Whats a good Wisdom centric build?


Advice


Assuming that all stats except con and Wis are 10, and the other 2 are 16 and 20 respectively (after race bonuses). And that the Guided weapon property is allowed if needed (melee weapons only).

what would be the best class in a highly competitive, high magic setting and why?

My character died due to being too weak, and the DM allowed me retrain everything but my stats after being revived, we're at level 10.
The Dm doesnt like dipping, so he said any ability that gives X to Y is capped by the levels in the class that grants it (but it stacks with other classes that grant it).
In order to give us some leeway, he is allowing us 5 'free' levels in the form of Gestalt (but only 5).

The campaign is combat focused with a battle of the week type of session, so I wanted to build something good, but I'm at a loss as to what.

Grand Lodge

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Sensei monk gains Inspire Courage as well as Wis-to-hit for unarmed strikes and monk weapons. Coupled with Quigong you're looking at a spell-slinging, courage-inspiring ki master. Your save DC for Stunning Fist would be pretty high as well. If you don't want to go the obvious route of Cleric or Empyreal Bloodline Sorcerer.

Hm, Druid wouldn't be a bad option either. Gain an animal companion that you'd be able to buff out the wazoo and just be a caster from there.

*Edit*
As for Gestalt builds, getting 5 levels of Sensei/Quiggong alongside Druid would be pretty cool. If you're allowed to continue with one more level of Sensei you can use your ki powers on allies. From then on go Druid. Wis to AC, really good saves, a lot of fun options with wildshaped feral combat training that are wis-to-hit.


Soulbolt archetype of Soulknife, with Focused Offense Blade Skill(Wis to Attack and Damage)


Ooh, a gestalted cleric//empyreal sorcerer 5 followed by mystic theurge 5 would be absolutely spectacular.

But if you're looking for something a bit more physical, yeah, druid is definitely the way to go. You don't even need the monk levels, just gestalt it with your favorite martial class, get a guided amulet of mighty fists, and go crazy. For extra fun, grab the Kraken Style line and turn into a giant octopus.


Quote:
The Dm doesnt like dipping, so he said any ability that gives X to Y is capped by the levels in the class that grants it (but it stacks with other classes that grant it). In order to give us some leeway, he is allowing us 5 'free' levels in the form of Gestalt (but only 5).

Ya lost me. Your GM doesn't like "dipping" (multiclassing?), but you're getting gesalt (which is far stronger than multiclassing could ever be)?

Grand Lodge

Slim Jim wrote:
Quote:
The Dm doesnt like dipping, so he said any ability that gives X to Y is capped by the levels in the class that grants it (but it stacks with other classes that grant it). In order to give us some leeway, he is allowing us 5 'free' levels in the form of Gestalt (but only 5).
Ya lost me. Your GM doesn't like "dipping" (multiclassing?), but you're getting gesalt (which is far stronger than multiclassing could ever be)?

Don't look a gift horse in the mouth.


For a different approach - Cleric 10 // Unchained Monk 5. The feats you're aiming for are crusader's flurry, dazing spell, and guided hand. Yes, I know you can get guided on an item. You're going to cast holy ice weapon instead, with the dazing spell metamagic feat, and give your enemies a save or be dazed on every hit. If your party doesn't have someone who casts haste then you might cast divine power or blessing of fervor to get that extra action so that you have the best possible chance of daze-locking your enemies.

You have all good saves to level 5, good fort and will past that. BAB +8, full cleric casting with all those long-term buffs, 5d10+5d8 HD. It should work pretty well IMO.


An Inquisitor seems like a great choice for this, especially since the guided weapon property is available to you. They get wisdom for so many things and they get so many buff spells and abilities that you should easily get decent attack and damage. I’m not sure what I’d recommend to gestalt with them. Maybe a martial class with full bab to help bring that up a bit. The only bad save they have is reflex so you may consider upping that, but reflex is generally the least important save.


With 10’s in everything but CON and WIS it is going to be difficult to build a decent character. With a 10 STR you will probably run into encumbrance issues if you wear armor. Mithral armor can help but it eats up your gold that would be better off spent on something else. Since they cannot wear armor, monks do need some DEX for AC. With a low AC your best bet is to play something that will not be in the front lines. That leaves out the most classes that use WIS except maybe a ranged inquisitor.

The other problem you are going to be facing is that you don’t qualify for many combat feats. Most combat feats have a 13 stat prerequisite. This means you are extremely limited in what you can take. Without decent combat feats you are going to be hard pressed to build a character that uses any kind of combat style. Archery will be difficult without things like rapid shot, and deadly aim. Two handed builds without power attack are going to be hampered. Two weapon fighting is going to be impossible.

So the best thing to play would be a full caster. Avoron is right about the mystic theurge being a good option. If the campaign goes all the way to 20th level you would end up with a character 9th level casting in one class and the other would still get 8th level. Feats and gear that boos spell casting would become even more useful.


