DM Jesse's Kingmaker PbP (Inactive)

Game Master Jesse Heinig

hmm... it had honestly never even occurred to me to make a paladin of one of the eldest. Time to read up on Magdh and Imbrex.

Are any of the newer races tied to the fey at all?

@Vallen

At first glance, Vallen seems fine, aside from traits - you picked two general traits, instead of one campaign trait and one trait from the general pool. I see he's been in a few different campaigns in a few different incarnations!
Now, notably, most of the campaign traits for KM are assuming your character is human or someone who lived on the fringes of human society. The best fits are probably Issian (the Golushkin mountains would likely fit that description), Pioneer (if you spent some time outside the mountains but in their shadow), or you could probably swing a reflavoring of Noble Born: Garess and say that you have patronage from them. Of note, House Garess in Brevoy has connections with a dwarf holding in the Golushkin mountains. So, if you want a sponsorship from/connection with one of the noble houses of Brevoy that's a good choice.

Yeah, this does mean you have to make the hard choice about whether to have Perception as a class skill, or keep the really appropriate Guardian of the Forge trait. My players will probably tell you that Perception has not been as critical of a skill in this adventure so far as it is in some Pathfinder games - I don't think the party has been surprised yet.

@nate lange
If you want a fey-connected character, take the feytouched race here. Since Pathfinder doesn't use level adjustment, this just becomes amortized; you gain the charm person, skill bonuses (becomes a flat +2 Stealth), and immunities at character level 4. It's got +Cha, though the +Dex is not really helpful and the -Con hurts for a tank.

An alternative "touch of strange" character would be a fetchling, which also has +Cha. The -Wis is not a killer since Pathfinder paladins don't really use Wisdom anyway. While it's tangental to faerie business, the shadow realm does mean that the character has a bit of an "otherworldly" aspect and is already accustomed to dealing with supernatural beings from other planes.

@nate lange If you are looking for a race that feels tied to the fey, you could go with an azata-blooded aasimar (musetouched)... it has a Cha bonus, bonus to Diplomacy and Perform (both fitting for the fey), and glitterdust (fey powder?).

Oops. I forgot about campaign traits.

Honestly i took Seeker so Vallen would have perception to compliment Disable Device and some sharpshooting in the future if he builds a scoped distance musket or something. But if that's not an issue perhaps I'll think about what else i can put those skill points into. There are plenty of canidates.

I will incorporate being sponsored by House Garess. I assume they would, by extention, be on good terms with The Five Kings Mountains Kingdom and Highhelm. The easy way out is to just take Pioneer (which seems to have waaay too much going for it) to get perception and justify it with Vallen's previous adventures.

He's been through a lot, first character i made on the boards. Played in a WONDERFUL homebrew survival campaign for about a year and a half when one day the GM vanished without warning, never to be seen again. :( I like to pay homage to the game because it was some of the best roleplaying experience of my life.

This just occured to me- how would you handle using firearms from horseback? I don't mean the moving while shooting rules either- horses bolt/get spooked by gunshots very easily without proper training, and sometimes that doesn't even work. Hell, they get spooked by car horns. Handle animal check unless it's a specially trained warhorse? This also raises the question about everyone ELSE'S horses. I suppose easiest thing to do is ignore reality!

Vallen

So, I actually do/did mounted archery. For game purposes PF solely makes the distinction of "combat trained" or "not combat trained" for mounts; there's no distinction of, say, a mount that is trained for a rider to do archery, but not trained for melee combat. For our purposes, then, "combat trained" as a game definition includes all forms of combat, including firearms.

As far as Noble-Sponsored/Pioneer, Noble-Sponsored fits very well because the head of House Garess has no children and has instead declared that his heir is a dwarf who is sponsored by his house. Thus, barring some political upheaval (it's obviously an unpopular choice in some circles), House Garess will be run by dwarves within the next few decades.

Note that Pioneer gives you a +1 to a skill but does not make it a class skill.

@nate lange

Carinna's suggestion above is also a good one, could be very strong for a paladin with the +Cha.

Gathlain was the race I was trying to remember. If I go with the fey thing I would probably either make one of those (if they're even available) or a human with the fey magic racial ability, depending on the fluff I settled on. Mechanically, I've got a bunch of ideas for the fey theme, but I didn't find a ton of fluff inspiration from either of the Eldest that a paladin could follow.

the bard I posted already was a musetouched aasimar, and I was considering the same if I did a shelynite paladin.

