Flanking - third PC


Rules Questions


The other night this came up, and wanted to ask opinions. I think what was done was strictly correct by the rules, but the rules are weird in this area.

Player A and Player B have the enemy flanked. Then Player C comes up and attacks the enemy. The question was, did Player C get the flank bonus? At the time, the DM stated no, because Player C did not have a "flank buddy" as it were. But my thought is, wouldn't "flanked" be a condition that the enemy would either be in or not be in? Just because Player C isn't doing the flanking would not mean the enemy isn't flanked, and therefore less able to defend himself, and therefore easier to hit.


There is a certain logic to your idea, but RAW the GM was correct.


"Flanked" is not a condition that impairs a defending creature; "flanking" is a bonus that an attacking creature gets under specific circumstances. The usual circumstances are spelled out in the Combat chapter:

Flanking wrote:

When making a melee attack, you get a +2 flanking bonus if your opponent is threatened by another enemy character or creature on its opposite border or opposite corner.

When in doubt about whether two characters flank an opponent in the middle, trace an imaginary line between the two attackers' centers. If the line passes through opposite borders of the opponent's space (including corners of those borders), then the opponent is flanked.

Exception: If a flanker takes up more than 1 square, it gets the flanking bonus if any square it occupies counts for flanking.

Only a creature or character that threatens the defender can help an attacker get a flanking bonus.

Creatures with a reach of 0 feet can't flank an opponent.

If Player C's opponent is threatened on its opposite border or corner, then Player C receives a flanking bonus; otherwise, barring some special ability, Player C doesn't.

There's a feat (Gang Up) that models something like what you're getting at, but it's a feat, not the default situation.

Grand Lodge

Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

Blahpers is entirely correct, but I can add a situation where the third person would get the bonus too.

If the target is larger than medium, then more than one character can be on its side. For example; a Large dragon is flanked by characters to its north and south sides, they are flanking and so get the bonus. A third character joins in on the south side, and so is opposite the character on the north side and ALSO gets the bonus.

Hope thats clear, it would be easier with pictures. :)


I'll agree the blahpers is correct


RAW has already been mentioned. However, I agree RAW is weird in this case.

If I would run a game I would go with one of these option.

Alt 1. The opponent has a facing, and the "flankers" in front of the opponent will not get a bonus unless having the Gang Up Feat.

Alt 2. If an opponent is flanked, everyone fighting it gets the bonus. The Gang Up Feat is for when 3+ are fighting one opponent but none are in a flanking position (for example, standing in line).
X
XO
X

or

XO
XX


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Darrell Impey UK wrote:

Blahpers is entirely correct, but I can add a situation where the third person would get the bonus too.

If the target is larger than medium, then more than one character can be on its side. For example; a Large dragon is flanked by characters to its north and south sides, they are flanking and so get the bonus. A third character joins in on the south side, and so is opposite the character on the north side and ALSO gets the bonus.

Hope thats clear, it would be easier with pictures. :)

Another option: One of the PCs has a reach weapon.

AXAR

A=PC Ally
R=PC w/Reach
X=Enemy

My Reach Cleric uses this all the time.

/cevah

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