Alright gang, looks like Cirri is out of the woods...
While we post our "rest" actions in Gameplay (see DM "Aftermath" post), I'd like to also take this opportunity for feedback on our first High Level Encounter together in Discussion, being that we are in this game for the long haul. When you get a free moment, please answer these questions below (openly, in a spoiler, or PM as you like):
Q) Were the Trackers helpful? How?
Q) Either way, how could they be improved?
Q) What other DM actions were helpful or unhelpful? Why?
Q) Permission for DM to give you individual feedback?
Q) Any feedback you have for DM? Shoot!
=)
Well, that was fun. Almost died in my first high level encounter.
Nah, you just took a short nap. Billy wasn't about to let anyone die. He was even willing to stick around while you retreated, so the spider had another target besides you.
1) Trackers: Very helpful. Nice to know everyone's hp level, rounds of IC remaining, and enemy stats when known.
2) Improving Trackers: Maybe too many details? For instance, after potions are taken, it would clear up the tracker to remove them instead of saying "drank potion". I don't feel strongly about this, I'd just prefer less clutter.
3) DM Actions: The frequency of posts was excellent. You definitely kept the combat moving.
4) Permission for Individual Feedback: Sure. Especially if there's anything I can do in my posts to make your job easier. Or just if my posts/style/rhymes are more annoying than worthwhile.
5) Feedback: I'd still like to know the DC for the IC rolls. Unless I missed it, I never knew what I needed to hit. For instance, if I fail a roll, I might wanna use Halfling Luck for a reroll.
Q) Were the Trackers helpful? How?
The trackers were very helpful and contained a lot more information than I'm used to seeing from GMs in general. It makes it very clear what the GM thinks the current situation is and allows one to compare it with ones own view to confirm that everyone is on the same page.
Q) Either way, how could they be improved?
They're perfect. Don't change anything. Ha ha, seriously though, I can't think of anything off the top of my head right now.
Q) What other DM actions were helpful or unhelpful? Why?
I like the OOCs where you translate the narrative into game mechanics. With other GMs it's sometimes difficult to tell if an attack even hit, let alone was a crit, or how many HP of damage got through. I'm very much a numbers guy and I like to know exactly what DCs are involved in any situation so that I can properly calculate probabilities and plan my actions accordingly.
Q) Permission for DM to give you individual feedback?
I give everyone permission to provide me with (hopefully constructive) feedback. If I'm doing something that annoys you or there's something you think I can do better, let me know. I may not do anything about it, but at least I won't be able to say I didn't know.
Q) Any feedback you have for DM? Shoot!
So far so good. I'll DM you if I have any serious issues about something.
Very useful. I got confused about my Dying value and the order of taking damage and when I can recover.
Q) Either way, how could they be improved?
The tracker has a lot of information on it. Which is good, but it's also difficult to read. Maybe the ooc flag could be used to hide less important information (like what we are wielding.)
Q) What other DM actions were helpful or unhelpful? Why?
Telling me if the checks succeeded, failed or critically failed. It gave me a good idea of whether it was worth continuing my strategy. Or it would have, but the spider KOed me after those grapples failed.
Q) Permission for DM to give you individual feedback?
Of course! Cirri is my highest level Pathfinder 2nd ed character and I'm always looking for more advice.
There are also a lot of moving parts and options, so I try to provide links when possible.
Q) Any feedback you have for DM? Shoot!
Thanks for showing the rolls for the enemies. When I GM I'm always nervous about keeping suspense or being honest.
Yes, tremendously. They helped me judge how damaged each enemy was, their conditions, and how much longer we had on Billy's Inspire Courage.
Q) Either way, how could they be improved?
Maybe incorporate conditions into the DCs being shown? Like when the spider was frightened 1, its AC was still displayed as 30.
Q) What other DM actions were helpful or unhelpful? Why?
When the spider attacked me and missed, there was still a note about making a Fortitude save. I saw that before I saw the roll, so at first I thought it had hit and poisoned me.
Q) Permission for DM to give you individual feedback?
Of course!
Q) Any feedback you have for DM? Shoot!
I'm highly enjoying things so far. Thank you!
I'm never very good at what questions to ask about creatures, so I will take suggestions.
I think I get a question as well. No need to ask the typical questions (special attacks/defenses, best/worst saves, etc.).
I was gonna ask: Are Anugobu typically found on their own, like this one?
Other possible questions:
What languages do Anugobu's typically speak?
Where can their species typically be found?
This is a good point I forgot to touch on.
Why don't we say that if you chose "Common" as a language, it means you chose "Tien", and if you chose "Tien" as a language, it means you chose "Taldane"?
Too simple a fix?
Wouldn't it be easier to say if you chose Tien, you chose Tien. And if you chose Common, you chose Taldane? It's certainly what I was thinking when I was choosing languages.
