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Advice


So been struggling to make a new character for PFS. Was debating on a nature fang druid with archery, but I felt his accuracy and damage would fall behind. Thought about a going a cleric with a dip in bloodrager (for a sage familiar) but then I found out it wouldnt go up with...I liked the cleric but felt the skills were too low for my taste. I was gonna go the shaman but I feel like he is gonna take a long time to actually come online (like 4 or 5) Kinda stuck at this point.

Idea I'm trying to go for is a str based character who has decent skills I would like to go a full caster but not a game breaker. I am currently using a inspired blade/investigator and a inquisitor archer and have had a lot of fun...trying to come up with something different while having fun. I did try a skald but melee was not working.

Grand Lodge

Nature fang

I have a nature fang druid archer. My accuracy is around that of a bard, or hunter archer but behind that of inquisitor or Arsenal champion.

He are some things that helped.

- spells that blind burst of radiance comes to mind.

- plan for lenses of the predator.

- I dipped fighter so I get all my feats sooner.

- take the eagle domain so your manyshot gets 1/2 your level For this Attack you should have top tier accuracy. 3/4 Bab +5 study + 10 over the course of the character is huge.

- When you have a chance fire a pharamon arrow (+2 attack and damage) and activate your animal mask. Now you threaten.

- use spells the fatigue or entangle

- high levels your familair (sage or protector) casts obscuring mist (ioun) close and above the enemy. You use overland flight and echolocation or an item to see through the fog a pepper flat footed ac with sneak attack arrows. (I'm not at this level yet)

My build is a raptorkin skinwalker and may damage is good not top tier but good.

Cleric

Play a separatist cleric and take an animal domain that offers a familiar. Eagle, monkey, crocodile, frog and the anger inquisition or rage domain. That gets you most of the way to that build I think.

Shaman

Caster shaman come online at level 2 when they get hexes. If you wanted to try that.

If you play a human or half human and grab divine favor a melee shaman hit the ground running at level 3.

Skald

I have effective melee skalds. They tend to enter the fight on round 2 because typically buffing is a better use of an action. You will start behind other melee classes but once heroism comes online you start to catch up.

I suggest a melee or archer bard for damage, support, skills, face and casting.

Basically any alchemist should suit your play style. Mindchemist, grenadier, beastmorph are all good.

A magus maybe Dex kensai with high in using a scimitar. I like str builds better but this will give you more int to work with.


Sorry for the delay. Party of me wonders if my indecision is due to the fact that I made him as a skald. I took a level dip in bloodrager for a familiar to go for amplified raging with a 25 star her is nice.. but someone threw a pet (not a companion) I thought about going reach but he has a 12 dex.

If I ditched the bloodrager I would probably be better off with the bard.

I really thought about a alchemist but worried he would step on the investigators toes.

Magus always scares me off due to burst damage.. always scared I would run out or waste it.

Biggest problem with shaman is they really need a dip but then the dip hurts quick.

Really wish I could find a cleric with skills
Part of me goes back to the oracle but I try to avoid cha build

Grand Lodge

A bomber alchemist will play differently. You will still buff, and roll lots of skill checks but that's just pathfinder. The strategy will be about debuffing or doing damage and how much of either is correct.

I have played a skald in pfs to level 10 it is great. You are not appreciated as much as a bard but that is because people under value defense hp, bonuses to 2 saves, DR, fast healing, and you can still get discordant voice. They are amazing they also get furious and bloodsong 2 of the best enchantments in the game. This makes the great melee combatants. Just sprinkle a little heroism and blade dash for flavor. Next use some masterpieces and sagas for support. It's all amazing. I used a fauchard and never had a problem focus on knowledge knowledge and face skills.

Or, simply play a bard they are easier and still amazing.

Most of the best pathfinder classes have limited resources judgment, bane, smite, bombs, spells. The magus is no different take wand wilder and use frostbite you can last all day.

The shaman does not need a dip. A monk level is fun but not needed. Many people accept single level dips on prepared casters becasue they are on the sorcerer spell track and you can still be a super powerful 9th level cast even with the one level delay. Just take fate's favored pick up divine favor from the clerics list and hit stuff with a two handed weapon. Take spiritual guardian for an extra set of full Bab attacks. The damage is low but the action economy is nice. Or just play a caster shaman they are amazing a hexes mean you can cast all day.