@nate lange

Interesting. The gathlain is certainly a strong (even if small) tank with that alternative fast healing ability. One of the players who recently left was a flyer so that would fit in there (although the gathlain don't fly as well as strix). KM has a strong faerie undertone that comes out late in the AP so that could give us a connection with legs - also the party has already made friends with some local faeries.

Ah, it must have been wishful thinking that made me read the Pioneer trait as giving +1 and a class skill, considering that's what most of those traits do anyway. We'll go Noble-sponsored: House Garess, and replace Seeker. I can use those 3 skill points for other things, like Alchemy (for sweet, sweet alchemical cartridges).

Everyone else will have to keep their eyes peeled for traps...

Boop the Snoot

DO NOT BOOP THE SNOOT

I realize now that I have posted that in the wrong game.

Okay, because I was really confused even though I still thought it was funny :3

Lol, that makes it even funnier honestly!

I actually looked through the gameplay thread to try and figure out what you were talking about.

Alright, I think I'm ready. I decided to start working up the Gathlain character and the tiefling and see how I liked them... besides being a better frontliner, when it came time to write the fluff I just really felt like this guy (the tiefling paladin of Ragathiel) really connected me with some creative energy I haven't had in a while. As always, I welcome any feedback on build, fluff, party dynamics, etc.

If everything looks good, just let me know when/how to enter gameplay. Am I correct that Vallen and I are arriving together? If so, maybe we should talk about the pre-existing dynamic between our characters?

Just read through Vallen. Boy has he been through a lot already. A few things of note on mechanics. The number of skill points is correct but you have craft stone and craft stonemasonry. Those are the same thing. The backstory mentions crafting weapons so that should be a craft. Possibly a rank or two in diplomacy as well since he's negotiated with hobgoblins. They are not the most pleasant of monsters. Armor check penalty should be either -6 (-8 with shield) armor and capacity penalties do not stack. Worst is used. Besides that, he should be an excellent addition when kingdom building comes into play. Trudging through the forests and plains? That's going to rough. But a gun is a great choice for casters.

And now I have done Auric Lightmane. Man that one skill point looks rough. Thankfully we are using Background skills. Only thing mechanically is that resistance is 5 not 7. Unless I missed something. Almost missed the mercy and FCB. He'd probably feel a lot less sqweemish taking care of these bandits so it is probably good he was not around. We are currently trying to redeem more than remove. We'll see how that goes later.

My trait (unscathed) raises my resistances.

and, yes- the skills (or lack thereof) do hurt but this is my only character currently that has so few so hopefully it should be an interesting role playing challenge...

Regarding the bandits: because of my upbringing I prefer diplomacy to violence, and because of my personal story (and the story of my god) I believe in offering apparent bad guys a better way... if they choose not to take it though, or prove unworthy of the opportunity, I will not be squeamish about taking care of them.

Thanks for looking Vallen over, Cassandra!

When you say craft stone, do you mean Craft: Sculptures? Vallen has craft sculptures and stone masonry, which I consider distinct skills. The former is purely artistic while the latter is functional. I have always seen Vallen as an artist in addition to a builder. In essence, he uses both skills in his work. Sculpting also applies to any material, it's just that Vallen's favored medium is stone.

He'll be dropping the Seeker trait which will free up three skill points, so i should be able to put points in diplomacy and other craft skills like you mentioned. I haven't had time yet and strangely enough can't edit my sheet from my phone (it won't scroll!)

Thanks for pointing out ACP and carrying don't stack, I didn't know that (I usually keep characters at a light load). Not sure where you're getting the shield part though, he has a mwk buckler.

He'll try not to slow the party down, I'll get him a horse.

I currently also have a 20' move*... looks like we'll both need horses.
* except when charging, running, or withdrawing...

@Auric: Just a little thought... why don't you switch your Int and Wis scores? You are using Wis only for the will saves, and since you are a paladin, it is already pretty high thanks to divine grace. On the other hand, an additional skill point is much more useful.

I thought about that, actually, but I really picture him as more dull than foolish. Plus the way I see him there really aren't many other skills I would even consider... ride maybe, that's about it. And, like I said, this is the only character I'm playing right now who has less than like 4 or 5 ranks per level so it should be an interesting change.

Tweaked Vallen, giving him the Noble Sponspered trait. He's got craft: alchemy (for alchemical cartridges), blacksmithing, weaponsmithing, and diplomacy, and survival to better reflect his adventuring backstory. Also got him a Traverler's Any-tool to cut down his equipment load to Medium, and he's got a light warhorse (which I need to name...)

