Goblins!

Monday, April 2, 2018

Ever since the goblin song from page 12 of 2007's Pathfinder Adventure Path #1: Burnt Offerings, goblins have been a key part of what makes Pathfinder recognizable as Pathfinder. When we first started looking at what would become the ancestries in the Pathfinder Playtest Rulebook, we knew that we wanted to add something to the mix, to broaden the horizon of what it meant to be a hero in Pathfinder. That naturally brought us to goblins.

The trick was finding a way to let you play a goblin who has the feel of a Pathfinder goblin, but who is also a little bit softer around the edges—a character who has a reason to work with a group of "longshanks," as opposed to trying to light them on fire at the first opportunity. Let's look at an excerpt from the goblin ancestry to find out a bit more.

Illustration by Wayne Reynolds

As a people, goblins have spent millennia feared, maligned, and even hunted—and sometimes for understandable reasons, as some rural goblin tribes still often direct cruelty, raiding, and mayhem toward wandering or vulnerable creatures. In recent decades, however, a new sort of hero has emerged from among these rough-and-tumble tribes. Such goblins bear the same oversized heads, pointed ears, red eyes, and jagged teeth of their crueler kin, but they have a noble or savvy streak that other goblins can't even imagine, let alone understand. These erstwhile heroes roam Golarion, often maintaining their distinctive cultural habits while spreading the enthusiasm, inscrutable quirkiness, love of puns and song, and unique mirth that mark goblin adventurers.

Despite breaking from their destructive past, goblin adventurers often subtly perpetuate some of the qualities that have been characteristics of the creatures for millennia. They tend to flock to strong leaders, and fiercely protect those companions who have protected them from physical harm or who offer a sympathetic ear and sage advice when they learn of the goblins' woes. Some goblins remain deeply fascinated with fire, or fearlessly devour meals that might turn others' stomachs. Others are inveterate tinkerers and view their companions' trash as components of gadgets yet to be made. Occasionally, fellow adventurers find these proclivities unsettling or odd, but more often than not goblins' friends consider these qualities endearing.

The entry in the Pathfinder Playtest Rulebook has plenty more to say on the topic, but that should give you a sense of where we are taking Pathfinder's favorite troublemakers.

In addition to the story behind the goblin, its ancestry entry has a lot of other information as well to help you make a goblin player character. It includes the base goblin ability boosts (Dexterity and Charisma), ability flaw (Wisdom), bonus Hit Points (6), base speed (25 feet), and starting languages (Common and Goblin), as well as the rules for darkvision (an ability that lets goblins see in the dark just as well as they can see in normal light). Those are just the basics—the rules shared by all goblins. Beyond that, your goblin's unique ancestry allows you to choose one ability score other than Dexterity or Charisma to receive a boost. Perhaps you have some hobgoblin blood and have an additional boost to Constitution, or you descend from a long line of goblin alchemists and have a boost to Intelligence. You could even gain a boost in Wisdom to negate your flaw!

Then you get into the goblin ancestry feats, which allow you to decide what type of goblin you want to play. Starting off, let's look at Burn It. This feat gives you a bonus to damage whenever you cast a fire spell or deal fire damage with an alchemical item. On top of that, it also increases any persistent fire damage you deal by 1. Goblins still love watching things burn.

Next up is one of my favorites, Junk Tinkerer. A goblin with this feat can craft ordinary items and weapons out of junk and scrap they can find almost anywhere. Sure, the items are of poor quality and break easily, but you will never be without a weapon if you have this feat.

We could not have goblins in the game without adding the Razor Teeth feat. This grants you an attack with your mouthful of razor-sharp teeth that deals 1d6 piercing damage. To be honest, the target of your attack should probably also attempt a Fortitude save against whatever you ate last night that is still stuck between your teeth, but we'll leave that for the GM to decide.

Finally, there is the appropriately named feat Very Sneaky. This lets you move 5 feet farther when you take an action to sneak (which normally lets you move at only half your normal speed) and potentially renders your target flat-footed against a follow-up strike!

There are plenty of other goblin feats for you to choose from, but that's all we have time for today. Come back on Friday when we'll look at some of the feats from the other ancestries in the game!

Jason Bulmahn
Director of Game Design

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Tags: Pathfinder Playtest Wayne Reynolds
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Okay so, first we are going to waste pace in the corebook for a gimmicky race, that a sizable fraction of the consumers base does not want there.