If you want skills invest in int and play the separatist so you can have a sage familiar. You should be able to easily get the equivalent of 6 or 7 ranks a level. Your channeling may be weak but it is a middling class feature any way.

What's the issue with cha builds? Oracles are amazing so are bards and sorcerer for that matter.


So did you spend a exotic feat for fauchard? Did you got bloodrager? I'm struggling on stats which way did you go?

I'm hesitant with a full caster with cha..especially if going a martial based oracle.

I need to glance through the the alchemist too

Grand Lodge

I used a Lucerne hammer until I could afford a Cracked Opalescent White Pyramid. One of the very nice benefits of having martial weapon proficency.

My stats were 18/12/14/12/7/16 that's dual talented human. There are better array but this fit the character. Ac has never been the characters sting point but fast healing and smart play kept me alive until I had mirror image. There was no multiclassing. A will save boosting trait would be a good idea.

14 cha on a battle oracle is enough and they are amazing. A lot of what a divine caster do you don't need dcs.


I was working with a half orc. My worry is if I go a reach build will 12 be enough?

Silver Crusade

I'm playing a reach Shaman in Ironfang Invasion with 12 Dex, which gives 2 AoOs/rnd (with Combat Reflexes). My character is 6th lvl now, and since the start of the campaign, I think I've missed a total of 2 or 3 extra AoOs from not having a higher score. If I select Battle as my Wandering Spirit, and Battle Master as my Wandering Hex, I can make 3 AoOs. IMHO 12 is enough.


Pathfinder Starfinder Maps, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber
ekibus wrote:
Idea I'm trying to go for is a str based character who has decent skills I would like to go a full caster but not a game breaker. I am currently using a inspired blade/investigator and a inquisitor archer and have had a lot of fun...trying to come up with something different while having fun. I did try a skald but melee was not working.

A strength based investigator will play a lot different than Inspired Blade / Investigator.

Could you explain why the melee Skald didn’t work? I’m currently playing one and while the knowledge skills aren’t what an investigator can do, they are good at the people skills. Although I took a dip of Bloodrager, that was because I did a paired build with a friend and needed it for a teamwork feat we both took.

ekibus wrote:
I was working with a half orc. My worry is if I go a reach build will 12 be enough?

Get a snakeskin tunic and it will be. In my experience, without something to force them it is rare to get three or more AoO. The Swashbuckler is an exception, as are certain animal buddy pairings.


On paper he looks awesome Str 17 Dex 12 Con 14 int 12 Wis 9 and cha 14. Fort 8 Ref 3 Will 3 Ac17 HP 19 Init +5 and 30 ft movement He has the feats: Alertness, Amplified rage, Endurance and traits Community minded and fate's favored. When performing he has 25 str and 22 con.

So problems so far is first everything dying by the second round. I'm sure as it goes up it wont be as much of a factor. Then Having someone using a bought pet running in front of me in a limited space preventing me from hitting. Skills are a bit weak atm. I actually gave up darkvision to gain 1 skill per :P

So thinking a reach weapon will help alot here. Of course skills will fill up as I go. Going full skald would free up a lot, go human, gain a extra feat and not needing to spend the first on amplified rage...But getting +8 str/Con is so nice

RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32

I had fun with a (wyrm-scourged) dwarf barbarian 1/magus 6

Barbarians have a fun list of class skills, and combined with being prepared to be an Int-based caster, you get a lot of them at 1st level. Acrobatics, Climb, Intimidate, Knowledge nature, Perception, Survival, Swim. A good mix of mobility, social, and exploration skills.

Berserker of the Society and Magical Lineage (shocking grasp) traits.

1. Power Attack
3. Arcane Strike
5. Dodge (not necessary, maybe Combat Casting, Extra Rage, Furious Focus, Improved Initiative, or Pushing Assault would be better?)
6. Combat Reflexes
7. Intensify Spell

Barbarians have a fun list of class skills, and combined with being prepared to be an Int-based caster, you get a lot of them at 1st level. Acrobatics, Climb, Intimidate, Knowledge nature, Perception, Survival, Swim. A good mix of mobility, social, and exploration skills.