He also has less money now...

Hey guys, I'm going to be pulling 12s at work for the next three days so you may not see much in the way of posts from me during that time. I'll try to check in/keep up as much as I can but it may not be until Friday night or Saturday before I'll get caught up. As always, feel free to bot me for combat/skill checks as needed!

Can you put a separate link for the map of the stolenlands? I wonder if we might take a detour and explore a hex on the way back from Oleg's. After dealing with the trio.

It's kind of a pain to export that to a picture that I can post, so I've just switched the map link over to the overland map for now. I'll try to turn it into a separate link tomorrow.

If you can find it (I can't) I remember seeing an interactive Stolenlands hex map that allowed you to reveal and hide certain hexes and apply markers to denote important points.

Hey folks, I've received word that Carinna needs to take a break from PBP for a while. We'll need to look for one additional player to step in for her. As before, if you want to suggest a specific person, please do so. Otherwise, I'll ask around or hold a re-recruitment for the position.

It sounds like it's getting close to time for Vallen and me to arrive... I don't think I ever really got any feedback from the DM on the finalized version of Auric- everything look ok?

Also, I know I'm the new guy here but I have an RL friend that's a dependable poster who might be interested in getting in another game; I could give him a call if you'd like?

I also have some friends from another game I can ask.

Aw. Most of the original group is gone now.

It sounds like it's getting close to time for Vallen and me to arrive... I don't think I ever really got any feedback from the DM on the finalized version of Auric- everything look ok?

Also, I know I'm the new guy here but I have an RL friend that's a dependable poster who might be interested in getting in another game; I could give him a call if you'd like?

Auric looks ready to go. I didn't do a rigorous accounting on his gear prices, but at a glance it looks like he is about right for his level.

Bummer about Carinna; I hope he/she will be okay. As far as another player goes, I'm fine with either Auric or Vallen checking around :)

Also still busy with work, also quite tired - will try to catch up with the game proper tomorrow evening or Saturday.

I changed my picture again... I really can't find one that I'm completely happy with but I like this one better than the last one (for now). I saw that you're ready for us to post, I'm just trying to get this squared away first...

edit: dug even deeper. This was the best one I could find. It's probably fairly accurate when he rage/smites, but he'll generally seem a lot friendlier than this picture outside of combat.

Hey, I did not invite my friend to this game but I did mention in passing that there might be an opening here soon and he told me that one of the games he was in just ended and he's looking to pick something up... so if you decide you're interested at all I know he's at least curious about this game. Korinne- it's actually Orin's player.

I'm open to the possibility. Your friend messaged me and has a pistoleer to try. I'm fine with that notion. (Pistols are emerging technology here, primarily from Alkenstar and Numeria, per the core setting of Golarion.)

That's not my friend... or, at least, not the RL friend I mentioned (I just texted him to double check). Could be one of the people Vallen mentioned?

Yep, that's Galorit's friend.

I don't have any specific preferences either way, though I will note that at the moment you guys still don't have any trapfinding.

I'm cool with whatever. I was actually considering possibly posting a recruitment for a GM swap (like if someone was willing to run something my friend and I want to play together I would GM something for them in return), so if he doesn't get in here I'll probably just do that. Of course, if you want I could ask if he wants to pitch a guy and you could pick between the two or three friends of the group that reply?

My barometer is simple:
• You need to be able to work reasonably with the group - no strong-arming or threatening other players unless you decide together to create a scene that you want to make. This means evil characters are likely a non-starter unless you are Lawful Pragmatic and loyal to the group.
• Tired of seeing superiority builds like synthesist summoner/monk or Strength 18 half-orc slayer with the magic tattoos race+trait that give you +2 on all your saves.
• You should have some reason, in the story, why the Swordlords would decide that you're a good choice to represent Brevic interests in the Stolen Lands, i.e. if you are an alien from another planet you will have to jump through some flaming hoops to explain why you got picked to head up this operation.

Other than that it's really up to the players to decide who they like.

Gosh, I hope my build isn't too much? I could still try to tone it down a bit if you like?

As for my friend, I'll tell him he can pitch something to the group?

Nah, mostly I get tired of exploiters who look for unintended bad design so that they can get clearly outsized benefits to skew the game to do whatever they want.

