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Maximum AB at level 1


Advice


What is the max AB that a character can get at level 1, w/o including base attribute bonuses (But class boost can be included)?

Highest I have come up with is a Halfling Full BAB
+1 BAB
+1 Size
+1 Weapon Focus
+1 Trait
----
+4 Level 1 Attack Bonus

He would probably be a fighter or Swash to get weapon Finesse along with Weapon Focus


Pathfinder Companion, Maps, Modules, Roleplaying Game Subscriber; Starfinder Charter Superscriber

What about strength? The maximum bonus that a Halfling can get from that is +3, but an Orc could potentially get +6, which more than makes up for the loss of the +1 size bonus for being Small.

A Human has a maximum strength bonus of +5 and could take Possessed Hand as his bonus feat for a +1 insight bonus to attack and damage rolls.

Is the trait bonus from Ancestral Weapon or some other trait?

Sovereign Court

Make it a gnome ranger for favored enemy bonus and racial hatred perhaps?


I figure that if they get a -1 for str they will likely get a bonus to Dex and use a finesse weapon, or maybe he is a ranged guy, etc...I said no attributes to keep it "fair" between different styles, different attribute spreads, etc...

I was thinking either Sword Scion or River rat (IIRC the names, but there are a few possibilities)


Cylyria wrote:
Make it a gnome ranger for favored enemy bonus and racial hatred perhaps?

Only problem with those (IIRC) is that they are extremely situational, while an argument can be made about size being as well I feel that Medium or higher is very common


Jason Wedel wrote:
What is the max AB that a character can get at level 1, w/o including base attribute bonuses (But class boost can be included)?

Do you count rage or not? Because +2 AB at level 1 is significant. This likely corners you into Str based combat, though - but there are Small races with no Str penalty. And there are orcs with +4 Str, which accomplishes more than the +1 AB from Small.


I would say indicate both rage and no rage, so let's change the rules: Assume you have a base 18 in any ONE attribute before racial mods, so the above guy I did would be a swashbuckler or fighter (to have weapon Finnesse) and a Dex of 20 (after mods) for a grand total of +9


I'll presume true strike is banned :-P

First thing that comes to mind is an Alchemist, which can stack a dex-boosting mutagen with a reduce person extract for a very high dexterity-based to-hit. Presuming you have a size bonus and the trait bonus as described earlier, that gives you +6 to hit. When throwing a splash weapon you get +1 from throw anything, and we can also take the point blank shot feat to get an extra +1 within 15 feet. So +8 total.

A Paladin can potentially get +5 to hit from his charisma score when smiting. With +1 from BAB, +1 from trait, +1 from small size, and +1 from weapon focus that takes him to +9. That's a bit higher than the previously mentioned alchemist, but it also would require two maxed out stats and only work against evil foes.

Edit on new rules: presuming goblin is banned (+4 dex = awesome) then the 20 dex alchemist in this case has 26 dexterity with both buffs active, +2 from size, +1 from trait, +1 from throw anything, and +1 from point blank shot for a grand total of +13 with his buffs active, and +9 without.


+5 stat
+2 rage
+2 charge attack
+1 feat
+1 trait
+1 BAB
+1 MW weapon (or whetstone'd)

+13 is probably tops for core races.


Masterwork good catch but dedicates both traits (to get the gold for it)...NICE idea...


Changed the rules to allow Orcs/Goblins, other +4 races


Jason Wedel wrote:
Masterwork good catch but dedicates both traits (to get the gold for it)...NICE idea...

A single trait gets you a +1 to hit AND a masterwork weapon.


Which one?


Jason Wedel wrote:
Which one?

Ancestral Weapon


Dasrak wrote:
Jason Wedel wrote:
Which one?
Ancestral Weapon

Yep! Thanks for the link. I'm on a mobile device so it's a pain for me to do it.

An interesting option is to pair the above trait with Signature Moves. You can snag 2 masterwork weapons or 1 weapon and 1 shield.


Slim Jim wrote:

+5 stat

+2 rage
+2 charge attack
+1 feat
+1 trait
+1 BAB
+1 MW weapon (or whetstone'd)

+13 is probably tops for core races.

Which would be enough to hit an average CR 3 creature on rolling a 2 or better.


orc Id Rager (anger) Bloodrager with weapon focus, masterwork weapon, and whatever else everyone is using.
This gives you a raging strength of 28 which is +9 attack bonus from str. Then add bab, trait, masterwork, and WF, total attack bonus of +13, +15 on a charge. core race drops this by 1 str mod for +12, +14 on charge. (big plus is that using a lucern hammer the half-orc is doing 1d12+12 damage on a hit, have them worship torag with Defensive Strategist trait to not be flat footed lettings you be sure to have an AoO if something comes at you.)

EDIT: going hatred actually lets you get a +2 attack and 1 damage as a move action against a target, so that's letting you get +1 over the anger emotion.

Liberty's Edge

Well, if you're just looking for highest attack, take deific obedience with Pharasma and use a dagger. +2 sacred bonus to hit instead of +1 for weapon focus.


Level 3 required I believe on that one...

Liberty's Edge

Jason Wedel wrote:
Level 3 required I believe on that one...

Oh yeah, you're right. Knowledge religion 3 ranks as a pre-req, I think...

EDIT - Yeah, KN religion for deific obedience, kn planes for celestial.


Divine Paragon cleric gets it as a bonus feat at level 1. BAB 0 at level 1 sadly.


avr wrote:
Divine Paragon cleric gets it as a bonus feat at level 1. BAB 0 at level 1 sadly.

Divine Paragon Cleric might be a good approach here. You can stack the Bless, Divine Favor, and Magic Weapon spells for a total of +3 to attack, use a variant channel option to gain +1 to attack from that, then you get the +2 from Divine Paragon obedience. On top of a +1 trait bonus from ancestral weapon (MW bonus doesn't stack with Magic Weapon), +1 size bonus and +6 from a 22 dexterity goblin, that takes you to +14 to hit, or +16 when charging.

Actually, I'm not sure on the compatibility of the AB boosting variant channel options with Pharasma. Does anyone know if that's a legal combo?


Jason Wedel wrote:
Changed the rules to allow Orcs/Goblins, other +4 races

Orcs will be +1 over other strength races, but goblins shouldn't be any better because they're either not taking Weapon Focus at 1st, or they're gaining Weapon Finesse via unchained rogue (BAB0).

The caster tricks require multiple rounds of buffing. (Martials will just drink potions.)


If you have a Mascot familiar and the trait Fate's Favored, you can get +2 bonus when it performs an Aid Another on your attack roll, and on top of that, a +2 Luck bonus on all attack rolls that turn (+1 normally, +1 for fate's favored), for a total of +4.

Combine that with flanking and charging ...


Slim Jim wrote:
Jason Wedel wrote:
Changed the rules to allow Orcs/Goblins, other +4 races
Orcs will be +1 over other strength races, but goblins shouldn't be any better because they're either not taking Weapon Focus at 1st, or they're gaining Weapon Finesse via unchained rogue (BAB0).

Weapon Focus has a +1 BAB prerequisite, so 0 BAB classes can't qualify for it anyways. Also you can just make ranged attacks instead of melee attacks, although that deprives you of a charge bonus.

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