Advanced Class Guide Preview: Bloodrager

Tuesday, June 24, 2014


Illustration by Géraud Soulié

Even during the brainstorming and initial design for the Pathfinder RPG Advanced Class Guide, the bloodrager was the "weird" class. The concept was strong—a mix of the barbarian and the sorcerer that used bloodlines to fuel its arcane rage—but the weirdness came from the lack of precedent for the class. Hunters, investigators, shaman, and swashbucklers were all over history, folklore, and were even mentioned in Golarion before they were added to this book, but the bloodrager was created out of whole cloth. We thought about toying with the name or forcing it into some kind of classical archetype, but when we tried either of those, something got lost along the way.

While we liked the initial proof of concept, marrying it with another story idea did not solve the problem. There was still something missing. Then it came like a thunderbolt—spells! The bloodrager needs spells!

Like the sorcerer, the bloodrager needed to be a spontaneous caster, but we wanted the progression to look something like the ranger or the paladin (the bloodrager was a full BAB class after all), both of which are prepared casters. The first order of business was to design a similar progression for spontaneous casters. Once that was done, we had to find the right spell list. Spell lists are tricky beasts, and we knew substantial shifts would occur with each design iteration, but we needed a starting point. To that end, we chose a modified version of the magus list. We knew it wasn't perfect—far from it—but it was the best place to start.

The overall design goal was to create a class that was both easy to build and fun to play. Even before we unleashed this most metal of classes to the general public, I had a good feeling we were on track. Ryan Macklin decided to give this bruiser a whirl during our internal playtests, and loved the feeling of playing a character that basically felt like a character off the cover of an old heavy metal album, without flipping though a number of sources to get him just right. In other words: mission accomplished.

When the bloodrager reached the public playtest, this sentiment was echoed by a great number of playtesters. Were there issues? Sure. As we figured, that spell list wasn't cutting the mustard, but it gave us handholds to make the climb toward the class's own spell list. There was some fiddling to be done with a number of class features, both those that were standard for the class, and those nestled in the bloodlines, but the excellent playtest data gave input on where to expand, where to pull back, and which ones just needed a little finesse to get right.

After some playtest chatter, we looked again at renaming the classes or to give it a focus that fit better with lore, but in the end the class is what it is called, and named what it does. So bloodrager stuck.

With the development of the bloodrager completed, the next step was the creation of archetypes. This is always difficult for classes that basically have archetypes in their design (bloodlines, I'm looking at you) but we came up with some exciting options. In Advanced Class Guide you'll find the bloodrider (a mounted bloodrager that transfers some of his power to his mount) the rageshaper (a rager that gains extra features when it changes shape) and the untouchable rager (which replaces spell progression with spell resistance). All together, mixing bloodlines with archetypes, you'll be able to play a variety of bloodragers!

Stephen Radney-MacFarland
Designer

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Tags: Bloodrager Géraud Soulié Pathfinder Roleplaying Game
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Bongo BigBounce wrote:

Solomon the Garundi, Human Undead Blooded Bloodrager is ready for action.

Solomon the Garundi,
Born on a Moonday,
Blessed on Toilday,
Married on Wealday,
Took ill on Oathday,
Grew worse on Fireday,
Died on Starday,
Buried on Sunday.
That was the start,
Of Solomon the Garundi

That sounds like Solomon the Garundi lives Like A Boss.


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Albatoonoe wrote:
Yeah, there is pretty much only one character from myth and legend that I can compare to the Bloodrager. Cu Chulainn and his warp spasm. I'm so down for this class.

I am definitely going to consider making a bloodrager character like Cu Chulainn for PFS. Grab a longspear, make a "warp spasm", and slay everything within 10 feet of him. Figuring the bloodline will likely be the challenge.


I think I will like this class. A lot! :)


Kalvit wrote:
I am definitely going to consider making a bloodrager character like Cu Chulainn for PFS. Grab a longspear, make a "warp spasm", and slay everything within 10 feet of him. Figuring the bloodline will likely be the challenge.

Abberant bloodline, easily. Even the flavor starts to match up with the warp spasm.


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Mikaze wrote:
When I first saw the artwork I thought "an archetype based on Soul Calibur's Tira is awfully specific..." ;)

Came here to make this post.

At least Mikaze was the one that stole it from me, and not someone else. =p

I must admit the idea of an archetype that gives up spellcasting for Spell Resistance seems like an archetype nobody in their right mind would ever take.

You give up the ability to buff yourself, and gain...an inability for ANYONE ELSE to buff you.

Here's hoping it's got some major goodies to make up for that downside, or something that mitigates it.


Rynjin wrote:
Mikaze wrote:
When I first saw the artwork I thought "an archetype based on Soul Calibur's Tira is awfully specific..." ;)

Came here to make this post.