At 1st level, you wield your dwarven waraxe in two hands, rage, and use Power Attack.

Once you start taking magus levels, you get lots of combat options. You can use Spell Combat and fight one-handed while buffing and blasting burning hands and color spray. You can use Spell Strike to do the shocking grasp nova thing. You can buff with enlarge person, bear's endurance, bull's strength, cat's grace (for extra AoOs), or blur during the first round or two, then wield your dwarven waraxe in two hands, rage, and use Power Attack.

I also dumped my Charisma to 6 (should have gone all the way down to 5) and used failed Diplomacy checks to act as Aggro. ;-) He was SOOOOO good at putting his iron-shod foot in his mouth! :-D

I put my FCB into the dwarf magus option, which is 1/6 of an additional use of a 1/day arcana, like Quicken Spell or whatever the Arcana version is called.

I considered taking a 2nd level in barbarian for the Moment of Clarity rage power, so I could interrupt a rage to cast a spell, and the ability to take Extra Rage Power feats.


magus doesn't need to be built as a burst damage dealer, they have plenty of ways to do good consistent damage.

druid's are your best bet for str based, skills with 9th casting
for 6th casting you have
bards, alchemists, inquisitors, magus, investigator, occultists are all 6th level casters that have good consistent str builds and many good skills. lots of these can have familiars.
the inquisitor, and occultist can get rage in class eventually with certain options.

RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32

I like how a reach druid's feat choices can synergize really nicely with wildshape.

1. Combat Reflexes, somehow get a reach weapon (race, human bonus feat, Heirloom Weapon, dip into barbarian or fighter or cavalier, etc.)
3. Power Attack
5. Natural Spell (naturally!)
7.-19. Summoning feats: Spell Focus conjuration, Augment Summoning, etc.

I played a fun elf druid archer in 3.5. Point Blank Shot and Rapid Shot are fun when combined with produce flame!

Grand Lodge

Diefic obedience irori is a great way to bump up knowledges as a skald. You can also carry pathfinder chronicles and use heighten awareness.


@Grandlounge I agree Diefic obedience is on my list. He has a wand of heighten awareness. Thing I'm worried about is feats will be crushing if I go the route I'm thinking. The mandatory half orc (no bonus feat) Amplified rage, combat reflexes, the feat that prevents soft cover with a reach weapon, power attack, deific obedience and skald vigor. Considering that you only get around 6 feat in pfs I think I'm in trouble. I'm wondering if I could just move the character concept over to bard.

@Chess Pwn I was debating between archer druid (nature fang) or a goliath druid. I've had a lot of fun playing a archer but was trying not to step on toes (even though the archer is about to be retired)

@Smilodan I honestly kinda forgot that the magus could do the spell and attack (been awhile since I actually looked at it) I always wondered about a hexcrafter but I think hexes kinda break the flow


Pathfinder Starfinder Maps, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

Amplified Rage is not mandatory.

The feat for reach weapons is Phalanx Formation from Melee Tactics Toolbox. If you are happy with just one AoO per round, you get Uncanny Dodge at 4th level Skald. Once you have it you are never flat-footed, which means you can take your AoO even when surprised. That would reduce the need for Combat Reflexes.

CRB, pg. 178 wrote:
Flat-Footed: At the start of a battle, before you have had a chance to act (specifically, before your first regular turn in the initiative order), you are flat-footed. You can’t use your Dexterity bonus to AC (if any) while flat-footed. Barbarians and rogues of high enough level have the uncanny dodge extraordinary ability, which means that they cannot be caught flat-footed. Characters with uncanny dodge retain their Dexterity bonus to their AC and can make attacks of opportunity before they have acted in the first round of combat. A flat-footed character can’t make attacks of opportunity, unless he has the Combat Reflexes feat.

Italics added in above quote.

Power Attack is often not a good choice for a 3/4 BAB class. A miss does no damage.