Maybe I'm missing something. Just seems confusing to not have Tien be Tien.
Well, it's tricky, since generally in Tian Xia, Common refers to Tien rather than Taldane.
I took both languages (and didn't call either one Common) partly for this reason, and it's also why I asked the question. Better to know now than try to hash it out in a situation where the distinction matters!
What do other people think?
...
Unrelated, I made a "marching order slide" with three configurations (so as to remove this info from the Tracker per your feedback) - when you get a moment place your Token on each of the "Open", "Corridor" and "Narrow" tiles!
Honestly, it's always bugged me a little to use the term "Common" as a synonym for Taldane. Except for Amanandar (capital New Oppara, where Slick picked up his Taldane), there's hardly any Taldan presence on Tian Xia. For all intents and purposes Tien is the common language on Tian Xia, and the language that Ahmitar would know; same goes for most of us since we're also from Tian Xia and not the Inner Sea region (where Taldane is the shared language).
I'm fine with assuming that "Common" means Tien for this adventure and to avoid confusion, I've changed Slick's profile so his languages now read "Taldane, Tien" to make it clear. If we all do the same, then the problem goes away.
I've placed my token on the marching order slide. Front and center!
I used Common for Taldane in my case because Yagon is not from Tian Xia. I also chose both languages, so it makes no difference to me.
Cirri speaks Taldane, since she isn't from Tian-Xia. She doesn't know Tian (weakness of my build: the archeologist who isn't multilingual.) But I can fix that at the next skill level. I'll update my character sheet accordingly.
I think it fits with the "mysterious foreign backer" persona we've created for you. :)
Here are some musings on our upcoming encounter based on what Ahmitar has told us to expect. If this sort of thing is too meta-gamey or spoilery, then let me know. I'll wrap it in a spoiler just in case.
It sounds like the courtyard is the residence of either Spirits/Ghosts or a Haunt. I suppose it could be some other form of Undead, but as none are visible through the doorway (Slick checked), they would likely be Incorporeal or possibly just Invisible.
If it is an actual monster we're dealing with, then my experience is that they are (usually) totally destructible by the infliction of enough damage, with no coming back once dead dead. The main difficulty being the delivery of the damage by physical means due to resistances and/or immunities.
If it is a Haunt, then that's another story. Haunts are hazards and usually have to be Disabled (ie. exorcised) by means that don't involve smashing them with weapons. Usually a Religion roll is involved to put the spirits to rest, but other skills might also come into play. The main thing about haunts is that they tend to repeat until permanently disabled. The ones I've come across have inflicted their damage through the use of illusion or other non-physical means. This doesn't make them any less deadly though; I remember one example of a trampling horde of civilians that nearly TPKed the party in one round.
The main trick is telling them apart as they can look very similar when you first run into them. I've found the best rule-of-thumb to be whether the creatures "attacking" you seem to take damage from strikes that should inflict damage. If they seem to ignore you and/or your attacks, then it's probably a haunt; if they seem to acknowledge the attacks and appear to weaken due to them, then they're probably creatures. Being asked to make Will saves before taking "physical" damage is another strong indication of a haunt.
Our approach should therefore be to try an identify whether we're dealing with monsters or a hazard. If monsters, then we kick their asses until they dissipate. If a haunt, then we Recall Knowledge until we figure out how to disable it and the more religiously inclined of the group make the attempt while the rest of us stay out of the area of effect to minimize overall damage to the group.
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...
We also appear to be approaching a consensus on the language. I think what I'd like to do is just use the word "Common" to signify "Tien" and the word "Taldane" to signify "Taldane" - do you all think this is okay?
I am keeping track of Time in my GM Alias - specifically, Hex Time elapsed since Docking!
Languages sound fine to me.
Like Yagon (and I think Slick), Billy took both Taldane and Tien, so whatever is easiest is fine with me. I'll update his character sheet when it's decided.
Regarding the spirits, based on information we already know from Ahmitar, is there any chance we can attempt Religion checks to gather information prior to actually seeing them? (Probably not, but figured it's worth a shot.)
Sorry to hold us up, I haven't been feeling well lately.
I was hoping to get answers to Billy's questions, before rolling initiative.
o What did Ahmitar say about the wall paintings?
o Could Ahmitar tell us anything about the spirits in the courtyard?
o Can we make any Recall Knowledge (Religion?) before the encounter based on what we already know from Ahmitar?
I'm sorry everyone. I was having difficulty keeping up with this game as it is and then I got sick. Now I'm having to deal with others in my family getting sick and some other real life issues popping up on me at the same time. Soon the holidays are going to be here. I'm afraid I wouldn't be able to give this game the attention it deserves for a few more weeks and that isn't fair to the GM and the rest of the players. You deserve better.
