New Wizard, need help with Spell selection

[Roco]

Hello everybody!

I'm new to playing a wizard but not to Pathfinder or casters in general. But I'm much more used to playing a sorcerer or oracle where your spell's known is very limited.

Now I'm taking a crack at a prepared caster, a wizard, and really need help as the choices available are staggering!

Part of my choice fatigue/freeze up is I can't seem to find a universally good list for spells that doesn't seem just... well daunting. Is there a tool or resource out there that helps to organize, search and filter spells, and in general, allow me to cobble a spell book together much easier?

So, while I try to dizzy myself with all the options I figured I'd ask here for advice on spells to take. I'll start by describing the type of character/wizard I'm going for.

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He's a Neutral Good Elf Wizard (Bonded Wizard Archetype) level 8 starting character. He'll start with the base allotment of spells you can know starting off. 3+INT 1st levels, +2 per level any spell that can be known after that. He also has 1,000 gp (possibly 3,000gp if I decide to make my cloak of resistance +2 a +1 instead) for extra spells.

We're using the 25 point buy ability scores so his INT is 26 (18 base, +1 at level 4 and 8, +2 from race, +4 from item)

He's a junior professor and librarian from a noble family. Forced to stay in his job and city and never allowed to leave due to sheltering and controlling family. A group of adventurers passes through and does some heoric deeds impressing the wizard well enough to try and join their group and sneak out of the city.

He's a Divination school focused wizard but the city he's from and the school he attends makes liberal use of Necromancy. Long and short of it is they see dead bodies as a waste, might as well raise them and put em to work like an organic robot labor force.

So his focus should be on Divination and Necromancy. His opposition schools are Evocation (ballsy, I know, but we already have a pure blaster mage in the group) and Enchantment.

Our group's play style is much more narrative than combative/mechanical. But we do get into fights from time to time. But spells that are not as good because they suck in combat are fine additions so long as they give great social and utility applications.

He's also the knowledge nerd. (filling in the gaps of knowledges that the team lacks).

I see this character as a utility, buffer, debuffer, diviner type character. But much more leaning on the utility aspect. He has Fast Study which allows him to prepare spells in 1 minute! (so I can keep my prepared list relatively free all day and only prepare when I need to)

The only spells I wish to stay away from (mainly for the sanity of our GM) is heavy book keeping type spells (like AoO stat damage) or level reducing spells. Also I want to avoid most mind control, save or die type spells (except for the obvious undead controlling stuff). It's why enchantment is an opposition school.

Oh, and last thing, only spells from Pathfinder official books (but any official book is okay).

So with all of that in mind, what spells would you suggest at each level?

Also if you just have general suggestions on how to play a wizard or useful tips/tools that too would greatly help!

[Ventnor]

I don't know how locked in you feel with your character build, but I'd recommend giving the Arcanist class a look. The Arcanist prepares spells like a wizard does, but casts their prepared spells spontaneously like a sorcerer.

Anyway, at level 1 grease is not a bad spell to have in your back pocket. You can use it to make enemies slip and fall down or cast it on an ally to help them escape a grapple.

[Roco]

Ventnor wrote:

I don't know how locked in you feel with your character build, but I'd recommend giving the Arcanist class a look. The Arcanist prepares spells like a wizard does, but casts their prepared spells spontaneously like a sorcerer.

Anyway, at level 1 grease is not a bad spell to have in your back pocket. You can use it to make enemies slip and fall down or cast it on an ally to help them escape a grapple.

I'm certainly no opposed to it (especially since there's the school savant option) but the thing I'm worried about is they have less spells than a usual wizard or sorcerer.

[Perfect Tommy]

Must Haves:

4.
Emergency Force Shield
Black Tentacles
Dim Door

3. Ablative Sphere
Haste
Fly

2. Defending Bone, Glitterdust/SeeInvisible

1
Mage Armor
Liberating Command
Sure Casting
Snowballs
MonkeyFish
Also - you should have one or two of the pit spells.

Nice to have, depending on build
4
Skin Project, Greater False Life

3
ClairVoyance - I guess. Divination sucks unless you're playing a diviner.

TinyHut (Give your party concealment...)

