How do Current Skills map / transfer to Playtest Skills?


Playtest


Pretty Excited about the character sheet shown in Episode #8.

Maybe this was discussed already somewhere else - please point me to a more central thread.

Noticed there are now 17 Skills instead of 25+.

Tried to map the skills - Bold Skills seem to go 1 to 1. Current skills have arrows under the Playtest Skill they seem to fold into.

Attempted Mapping:
Deception CHA
<- Bluff CHA
<- Disguise CHA
Diplomacy CHA
Intimidate CHA
Perform CHA
Acrobatics DEX
Stealth DEX
Thievery DEX
<- Disable Device DEX
<- Sleight of Hand DEX
Arcana INT
<- Spellcraft INT
Crafting INT
Lore INT
<- Appraise INT
<- Knowledge INT
<- Linguistics INT
Occultism INT
Athletics STR
<- Climb STR
<- Swim STR
Medicine WIS
<- Heal WIS
Nature WIS
Religion WIS
Survival WIS

Orphans: Not sure where these go
Handle Animal CHA
Escape Artist DEX
Fly DEX
Ride DEX
Profession WIS
Sense Motive WIS

Skills that are now their own Sub Game Model:
Resonance <- Use Magic Device CHA
Perception <- Perception WIS

Thinking understanding how skills are folded would provide insight into the design of the Skill Feats and progressions of the Playtest.

What does everybody think about this?

Also there doesn't seem to be a way to represent a table in the forum comment system. Markdown support would be nice. Or a way to even do a fixed width fonts so structured spacing would be possible. Correct me if I am missing something on the forum comment system.


I believe lore is covering Profession as well, since we know that Lore (sailor) is a thing that certain nautical mechanics care about, in the same way Profession (sailor) was a thing. And I think Sense motive is covered under perception now. As for Escape artist I'd guess that's acrobatics, and handle animal I believe was a Skill feat of nature, unless I'm remembering wrong. I don't know if fly or ride will be in PF2e, and my guess would be not, but if they are, I'd say acrobatics (or maybe acrobatics and athletics respectively).

Also, as for Knowledge, I agree some of the knowledge will be Lore, but I think Nobility and Local (and maybe history) will be Society, Geography I'd guess is rolled into survival (maybe nature, but I wouldn't bet against survival), Same with dungeoneering (but almost certainly survival this time, with monster knowledge probably folded into occult). Planes is probably folded into religion, but I'd guess history and engineering will probably stay as lore.

RPG Superstar Season 9 Top 4, RPG Superstar 2015 Top 32

Based on the Consolidated Skil LIst from Pathfinder Unchained, my guess would be:

Handle Animal - Nature
Escape Artist - Acrobatics
Fly - Acrobatics
Ride - Acrobatics
Profession - Lore
Sense Motive - Perception


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Steel Radial wrote:
Also there doesn't seem to be a way to represent a table in the forum comment system. Markdown support would be nice. Or a way to even do a fixed width fonts so structured spacing would be possible. Correct me if I am missing something on the forum comment system.

You aren't missing anything, and simply having fixed width would be awesome.


Charlie Brooks wrote:

Based on the Consolidated Skil LIst from Pathfinder Unchained, my guess would be:

Handle Animal - Nature
Escape Artist - Acrobatics
Fly - Acrobatics
Ride - Acrobatics
Profession - Lore
Sense Motive - Perception

Thanks Charlie.

Is it likely do we think that flying and riding will have different feat packages under acrobatics to cover them?

Also interesting that Handle Animal goes from WIS to CHA. Are there character class implications for this, if the change was implemented in the current system?


Fuzzy-Wuzzy wrote:
Steel Radial wrote:
Also there doesn't seem to be a way to represent a table in the forum comment system. Markdown support would be nice. Or a way to even do a fixed width fonts so structured spacing would be possible. Correct me if I am missing something on the forum comment system.
You aren't missing anything, and simply having fixed width would be awesome.

Thanks Fuzzy! Is there any way to contribute to the Pathfinder web team's Github for this forum system? Is it just a customized package? Would love to contribute to an improved system.