I think it is best that I withdraw now before you've gotten too far in.
Yagon, focus on getting better and handling your family. It was fun playing with you.
Life can be a b!t¢# sometimes Yagon. Take care of yourself and your family. I hope things look up for you soon.
So what's the standard procedure for when a player/PC is no longer able to continue playing?
Wishing you and your family a speedy recovery.
Was looking forward to playing with Yagon...super unique character. I think things will slow for all of us around the holidays. So I'd personally vote for you sticking around if you think your situation in real life will get back to normal at some point in the near future. Please consider that.
Quick Update:
Osh The Deer has the open slot and is reading over and considering joining us as a replacement fifth.
If he declines, we will continue on with four players. Either way, looking to advance Gameplay in 24 hours.
Cheers!
Osh The Deer has the open slot and is reading over and considering joining us as a replacement fifth.
That would be great. I've both played with and been GMed by MauveAvengr before and have had good experiences both ways. Slick fighting side-by-side with a barb would be something to see too.
Welcome Osh!
GM, while we're waiting, any chance you can answer my questions from a couple posts earlier? (Unless you're waiting to answer them with a Gameplay post.) Thanks.
Osh the Deer,
If you would like to positively join us, go ahead and roll initiative and I'll add you to the tracker immediately!
We can figure out the "story" of your campaign inclusion here in Discussion, or, in the aftermath of this Encounter, or both...
Looks like Osh is a small deer-shaped poppet from Goka. Given that Slick is also from Goka, it shouldn't be too tough to fit him into the story. How the story goes depends somewhat on whether we need to include Yagon in the story or if we can retcon Yagon out of the story and pretend Osh was there all along.
If the latter, then maybe the wizard that created Osh went looking for someone to help train his creation for the tournament and was directed to Slick's training hall. Slick would initially have been leery of taking on what to all appearances was a child's stuffed animal, but Osh's natural fighting abilities quickly convinced him otherwise. The poppet was soon recruited into the team, and the rest we already know.
If we need to integrate Osh into the story as it stands with no retcon, then we're going to need to come up with a way to explain Yagon's departure mid-tournament and Osh's appearance out of the blue. That might be a tall order given that I'm guessing there are rules against changes in team membership during the tournament.
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Hey, just checking in! Give me a second to read up and post!
I added your token - you will be "Up" in Cirri's initiative block - welcome!
Thank you! Gonna review Osh's abilities in the mean time.
Haven't played high level 2e yet so I'm excited to join!
Welcome, Osh! We're both playing high level 2e for the first time.
For the story's sake, we can say Yagon decided to safeguard the temple, or Groteus requested him for a more important task. If his god wills it, he would follow.
To introduce Osh, I would retcon him as part of our team. Maybe he was shy while on the ship, or no one else paid the stuffed doll any mind. Cirri would have a million questions about the life of deer and would pay for his entry.
By the way, I cast >Vital Beacon< (Heightened to 5th) on myself. Any of my allies or myself can spend an action to interact with me and heal for 5d10 Hit Points. This works once per round.
The second this happens, you heal 5d8 Hit Points.
The last this happens, you heal 5d6 Hit Points.
Then the spell discharges.
Sorry for the radio silence, folks. Had a rough weekend, but I'm feeling way better now. Bummer about Yagon, but welcome to the party, Osh!
By the way, I cast >Vital Beacon< (Heightened to 5th) on myself. Any of my allies or myself can spend an action to interact with me and heal for 5d10 Hit Points. This works once per round.
The second this happens, you heal 5d8 Hit Points.
The last this happens, you heal 5d6 Hit Points.Then the spell discharges.
It looks like there's a fourth round of healing possible at 5d4 before the spell ends.
It's like a reverse lay on hands! Love it.
Slick is correct.
5d10
5d8
5d6
5d4
And then it's discharged. It's a handy spell for Cirri if she transforms into a non-spellcasting creature- at least she can heal herself.
Staircase wall 5 feet height - May Leap (◆) down unharmed with a DC 20 Athletics or Acrobatics check
Not that it matters to Slick (Cat Fall and Athletics +23), but the Falling rules state that you only take damage if you fall more than 5 feet, and that you land prone only if you take any damage from a fall. Is there something special about this 5 ft drop that requires a Leap action and an accompanying DC roll? Why couldn't someone just Stride across such a drop as if it wasn't there, or maybe treat the drop as an extra 5ft of movement (as difficult terrain, for example)?
We're still not totally sure what we're up against. Given the way they're behaving, my guess is that we are not dealing with a Haunt and that these are separate Creatures of some sort. I know that a Recall Knowledge roll will be required to positively identify them, but can we assume some minimal knowledge of incorporeal spirit creatures?