2. False Life, Mirror Image,
1.
Shield
Grease
Charm Person

[shaventalz]

Perfect Tommy wrote:

Must Haves:

4.
Emergency Force Shield

3. Ablative Sphere

1
Liberating Command
Sure Casting
Snowballs

Nice to have, depending on build
3
ClairVoyance - I guess.

I'd disagree with you on these spells, or at least disagree on preparing them.

EFS is great... as something you can pull with an arcane bond. Without some way to reliably and quickly get out of it, the caster needs to spend a standard action to dismiss the spell. Otherwise, he's trapped.

I've never used Ablative Sphere. Given how quickly enemy attack modifiers rise, I'm not sure even +8 AC is worth a 3rd-level slot.

While Liberating Command starts off great... it specifies an Escape Artist check. How many PCs actually put multiple ranks into that skill? And with the insane grapple modifiers on basically any monster that will try grappling, it's just not that helpful later on.

Sure Casting (and possibly Mage Armor) are wand/scroll spells.

Snowball got nerfed, so all it is now is a ranged version of Shocking Grasp (and it's one of his opposition schools.) If you can convince your GM to let you take the old version... maybe. That might be stepping on your blaster's toes, though.

Clairaudience/Clairvoyance is terrible in most cases. It takes 10 minutes of likely-obvious spellcasting to get minutes/level of sight/sound into a familiar or obvious location. Maybe useful in a town to spy on some known meeting room, but not useful when you're out on the road.

*******

Here are some spells my own Diviner Wizard has found useful. He has Necromancy as one of his opposition schools, so I don't have good data for that. Also note this list doesn't include some of the "standard" spells (Grease/Pit/etc.)

1)
Heightened Awareness: Bonuses to Knowledge, Perception, and possibly Initiative.
Ant Haul: Only if the GM actually tracks encumbrance. Either put this on your melee guys to make sure you can haul everything out, or put it on yourself. 10 Strength gets you a whole 33 pounds of equipment, including clothes/spellbook/component pouch.
Endure Elements: Again depends on the GM/situation.
Comprehend Languages: Probably on a scroll or wand. Heading into an ancient ruin? Found a mouldering old tome? Make sure you can read the warnings.

2)
See Invisibility: Decent duration, and tells you where to use that scroll of Glitterdust.
Book Ward: Spellbooks are valuable. This is a days/level protection spell for them that can be used during your "off" days.
Investigative Mind: This is Enchantment, but it might be worth taking anyway. If you're the "knowledge nerd", several uses of roll-twice on Knowledge could make it worth the extra cost.
Fog Cloud: Maybe on a scroll? Blocks line of sight at range.

3)
Tongues or Voluminous Vocabulary: Divination spells useful for the party face. VolVocab also doubles as a research aid if you're dealing with books written in a foreign language - it lasts all day.
Haste: Also Haste, Haste, and Haste.
Magic Circle against Evil: 10 minutes/level and can cover multiple people. Worth having available, but might not get prepared every day (depending on what your party's doing.)
Stinking Cloud: Blocks line of sight and debuffs.
Aqueous Orb: Nonlethal damage that can reposition enemies and put out fires. Pretty versatile.
Daylight: Because otherwise Deeper Darkness will ruin everyone's day. Probably use via Arcane Bond or an oil. EDIT: It's Evocation, so no arcane bond.

4)
Locate Creature: Need to find a specific NPC? This is the spell for you.
Named Bullet: Need to kill a specific NPC? Here you go. Also works on "that dire tiger that keeps getting into the sheep."

5)
Life Bubble: Just because you don't want to use Cloudkill doesn't mean the GM won't.

Also, you can get some major versatility out of Summon Monster spells if you're willing to dig through the lists. Healing, earth glide, flight, swim, miscellaneous SLAs... it's just a lot of information to sort through.

[shaventalz]

As for how to track everything... Personally, I have several printouts.