Tholomyes wrote:

I believe lore is covering Profession as well, since we know that Lore (sailor) is a thing that certain nautical mechanics care about, in the same way Profession (sailor) was a thing. And I think Sense motive is covered under perception now. As for Escape artist I'd guess that's acrobatics, and handle animal I believe was a Skill feat of nature, unless I'm remembering wrong. I don't know if fly or ride will be in PF2e, and my guess would be not, but if they are, I'd say acrobatics (or maybe acrobatics and athletics respectively).

Also, as for Knowledge, I agree some of the knowledge will be Lore, but I think Nobility and Local (and maybe history) will be Society, Geography I'd guess is rolled into survival (maybe nature, but I wouldn't bet against survival), Same with dungeoneering (but almost certainly survival this time, with monster knowledge probably folded into occult). Planes is probably folded into religion, but I'd guess history and engineering will probably stay as lore.

Thanks Tholomys.

I am interested in how the Knowledge, Lore, Society splitting works. Where can I find the Dungeoneering and Planes Skills in the current book list? Would be nice to under standing which parts of environment related capabilities are Lore/Knowledge and which have distinct break out skills and why.


1 person marked this as a favorite.
Steel Radial wrote:

Pretty Excited about the character sheet shown in Episode #8.

Maybe this was discussed already somewhere else - please point me to a more central thread.

Noticed there are now 17 Skills instead of 25+.

Tried to map the skills - Bold Skills seem to go 1 to 1. Current skills have arrows under the Playtest Skill they seem to fold into.

Attempted Mapping:
Deception CHA
<- Bluff CHA
<- Disguise CHA
Diplomacy CHA
Intimidate CHA
Perform CHA
Acrobatics DEX
Stealth DEX
Thievery DEX
<- Disable Device DEX
<- Sleight of Hand DEX
Arcana INT
<- Spellcraft INT
Crafting INT
Lore INT
<- Appraise INT
<- Knowledge INT
<- Linguistics INT
Occultism INT
Athletics STR
<- Climb STR
<- Swim STR
Medicine WIS
<- Heal WIS
Nature WIS
Religion WIS
Survival WIS

Orphans: Not sure where these go
Handle Animal CHA
Escape Artist DEX
Fly DEX
Ride DEX
Profession WIS
Sense Motive WIS

Skills that are now their own Sub Game Model:
Resonance <- Use Magic Device CHA
Perception <- Perception WIS

Thinking understanding how skills are folded would provide insight into the design of the Skill Feats and progressions of the Playtest.

What does everybody think about this?

Also there doesn't seem to be a way to represent a table in the forum comment system. Markdown support would be nice. Or a way to even do a fixed width fonts so structured spacing would be possible. Correct me if I am missing something on the forum comment system.

You are mostly right. We don't really know how fly, ride, and escape artist will work, but I'd suspect all are an acrobatics function. As mentioned, profession is now under lore.

Lore is basically a miscellaneous skill. It represents a very narrow field of knowledge. Lore examples include a specific diety, blacksmithing, and IIRC underworld. It does NOT represent what knowledge checks were in PF1. A Lore is generally too narrow to be useful often. It is also used for what would have been profession checks before.

Knowledge checks, UMD, and spellcraft seem to have all been rolled together, but split into 4 fields of study. Arcana, occultism, nature, and religion. These correspond to the 4 spell lists. The skills will be used for Identifying and activating magic items corresponding that spell list, identifying categories of enemies (outsiders for religion, dragons for arcana, plants and animals for nature, aberrations for occultism, etc) and some other miscellaneous stuff. Religion can be used for exorcism. I think nature will probably include handle animal, etc.

I'm not sure how linguistics will work, but I hope it gets examined. I really like it as a "decode scrambled messages" or "piece together damaged documents" skill. I don't like how you learned languages through it. I'm thinking it might get rolled into society.

If appraise was just written out of the game I'd be happy. Maybe make perception relevant for evaluating loot, but I ignore that skill so often anyway. It just isn't fun and slows down the game.