My personal problems are that:

1) This space could have been used for a race deserving the spot or deepening the existing ones.
2) I don't play in golarion, in my opinion it is the worst professionally published setting in DnD history. Now that is normally no skin off my back. But this seems to indicate that goblin mechanics will be tied deeply to golarion. Which essentially means that it will be really hard for me to use ANY goblins PC or no.
3) The attitude of the developpers. "We know better than you" is not the correct attitude to have. Especially when it has time and time again been shown that you infact don't.
4) Motive, this is clearly a marketing move nothing more. So now marketing is more important than actually creating a good game. That is again not a good attitude to have.


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If core races were decided by popularity, one ought to right away take the knife and cut both gnomes and halflings from the book right away and put catfolk and tieflings there. That statement was based on pure anecdotal evidence, but still.

Also the question, for Pathfinder to finally leave the last remnants of the DnD nest. Goblins actually feel less inconsequential than gnomes or half-elves in how they manifest in the fictional setting. I guess every other AP does have some gnome in a fancy hat and with big facial hair as quirky character, but they are so marginal. So what the heck are even core races? What does it MEAN to be a core race? It cannot be importance, because half of the classic core setup barely counts then!


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Gobo PCs don't really fit into the stories that I tell. At least the Gobo rules will be easy to ignore.

Scarab Sages

Durvin Gest wrote:
Tallow wrote:
I guarantee that if Goblins are legal for PFS2, I won't be GMing for it.
But, what about me? I'm a good goblin. Hero of the Pathfinder Society in fact :-D

<zerbert>

Silver Crusade

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Pathfinder Adventure, Adventure Path, Companion, Lost Omens, Rulebook, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game, Starfinder Society Subscriber
Kalindlara wrote:
eddv wrote:
I mean widespread rejection is going to have to be pretty universal for them to get the full dumpster treatment because the rulebook art has the goblin alchemist and I suspect they have already paid Wayne Reynolds his fee for the art of the guy and so they most likely intend to use it hell or highwater like Tangent is suggesting.
Indeed. The sheer amount of commissioned art so far pretty much guarantees that this isn't changing.

And there's going to be plenty more :3

*rubs hands together*


John Ryan 783 wrote:
Dαedαlus wrote:

I still am not a fan of Goblin PCs. This blog does nothing to change that. It adds a level of handwavium that shouldn’t be present in Core races.

That said, getting a bit of info about how races will be handled is interesting, but really my biggest takeaway is this:

Charisma!? Really?

Charisma a huge change, as in 1st edition it is the stat they lose out on. Going from -2 to +2 is pretty big. Did all goblins get mind controlled into better manners?

I'm thinking that the idea behind it is that a Goblin that has the ability to buck their upbringing has a pretty strong force of personality to do it. If that's the interpretation then I think it's a reasonable mechanical reflection


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Corrik wrote:
Frosty Ace wrote:


Them being a core race that's just chaotic??? is more fun and interesting than, "Oh. They're green with teeth. They must be evil." Which is... kind of dumb, honestly. Sacred cow levels of dumb. Imo anyway.
They don't read, educate themselves, or conduct any other real activity of civilization. They are depicted as near mindless monsters who do nothing but revel in chaos and violence. Whose greatest cultural achievement is coming up with a song to chant while they raid villages.

So primitive humans then? The further back in time you go, the more monstrous humans are. It's not like the acts depicted by any race in this world were never done by any other race or irl humanity itself.

I get that you want Orcs to be core, but there is no need to be upset with people that are happy to play Goblins because they like them, or to try to invalidate their excitement that they're core now.

Edit: Ironically my "green with teeth" statement was also about Orcs. Haha.


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Envall wrote:
So what the heck are even core races? What does it MEAN to be a core race? It cannot be importance, because half of the classic core setup barely counts then!

In the very least, core races are a common sight at taverns.

Silver Crusade

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Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber
Corrik wrote:
Envall wrote:
So what the heck are even core races? What does it MEAN to be a core race? It cannot be importance, because half of the classic core setup barely counts then!
In the very least, core races are a common sight at taverns.

Really? I was under the impression that an average Pathfinder tavern is 40% humans, 20% kitsune, 20% aasimar/tieflings, 10% elves/half-elves, 5% everything else + 1 token dwarf.