Skald's Vigor and (later) Greater Skald's Vigor are always worthwhile.


ekibus wrote:
Thought about a going a cleric with a dip in bloodrager... Idea I'm trying to go for is a str based character... I would like to go a full caster

Play a Tengu with Claws. Dip a level in Ranger, then take most of the rest of your levels in Warpriest. A Tengu with Claws gets 3 Attacks/Round, and as you take Weapon Focus Claws then Bite, that Damage will keep going up. You could add another Attack to your Full Attack with a level White Haired Witch. You could add yet another with an Animal Mask or Helm of the Mammoth Lord. You will be a Cleric with lots of attacks that do lots of damage: Strength-based character and a caster.

ekibus wrote:
I liked the cleric but felt the skills were too low for my taste.

This idea still has that problem. If you dipped a level in Ranger, you'd get some more skills, and you might acquire a Wand of Strong Jaw, which you could use to Buff your natural Attacks by 2 sizes, so that if you were a level 1 Ranger/5 Warpriest, your 2 Claws and Bite would do 3d6 each.

Sleeping in your armor is not usually such a big problem in PFS, but it's something I always concern myself with. If you dipped a level in Magus, Paladin, Sorcerer, or Wizard, you might acquire a Wand of Swift Girding, which will let you dress in any armor as part of the Standard Action Casting Time. If your dip were in Paldin, you could wear Heavy Armor, nice since this character will wear no shield. You could dip Arcanist and get one of those cool exploits like Dimensional Slide which will let you Teleport up to 10' with no disorientation--a neat tactical trick.

Another way to go to offset the skills problem is to take 3 levels in Ranger, taking Precise Shot and using a Wand of Gravity Bow. Then after you have Endurance and can sleep in Medium Armor, start taking levels in Warpriest and taking Weapon Focus for your Claws, then for your Bite and then for your Bow as your Sacred Weapon Damage grows enough to justify it. I like the Freebooter Archetype.


ekibus wrote:
Idea I'm trying to go for is a str based character who has decent skills... trying to come up with something different while having fun.

Say what you will, I'm giving you different!

I have been fooling around with a character that combines levels in Snakebite Striker Brawler, Bounty Hunter Slayer, dips 1 level in Arcanist, and takes levels in Ninja.

He will have a good amount of Skill Points. He will have lots of ways of locking in the Sneak Attack Damage: Feinting, Dirty Tricks (Blindness, and if that doesn't work, make them Deaf and Blind.), Ninja Vanishing Trick, Dimensional Slide for Flanking. When you can afford one, a Wand of Greater Invisibility.


Savage Technologist + extra rage at 1st level, then go your druid archetype after that.

You'll pick up Lesser Restoration at 4th to deal with fatigue.

Grand Lodge

Bretl has it right basically every feat on the build is optional.

I did not take power attack until I had a couple castings of heroism.

I skipped combat reflexes because if I'm using my song or casting the first round there was not many enemies to pass through my threatened area as they were usually engaged with my allies.

Phalanx for nation can be useful but also skippable becuase you can use blade dash to get into a good position.

Skald vigor feats are amazing.

There is a feat combo I like for the build but it might take some convincing to get others to use. Take extra rage power reckless abandon normally you can share rage powers taken with extra rage but then you take Inspire Ferocity this let's you start staking offensive buffs really early. But you are increasing the rocket tag characteristics of the game.

Grand Lodge

Slim Jim wrote:

Savage Technologist + extra rage at 1st level, then go your druid archetype after that.

You'll pick up Lesser Restoration at 4th to deal with fatigue.

Savage technologist is a good dip but I always have trouble justifying it storywise but that is me.

Lesser restoration has a three round casting time if you have time to cast it don't you normally have time to wait if the fatigue?


@BretI..amplified rage not mandatory!? Gaining +8 str and cont at level 2 seems pretty tough to skip. That is kinda the cornerstone of this character...ditching that makes me wonder why I didnt just go bard.

@Grandlounge:I become really nervous when the ac gets low...I went feather domain on my inquisitor to have a companion between me and the opponent and my level 6 investigator has a AC 32...So I admit I'm paranoid :)

So the question becomes what does a skald bring that a bard doesnt? Kinda feel like I could free myself up a bit, pick up flagbearer and go long spear and be doing pretty well.