Steel Radial wrote:
Fuzzy-Wuzzy wrote:
Steel Radial wrote:
Also there doesn't seem to be a way to represent a table in the forum comment system. Markdown support would be nice. Or a way to even do a fixed width fonts so structured spacing would be possible. Correct me if I am missing something on the forum comment system.
You aren't missing anything, and simply having fixed width would be awesome.
Thanks Fuzzy! Is there any way to contribute to the Pathfinder web team's Github for this forum system? Is it just a customized package? Would love to contribute to an improved system.

No idea. You could try posting in Website Feedback. Good luck!

Liberty's Edge

The actual map is more like the following with PF2 skills listed first, and PF1 skills that fall under them in parentheses:

Acrobatics (Acrobatics, Escape Artist, Fly, some Combat Maneuvers)
Arcana (Know: Arcana, Spellcraft & Use Magic Device for Arcane Spells/Items)
Athletics (Climb, Swim, some Combat Maneuvers)
Crafting (Appraise, Craft)
Deception (Bluff, Disguise)
Diplomacy (Diplomacy)
Intimidation (Intimidate)
Lore (Profession, Know: Engineering, individual Knowledge skills without monster lore like History or Nobility can also be managed)
Medicine (Heal)
Nature (Know: Nature, Handle Animal, Spellcraft & Use Magic Device for Primal Spells/Items)
Occultism (Know: Dungeoneering, Spellcraft & Use Magic Device for Occult Spells/Items)
Perform (Perform)
Religion (Know: Religion, Know: Planes, Spellcraft & Use Magic Device for Divine Spells/Items)
Society (Know: Local, Know: History, Know: Nobility, Linguistics)
Thievery (Disable Device, Sleight of Hand)
Stealth (Stealth)
Survival (Survival, Know: Geography)

Some of those are slightly speculative (Linguistics, for example is based entirely on Culture, which is Society's equivalent in Starfinder granting languages), and I'm honestly not sure where Ride winds up.

Perception, despite not being a skill, covers Perception and Sense Motive.


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Captain Morgan wrote:


You are mostly right. We don't really know how fly, ride, and escape artist will work, but I'd suspect all are an acrobatics function. As mentioned, profession is now under lore.

Lore is basically a miscellaneous skill. It represents a very narrow field of knowledge. Lore examples include a specific diety, blacksmithing, and IIRC underworld. It does NOT represent what knowledge checks were in PF1. A Lore is generally too narrow to be useful often. It is also used for what would have been profession checks before.

Knowledge checks, UMD, and spellcraft seem to have all been rolled together, but split into 4 fields of study. Arcana, occultism, nature, and religion. These correspond to the 4 spell lists. The skills will be used for Identifying and activating magic items corresponding that spell list, identifying categories of enemies (outsiders for religion, dragons for arcana, plants and animals for nature, aberrations for occultism, etc) and some other miscellaneous stuff. Religion can be used for exorcism. I think nature will probably include handle animal, etc.

I'm not sure how linguistics will work, but I hope it gets examined. I really like it as a "decode scrambled messages" or "piece together damaged documents" skill. I don't like how you learned languages through it. I'm thinking it might get rolled into society.

If appraise was just written out of the game I'd be happy. Maybe make perception relevant for evaluating loot, but I ignore that skill so often anyway. It just isn't fun and slows down the game.

Thanks Cap!

Interested in understanding How the four magic school's skills compare, and then how Survival, Society, Lore, Profession are mapped and work. Also this means that some formally INT Knowledge skills become WIS. Does Handle Animal changing from CHA to WIS have effects on character builds or classes?


