Long story made short: what's the point of the psychic detective?
Long story: I am a few years out of date on my Pathfinder knowledge but recently joined a group playing Pathfinder Society. My intent was to play a character that is intelligent, a spontaneous caster, and contributes through battlefield control, utility spells, and knowledge. My first attempt was an elf Sage Sorcerer (wild bloodline that uses Int instead of Cha) and was happy with some good knowledge checks and a well-placed grease spell.
Then I ran across the psychic detective archetype for investigators and it seemed at first blush to be much closer to the characters that inspired my earlier character choices (Titus Crow, Jules de Grandin, Dr. Owen Orient, Doctor Druid, etc.). The more I read the rules for Investigators in general, and the rules for psychic spells in particular, the more it seems like an overly complicated way to do things that a few choice spell selections already do well for the sorcerer.
Since this may just be my unfamiliarity with the rules, can anyone share other things I should consider as I choose between a sage sorcerer and a psychic detective?
TL;DR: Sorc will be a caster. Investigators are more versatile, but weaker spells, better at pretty much everything else
Those are two very different classes. Can't say much specificaly about a Sage Sorcerer, but in general you're still a sorcerer, so you will be nearly 100% reliant on your spells.
I've played an investigator too, though not a psychic one, so I can't say too much about the spell selection there. But it's a lot of mind based spells. As an investigator you have much more than your spells. You probably have a decent Dex score too. You have way more skill points, and aside form social skills you will be better at them too. You will be a competent martial combatant as well using stiudied combat, basically it adds half your level to melee attack and damage.
So, I guess it comes down to how much you want to be a full caster vs 3/4 caster, melee and skills
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
I find the question confusing. It's a little like trying to compare an Arcane Bloodline Sorcerer to a Bard. Other than the fact that they are spontaneous casters that use the same casting stat, they don't have much in common.
If you want a skill monkey who can engage in combat and but also has a bit of casting then Psychic Detective is pretty good. If it's the Psychic magic that's the issue you might consider the Questioner Investigator which is an arcane caster.
Long story made short: what's the point of the psychic detective?
Long story: I am a few years out of date on my Pathfinder knowledge but recently joined a group playing Pathfinder Society. My intent was to play a character that is intelligent, a spontaneous caster, and contributes through battlefield control, utility spells, and knowledge. My first attempt was an elf Sage Sorcerer (wild bloodline that uses Int instead of Cha) and was happy with some good knowledge checks and a well-placed grease spell.
Then I ran across the psychic detective archetype for investigators and it seemed at first blush to be much closer to the characters that inspired my earlier character choices (Titus Crow, Jules de Grandin, Dr. Owen Orient, Doctor Druid, etc.). The more I read the rules for Investigators in general, and the rules for psychic spells in particular, the more it seems like an overly complicated way to do things that a few choice spell selections already do well for the sorcerer.
Since this may just be my unfamiliarity with the rules, can anyone share other things I should consider as I choose between a sage sorcerer and a psychic detective?
There's nothing a non-full spellcasting class can do that a full "9 levels of spells" caster can't do better. Investigators are great if you care about skills, but you're right, there are spells that could work just as well or better.
The question now is, having peered at the truth beyond the veil, do you try to solve every problem with a spell on your own, or do you play a subpar option that may not be as powerful, but can likely still contribute?
The answer to that question is your own.
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
The Ley-Line Guardian Witch is also spontaneous INT-based casting, with less Witch flavor (no Witch familiar stuff). Witches are extremely customizable characters, and Ley-Line Guardian doesn't narrow their options like Sage does to a Sorcerer. You can potentially also build a Witch with the right patron into a powerful gish with minimum sacrifice.
If you want knowledge/INT power, check out the Fey Obedience for Magdh, the fey goddess of fate. Awesome stuff.
Lots of good answers, thanks (but I did have to look up TL;DR). Ultimately I'm not looking for the exact right answer, but just hoping to learn from the experience of other players what works well and what to consider while building a character.
