still active!

I can understand not wanting a ton of +2's floating around. I think most of us would be happy if were retroactively changed to unlock a different race that there isn't a common boon for, like a Space Goblin. Space Goblin would be especially thematic given that Goblins are a core race in Pathfinder 2.0.

It would not be very cool to us early GMs to nullify it.

Grand Lodge ***** Regional Venture-Coordinator, Great Lakes aka TwilightKnight

Arc Riley wrote:
...given that Goblins may be a core race in Pathfinder 2.0

Fixed that for ya ;-)

Remember, 2E is still in Playtest mode so nothing is yet determined. I think most would agree there is a very strong inclination that goblins will be making it into the CRB, it is not definite yet. We should be careful making any rules decisions that utilize comparisons to 2E in its current state.

Personally, I just don't want to see legacy races incentivized over alien races. I've already experienced a table where I was the only one not playing a legacy race. It just did not feel as Starfindery.


A couple of minor problems

- Guide is still unclear on if the chronicle from a higher level SCENARIO played by pregen can be applied to a first level character.
"You can apply adventure credit from a higher-level sanctioned module or Adventure Path" on p. 8.
"may choose to apply this Chronicle sheet to a 1st-level character by
reducing this value to 720 credits for completing a scenario" on p. 16

- No rule on auto-recharging the batteries is listed (unless this rule is revoked). A news post containing this info which is a year old is quite hard to find now.

Scarab Sages Venture-Agent aka CptJames

Thurston Hillman wrote:

I don't want to make an official clarification on all the points yet.

But the intent I have in mind is that this only affects Chronicles that indicate a +2 bonus was available as an option. I recognize this penalizes some of the older Chronicle sheets, but those were also the Chronicles that were out in the wilds for the longest period of time.

Overall, I'm concerned that by doing this with legacy boons, we're pigeon-holing ourselves into a position where every future race suddenly gets a similar clarification and suddenly there's a whole bunch of +2 stat bonuses floating around that de-value the appeal of Core Races. The original idea behind the +2 was that we could give some value to these boons knowing that other methods for accessing them would be available. Now, by retroactively giving out this bonus to all people who previously got the boon I'm worried that people will expect it in all future instances.

This is something I'm going to bring up internally as well and figure out how we want to handle some of the specific instances.

I'd really love to hear about this.

The reasoning behind it for me is this:

Played the scenario #1-09 to get a Dwarf. Made a Dwarf using the chronicle. Now that Dwarf gets a +2 bonus retroactively with a free personal slot? Is that how it's written?

Now, I have also GM'ed that same scenario and gotten the same chronicle before the new guide came out. Does this enable me now to attach that same boon in the Personal slot and get an additional +2? Because as I read what you are saying I can do that?

Very confusing...any help would be much appreciated!

Sovereign Court **** Venture-Lieutenant, Netherlands—Leiden aka Ascalaphus

Thurston Hillman wrote:
Glen Parnell wrote:
So, is the Tier 2 Gorgon only supposed to have 1 weapon forward, and none in the turret?

Sure does.

Sure is a really big heavy weapon :)

But it has less armor than the Pegasus, less shields, Turn 2 and Speed 4. Isn't this just going to be a case of "we sit there trying to turn in the one direction we can hit them, they fly around us and slowly kill us"?

Sovereign Court **** ⦵⦵⦵⦵ Venture-Agent, Georgia—Atlanta aka The Masked Ferret

Lau Bannenberg wrote:
Thurston Hillman wrote:
Glen Parnell wrote:
So, is the Tier 2 Gorgon only supposed to have 1 weapon forward, and none in the turret?

Sure does.

Sure is a really big heavy weapon :)

But it has less armor than the Pegasus, less shields, Turn 2 and Speed 4. Isn't this just going to be a case of "we sit there trying to turn in the one direction we can hit them, they fly around us and slowly kill us"?

Turn In Place all the time?

Even then, proper shield management could help... And it depends on quality and luck of the gunner. Average damage is 22, which blows through most shields at this level.

* ⦵⦵⦵

Starfinder Superscriber
James Hargrave wrote:
Played the scenario #1-09 to get a Dwarf. Made a Dwarf using the chronicle. Now that Dwarf gets a +2 bonus retroactively with a free personal slot? Is that how it's written?