In a KM game in which I played there was one of the aforementioned Strength 18 half-orc slayers, with the race substitution+trait that gives a +1 luck bonus to all saves and then a +1 increase to any luck bonus. One racial substitution and one trait does not equal +2 to all saves; +2 to one save is a feat like Iron Will - this is clearly an outsized unintended benefit. In what should be a surprise to no one, he was Chaotic Neutral, which he used to justify any behavior he wanted (including enslaving prisoners, a thoroughly Lawful Evil act) and he threatened party members with violence if he didn't get his way. He even threatened to rape one of the party members. Needless to say, I left that game.

So basically my barometer is not "Is your build effective?" but rather "Did you exploit clearly unintended systems to build a character specifically so you can do whatever you want and force the game to go your way?"

By all means have your friend pitch, and we'll do a sort of mini-recruitment and see what people like.

Oops yeah, I told my friends in my other game about the opening here, and Azih said they had been looking for a Kingmaker game. I highly recommend them- amazing roleplayer that never fails to impress me with their storytelling.

Uh, wow. That half-orc slayer sounds like the worst kind of player (or hell, PERSON) to be around. I'm glad you left that game.

So Azih, Galorit's friend, has proposed a pistoleer, presumably chaotic good (seems to be a Desnan), aiming for a Marshal role, with some backstory based on the short briefing I received. @Auric, did your friend have a specific character in mind? Then we can all argue. :)

Of note, I think we all kind of assumed that Carinna would be the ruler, since her backstory included being from a noble family, she's a Swordlord-in-training, she has high swashbuckler charisma, etc. Now that she's departing we'll need to think about who's gonna do what, since we are perilously close to establishing a kingdom.

Though I don't know him as well as Auric does, the friend that he mentioned is fun to play with and is no slouch at RPing. However I'm also happy to see what Azih has in mind as well. Too bad we can't take both ;)

And yeah, with Carinna gone we'll need someone else to play ruler - you proooooobably don't want Korinne or Cass doing it; their strengths lie elsewhere :)

Also, are we still aiming for a pretty traditional kingdom setup? I know very early on we'd toyed with the idea of more of a confederacy owing to several of the party members being of a chaotic good bent (as well as there being some interest in having a place that welcomes 'outcasts' like Cass's people), but I think it was vetoed at the time. I'm good either way, just some food for thought :)

If you want a nontraditional, non-feudal system, I happen to have written some additional KM rules about just that thing.

Are you into theocratic monarchies, because I've got the Charisma for it... I would need some hardcore advising on anything Int/Wis related though...

I'll see my friend tomorrow for an iRL game, I'll talk to him about a character idea. Also, the timings not great now that I've just introduced Auric but if need be we could make him one of the NPCs and I could make a would-be-king instead... one of my early ideas was for a noble who came down in the second wave to provide some political leadership (but I scrapped it because I didn't want to step on Carinna's toes at all...)

Up to you, depends on what you'd enjoy. Korinne's got smarts, Vallen's got wisdom, so we have some flexibility.

Up to you Auric. I think we can manage somehow, regardless.

Nice write up on the various forms of ruling systems, Jesse. Vallen is a traditionalist, so he would want at least a constitutional monarchy (though that kind of kills his roll for Councilor). I'll have to think about it more and read the rules more in-depth later.

So what needs doing around here? We going to finish exploring hexes?

The campaign info tab includes a quest log. You need to finish exploring the area (the charter requires you to complete that task), and there are a few critters to hunt down and finish off.

Hey all, just checking in to say that I'm actually back - which is the good news! The bad news is that I tested positive for the flu this morning. Guess I'll at least have plenty of time for PbP while I'm off work and recovering, heh.

Well, my friend ended up getting a nasty cut and had to go for stitches (he's fine now), so he hasn't had much time to think about a pitch. His initial reaction when I talked to him was that he might be interested in playing a dual-wielder, either an unchained rogue or maybe a slayer (either way he could be a candidate for spymaster?)

As for me, I'm perfectly happy to play Auric (and go for general or diplomat), and I don't want anyone to feel like I'm trying push myself into the king role, but if nobody else is interested I do have an idea for a character that would be well-suited for it... a somewhat distant cousin of the king whose tutor was an Aldori swordlord; he would have been handpicked to go provide some leadership in the forming nation. He'd be a cavalier/bard (with some combat ability, but certainly not like Auric) headed either towards the Noble Scion prestige class or Battle Herald (depending on why the party seems to need when we get to that point).

Thoughts?