Granted I need to put some time on building and editing instead of theory. I want to see how a bard would look. Relook at the shaman one last time. Take the plunge into the oracle.. lol way too much to go into

Grand Lodge

I would say ac at that level leans toward wasted resources. I say that becuase not getting hit keep you character alive but directs attacks toward other characters. It does not help end the fight. I would rather put money and resources toward taking something out round one or helping others to. If I kill one of five enemies round one I just cut the total damge for the whole team by 20%. Instead of not getting hit myself.

26 is good ac at that level a bit more is fine though. It also worth considering, do you know what is better than an animal companion between you and the enemy? A barbarian and you make everyone a barbarian. Use your teammates when your character has a vulnerability.

Bard vs Skald

Bard gives pluses to attack and damage and saves against fear that conflicts with a million other effects.

The skald gives strength attack, strength damge (ranged characters should have adaptive bows), will boosts, Fort boosts, hp, fast healing, DR and several rage power. This can give ac and pounce with the beast totem, or free damage and miss chance with the spirit totem. You can use flexible fury to give ghost touch to the whole team neutralizing one of the more dangerous types of enemies. Flexible fury can also be used for Lesser Celestial Blood good alignment on weapons for everyone.

You can also get superstition for your self through extra rage to beef up saves. Saves are the most important defense and you help a lot of characters with them.

Even a caster that goes down can wake up again or have more hp so they don't die so easily. Once you give out fast healing on their turn they auto stabilize.

Finally spell kening it is one of the best powers in the game. Need a clutch spell you have it.

My conclusion is the skald offer way more than the bard does but does so at the cost of offering it to fewer people. If there is yourself and one other person that can use the raging song you will do well. If there are you and 2 others or any animal companions you can destroy.

If you you want AC try the beast totem. I know a few barbarian with high ac based on the line. Or do a strength surge, knockdown, knockback build to limit enemies getting to you. Heck in this build make your familair a mauler and double you action economy.

Scarab Sages

PCScipio wrote:
I'm playing a reach Shaman in Ironfang Invasion with 12 Dex, which gives 2 AoOs/rnd (with Combat Reflexes). My character is 6th lvl now, and since the start of the campaign, I think I've missed a total of 2 or 3 extra AoOs from not having a higher score. If I select Battle as my Wandering Spirit, and Battle Master as my Wandering Hex, I can make 3 AoOs. IMHO 12 is enough.

You may run into issues if you use enlarge person for expanded reach with a 12 DEX, since being enlarged lowers your DEX by 2, which would remove the extra AoO. You may get some table variation with GMs allowing it (or just not checking it), but I'm pretty sure it would take you back down to 1 AoO.

BretI wrote:
ekibus wrote:
I was working with a half orc. My worry is if I go a reach build will 12 be enough?
Get a snakeskin tunic and it will be. In my experience, without something to force them it is rare to get three or more AoO. The Swashbuckler is an exception, as are certain animal buddy pairings.

The tunic is a solution. As is an Ioun Stone that adds to DEX. Both are 8,000 gold, though, so not really available until around 5th level, while a potion of enlarge person is affordable from level 1.

Grand Lodge

Enlarge applies a penalty to dex. Penalties function like ability damage and damage only decreases a few select things.

Quote:
Dexterity: Damage to your Dexterity score causes you to take penalties on Dexterity-based skill checks, ranged attack rolls, initiative checks, and Reflex saving throws. The penalty also applies to your Armor Class, your Combat Maneuver Bonus (if you are Tiny or smaller), and to your Combat Maneuver Defense. A character with a Dexterity score of 0 is incapable of moving and is effectively immobile (but not unconscious).

That is not to say there won't be table variation but this is the most correct ruling in my estimation for PFS.

Scarab Sages

FAQ wrote:

Temporary Ability Score Increases vs. Permanent Ability Score Increases: Why do temporary bonuses only apply to some things?

Temporary ability bonuses should apply to anything relating to that ability score, just as permanent ability score bonuses do. The section in the glossary was very tight on space and it was not possible to list every single ability score-related game effect that an ability score bones would affect.