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Gorbacz wrote:
Corrik wrote:
Envall wrote:
So what the heck are even core races? What does it MEAN to be a core race? It cannot be importance, because half of the classic core setup barely counts then!
In the very least, core races are a common sight at taverns.
Really? I was under the impression that an average Pathfinder tavern is 40% humans, 20% kitsune, 20% aasimar/tieflings, 10% elves/half-elves, 5% everything else + 1 token dwarf.

Population demographics will change the population layout, as will personal PC choice. However in the average fantasy tavern, one would not be surprised to see a Dwarf, Elf, Gnome, Half-Elf, Half-Orc, Halfling, or Human. Goblins are on the list now. Maybe every tavern will suddenly have a token Goblin?


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I personally am intrigued by the ancestry and ancestry feats; as it gives hopes for a flashbang style halo feat for aasimars, a tail fighting one for tieflings and some sort of jewel encrusted ancestry for an oread (with bonus to charisma obviously).
As for having Goblins as core. Get over it. I mean what about your half orcs raised by orcs? are they stigmatized and no less dangerous?
Also I kinda want to make either a goblin unaware of his heritage (think orphaned and raised by a blind Oracle in the middle of nowhere), or a hellknight's 'squire' (see slave/fodder)


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I'd be completely ok losing the halflings and gnomes. The first are incredibly stuffed with derivative lore, and the latter can't quite escape "the zany" foisted onto them by Dragonlance. So into the hopper they go!

And I don't plan on watering down any goblins I'm playing - I'll sneak, sing (and rhyme badly, crudely), hate horses and dogs, eat baby dogs, make trashquipment (heck I do that in real life) and generally be somewhat mad. I might not focus on the burning stuff, as I find that a little boring, and I think I could induce the little beggar to read and draw, as all peoples should lose their irrational fears (of gob...things) and superstitions. Could even tone down the mad, or ramp it way up into vague derangement - that should work for a sorceror, barbarian, ecstatic paladin etc...


Actually, we need halflings and gnomes so goblins can disguise themselves as those races OR EVERY TOWN GUARD WILL MURDER THEM FOR THEIR EARS COZ THEY EAT BAYBEEZ. Or pickles. Pickled punks?

Silver Crusade

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Well this blew up overnight. All I'll say at this point is that I'm looking forward to playing and running games for goblin PCs. Should be fun!


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Corrik wrote:


Population demographics will change the population layout, as will personal PC choice. However in the average fantasy tavern, one would not be surprised to see a Dwarf, Elf, Gnome, Half-Elf, Half-Orc, Halfling, or Human. Goblins are on the list now. Maybe every tavern will suddenly have a token Goblin?

Dwarves, elves and half-orcs are still very rare. Core race in this case does not mean common place race. Your average tavern is still mostly full of men, maybe with a group of halflings in the corner.

Silver Crusade

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I fall into the "normal parties aren't even really that morally good if you thinl about it so why does having a goblin in the party bother you so much when you have a half orc barbarian smashing everything and a rogue stealing everything that isn't nailed down camp."

I mean they're called murder hobos for gods' sakes. If a goblin isn't that then I don't know what is.


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Damn, I could go for some pickles...


Gorbacz wrote:
Laird IceCubez wrote:

Didn't Paizo say they didn't want to include Gunslinger as a core class due to some people not liking gun rules even though they are an offiical part of Golarion lore.

Now they're adding goblins as a core race. Kinda odd they couldn't do the same with guns, it's been 10 years, technology spreads.

D&D playerbase's vehement dislike of getting gunpowder (or any other post-medieval tech, for that matter) into fantasy settings won't go away quickly. You will be flying jetpacks and teleporting across the planet, yet D&D players will still cry foul if you try to force firearms down their throats.

If Paizo would announce Gunslingers going core, you'd have a 2k posts long thread on that by now ... and an inevitable mixing in of real-world politics, because the times we live in.

Goblins are much safer :)

Not just D&D. And even if they do not use gunpowder but are just some ballistae like weapons that look like guns it generates a s**tstorm.

For all the differences RPGs are a lot alike in that regard^^


I for one am looking forward both to having goblin PCs to mess with and playing with and as them. If nothing else the amount of vitriol in this thread thrown their way just makes it extra appealing to me.