At least Mikaze was the one that stole it from me, and not someone else. =p

I must admit the idea of an archetype that gives up spellcasting for Spell Resistance seems like an archetype nobody in their right mind would ever take.

You give up the ability to buff yourself, and gain...an inability for ANYONE ELSE to buff you.

Here's hoping it's got some major goodies to make up for that downside, or something that mitigates it.

i hoping it only happens during bloodrage and the spell resistance is something ridiculous to screw spellcasters over.


christos gurd wrote:
Rynjin wrote:
Mikaze wrote:
When I first saw the artwork I thought "an archetype based on Soul Calibur's Tira is awfully specific..." ;)

Came here to make this post.

At least Mikaze was the one that stole it from me, and not someone else. =p

I must admit the idea of an archetype that gives up spellcasting for Spell Resistance seems like an archetype nobody in their right mind would ever take.

You give up the ability to buff yourself, and gain...an inability for ANYONE ELSE to buff you.

Here's hoping it's got some major goodies to make up for that downside, or something that mitigates it.

i hoping it only happens during bloodrage and the spell resistance is something ridiculous to screw spellcasters over.

I'm hoping it functions something like the Bloodrager is able to form bonds with party members that allows them to bypass his spell resistance. He might be all but immune to enemy magic, but if the casters ever turn, he's very vulnerable.

Dark Archive

Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

While not quite a bloodrager in ability, the Juggernaut's powers stemming from a Crimson Gem could be a cool basis for how one became imbued with such powers.


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Albatoonoe wrote:
Yeah, there is pretty much only one character from myth and legend that I can compare to the Bloodrager. Cu Chulainn and his warp spasm. I'm so down for this class.

YES.


I can see doing a number of characters from pop culture with this class: Fenris, Ichigo Kurosaki, Ghost Rider with a crossed Undead/Demonic or elemental bloodline with the Bloodrider.


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Ross Byers wrote:
Tels wrote:
This makes me think of someone who is unquestionably a pacifist... and violent about it.
I'm picturing the aftermath of that violent outburst. "Look what you made me do!"

And then rub their noses in it.


Bloodrager is built on such a strong chassis that it's gonna be hard for them to actually get worse on the transition from V2-->final. I'm looking forward to some buffed Bloodlines and a more expanded spell list. As long as they didn't nerf the Hit die and remove casting while raging the chassis for the Bloodrager should be strong. The upcoming class specific feats can only make it better.

Shadow Lodge

My bloodrager Druid is now eager for that Rageshaper archetype.


Albatoonoe wrote:
Kalvit wrote:
I am definitely going to consider making a bloodrager character like Cu Chulainn for PFS. Grab a longspear, make a "warp spasm", and slay everything within 10 feet of him. Figuring the bloodline will likely be the challenge.
Abberant bloodline, easily. Even the flavor starts to match up with the warp spasm.

I know only what I googled, but when I hear "warp spasm" I think of the Arcane bloodline's passive Blur and similar abilities.


Nothing would be more metal than spawn of Rovagug bloodline.


Even more excited! Those archetypes sound very interesting.


Kairos Dawnfury wrote:
Albatoonoe wrote:
Kalvit wrote:
I am definitely going to consider making a bloodrager character like Cu Chulainn for PFS. Grab a longspear, make a "warp spasm", and slay everything within 10 feet of him. Figuring the bloodline will likely be the challenge.
Abberant bloodline, easily. Even the flavor starts to match up with the warp spasm.
I know only what I googled, but when I hear "warp spasm" I think of the Arcane bloodline's passive Blur and similar abilities.

Considering the names Cu Chulainn acquired and the fact that he's the son of a god of war, Celestial or Destined bloodlines can also work. That's the beauty of some mythological characters. We can attribute certain physical ideas to one concept, or take the origins and use another.

If I had wanted to make Siegfried from the Rhinegold, that would easily be Dragonic bloodline. Still considering that one for a Falcon Punching Bloodrager. Scale Mail so it almost always has weapons, and then gain claws when raging. Or just use the rage to punch like a boss.


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Pathfinder Lost Omens, Rulebook, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game, Starfinder Society Subscriber

I've had a evil minotaur barbarian/sorcerer NPC in my campaign since the 2nd Edition days. There's never been a perfect fit for multiclassing that would really fit my concept of him up to now. I'm looking forward to putting him in the shop for some retooling, since this seems to prefectly fill the bill!


To be honest, I cared about the Bloodrager about as much as the Hunter (not at all) until recently. Maybe I just missed something in the concept and didn't bother to properly read the class entry during the playtest... but now I think this is on par with Swashbuckler and Slayer for me as far as coolness goes. Seems like a lot of fun to build and play. Will be very interesting to see the final spell list and bloodlines.

Really can't wait to get my hands on the book come August!


Hmm I'm thinking a Shoanti from the skull clan that weilds an earthbreaker.