Yes. Thurston gave an official clarification on this earlier in this thread:

Thurston Hillman wrote:
Official Clarification: Characters with any Legacy-race boons prior to the publishing of the Guide can retroactively apply the ability score bonus to a character created prior to this guide update's publishing. The boon no longer occupied a Personal boon slot on your character sheet.

I have a half-orc and dwarf in the same boat; #1-06 and #1-09 respectively were used to create PCs of the respective races but nothing else, so I can retroactively add a +2 to any ability score 14 or less as if I had originally used the second boon option.

James Hargrave wrote:
Now, I have also GM'ed that same scenario and gotten the same chronicle before the new guide came out. Does this enable me now to attach that same boon in the Personal slot and get an additional +2?

My reading of the second boon option is that you cannot use multiple copies of the boon to get +2 more than once. Quoting the boon itself: "A character can earn this benefit from this boon only once."

But this is one of the things we're awaiting official clarification on since many players already had stacked the same boon in the way you described to get a single +2 bonus, but now have two of the same boon on a PC when they only need one to get the +2 bonus they've already applied.

Sovereign Court **** Venture-Lieutenant, Netherlands—Leiden aka Ascalaphus

Turn in place only works if you win initiative. So to make the Gorgon 2 work, you have to have the best pilot to be able to just sit there and face the one direction you can shoot in.

Otherwise, all they have to do is avoid one of your narrower arcs and you can't do anything at all.

Let me be clear: I like ships that don't rely too much on the turret, because it leads to more mobile combat where you're angling for the best shot instead of just sitting there trading broadsides. But to have a mobile combat you have to be actually mobile. And even then, putting all your eggs in the forward arc is not a pleasant decision. It sucks if you have two people who want to (or can only, because of class) play gunner. Or if the enemy is also nimble.

I like "any arc good, one arc better", not "if it's not that arc then just twiddle your thumbs".

Scarab Sages Venture-Agent aka CptJames

Arc Riley wrote:
James Hargrave wrote:
Now, I have also GM'ed that same scenario and gotten the same chronicle before the new guide came out. Does this enable me now to attach that same boon in the Personal slot and get an additional +2?

My reading of the second boon option is that you cannot use multiple copies of the boon to get +2 more than once. Quoting the boon itself: "A character can earn this benefit from this boon only once."

But this is one of the things we're awaiting official clarification on since many players already had stacked the same boon in the way you described to get a single +2 bonus, but now have two of the same boon on a PC when they only need one to get the +2 bonus they've already applied.

Thanks for the clarification regarding the top bit! Free +2!

So I believe as my first boon was to make a character, and that now goes away and I get a +2. I can add the second boon (which I hadn't done yet), which goes into the personal slot, to get a +2 bonus because "A character can earn this benefit from this boon only once."

I haven't earned this bonus from the first boon, as that was "New Character" not "Existing Character". So this would be the first time I gain this benefit.

Aka I get 2x +2 and it's perfectly fine?

If I wanted to add a 3rd boon (say GM or Play again with Nova replay) then I would understand that needs further clarification!

That's how I understand it anyway.

* ⦵⦵⦵

Starfinder Superscriber
James Hargrave wrote:

So I believe as my first boon was to make a character, and that now goes away and I get a +2. I can add the second boon (which I hadn't done yet), which goes into the personal slot, to get a +2 bonus because "A character can earn this benefit from this boon only once."

I haven't earned this bonus from the first boon, as that was "New Character" not "Existing Character". So this would be the first time I gain this benefit.

Thurston's clarification doesn't grant a new +2 ability score boost, its that since we no longer need that boon to play the race we can retroactively switch our choice on how to use the boon to the second option. This was made more clear when he wrote that intended this only for boons that permit a +2 ability score boost on an existing legacy race:

Thurston Hillman wrote:
But the intent I have in mind is that this only affects Chronicles that indicate a +2 bonus was available as an option.

For now it'd be safest to wait for further official clarifications on how the organized play team would like to handle this. We've been asking for clarification on this for a few months now but hopefully now that the guild guide is out they can focus on it more.

As much as I'd like final closure on this topic we're also still waiting for the promised new RSP 10% boon and an update to Additional Resources, both of which affect a lot more people.

Scarab Sages Venture-Agent aka CptJames

Arc Riley wrote:
James Hargrave wrote:

So I believe as my first boon was to make a character, and that now goes away and I get a +2. I can add the second boon (which I hadn't done yet), which goes into the personal slot, to get a +2 bonus because "A character can earn this benefit from this boon only once."

