Help with Tiefling Kineticist Build

[Coreyographed]

Hey everyone,

I'm making a new character for my friend's Pathfinder campaign, and I really like the idea of a Tiefling Kineticist. Problem is, I'm having trouble seeing what's going to be best for the group as a whole. Our party is a human fighter, a dhampir alchemist (vivisectionist archetype), and a tengu cleric (focus on necromancy). I will be coming in at level 6, and I'm trying to figure out what's going to be the best for the group while still feeling like I'm contributing a lot. There will also be another player joining us (not sure what she's playing yet).

What I've got so far for a statline is this: (15 Point Buy)
Tiefling (Hellspawn) Kineticist 6
Str: 7
Dex: 17
Con: 18 (+1'ed at level 4)
Int: 10
Wis: 12
Cha: 7

I don't want to just be a blaster, I'd like to have some good utility too since we lack an arcane caster. I'm thinking maybe starting with the air element and then moving to aether next level, but will that really be very effective? I have absolutely no experience with the kineticist. I've never seen it played, I've never DM'ed one, I've never played one, I've never been a player in a group with one, etc.

I have read N. Jolly's Guide and gone to RPGBot as well, but I'm still somewhat hesitant to trust guides entirely. Does anyone some experience with this class to know what does work and what doesn't work? I'm open to all sorts of suggestions. Thank you!

[DeathlessOne]

I can only speak from my own experience with kineticist (both as a player and GM). You are NOT going to have trouble dealing damage, except in rare occasions. Your feats, for the most part, are icing on the cake and are not really needed to be effective. I would like to know which adventure path you are running through, as that will influence my recommendations.

However, all things considered, I’d be sorely tempted to make a Phytokineticist (wood element). Double focus in Wood (positive blast, wood blast, Verdant Blast) and then Air (air blast) for Spring Blast, though the third elements isn’t important. Verdant Blast is great because you can choose all physical damage and your choice of positive (even ALL positive). Positive is one of the two elements that allow for a “burst heal” like effect and the only one that heals the FULL damage of your blast. I like options, what can I say?

As far as versatility goes, there are several ways to focus on UMD and you don’t really need anything except the typical items to make your class work well. Consumables, and crafting, can go a long way.

[Coreyographed]

Thanks for the quick response! We aren’t going through an AP, we are doing a homebrew campaign that focuses on the occult and dark magic. Lots of undead and constructs so far. Expecting devils and demons down the line.

Is the kinetic blade line worth it? Sorry, seen several people recommend it, so I was just wondering. Also, is wood actually that good compared to the others? I haven’t heard many glowing reviews of wood so far, so I don’t mean for that to come off the wrong way.

[Shiroi]

So it depends on what kind of utilities you want. Air has good flying support, and makes an excellent scout. Water has amazing battlefield control options, some pseudoheals that aren't so great but might save a life, and can do insane stuff in a campaign involving water. Aether is basically all utilities all the time, with more potential to be a rogue than the rogue has and lifting capacity a barbarian dreams of. Earth will easily make every thought out and planned ahead combat a curb stomp by laying out their perfect terrain, makes non-magical dungeons a straight walk through walls, and burrows a nice den any time you need out of the weather for the night.

Wood is basically good in a forest. Granted it gets all the normal damage options, so it's not a bad thing, it just doesn't feel like it's got much other stuff outside a heavy wooded area. Fire has lots of damage, all the touch attack, but again is not the most utility oriented.

UMD can definitely make some utility options, so can VMC since you don't need anywhere close to all your feats. N. Jolly did great work on that guide and listened to what, 4k+ posts of feedback on it while he wrote it? Trust me, he's got the info. It was a community labor of love of a lot of us kineticist fans. The kinetic whip is insane damage, and kinetic blade is almost a must for anyone but air. If you get caught in melee, using a ranged blast is 2 attack of opportunities, one for the SLA and one for a ranged attack. Kinetic blade fixes both of those by not provoking or being ranged, and whip only makes it better. It also means iterative damage with a touch attack for many elements, which is sick.

[DeathlessOne]

Coreyographed wrote:

Thanks for the quick response! We aren’t going through an AP, we are doing a homebrew campaign that focuses on the occult and dark magic. Lots of undead and constructs so far. Expecting devils and demons down the line.

Is the kinetic blade line worth it? Sorry, seen several people recommend it, so I was just wondering. Also, is wood actually that good compared to the others? I haven’t heard many glowing reviews of wood so far, so I don’t mean for that to come off the wrong way.

Wood element is not "TEH BEST!!1!!" element to pick and there are flashier elements. Wood element has a solid foundation to build off of, and then branch out (especially with the inclusion of the Wood Healer talent). Even I would be tempted to branch out into a new element at level 7. It just depends on how the campaign is going.