Shao-Khan esque nut case that bongs you off the dome with a giant hammer.


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DM_aka_Dudemeister wrote:

Bloodrager very exciting, but does anyone else want to caption the above picture with the voice of a high pitched nerd with a cleft pallet.

Bloodrager: "FOOLSH! You thought you could defeat me! But now I schummon forth my deadly schpinning hula hoopsch... OF DEATH!"

Merisiel: "Seriously?"

Sean Connery is a blood rager?


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I'm looking forward to making Claymore-like characters with this class.

Dark Archive

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Kryzbyn wrote:
Sean Connery is a blood rager?

You should have seen him backstage at Celebrity Jeopardy. The image of 80 yro Connery wearing only his classic Zardoz costume... that image will haunt me forever. {shudders}


Do not mock the great Zed of Zardoz!


Ryan Macklin wrote:
Pecan Sandie Duncan wrote:

BOOOODRAAAGE! {politely sips tea and knits doily}

...

Hmmm, I have a sneaking suspicion I might be doing it wrong.

DOILYS AND EARL GREY FOR THE MACKLIN GOD!

To be truthful, my bloodrager in the playtest was all about tea, peace, harmony, all that... except while bloodraging. He was totally ashamed to be abyssally tainted. In our first major encounter, he even tried to talk down the monsters while everyone else was fighting. That, of course, served as a platform for the tilt: when the monster rejected his offer, the bloograge happened; I removed my lithe half-elf mini from the table and put the barghest in its place.

The players flipped. It was awesome. It highlights one of the little touches I love about the class: there's no alignment restriction from your bloodline (or at all in the class), so you can get your emo while clawing a foe's face. (Folks who know me well know that's my jam.)

Strangely, this post made me more excited about the bloodrager than the ACG play test and the blog post combined. Can't wait to see it in play :)


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I just can't wait to get motivated.


Looking forward to updating my playtest arcane bloodrager into an arcane untouchable rager. Looking forward to going super saiyan and wrecking as many spell casters as possible.


Also, the Prince of Persia (in game 3), Shagon, and vampire hunter D using a dhampir and the undead bloodline.


Fitz from The Farseer Trilogy fits pretty well as a hunter / bloodrager - in the second book he's learned a bit of "magic" and has enough brute strength to wield a greataxe in battle, and the bond he shares with his wolf companion Nighteyes sends them both into a frenzy when combat starts.


New idea for an archetype: Bloodrager who specializes in electric based magic. Bloodtrocuted!

RPG Superstar 2008 Top 32

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Torbyne wrote:
New idea for an archetype: Bloodrager who specializes in electric based magic. Bloodtrocuted!

The iconic bloodrager has the Air bloodline, which has ties to the Electricity damage type.


Ross Byers wrote:
Torbyne wrote:
New idea for an archetype: Bloodrager who specializes in electric based magic. Bloodtrocuted!
The iconic bloodrager has the Air bloodline, which has ties to the Electricity damage type.

Where can I find that. Cause the iconic Bloodrager isn't up from where I see.


I'm really hoping that there will eventually be some sort of lunar or lycantherope bloodline bloodrager type. This simply seems to be an almost ideal class for that type of character concept.

RPG Superstar 2008 Top 32

Ralanr wrote:
Ross Byers wrote:
Torbyne wrote:
New idea for an archetype: Bloodrager who specializes in electric based magic. Bloodtrocuted!
The iconic bloodrager has the Air bloodline, which has ties to the Electricity damage type.
Where can I find that. Cause the iconic Bloodrager isn't up from where I see.

Hopefully the art and bio will be up today, but there's a statblock in Risen from the Sands, and he's featured on the ACG cover, wrapped in lightning.


Looks like the post is delayed or forgot once again :(
Shame since Crowe is the first shoanti iconics to come out, im very curious to read about him.


Delayed because the writer is sick.


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Pathfinder Starfinder Society Subscriber

I wonder -- has Paizo been preparing this article by sending their employees to interview him? If so, that would be at least two of them that Crowe has beaten up. I hope he didn't hurt either of them too seriously.

Scarab Sages

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David knott 242 wrote:

I wonder -- has Paizo been preparing this article by sending their employees to interview him? If so, that would be at least two of them that Crowe has beaten up. I hope he didn't hurt either of them too seriously.

"So Mr. Crowe, tell us about your background, growing up on the steppes of.. WHY!?!?! WHAT DID I DO!?!?!??!"

"Ladies and Gentleman, our interview with Bloodrager Crowe has been temporarily postponed due to a sudden and unexpect illness experienced by our writer. Please remain patient while he heal... that is, recovers."

Feel better Jason!

Webstore Gninja Minion

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Removed a post. Let's keep it clean and PG-13 and not insulting, thank you!