The purpose of the temporary ability score ruling is to make it so you don't have to rebuild your character every time you get a bull's strength or similar spell; it just summarizes the most common game effects relative to that ability score.

For example, most of the time when you get bull's strength, you're using it for combat, so the glossary mentions Strength-based skill checks, melee attack rolls, Strength-based weapon damage rolls, CMB, and CMD. It doesn't call out melee attack rolls that use Dex instead of Str (such as when using Weapon Finesse) or situations where your applied Str bonus should be halved or multiplied (such as whith off-hand or two-handed weapons). You're usually not using the spell for a 1 min./level increase in your carrying capacity, so that isn't mentioned there, but the bonus should still apply to that, as well as to Strength checks to break down doors.

Think of it in the same way that a simple template has "quick rules" and "rebuild rules;" they're supposed to create monsters which are roughly equivalent in terms of stats, but the quick rules are a short cut that misses some details compared to using the rebuild rules. Likewise, the temporary ability score rule is intended as a short cut to speed up gameplay, not as the most precise way of applying the bonus.

A temporary ability score bonus should affect all of the same stats and rolls that a permanent ability score bonus does.

LINK

A lot of GMs read that as applying to temporary penalties as well. Like I said, you'll likely run into table variation. For my characters, I've generally just gone with a higher DEX to remove the issue.

Grand Lodge

Like I said "most correct in my estimation". The author of the faq could have, for minimal effort, written it to cover both bonuses and penalties. Until it is expanded it remains my best guess.

It is perfectly reasonable to ask a gm politely before or after the game how the reconcile these two. Not to say this is not a YMMV situation but asking and conversing with your gm if you bring the necessary text with you is a good way to show you're a thoughtful player who is playing above board.

All that said your advice is still good advice and I did not mean to imply otherwise. A bit of extra Dex rarely hurts a character. But knowing how the gm will rule is still relevent if you ever need the extra attack.

Scarab Sages

No problem. And I'm not telling you, or anyone, how to rule it in your game. I'd probably even let it go in one I was GMing. As a player, though, there's really no alternative if you find yourself at a table with a GM who does think it applies. You'll just be down to 1 AoO for that game (EDIT: While enlarged). Not the worst thing in the world, but something I'd rather not deal with.

Grand Lodge

Forsure. You rarely find yourself in conflict if you take the more conservative ruling. I tend to avoid unclear rulings.


Pathfinder Starfinder Maps, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber
ekibus wrote:
@BretI..amplified rage not mandatory!? Gaining +8 str and cont at level 2 seems pretty tough to skip. That is kinda the cornerstone of this character...ditching that makes me wonder why I didnt just go bard.

I didn’t say you had to ditch it. I said it was not mandatory.

Since you are adverse to low AC and keep using the phrase “just go Bard”, that is probably what you should do.

A Skald is going to have a lower AC than a Bard. It also has a better Fortitude save and weapon proficiencies, but the weapon proficiencies don’t matter since you must multiclass with some other class in order to get the Rage class feature required for Amplified Rage. Raging Song isn’t enough to qualify for that teamwork feat.


BretI wrote:
ekibus wrote:
@BretI..amplified rage not mandatory!? Gaining +8 str and cont at level 2 seems pretty tough to skip. That is kinda the cornerstone of this character...ditching that makes me wonder why I didnt just go bard.

I didn’t say you had to ditch it. I said it was not mandatory.

Since you are adverse to low AC and keep using the phrase “just go Bard”, that is probably what you should do.

A Skald is going to have a lower AC than a Bard. It also has a better Fortitude save and weapon proficiencies, but the weapon proficiencies don’t matter since you must multiclass with some other class in order to get the Rage class feature required for Amplified Rage. Raging Song isn’t enough to qualify for that teamwork feat.

raging song is a rage effect and qualify for the prereqs and use of amplified rage.


Bloodrager is good in that you can gain a familiar (valet) and gain the extra rage punch (aka +4) one thing in debating is going with the dip at 3 or 5. Focus on skald buffing and skills with combat reflexes and skald vigor


Pathfinder Starfinder Maps, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber
Chess Pwn wrote:
BretI wrote:
...since you must multiclass with some other class in order to get the Rage class feature required for Amplified Rage. Raging Song isn’t enough to qualify for that teamwork feat.
raging song is a rage effect and qualify for the prereqs and use of amplified rage.