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I recommend Evangelist Cleric 10//Uncahined Monk 5

Use no armor and get that Wisdom to AC and after you get monk robes the +2 AC will be nice. You will use the Monk Levels for Defense mostly. Evasion and good saves are really nice. You will want a guided AoMF so your wisdom is added to damage. This gives you Stunning Fist if anything happens to get to you and you can just walk away.

How you build is Up to you. The most popular is Heroism domain for the Level 8 power. Taking Sacred Summoning you can: Standard- Summon, Move- Bardic Performance, and swift- Heroism buff. Your summon then can act while buffed up. Your entire team will be multiplied into doing more damage.

Another way to build is with Feather Domain, Evangelist PrC (Erastil) ((work in Pre-reqs)), and Sacred summoning feat again. You don't get the heroism but you do get an animal companion who will do plenty of damage after being buffed by you. You will be Performing to buff everything on the field.


Cleric or wisdom sorcerer. You need to be a caster that just casts with those stats.


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I echo Chess PWN, if you have a 20 in a casting stat, and your other stats are bad except for your "not dying stat" just pick a 9 level caster that keys off of Wisdom. Druid is also a possibility, but Empyreal Bloodline Sorcerer is probably the strongest choice.

Lean into the SADness...


s00pahFr0g wrote:
An Inquisitor seems like a great choice for this, especially since the guided weapon property is available to you. They get wisdom for so many things and they get so many buff spells and abilities that you should easily get decent attack and damage. I’m not sure what I’d recommend to gestalt with them. Maybe a martial class with full bab to help bring that up a bit. The only bad save they have is reflex so you may consider upping that, but reflex is generally the least important

Monster tactician inquisitor with 5 levels Zen archery monk gestalt.

Get amulet of mighty fists (guided). Get wis to everything.

Round 1: summon
Round 2: shoot down anything that resisted your critters onslaught.
Round 3: profit.

For fun flavor, I like to fluff it so that my summons are church traitors being put to good use.


Slim Jim wrote:
Quote:
The Dm doesnt like dipping, so he said any ability that gives X to Y is capped by the levels in the class that grants it (but it stacks with other classes that grant it). In order to give us some leeway, he is allowing us 5 'free' levels in the form of Gestalt (but only 5).
Ya lost me. Your GM doesn't like "dipping" (multiclassing?), but you're getting gesalt (which is far stronger than multiclassing could ever be)?

My thoughts exactly...


AlastarOG wrote:
Slim Jim wrote:
Quote:
The Dm doesnt like dipping, so he said any ability that gives X to Y is capped by the levels in the class that grants it (but it stacks with other classes that grant it). In order to give us some leeway, he is allowing us 5 'free' levels in the form of Gestalt (but only 5).
Ya lost me. Your GM doesn't like "dipping" (multiclassing?), but you're getting gesalt (which is far stronger than multiclassing could ever be)?
My thoughts exactly...

Well, its more of a, We get gestalt up to level 5, so we cant just grab an pick paladin 2, scaled fist monk 1 and Oracle 1 with the rev that gives Cha instead of Dex, and some other Cha to X class and just go full cha caster with cha to everything.

or dip 1 lvl in monk on a wis character


Basically he can't multiclass with the gestalt levels.

With that being said, going Cleric with Empyreal Sorcerer gestalted (or vice-versa) is probably the best choice of action here.


Are mythic feats allowed?

(Avoron's suggestion is likely the most powerful pure caster, and it's hard to not do that unless you're disinclined to play a pure caster and/or several existing character have those bases covered.)


Empyreal sorcerer 5//Cleric or Druid 5 (if you go druid, make sure to take the Dirty Druid Water bond for free potions)

Then Mystic Theurge 5, keeping MT up as long as you can.

Dorf is a totally appropriate race, giving you more con and wisdom.

If you insist on mastering the art of the fighty, you must also go dwarf, but then go unchained monk, perhaps with Inquisitor as your gestalt option. Get an amulet of mighty fists with Guided on it. Probably also the Dirty Fighting feat so you can do high-end combat maneuvers.

Alternatively for an archer build - Cleric of Erastil5//Ranger5
Onto Ranger +1/Hinterlander 4
1Weapon Focus: Longbow
2B - Deadly Aim
3 - Erastil's Blessing
3B - Endurance
5 - ???
6B - Improved Precise Shot
7 - ???
7B - Rapid Shot
9 - ???
9B - Manyshot

Cleric swaps seamlessly for Shaman, Empyreal Sorcerer or any other wis-based caster. Even psychics, if you're into the weird stuff. If you start out loaded with cash, pick up Heavy Armor Proficency and purchase a set of mithral fullplate to cover for your horrendous dexterity while still retaining medium armor for the purpose of not losing your archery feats.

Things that improve damage are super important here, and technically Erastil's Blessing never specifies that wisdom to hit only works with 'long'bows, so you could go half-orc and use an orc hornbow instead. It leaves you with a useless Weapon Focus: Longbow though, since that *is* a prereq for the blessing.

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