I haven't earned this bonus from the first boon, as that was "New Character" not "Existing Character". So this would be the first time I gain this benefit.

Thurston's clarification doesn't grant a new +2 ability score boost, its that since we no longer need that boon to play the race we can retroactively switch our choice on how to use the boon to the second option. This was made more clear when he wrote that intended this only for boons that permit a +2 ability score boost on an existing legacy race:

Thurston Hillman wrote:
But the intent I have in mind is that this only affects Chronicles that indicate a +2 bonus was available as an option.

For now it'd be safest to wait for further official clarifications on how the organized play team would like to handle this. We've been asking for clarification on this for a few months now but hopefully now that the guild guide is out they can focus on it more.

As much as I'd like final closure on this topic we're also still waiting for the promised new RSP 10% boon and an update to Additional Resources, both of which affect a lot more people.

Ahhhh gotcha. So it's now "Existing Character" for a +2. Gotcha.

Arc Riley wrote:

I know other people also have applied two copies of the same chronicle sheet to one PC to gain the +2 benefit; eg stacking copies of chronicle sheets from playing then GMing #1-09 to create a Dwarf with a +2 ability score.

Since those boons' +2 ability score option says "A character can earn this benefit from this boon only once", should a +2 bonus be applied to a different ability score, or should the player "detach" the second copy of the chronicle sheet (making no changes to the character since the first copy now provides the +2 bonus) and have the second sheet available to apply to a different character of that race?

This makes more sense now. Cheers.

Sovereign Court **** Venture-Lieutenant, Netherlands—Leiden aka Ascalaphus

Was it intended that the tier 6 and 8 Drake have weapons on Port but not Starboard?

Dark Archive ***

Lau Bannenberg wrote:
Was it intended that the tier 6 and 8 Drake have weapons on Port but not Starboard?

Shoot left because evil is never right? Possible if they ran out of build points..


2 people marked this as a favorite.

I think that the big thing about the adjustment for Legacy races is that they can get a +2 to a stat AND still have an open Personal boon slot. There are some really nice non-race Personal boons that have come out recently, and I am very glad that I will be able to apply one to my Dwarf Operative/Mystic from Salvation's End, even if I effectively "lose" one of the two 1-09 boons I used to make her.

The benefit for having the race boon early is to actually be able to play the race before anyone who didn't have the boon. Does that kinda leave people who hoard the boons in a lurch? Yeah, kinda. Snooze = Lose, for lack of a more sensitive response.

That said, if Thursty & Co. were to listen to me (and I am pretty great, so why not), my suggestion would be to make a GM Incentive Legacy Race Boon that players can trade with their VC, effectively turning in their old, unused one and getting the new, updated boon in its place.

Sovereign Court **** Venture-Lieutenant, Netherlands—Leiden aka Ascalaphus

Dracomicron wrote:
The benefit for having the race boon early is to actually be able to play the race before anyone who didn't have the boon. Does that kinda leave people who hoard the boons in a lurch? Yeah, kinda. Snooze = Lose, for lack of a more sensitive response.

I think it's important to manage these expectations.

I'm very much in favor of "(convention) race boons give early access". It's a compromise between "we need a big incentive for people to do X" and "people who live nowhere X never get a chance to play Y". Use the cool new race as a convention boon this year, and as a choice on the RSP GM reward menu the year after for example.

IIRC that legacy races would get opened up more was foreshadowed over a year ago, but I don't really remember where and when exactly. Clearly, not everyone got that memo. So, expectation management.

Starfinder Society Developer

2 people marked this as a favorite.

I think I have some solutions to these issues. Again, I'm waiting to bounce them off some people internally.

That being said, my prior clarification above (hooray, making updates while in Halloween mode... not a good idea!) puts RSP boons and Legacy Boons earned from scenarios on the same footing. This should NOT be the case. I'm looking at something that will give the RSP Legacy boon recipients a small boost, while those who earned these from scenarios can just swap out the "new character" option to the "existing" option to earn the ability score boost but still take-up the Personal boon slot to avoid the +4 ability score issue I want to avoid.

That way no one loses anything. The RSP folks get recognized with a buff, and new (scenario earned) Legacy Race earners are on the same footing as those who've been hoarding them. Which, honestly, was my intent all along.

Starfinder Society Developer

The blog has been updated to include a more correct clarification on how to handle prior Legacy Race boons. This recognizes the importance of our RSP and convention goers, while also not taking anything away from people who'd previously received boons in scenarios.

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