For example... At level 11, it seems reasonable that we would have come up against Ghosts at least once by now, and know that they are VERY resistant to almost all (especially non-magical) damage, and that unless you have a Ghost Touch rune on your weapon (like Slick's sword, and now Cirri and Aoibhean's handwraps) or can inflict specific types of magical damage, you are unlikely to hurt them much, if at all.
Okay, so Osh posted his attack. However you guys want to add him in is fine! Flexible with character introduction. Anything important that I missed? Haven't read all the posts.
And right now, he has Marshal Dedication but I'm not 100% sure I want to continue with this. Not sure if it's too late to change, may take something else. Will wait until after the combat though. Going to look at other dedications though to see if theres anything cool or fitting. Any suggestions?
And right now, he has Marshal Dedication but I'm not 100% sure I want to continue with this. Not sure if it's too late to change, may take something else. Will wait until after the combat though. Going to look at other dedications though to see if theres anything cool or fitting. Any suggestions?
I'd have suggested Monk, but your Dex isn't high enough.
How about Beastmaster? It might be cool to see Osh riding on the back of a real deer. You would need to get trained in Nature though.
Other options you might look at are Scout and Wrestler.
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Anything important that I missed?
"♫ From Tianjing, my family farm.
To a voyage across the sea.
Bonmu waits with all her charm.
And nearly enchanting as me. ♫"
Team Song
"♫ Golden piercings ... most divine! The pleasure, madam, is all mine.
Let the tourney now begin. We cannot wait to meet Hao Jin!
I'm her biggest fan you see. And her wondrous tapestry.
So lead the way! Let them stare. The team to beat: Cirri's Corsairs. ♫"
Temple Song
♫ "Here at the temple we stand.
But things are not going as planned.
.....This bug infestation!
.....We need inspiration.
I'm Billy. Let's strike up the band." ♫
Spider Bite Song
♫ "A ganzi, a dhampir, an ape.
A pirate, who just needs a cape.
.....And me, Billy Bardy
.....The life of the party.
These spiders: no chance of escape!" ♫
Ancient Defender Song
♫ "Our goal is to quiet each ghost.
To make this place safe for our host.
.....Destruction we'll render.
.....Upon each Defender.
I'm Billy, and that is no boast!" ♫
Love the song!
With a bard in the party, Marshal is probably not a great idea.
There are three main ideas:
-Sentinel dedication (to up Osh's AC a bit!)
-Wrestler (and focus on grappling)
-Ghost Eater (to tie in to the AP)
Leaning towards wrestler as it seems fun! Would be wrestling others with my antlers, which have 10ft reach.
Slick begins cutting down Pink Defender, critically striking thrice, and discorporating it instantly! 42, 40, then 64 damage
Wow! That was better than I thought. Looks like a 33 vs flat-footed is a crit, so their AC <= 25, and their 82 < HP <= 146!
That means that Slick's +25 to hit with his Greatsword (including Inspire Courage) is a hit on a 2/5/10, and he crits on a 10/15/20; even better if he crits early and flat-foots them for the remaining attacks.
I built Slick to be a fighting machine, but I think I've created a monster instead. Poor ghosts. They better take Slick down soon or he's just going to scythe them down like the grim reaper.
Marshal Dedication looks really cool. My 5th level Bard would be interested in it, but I'd need to retrain to get martial weapon proficiency. He also wields a whip and abuses the reach to make an AoO field of doom. Fighter dedication gives it to him at level 4, while Martials have to wait for level 8.
AC 25? Hey, I can that easily. I guess PF 2e really does treat AC as crit protection.
Aiobhean was unable to react three rounds ago.
Can I ask why?
Alright gang,
Our new player, Osh, has finalized his character.
Osh - would you please tend to your Character Bar when you get a chance?
How are we going to incorporate him into our Origin Story? Do we want a soft "he was there all along!" or more of a "surprise new team member!" angle? Perhaps a little of both? Something else?
I'm thinking it would be easiest to incorporate Osh into the adventure if we just played it like he was there all along. We can either retcon it by attributing Yagon's contributions to Osh, or play it like Osh was temporarily indisposed and riding in Slick's backpack all along. He then woke up at exactly the same time that Yagon got a message from Groetus that sent him on a new divine mission for the god and so he had to leave the tournament prematurely.
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Thanks for the intro! Have some family stuff to do this weekend, but will work on the character bar as soon as I have some free time. Chose the wrestler dedication and changed a few feats, but otherwise mostly the same! Wanted to differentiate myself a bit from Slick and Billy.
As for introductions, I'm very flexible on how you guys want to do it. I like Slick's idea that Osh was there all along.
Also, quick rules question. A deer animal barbarian's antlers have a 10ft reach and have the grapple trait. Does that mean that Osh can grapple 10 feet away with his antlers? Just want to make sure!
EDIT: If any of you have seen Toy Story, I'm basing Osh off of Bullseye.