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I don't have a "problem" with goblin PCs. Personally I'm pretty much an "everything goes" sort of GM. If they players what to play something and can come up with a decent explanation, backstory, what have you, I say do it.

Having said that, I don't know if goblin PCs "work" on Golarion as a whole. They've always been described as pests at best, rampaging kill monkeys at worst. And they really tend towards the worst.

But I'll wait and see what's in the playtest.


lowfyr01 wrote:
Gorbacz wrote:
Laird IceCubez wrote:

Didn't Paizo say they didn't want to include Gunslinger as a core class due to some people not liking gun rules even though they are an offiical part of Golarion lore.

Now they're adding goblins as a core race. Kinda odd they couldn't do the same with guns, it's been 10 years, technology spreads.

D&D playerbase's vehement dislike of getting gunpowder (or any other post-medieval tech, for that matter) into fantasy settings won't go away quickly. You will be flying jetpacks and teleporting across the planet, yet D&D players will still cry foul if you try to force firearms down their throats.

If Paizo would announce Gunslingers going core, you'd have a 2k posts long thread on that by now ... and an inevitable mixing in of real-world politics, because the times we live in.

Goblins are much safer :)

Not just D&D. And even if they do not use gunpowder but are just some ballistae like weapons that look like guns it generates a s**tstorm.

For all the differences RPGs are a lot alike in that regard^^

Hey Ferb, I know what we're gonna do today!


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2 things from me:

One, I seriously hope there is a good explanation that somehow fits with keeping Goblins the way they have been previously portrayed, WHILE simultaneously allowing for at least a decent reason as to why some would be heroic/not crapbags.
Maybe something like one particular community of Goblins did something good/noble/heroic/helpful, so most PC Goblins are from that Community, or at least inspired to be different by it, and the rest are still mostly psychotic murderers? Still not enough to make them Core, but...

Also, firmly in the camp that Charisma isn't the best choice for them. I know they're not "traditionally" Intelligent, but they Tinker and are sometimes crafty and one is the Iconic ALCHEMIST. How is it not a +2 Intelligence?

Anyway, excited for PF 2E, wish it was Kobolds though.


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Pathfinder Card Game, Companion, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game, Starfinder Society Subscriber; Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Charter Superscriber

I dig the ancestry idea, and the potential I see.

I would rather not see goblins as a core race. It doesn't seem to support the spirit of DnD that Pathfinder has so wonderfully managed to continue forward. But I do realize there are people that dig the whole goblin as PC thing, so I suggest making them available in a supplement for folks that want them.

Personally, this isn't a huge deal for me, as I will simply ban them (as PCs)from my home games.


eddv wrote:
Yossarian wrote:

Having thought about it more:

All good with the race being playable. It was already if you wanted it to be.

My worry is more of how much this changes APs and Golarion. Having a couple of goblin NPCs that are allies not enemies is one thing, but if we start to see lots of goblins living in human settlements that's going to get weird, fast. Given goblin's are a core race this could happen. Especially for the GMs that don't want too much friendly goblin action (such as myself).

The tricky part will be how the writers respond to this when it comes to AP and lore creation.

That's more or less my biggest non-PFS related concern is that once goblins become part of the cosmopolitan setting they sort of lose their goblinness. Its difficult to imagine goblins living in Absalom y while maintaining say Illiteracy, fear of dogs and horses or even much in the way of pyromania. Those things are just anathema to the idea of living in a metropolis and not ending up dead.

If goblins become tinker gnomes then they aren't really goblins anymore and that sort of seems like the trajectory theyre on. I guess we will just have to see what the lore-team does with them.

Regarding Absalom: Fun fact, horses are something of an oddity there, with camels being more common modes of transport, largely because centaurs and harpies kill/eat them. Doesn't help the rest of it necessarily, I just think it is kinda neat.


Make PF2e's first AP an all-goblin hijinks-infused festival of carnage, mayhem and foolishness. ;)

If they're going to break the mold, shatter it I say. A 3-chapter AP featuring those malevolent little freaks.

This has the added benefit of building in what has previously proven to be a much-needed time buffer to shake out the remaining kinks in the system.


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So nothings change about the race? Goblins are liable to be attacked on sight for being members of a baby eating race PC or not? Why is that core worthy again?

Grand Lodge

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I'm all for goblins being core. It's a nice breath of fresh air to a new system.