Ross Byers wrote:
Tels wrote:
This makes me think of someone who is unquestionably a pacifist... and violent about it.
I'm picturing the aftermath of that violent outburst. "Look what you made me do!"

Pacifist Crush!


Azten wrote:
Ross Byers wrote:
Tels wrote:
This makes me think of someone who is unquestionably a pacifist... and violent about it.
I'm picturing the aftermath of that violent outburst. "Look what you made me do!"
Pacifist Crush!

Damnit, now it's stuck in my head that Amelia's dad was a bloodrager (King of Seyruune everyone, no wonder people were scared of him)

Paizo Employee Developer

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It's live!

Shadow Lodge

doc the grey wrote:
I kind of want to know more about the rageshaper. I've got a dragon blooded bloodrager in my home group trying to become a dragon warrior and I'm wondering if it will allow him to become more dragony and what the trades are for it?

I'm playing Sss'Thokk, a PFS-legal Nagaji dragonblooded bloodrager (tonight at AFK in Renton where we're having the Paizocon meet and greet, actually) and I'm planning on moving in to Dragon Disciple at 6th level. The Rageshaper does sound tasty...

- Rebis


Rebis Ouroboros wrote:
doc the grey wrote:
I kind of want to know more about the rageshaper. I've got a dragon blooded bloodrager in my home group trying to become a dragon warrior and I'm wondering if it will allow him to become more dragony and what the trades are for it?

I'm playing Sss'Thokk, a PFS-legal Nagaji dragonblooded bloodrager (tonight at AFK in Renton where we're having the Paizocon meet and greet, actually) and I'm planning on moving in to Dragon Disciple at 6th level. The Rageshaper does sound tasty...

- Rebis

So if you use the Bloodrager information from the Revised ACG in PFS, how does it work when the actual ACG comes out and there are changes to the class (for example, the spell list)? Are you allowed to adjust your PFS character to meet the actual published version of the class?

I ask because I'm thinking of trying out PFS, and I am strongly considering trying a Bloodrager.


mbauers wrote:
Rebis Ouroboros wrote:
doc the grey wrote:
I kind of want to know more about the rageshaper. I've got a dragon blooded bloodrager in my home group trying to become a dragon warrior and I'm wondering if it will allow him to become more dragony and what the trades are for it?

I'm playing Sss'Thokk, a PFS-legal Nagaji dragonblooded bloodrager (tonight at AFK in Renton where we're having the Paizocon meet and greet, actually) and I'm planning on moving in to Dragon Disciple at 6th level. The Rageshaper does sound tasty...

- Rebis

So if you use the Bloodrager information from the Revised ACG in PFS, how does it work when the actual ACG comes out and there are changes to the class (for example, the spell list)? Are you allowed to adjust your PFS character to meet the actual published version of the class?

I ask because I'm thinking of trying out PFS, and I am strongly considering trying a Bloodrager.

As I understand it, when the ACG comes out, anyone running an ACG class has to rebuild their character to match the final version of the class.


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Malwing wrote:
I'm more than a little put off by the Bloodrager getting his own spell list. I have a lot of third party material that has spells for existing spell lists making applying them to Bloodrager trickier. My only hope is that it has all the magus spells with additions so that I easily house rule that all 1-4 level third party magus spells are also Bloodrager spells.

I don't care about 3pp stuff. I was just put off by how bad the bloodrager list was when compared to the magus list. Every single spell I used during the first playtest was gone.

I hope they fixed the list a little.


Umbranus wrote:
Malwing wrote:
I'm more than a little put off by the Bloodrager getting his own spell list. I have a lot of third party material that has spells for existing spell lists making applying them to Bloodrager trickier. My only hope is that it has all the magus spells with additions so that I easily house rule that all 1-4 level third party magus spells are also Bloodrager spells.

I don't care about 3pp stuff. I was just put off by how bad the bloodrager list was when compared to the magus list. Every single spell I used during the first playtest was gone.

I hope they fixed the list a little. If not... I'll just house-rule that it uses the magus list.

During the playtest I seem to remember Jason saying the spell list wasn't final and that we would probably see bloodrager spells(+new spells in general) in the book.


It was not only specific spells but the overall make up of the list with mainly blasts and next to no utility what made me dislike it.

My bloodrager was fluffed like a samurai, being very diplomatic and aristocratic when not raging and he used his casting abilities to be prepared for emergencies and for utility. Swift girding and keep watch were his two main spells. Nothing in that way remained in the new list.

Why a class that is really strong in melee should focus on blasts is something I never got. Give the option, ok but build the class around that? Really?


Yeah, it honestly doesn't make any sense to me either. Maybe if he had some kind of synergy with his beatsticking, like burning rage to cast a Lightning bolt as a Swift or something but as-is blasting as a 4 level caster is not usually a good use of your actions.

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