Is there an FAQ or Campaign Clarification that says that?

Orcs of Golarian, pg. 24 wrote:

amplified rage (Teamwork)

When adjacent to other raging allies, your rages become even more powerful.
Prerequisite: Half-orc or orc, rage class feature.
Benefit: Whenever you are raging and adjacent to a raging ally who also has this feat or flanking the same opponent as a raging ally with this feat, your morale bonuses to Strength and Constitution increase by +4. This feat does not stack with itself (you only gain this bonus from one qualifying ally, regardless of how many are adjacent to you).
ACG, pg. 16 wrote:
Bloodrage counts as the barbarian's rage class feature for the purpose of feat prerequisites, feat abilities, magic item abilities, and spell effects.

I can’t find anything like that in the Skald class features.

I do not think that Raging Song counts as Rage class feature.


BretI wrote:
Chess Pwn wrote:
BretI wrote:
...since you must multiclass with some other class in order to get the Rage class feature required for Amplified Rage. Raging Song isn’t enough to qualify for that teamwork feat.
raging song is a rage effect and qualify for the prereqs and use of amplified rage.

Is there an FAQ or Campaign Clarification that says that?

Orcs of Golarian, pg. 24 wrote:

amplified rage (Teamwork)

When adjacent to other raging allies, your rages become even more powerful.
Prerequisite: Half-orc or orc, rage class feature.
Benefit: Whenever you are raging and adjacent to a raging ally who also has this feat or flanking the same opponent as a raging ally with this feat, your morale bonuses to Strength and Constitution increase by +4. This feat does not stack with itself (you only gain this bonus from one qualifying ally, regardless of how many are adjacent to you).
ACG, pg. 16 wrote:
Bloodrage counts as the barbarian's rage class feature for the purpose of feat prerequisites, feat abilities, magic item abilities, and spell effects.

I can’t find anything like that in the Skald class features.

I do not think that Raging Song counts as Rage class feature.

It's right in the book like your example.

Quote:
If an ally has her own rage class ability (such as barbarian’s rage, bloodrager’s bloodrage, or skald’s inspired rage)

says right in the line that inspired rage is a rage class ability. Though they want to keep it separate from barbarian's rage since the extra rage feat doesn't work with it, thus it doesn't count as the barbarian's rage class feature but is a rage class feature.


@Chess Pwn Honestly didnt realize I kept saying "Just go bard" Honestly I've put a lot of work on this skald which is why I feel like I've been struggling to make another character. I sorta feel like he is on the edge of either really hitting it or kinda falling on his face.

Not sure where the raging song falls in that debate. Would be nice to use Battle song of the people revolt. It appears I would be able to skip the feat and the class dip and gain a similar effect.


Pathfinder Starfinder Maps, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber
Chess Pwn wrote:


It's right in the book like your example.
Quote:
If an ally has her own rage class ability (such as barbarian’s rage, bloodrager’s bloodrage, or skald’s inspired rage)
says right in the line that inspired rage is a rage class ability. Though they want to keep it separate from barbarian's rage since the extra rage feat doesn't work with it, thus it doesn't count as the barbarian's rage class feature but is a rage class feature.

I don’t read it the same way you do.

Let’s put your quote in context.

ACG, pg. 50 wrote:
If an ally has her own rage class ability (such as barbarian's rage, bloodrager's bloodrage, or skald's inspired rage), she may use the Strength, Constitution, and Will saving throw bonuses, as well as AC penalties, based on her own ability and level instead of those from the skald (still suffering no fatigue afterward). Inspired rage does not allow an ally to activate abilities dependent on other rage class abilities, such as rage powers, blood casting, or bloodrager bloodlines; the ally must activate her own rage class ability in order to use these features.

First of all, it is calling them rage class abilities, not class features.

Secondly, it is talking about how the abilities given by the Raging Song interact with other abilities that a recipient may have. It even calls out how the Raging Song doesn’t allow an ally to use all of their rage powers.