Plus there's already at least one settlement where goblins are an accepted part of the community. Thornkeep. They're allowed to come and go and do odd jobs in the town. To me goblins as core is an extension of this.

Dark Archive

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Mbertorch wrote:
Also, firmly in the camp that Charisma isn't the best choice for them. I know they're not "traditionally" Intelligent, but they Tinker and are sometimes crafty and one is the Iconic ALCHEMIST. How is it not a +2 Intelligence?

Goblins have always been averse to literacy and words in general, and according to their race page few are good with tools, so +2 Int wouldn't make much sense. They have also always been the type to act first and think things through later, hence the references to mishaps with fire and the poor decision-making in their initial introduction, so +2 Wis doesn't make sense either. However, goblins do have a love of song and punnery, and the ones that aren't out to burn your house down or raid your village are kind of funny. It's not much of a stretch to have a Charisma bonus, and it certainly makes more sense than the other two (especially Wisdom). Besides, if you want an Int bonus for your goblin the floating third bonus covers that.


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Envall wrote:


Your average tavern is still mostly full of men, maybe with a group of halflings in the corner.

My average tavern sounds like a creepy sausage party.

Silver Crusade

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Pathfinder Adventure, Adventure Path, Companion, Lost Omens, Rulebook, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game, Starfinder Society Subscriber

Aside from the catchy Goblin songs would someone point out where it is exactly that goblins have the reputation of eating babies?


Kobold Cleaver wrote:

Goblins have historically been described as gifted singers, natural bards, and total loudmouths. "Charismatic" doesn't mean pretty, it doesn't mean clever or sensible, and it doesn't even mean pleasant. Goblins have needed to have the Charisma penalty flipped for years. It never made any sense whatsoever.

Moreover, the idea that a large swath of sapient species (usually those in tribal or nomadic societies) are just Pure Evil Uncivilized Brutes has always been pretty unpleasant. It was the product of a pulpy ideal that we needed a number of "savage" races, often coded around old stereotypes for tribal societies and non-European races*, that PCs could have fun killing without any sense of guilt. Moving away from it can only be an improvement.

Frankly, that we're fretting about "Drizz't Kender Goblins" in a game where "anime gnomes literally have to be zany or they die" already exist and thrive and are arguably one of the most popular and successful innovations to a race that Paizo has ever made is totally absurd to me. Goblins will be fine. Goblin PCs have been around for years without issue, even without official endorsement. If we can't trust our players to handle the option of playing "Drizz't as a goofy Smeagol minstrel", why are we playing with them to begin with?

** spoiler omitted **

...

Couldn't agree more with this post. I welcome goblin inclusion into PF2 and it should help to move things away from bad stereotypes. Also it makes sense in that goblins are so numerous that there would be some ones who don't act entirely like the average goblin, just like there is with Tiefling and other typically monstrous races.

Scarab Sages

Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

Smells a lot like gobbers and bogrin from Privateer Press' Iron Kingdoms.

Not sure I like it, but I am willing to wait until I have the product on my screen.


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Rysky wrote:
Aside from the catchy Goblin songs would someone point out where it is exactly that goblins have the reputation of eating babies?

Lemme see ...

That catchy song was the first introduction to the goblins of Golarion. It was marketed widely via snazzy t-shirts, blog-posted and IIRC at least 2 or 3 people recorded performances of the various goblin songs.

When a song gets that much play and promotion the tendency is for the reason behind the reputation to be considered true until proven otherwise... Rather pernicious, to be sure.


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Green Eyed Liar wrote:

Smells a lot like gobbers and bogrin from Privateer Press' Iron Kingdoms.

Not sure I like it, but I am willing to wait until I have the product on my screen.

I loved Iron Kingdoms, so that would be a plus for me^^

Now some optional rules for raise dead that are inspired from IK would be great too.


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Joe M. wrote:
Leyren wrote:
Joe M. wrote:


Playtest Excerpt wrote:
Despite breaking from their destructive past, goblin adventurers often subtly perpetuate some of the qualities that have been characteristics of the creatures for millennia.

Grammatically, "their" refers the reader to "goblin adventurers." But the "destructive past" referred to here must belong to goblins generally rather than the goblin adventurers specifically.