I really like Kaouse's "There's nothing a non-full spellcasting class can do that a full '9 levels of spells' caster can't do better... having peered at the truth beyond the veil, do you try to solve every problem with a spell on your own, or do you play a subpar option that may not be as powerful, but can likely still contribute?" Well said. I've played lots of interesting sub-par characters, but never taken advantage of a full caster.
One other item knocking around my head is this: a sorcerer has a very limited number of spells (and rules)to keep track of. If I read psychic detective right, I would have to keep track of spells, inspiration, and phrenic points & amplifications, and talents. In the opinion of folks who have played it, does that make psychic detectives overly complicated or more fun?
|
One other item knocking around my head is this: a sorcerer has a very limited number of spells (and rules)to keep track of. If I read psychic detective right, I would have to keep track of spells, inspiration, and phrenic points & amplifications, and talents. In the opinion of folks who have played it, does that make psychic detectives overly complicated or more fun?
That's down to your playstyle.
Having four concurrent resources to manage is my jam. I love it, I love having backup resources to rely on, and I love the task of trying to manage my stuff so I don't run out when needed.
I also enjoy the Investigator's ability to defend himself with a blade well (studied combat is very powerful), and the versatility of the inspiration pool. Honestly, with a few levels and decent int mod, the Investigator trivialises skill checks to a crazy degree.
I also know some of my friends have a harder time faffing about with the fiddly action economy, and learning 3 different rulesets for one character. I would also point out that the Investigator is a martial character primarily, and a caster secondarily. The best spells for the class are buffs and utility - not so much battlefield control.
I personally hate playing sorcerers, with their ineffectual bloodlines, painful decisions between combat spells and narrative/niche spells, their lack of low level filler actions without spending money on buying scrolls, and reliance on heavy handed saving throw based spells to defend themselves.
On the other hand, the Sorcerer is a widely beloved class and still above all of the 6th level casters on the power curve. It really does come down to personal preference and style.
What's more important to you? Being a master of knowledge and jack-of-all trades? Or being a powerful int-based spellcaster with battlefield control? I think that will answer your question, as both classes can pull off the flavour you desire.
There's nothing a non-full spellcasting class can do that a full "9 levels of spells" caster can't do better.Long story made short: what's the point of the psychic detective?
Long story: I am a few years out of date on my Pathfinder knowledge but recently joined a group playing Pathfinder Society. My intent was to play a character that is intelligent, a spontaneous caster, and contributes through battlefield control, utility spells, and knowledge. My first attempt was an elf Sage Sorcerer (wild bloodline that uses Int instead of Cha) and was happy with some good knowledge checks and a well-placed grease spell.
Then I ran across the psychic detective archetype for investigators and it seemed at first blush to be much closer to the characters that inspired my earlier character choices (Titus Crow, Jules de Grandin, Dr. Owen Orient, Doctor Druid, etc.). The more I read the rules for Investigators in general, and the rules for psychic spells in particular, the more it seems like an overly complicated way to do things that a few choice spell selections already do well for the sorcerer.
Since this may just be my unfamiliarity with the rules, can anyone share other things I should consider as I choose between a sage sorcerer and a psychic detective?
Damage in combat in a random encounter dungeon scenario.
| 2 people marked this as a favorite. |
I'm playing a psychic detective in a home game and loving every minute of it. I have to agree with Dandy Lion that having a variety of pools to dip into keeps combat fresh, and there are always tons of options you have to sift through to find the optimal one for your situation.
Psychic magic takes care of big, dumb creatures with low will saves (and also includes some great combat buffs and info gathering), and I've spec'd for dirty tricks, giving me options against caster types with high will saves but low CMDs. The undercasting phrenic amp gives me more mileage out of my smaller spell pool, while inspiration can be used either in combat to secure a tough hit/save throw, or give you an edge on skills. All this on top of studied combat to keep you competitive with full babs, and you'll always have something to do reasonably well both in and out of battle.
Though I'll never be as specialized as a power attacking Barb or versatile in the long term as a wizard, I'm always contributing -something- of value no matter the challenge, and that keeps me totally invested in every encounter.