Deadmanwalking wrote:

The actual map is more like the following with PF2 skills listed first, and PF1 skills that fall under them in parentheses:

Acrobatics (Acrobatics, Escape Artist, Fly, some Combat Maneuvers)
Arcana (Know: Arcana, Spellcraft & Use Magic Device for Arcane Spells/Items)
Athletics (Climb, Swim, some Combat Maneuvers)
Crafting (Appraise, Craft)
Deception (Bluff, Disguise)
Diplomacy (Diplomacy)
Intimidation (Intimidate)
Lore (Profession, Know: Engineering, individual Knowledge skills without monster lore like History or Nobility can also be managed)
Medicine (Heal)
Nature (Know: Nature, Handle Animal, Spellcraft & Use Magic Device for Primal Spells/Items)
Occultism (Know: Dungeoneering, Spellcraft & Use Magic Device for Occult Spells/Items)
Perform (Perform)
Religion (Know: Religion, Know: Planes, Spellcraft & Use Magic Device for Divine Spells/Items)
Society (Know: Local, Know: History, Know: Nobility, Linguistics)
Thievery (Disable Device, Sleight of Hand)
Stealth (Stealth)
Survival (Survival, Know: Geography)

Some of those are slightly speculative (Linguistics, for example is based entirely on Culture, which is Society's equivalent in Starfinder granting languages), and I'm honestly not sure where Ride winds up.

Perception, despite not being a skill, covers Perception and Sense Motive.

Thanks DMW!

Interested to know more about how Profession, Crafting, Society, and Linguistics work in Starfinder and what that may say about the Playtest rules.


Steel Radial wrote:
Captain Morgan wrote:


You are mostly right. We don't really know how fly, ride, and escape artist will work, but I'd suspect all are an acrobatics function. As mentioned, profession is now under lore.

Lore is basically a miscellaneous skill. It represents a very narrow field of knowledge. Lore examples include a specific diety, blacksmithing, and IIRC underworld. It does NOT represent what knowledge checks were in PF1. A Lore is generally too narrow to be useful often. It is also used for what would have been profession checks before.

Knowledge checks, UMD, and spellcraft seem to have all been rolled together, but split into 4 fields of study. Arcana, occultism, nature, and religion. These correspond to the 4 spell lists. The skills will be used for Identifying and activating magic items corresponding that spell list, identifying categories of enemies (outsiders for religion, dragons for arcana, plants and animals for nature, aberrations for occultism, etc) and some other miscellaneous stuff. Religion can be used for exorcism. I think nature will probably include handle animal, etc.

I'm not sure how linguistics will work, but I hope it gets examined. I really like it as a "decode scrambled messages" or "piece together damaged documents" skill. I don't like how you learned languages through it. I'm thinking it might get rolled into society.

If appraise was just written out of the game I'd be happy. Maybe make perception relevant for evaluating loot, but I ignore that skill so often anyway. It just isn't fun and slows down the game.

Thanks Cap!

Interested in understanding How the four magic school's skills compare, and then how Survival, Society, Lore, Profession are mapped and work. Also this means that some formally INT Knowledge skills become WIS. Does Handle Animal changing from CHA to WIS have effects on character builds or classes?

Yeah, nature and religion are both wisdom now. What this means is that Druids and clerics can actually be the experts in their respective fields without raising a low priority stat, instead of being worse than a wizard at them. This erodes the domain of intelligence but has much better end results.

Druids are also good at handling animals without having to rely on what was even more likely to be a dump stat for them. And honestly, having charisma be the stat for animals was always kinda weird.

Also, I believe clerics all get a Lore about their specific diety, so even one without broader religious knowledge will know about the god who grants them powers. (I believe that if you have a Lore relevant to something that could otherwise be covered in a one of the broader knowledge checks, the Lore check gets a significantly lower DC.)

Skills will also have some other interesting applications. Each of the 4 magic knowledge skills will have rituals tied to it available to non casters. And a Religion check can be used to exorcise a haunt, while a diplomacy check can be used to potentially talk the spirit down.


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Fuzzy-Wuzzy wrote:
Steel Radial wrote:
Also there doesn't seem to be a way to represent a table in the forum comment system. Markdown support would be nice. Or a way to even do a fixed width fonts so structured spacing would be possible. Correct me if I am missing something on the forum comment system.
You aren't missing anything, and simply having fixed width would be awesome.

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What skill check is required to know how unicode works?

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