One is a few sets of spells for common situations (travel, dungeon crawl, and research.) These have spells/day and several preparation options at each spell level. Put that in a plastic sheet protector, and use a dry erase marker to cross out spells as they get used (or ones that weren't prepared that day.) Here's what I mean. This is mostly just to provide a simplified base, with room for customization. You'd probably keep a few more open slots.

The second printout is a summary of the more common spells. I actually only do this on my other casters, but the idea still holds. For spells that you don't just know, something like name/level/range/SR?/duration/effectSummary can be helpful.

The third printout is which spellbooks all the spells are in. This is probably unnecessary for you, and is mostly so you know exactly how much trouble you're in when the GM sends a thief after you.

[Meirril]

Well, then suggestions.

1st: Protection from Evil (or other): really a must have. Communal version is better, the protection from mind control is the main reason but the bonus to saves and AC are also good.

Blood Money is a really obscure spell from RotRL AP that lets you sacrifice strength to pay for material component cost. Not sure if your GM would be ok with this, ask for permission.

Illusion of Calm: Lets you cast in melee without triggering AoO.

Monkeyfish: gives you a poor climb speed or swim speed. Any of those means no skill checks! Very good utility spell. Though if you take Spider Climb and Touch of the Sea you'll never cast this.

2nd: Protection from <whatever>, communal. Already explained.

Resist Energy: and the communal version are universally taken spells. You might skip this version and just take the communal.

Blood Transcription: Sounds disgusting, usually when you kill a caster you can find his spellbook, but just in case you can't...

Create Treasure Map: Remember how I said you usually find that Spellbook? Almost guaranteed to work.

Detect Thoughts: If someone else likes to talk, you can listen a little better.

Mirror Image: The most annoying defensive spell in the game. Works 90% of the time.

False Life: Almost every NPC boss has this cast on them. You should too.

Steal Breath: Great against arcane casters.

3rd: Resist Energy, communal: already explained.

Mad Monkeys: swarm type disruption spell. There is no casting in this.

Stinking Cloud: A classic area denial spell. Can turn an entire encounter trivial.

Arcane Sight: One of the most common spells to make Permanent. Hardly ever cast.

Displacement: Not as good as Mirror Image, but very common none the less. Anything that bypasses Mirror Image also bypasses this.

Deathwine: Turn some of those plentiful healing potions into something useful.

Ray of Exhaustion: Excellent debuff.

Heart of the Metal: when combined with extensive Knowledge Checks and Blood Money a decent party buff. Kind of a B list spell unless you run into a lot of outsiders/constructs.

Monstrous Physique 1: Test your knowledge of humanoid monsters to gain access to lots of movement types and senses. Gargoyle is very popular.

Slow: Possibly the number 1 most useful debuff in the game. Reducing opponents to a single standard action is huge. The only way this is less than Haste is it can be resisted. It also counters haste.

4th: Dimensional Anchor: There is nothing more annoying that an enemy that teleports.

Remove Curse: You'll never prepare this spell, but you want it in your book.

Stoneskin: this really depends on how you and the GM play. Generally speaking, a fantastic defensive spell. With Blood Money you'll cast this a lot.

Arcane Eye: for scouting.

Invisibility, Greater: Not really great for you, but frightening on any melee.

Stone Shape: Lets you cheat a lot in dungeons.

5th: Break Enchantment: Something you don't want to casually prepare, but a must have for your book.

Teleport: does this need to be explained?

Wall of Stone: really the first useful wall spell you'll get. Allows you to separate hostiles so they party can take a big encounter in manageable chunks.

Contact Other Plane: risky spell, but useful.

Shadow Evocation: Finally, you can blast things.

Magic Jar: This spell is so broken and abused.

Waves of Fatigue: Decent area debuff. Cast this first and then follow up with Ray of Exhaustion. Even if they save they are exhausted!

Baleful Polymorph: Save or better than dead!

Fabricate: Not something you'll cast often, but if you like to craft...

