Is Drift travel evil?


General Discussion


According to the CRB, the drift has a fair number of residents from various planes who got randomly sucked into the drift when someone made a jump.

Stranding angels in the drift seems pretty evil to me.


Starfinder Superscriber

Well, they're stranding devils, proteans, and inevitables, too. So, if that's the only criteria, it's a wash out to neutral.


See this previous thread

Dark Archive

Pathfinder Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber
CrystalSeas wrote:
See this previous thread

So, basically, "drift-tear" (or whatever we're calling it) is the moral equivalent of pollution. That's not evil in game terms, but there might be individuals and groups that are opposed to it.


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There is nothing evil about traveling the Drift, and to prove it, the next 100 ships that travel via the drift get a box of adorable kittens!!


Dead Suns 4 mentions that each system usually has an organization of people that refuse to use drift travel for this very reason. I forget what the pact world's system's group is, but they do mention they use peaceful protest type tactics including occupation of space ports.

It goes onto mention that, being that the size of a given part of a plane being drawn into the drift could be as small as a single stone, and that so many of the planes are functionally infinite in size, the odds of any given drift travel drawing a sentient individual into the drift is negligible.


FormerFiend wrote:

Dead Suns 4 mentions that each system usually has an organization of people that refuse to use drift travel for this very reason. I forget what the pact world's system's group is, but they do mention they use peaceful protest type tactics including occupation of space ports.

It goes onto mention that, being that the size of a given part of a plane being drawn into the drift could be as small as a single stone, and that so many of the planes are functionally infinite in size, the odds of any given drift travel drawing a sentient individual into the drift is negligible.

Given that encounters with with trapped outsiders is a semi-common event, that doesn't really fit.


johnlocke90 wrote:
FormerFiend wrote:

Dead Suns 4 mentions that each system usually has an organization of people that refuse to use drift travel for this very reason. I forget what the pact world's system's group is, but they do mention they use peaceful protest type tactics including occupation of space ports.

It goes onto mention that, being that the size of a given part of a plane being drawn into the drift could be as small as a single stone, and that so many of the planes are functionally infinite in size, the odds of any given drift travel drawing a sentient individual into the drift is negligible.

Given that encounters with with trapped outsiders is a semi-common event, that doesn't really fit.

However, remember this is a game. We're the heroes, and if it could happen 1% of the time to normal people, it's at least 90% likely to happen to us.

Like arriving at the space station just as they're experiencing a huge security problem, and need to flush those incredibly rare electrovore creatures from the vents.

Shadow Lodge

Isaac Zephyr wrote:


However, remember this is a game. We're the heroes, and if it could happen 1% of the time to normal people, it's at least 90% likely to happen to us.

When something weird happens when i travel people wonder why I'm handling it so well...


Pathfinder Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

Don't forget that outer planar terrain is, itself, psychoactive. Drop a chunk of it into the Drift, and it doesn't stretch plausibility that its "attracted" to. . . well, anything other than the empty void that fills nearly all the Drift.


I see the potential for anti-Drift fanatics to use that as an excuse to what they really dislike -- the existence of alien creatures in their worlds. These would be the sorts of people who, for example see Absalom Station as an enclave that needs to be reserved for humans (and demi-humans, though some are not even comfortable with them being around). Sio some degree of the ugliness of xenophobia will service once humanoids find the stars.

Fortunately there may not be many of those people, though they certainly can make a lot of noise when they desire to. But on Absalom, most residents derive their income from interplanetary/interstellar trade and are used to seeing all kinds of creatures in the corridors. To them, aliens are no big deal unless they are openly hostile -- and probably find the thought of dealing with the racist Azlanti humans especially terrifying.

Part of that, of course, depends on whether you, as a GM, want to an optimist or a pessimist concerning human nature.


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All things considered...

{quote=Dougalas Adams]Space is big. Really big. You just won't believe how vastly, hugely, mind-bogglingly big it is. I mean, you may think it's a long way down the road to the chemist, but that's just peanuts to space.

The overwhelming majority of space is a vast swath of nothing. Were it not for game contrivance, pulling matter into the drift would be incredibly rare, and it would be just hot plasma from stars 99.99% of the time. I can see why people in-universe see it as a negligible downside.

Dark Archive

Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

Except that Drift travel pulls a part of any plane, not just the prime material, and a number of other planes (including most outer planes) are some infinite amount of land, rather than including some sort of planets and space. So, you'd actually have a much higher chance of getting part of one of those (since, you know, multiple times infinity is a larger number of choices than one set of infinity...oh man, my head just exploded)

Exo-Guardians

YogoZuno wrote:
Except that Drift travel pulls a part of any plane, not just the prime material, and a number of other planes (including most outer planes) are some infinite amount of land, rather than including some sort of planets and space. So, you'd actually have a much higher chance of getting part of one of those (since, you know, multiple times infinity is a larger number of choices than one set of infinity...oh man, my head just exploded)

I think we can look at the planes as a set. the Material Plane is an infinite set, but it is countably infinite as the known universe has an edge, but it is constantly expanding. The other planes are also thus countably infinite, including the number of planes themselves.

This actually results in a situation where both odds could be true we have an countably infinite chance of not pulling a finite piece of matter from the countably infinite number of countably infinite sized planes, and we have the same chance of pulling in said finite piece of said countably infinite set of countably infinite sets.

I guess long story shot, Drift Travel pulling chunks of other places operates on the principle of infinite improbability. I guess I'll go find a restaurant now, I need food after trying to explain that set logic and I think it failed somewhere, I hear there's a really fancy one at the end of the Universe, anyone want to hitch a ride for it?


I'll pass. It's hard to accept the travel time there when you've tried and failed to improve said travel time.

End of spacetime is hard to put beacons on, okay?


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Companion, Maps, Pawns, Roleplaying Game Subscriber; Starfinder Charter Superscriber

Is drift travel evil?

Yes. Unequivacally. It is just as bad as all of the harmful vaccines the government tries to force upon our children.

(Nevermind the overwhelming amount of good it does for civilization as a whole.)

;D


Ravingdork wrote:

Is drift travel evil?

Yes. Unequivacally. It is just as bad as all of the harmful vaccines the government tries to force upon our children.

(Nevermind the overwhelming amount of good it does for civilization as a whole.)

;D

Tell that to the Akitonians.


Pathfinder Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber
FormerFiend wrote:
Ravingdork wrote:

Is drift travel evil?

Yes. Unequivacally. It is just as bad as all of the harmful vaccines the government tries to force upon our children.

(Nevermind the overwhelming amount of good it does for civilization as a whole.)

;D

Tell that to the Akitonians.

Live by the natural resources monopoly, die by the natural resources monopoly. *cough*

. . . though, really, given how rich Akiton was, or at least should have been? They probably should have been able to adapt to the changing economy well enough. Sure, the drift drive gored their ox badly, but the system didn't transition to FTL overnight. They could have invested in new fields, and settled into a different, probably lower, but still healthy and functional economic level.

How much of this was "Akiton's society was too unstable from the Gap to react to a second such hammer blow", and how much was "Akiton's powers that be just reacted badly to the loss of their preeminent position, and pretty much screwed themselves and everyone else out of greed", is up to the GM.

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