It's in their past. For normal goblins, its not only in the past but also in the present.
That strikes the note of racial sin, which I'm really not a fan of and which I assumed was not the intention of the clause. Hence my comment.

ewveryone keeps making this argument about "NO one would trust a race thats eeevil" and it doesn;t make sense to me. Humans are still pretty roundly trusted, even though they are often horribly evil, and most of the foulest villians are human. If you don't think everyone would condemn the whole human race for the actions of their worse members, who would you expect everyone would do that to goblins.


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"Me so happy me could sing!"

"Poke the traditionalist, offend the purist!
Be mad alchemist…um…upend a tourist?
In the game forever more!
We be goblins! We be core!"

Silver Crusade

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The Mad Comrade wrote:
Rysky wrote:
Aside from the catchy Goblin songs would someone point out where it is exactly that goblins have the reputation of eating babies?

Lemme see ...

That catchy song was the first introduction to the goblins of Golarion. It was marketed widely via snazzy t-shirts, blog-posted and IIRC at least 2 or 3 people recorded performances of the various goblin songs.

When a song gets that much play and promotion the tendency is for the reason behind the reputation to be considered true until proven otherwise... Rather pernicious, to be sure.

... so this is all based on a pop song?


Goblins were already an allowable PC race in my homebrew campaign setting, so I'm looking forward to applying the PF2 goblin options in my game. I like the floating ability score boost. That's pretty unique!


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Pathfinder Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

Seems to me that humans wrote songs that talked of eating babies long before Paizo started having Goblins sing those sort of songs.

As others have pointed out, you've got gods like Sarenrae and Shelyn who are big on redemption. It makes sense that some of the followers of those gods would try to make other races (including Goblins) 'see the light'. Personally, I would expect a Shelynite to lead the way for goblins, just because the shared love of songs would give them a starting point.

I think that Paizo needs to work on their presentation and have something where a goblin is a hero. Right now, goblins are more pests and an easily influenced source of cheap, poor quality minions. In the stuff I'm familiar with, the goblins aren't really the people that come up with the evil master plans. They are the ones who get sucked into someone else's plans.

The biggest thing working against this change is that they didn't preview it in Starfinder. There everything seems to point to Space Goblins still being treated like vermin rather than a space faring race that can be negotiated with.

If they are going to push this forward, they really should have something in both campaigns showing what they think the exceptional goblin community (one able to produce heroes) is like.

Silver Crusade

Pathfinder Adventure, Adventure Path, Companion, Lost Omens, Rulebook, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game, Starfinder Society Subscriber

Starfinder didn't really seem to care for Pathfinder's continuity so the reverse shouldn't be true either (pretty sure this was one of the purposes of the Gap as well).


I love Goblins but I´m not sure I´m a fan of this.

That said, I first want the full lore and background on this shift. As it is now I can´t really think of any place on Avistan where they would be readily accepted. Or the more well known parts of Garund for that matter.


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Rysky wrote:
Aside from the catchy Goblin songs would someone point out where it is exactly that goblins have the reputation of eating babies?

I think one of the goblin comics had a goblin chief eating babies whole. It might have been a part of the visual gag though.


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Rysky wrote:
The Mad Comrade wrote:
Rysky wrote:
Aside from the catchy Goblin songs would someone point out where it is exactly that goblins have the reputation of eating babies?

Lemme see ...

That catchy song was the first introduction to the goblins of Golarion. It was marketed widely via snazzy t-shirts, blog-posted and IIRC at least 2 or 3 people recorded performances of the various goblin songs.

When a song gets that much play and promotion the tendency is for the reason behind the reputation to be considered true until proven otherwise... Rather pernicious, to be sure.

... so this is all based on a pop song?

Goblins are presented as having a non-literate culture. Songs are the most important way in which they communicate a sense of goblin identity and shared values. Almost universally, their songs are about torture, murder, the eating of other sentient creatures, etc.

This is not about "a pop song." This is about the very essence of how goblins have been almost universally presented in Paizo material until now.

It's also about how players have perceived and celebrated goblins, which is in someways even more troubling than the way in which goblins have been portrayed.


Considering Golarion setting so far, I'd rather see kobolds as tinkerer redeemable small evil race. Goblins were always too over the top.

But then I do not care so much, since in my setting goblins looks differently, have only about half of quirks of Golarion goblins and are much more alignment diversified.

Still PAIZO goblins is useful as a pattern for some gremlin fey variant, if not for mortal race.

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