Lastly, it never says that Raging Song counts as a rage class feature for the purpose of feat prerequisites, feat abilities, magic item abilities, and spell effects. Bloodrage (in the same book) specifically says that it does.

It does however say that it counts as bardic performance.

ACG, pg. 49 wrote:
A raging song counts as the bard's bardic performance special ability for any effect that affects bardic performances.

It seems to me they very carefully wrote it so as to differentiate between Raging Song and the Rage class feature.


Grandlounge wrote:
Slim Jim wrote:
Savage Technologist + extra rage at 1st level, then go your druid archetype after that. You'll pick up Lesser Restoration at 4th to deal with fatigue.
Savage technologist is a good dip but I always have trouble justifying it storywise but that is me.

You fell off the zeppelin into a primordial jungle. The fleet gated away without you. You have no idea where you are.


BretI wrote:
Chess Pwn wrote:


It's right in the book like your example.
Quote:
If an ally has her own rage class ability (such as barbarian’s rage, bloodrager’s bloodrage, or skald’s inspired rage)
says right in the line that inspired rage is a rage class ability. Though they want to keep it separate from barbarian's rage since the extra rage feat doesn't work with it, thus it doesn't count as the barbarian's rage class feature but is a rage class feature.

First of all, it is calling them rage class abilities, not class features.

Secondly, it is talking about how the abilities given by the Raging Song interact with other abilities that a recipient may have. It even calls out how the Raging Song doesn’t allow an ally to use all of their rage powers.

Lastly, it never says that Raging Song counts as a rage class feature for the purpose of feat prerequisites, feat abilities, magic item abilities, and spell effects. Bloodrage (in the same book) specifically says that it does.

It does however say that it counts as bardic performance.

ACG, pg. 49 wrote:
A raging song counts as the bard's bardic performance special ability for any effect that affects bardic performances.
It seems to me they very carefully wrote it so as to differentiate between Raging Song and the Rage class feature.

Rage IS NOT the barbarian's rage, thus they don't have or want any line saying it counts as the barbarian's rage. So they wrote it very carefully so as to differentiate between barbarian's rage and raging song while having raging song be a rage class ability like barbarian's rage.

But it is a Rage class ability, and if you're trying to argue that a rage class ability is somehow different than a rage class feature let's just say I hope I never need to play under you, cause it would seem that life channel isn't channel energy, and nature bond animal companion isn't animal companion class feature.


While hero lab isnt the end all it doesnt count the skald as having the rage feature. So at least for some GM's it is a non-starter, I'll try to email the gm I typically play with to get a ruling.

That said my idea is to keep the stats as is, go skald unil level 2 then bloodrager at 3 then skald the rest of the way. That will give me my buffing ability, combat reflexes and the big boost to social skills. At 3 go bloodrager to gain the familiar and take amplified rage. Feats are still tighter than I like but i will have to figure it out as I go. Thought is skald vigor at level 5 to keep him alive

Grand Lodge

You can just replace your bloodline power with a familiar. No second level needed. The longer it takes to inspire as a move action the long you will feel like you not doing anything.


Sorry just meant at level 3 I would take the one level of bloodrager. Plan to go with the familiar (greensting scorpion that I plan to keep on his person at all time for alertness, +4 init and the benefit of amplified rage) This character is level 2 already and since things are pretty well dead after I perform I figured the 2 levels of skald first makes more sense.

RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32

Anyone else have visions of Helena in the box and out in the desert, speaking to her hallucinatory scorpion?


Ok I'll admit I like how the character evolved.Started with the community minded (Rahadoum) So he does come from the desert :) I was really trying to work with a starvation of skill points and found out I could take out darkvision for +1 skill per level. Coming from a desert area it worked. Then the Scorpion? Matched :) I planned to go falchion but I really wasnt feeling and want to go reach.

Scarab Sages

Sounds like the idea is coming together. Also sounds like a fun character/concept!


Thanks, probably spent way too much time on this (counting other characters I worked on) I plan on him wearing layers of cloth over armor.. scorpion will be typically hiding in the folds. Took the feat go unnoticed for it. I feel like feats would be a huge premium fort him, but hopefully everything will click

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