Once you can start taking Extra Wild Talent (ie, level 6+) is where the fun really starts. If you are going to face a LOT of undead, starting with Wood (Positive Blast) is a viable option (there is not much resistance against positive energy), and then doubling down with Verdant Blast will really up your game. Switching to another element (Energy blast) with let you use positive admixture against the undead. Worst case is that living creature (or constructs) will ignore the positive part of the blast.

Depending on what the other player decides to bring in, and if your cleric wants to focus on necromancy (and not channel positive energy), there will be room for you to fill in the role of a healer, as well as a reliable damage dealer.

[Weirdo]

I really should hope that even if he's focusing on necromancy the cleric would be able to provide a decent amount of healing.

And the alchemist should be willing to chip in with Infusions (both curative and utility buffs).

If you have a cleric and an alchemist in the party, expecting a kineticist to fill the healer role seems... unfair.

[DeathlessOne]

Weirdo wrote:

I really should hope that even if he's focusing on necromancy the cleric would be able to provide a decent amount of healing.

It all depends on if the Cleric chooses to channel positive or negative energy. Healing takes a large hit if you have a negative channeler. Channel energy may not be the best in combat healing ability, but it sure pulls more than double duty outside of combat.

Quote:

And the alchemist should be willing to chip in with Infusions (both curative and utility buffs).

Should be? That is an assumption I wouldn't make. Some alchemists don't take infusions and just use their buffs for themselves.

Quote:

If you have a cleric and an alchemist in the party, expecting a kineticist to fill the healer role seems... unfair.

If you have a cleric and alchemist that can tackle the healing aspect, then yes, it would be inefficient for the kineticist to pick up the healer role. Whether or not that is 'unfair' is entirely subjective and determined by game table variance and preference.

[Dwarftr]

If you were interested int he kinetic blade idea, why not try a Kinetic Knight? Sure you lose out on the ranged blast aspect but get all the kinetic blade options including kinetic whip, and you can wear heavy armor and use a shield. You still get to use wild talents and such, just no ranged blasts.

PFS Legal Kinetic Knight
Source Psychic Anthology pg. 25
A kinetic knight dons armor and wields a blade of elemental energy. The Phoenix Kindred counted many of these resolute warriors among their number, combining the Recursion Tablets’ secrets with a warrior’s ways. Today, most remaining Tian kinetic knights follow the philosophy of ichimeiyo. Kinetic knights are rarer in the Inner Sea region, but not unknown; many realize their elemental powers while training for battle.

Courtly: The kinetic knight adds Diplomacy and Sense Motive to her list of class skills instead of Acrobatics and Stealth.

This ability alters the kineticist’s class skills.

Elemental Blade (Su): At 1st level, a kinetic knight gains the kinetic blade form infusion, and it costs 0 points of burn instead of 1 point. She can’t use her kinetic blast without the kinetic blade form infusion or an infusion that lists kinetic blade as a prerequisite.

At 3rd level, the kinetic knight gains the blade rush infusion. At 5th level, she gains the kinetic whip infusion. Her kinetic whip has the disarm, performanceUC, and trip weapon qualities. At 9th level, she gains the blade whirlwind infusion. At 11th level, she gains the whip hurricane infusion. At 13th level as a swift action, she can accept 2 points of burn to unleash a kinetic blast with the blade rush infusion.

This ability alters kinetic blast and infusions, and replaces metakinesis and metakinetic master.

Kinetic Warrior (Ex): The kinetic knight can use her Constitution score in place of her Intelligence score when qualifying for combat feats. This ability counts as having Combat Expertise for the purpose of feat prerequisites.

Elemental Bastion (Ex): At 2nd level, the kinetic knight becomes proficient with medium and heavy armor and shields (except tower shields). In addition, the kinetic knight can accept 1 point of burn to attune herself to a specific light or heavy shield until the next time her burn is removed. Wielding an attuned shield doesn’t prevent the kinetic knight from gathering power. A kinetic knight gains the elemental defense ability at 4th level, rather than 2nd, and its benefits apply only while she is wearing heavy armor and wielding an attuned shield. If the kinetic knight selects the expanded defense talent, its benefits also apply only under these conditions. If she has the shroud of water defense wild talent, whenever its bonus would be increased by accepting burn, she instead increases the enhancement bonus of her armor or attuned shield by an equal amount (to a maximum of +5).

This ability alters elemental defense.

Knight’s Resolve (Ex): At 3rd level, the kinetic knight gains the samurai’s resolve class feature, as a samurai of her kineticist level – 2. At 11th level, she gains the samurai’s greater resolve ability (Pathfinder RPG Ultimate Combat 20). If she also has samurai levels, those levels stack with her kineticist levels to determine the benefits of this ability.

This ability replaces the kineticist infusion gained at 3rd level and supercharge.