Overland Flight: Fly all day for 1 casting.

Shapechanger's Gift: Everything Polymorph should of been.

Permanency: Again a book spell, but oh so useful.

Stopping at 5th level since its one above where you'll start. Also I didn't duplicate any of the posts above. Look into buying Spellbooks with Preperation Rituals in them. The prepration ritual lets you get a special ability for no real cost.

Also one suggestion is trying to find a permanent magic item that gives you an offense that you can use while you think of something better to do. I personally used a Ring of Telekinesis for that. 75k well spent. Well, half that because I crafted it.

Also you might get into crafting magic items. If you have another blaster type around you can afford to sink some feats into crafting. Take Cooperative Crafting and then invest in Simulacrum once you cast 7th level spells and make copies of yourself and other casters you know. Try to meet high level priests, druids, ect so you have access to a lot of high level casters to duplicate. Actually monsters with spell-like abilities generally don't lose those abilities at half HD. Blood Money will be huge for this sort of thing. So will spells to buff your strength.

[Dajur]

Starting at level 8 makes playing an unfamiliar character much more difficult, but the spells listed above are a great start. I recommend keeping a cheat sheet with the most useful spells and a brief description with you for easy reference. This addresses the hardest problem I have playing casters, the sheer amount of spells, and spell descriptions you have to go through to find the ones that you want.

[Pantshandshake]

I haven't found a spellbook app that I actually like yet, so I go old school with my wizard: Flashcards.

Every spell I know goes on a flashcard. I also keep several themed sets of prepared spells handy, so I can just say "I have these memorized now" after a rest. I also keep the stats of monsters that I summon regularly on a few cards.

I'm an arcane bond wizard, so during play I keep the spells I have memorized under the card with the list of spells. Everything else is face up. As I cast spells, they go into the face-up pile. Once I use the bond, I turn that pile face down.

In terms of figuring out which spells to pick, that's harder. Do you have an Android phone? Get Masterwork Tools, and any time you'd go on facebook or whatever to kill 5 minutes, read spells instead. Start trying to figure out what you want to do, and then look at spells that will let you do that. Try and have things that target different areas; AC, ref/fort/wis saves, CMD, move speed, that sort of thing.

As helpful as the forums are, it's sort of like asking your friends what their favorite sandwiches are, and then only eating those sandwiches. You need to look at the menu, study it, and then decide on your own how to fill your belly.

[Kayerloth]

Quote:

As helpful as the forums are, it's sort of like asking your friends what their favorite sandwiches are, and then only eating those sandwiches. You need to look at the menu, study it, and then decide on your own how to fill your belly.

This.

While there are some spells that would likely pop up on almost any list, such as Haste, in general I wouldn't get too concerned about which exact spells you choose. First you are a wizard, if it turns out it's a bad choice it just gathers dust in the spell book after you start using the replacement. You don't want to make a habit of this but a few 'lemons' aren't going to cripple you in the long run unlike a sorcerer for whom missteps might hurt for much longer since only so many can get swapped around as they level and your known spells are limited. Second most of the spells out there can be used to good effect. The list of truly awful spells is fairly short. Many can be fairly niche and circumstantial but not useless and again in the long run you're a wizard, your spell book will eventually fill up rather nicely with such spells. That's why you reserve those empty slots when memorizing after all. And having that huge assortment of spells is one of the wizards strengths as a class.

When first deciding what spells I'd look to make sure I have one fairly versatile offensive spell, one defensive spell and a miscellaneous/utility spell. After that just keep building up the list almost like they were houses in a monopoly game (i.e. evenly between offense, defense, utility/niche) until you have a nice selection of ones you like and tend to use. Consider holding back some of your initial wealth to spend on spells after a few play sessions as you get a feel for what sort of challenges the group and your GM tend to encounter and what spells would have been useful for those challenges. Maybe even start by looking at what spells you've enjoyed and used with those previous casters (the sorcerer in particular). Being familiar with those spells already you'll have a better idea of which offensive, defensive and utility spells you already think are solid choices.