Paizo Top Nav Branding
  • Hello, Guest! |
  • Sign In |
  • My Account |
  • Shopping Cart |
  • Help/FAQ
About Paizo Messageboards News Paizo Blog Help/FAQ
Pathfinder Roleplaying Game

Pathfinder Adventure Card Game


Pathfinder Society


Starfinder


Starfinder Society

Guns and Magitech: How to build a damage dealing Technomancer


Advice

1 to 50 of 58 << first < prev | 1 | 2 | next > last >>

So a character concept I am having in my mind currently is a high damage dealing bounty hunter technomancer

I normally like to build melee damage dealers, but I want to try my hand with a ranged technomancer build

So far Im looking at taking magic missile and supercharge weapon

should I take longarms or will small arms with certain hacks and spell choices be ok?


If you want to deal consistent damage with a Technomancer, it's always a good idea to invest in longarms. You could try working your way up to Heavy Weapons if you like, since the biggest guns deal the biggest damage, but you would need to use an extra feat and also invest in strength somewhat, so you'd need to decide if that was worth it.


I'd probably stick with longarms
Decent damage, cheap ammo and good range

Is spellshot and empowered weapon good hacks for this build or nah?


3 people marked this as a favorite.
Adventure Path Charter Subscriber; Pathfinder Roleplaying Game, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

It's easier to make a ranged-combat technomancer than a melee technomancer.

IMO, android bounty hunter technomancer with 10 Str, 18 Dex, 11 Con, 16 Int, 10 Wis, 8 Cha makes a very good starting point. Progression:

1st- Longarm Proficiency
2nd- Magic Hack (Empowered Weapon)
3rd- Far Shot, Spell Focus (bonus)
5th- +1 Dex, +2 Con, +2 Int, +2 Wis; Magic Hack (Harmful Spells); Weapon Specialization (Longarms)
7th- Enhanced Resistance (DR)
8th- Magic Hack (Spellshot)
9th- Spell Penetration
10th- +2 Str, +1 Dex, +1 Int, +2 Wis
11th- Magic Hack (Eternal Spell/overheat*); Connection Inkling (stabilize and one other 0-level spell at will; wisp ally once per day per three character levels to provide harrying fire or covering fire)
...

Personal Upgrades Dex > Int > whatever

*- Spellshot every round; avg. damage for overheat at 11th level with Harmful Spells is 14 (equal to what would be added by supercharge weapon)


is empowered weapon worth it for the spell tradeoff?

I mean, a +1 to hit and 1d6 to damage isnt bad but

a magic missle at that level does 3d4+4 avg damage= 11.5

where was am empowered azimuth laser rifle does: 1d8+1d6 avge damage= 8

Silver Crusade RPG Superstar 2014 Top 16

MagicA wrote:

is empowered weapon worth it for the spell tradeoff?

I mean, a +1 to hit and 1d6 to damage isnt bad but

a magic missle at that level does 3d4+4 avg damage= 11.5

where was am empowered azimuth laser rifle does: 1d8+1d6 avge damage= 8

3d4+3 right? so 10.5?


oh right sorry, my bad I was off my one

So, looking at the spells for technomancer, they really dont get a lot of good ones for level 2. The only ones I could see use for are invisibility and mirror image


1 person marked this as a favorite.
MagicA wrote:

oh right sorry, my bad I was off my one

So, looking at the spells for technomancer, they really dont get a lot of good ones for level 2. The only ones I could see use for are invisibility and mirror image

Microbot Assault is amazing, it's a +2 for your party to hit and a -2 for the enemy to hit.

Fog Cloud shuts down enemy ranged to let you move to cover, run away, or move up to melee (or dump AOE spells into the fog) or drop it on yourself to do the same but making it harder for the enemy to move to avoid it.

Holographic Image is good at every level.


2 people marked this as a favorite.
Dragonchess Player wrote:

It's easier to make a ranged-combat technomancer than a melee technomancer.

IMO, android bounty hunter technomancer with 10 Str, 18 Dex, 11 Con, 16 Int, 10 Wis, 8 Cha makes a very good starting point. Progression:

1st- Longarm Proficiency
2nd- Magic Hack (Empowered Weapon)
3rd- Far Shot, Spell Focus (bonus)
5th- +1 Dex, +2 Con, +2 Int, +2 Wis; Magic Hack (Harmful Spells); Weapon Specialization (Longarms)
7th- Enhanced Resistance (DR)
8th- Magic Hack (Spellshot)
9th- Spell Penetration
10th- +2 Str, +1 Dex, +1 Int, +2 Wis
11th- Magic Hack (Eternal Spell/overheat*); Connection Inkling (stabilize and one other 0-level spell at will; wisp ally once per day per three character levels to provide harrying fire or covering fire)
...

Personal Upgrades Dex > Int > whatever

*- Spellshot every round; avg. damage for overheat at 11th level with Harmful Spells is 14 (equal to what would be added by supercharge weapon)

I endorse the stats (except the theme, which can be anything) and magic hacks if you're trying to maximize ranged damage with a very tight focus.

The feats are more flexible, but you definitely should do Versatile Specialization rather than Longarms Specialization in case you pick up another proficiency some day via feat or the Fabricate Arms hack. You also want Weapon Focus in there fairly early.


2 people marked this as a favorite.

I would do
2 Harmful Spells
3 Versatile Specialization
5 Weapon Focus (Longarms)


I would say that it is pretty amusing to get heavy weapon and use the "create temporary weapon" thingy to make on command elemetnal heavy weapons when you need one


so is empowered weapon really that good?

trading spells for to hit and an additional damage dice seems like not to much of a fair trade


It's only worth it IMO for do or die shots with a Spellshot attached and you can't afford to miss. But in that case the smartest move might be to cast the spell and not risk the shot.


I do like the idea of a nova super shot using supercharge weapon with an azimuth laser rifle and empowered weapon

1d6+1d8+4d6= 22 avg damage

that's pretty nice for level 2 damage


Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber; Pathfinder Comics Subscriber

For enternal spell I would pick Supercharge weapon (spell damage hack works with Supercharge weapon). With spell shot hack it is awesome, plus let's you Supercharge can boost teammates damage as well.
I personally like human glass cannon Technomancer. 1st two feats are longarm proficiency and weapon focus (longarms) but only have Dex at 16, same with int. Sadly, everything else is effective 10s.


is the eternal spells thing permanent or no?


Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber; Pathfinder Comics Subscriber

A 1st Technomancer spell of your choice becomes at will.


so its permanent on the gun?
nice!


Pathfinder Starfinder Roleplaying Game, Starfinder Society Roleplaying Guild Subscriber

At will, not permanent. You do still have to cast it, each time.


1 person marked this as a favorite.
HammerJack wrote:
At will, not permanent. You do still have to cast it, each time.

Which is why I don't like Supercharge Weapon for that pick, you're spending half of your rounds buffing your weapon rather than firing it. At 11th level you should have better options.

Overheat, although subject to resistance, is the clear combat winner because you can pump it out every round. Plus it can benefit from Harmful Spells (and provides the only really good reason to take Harmful Spells), which Supercharge Weapon cannot.

I do think it can be defensible to skip Eternal Spell or spend it on a utility option like Holographic Image 1.


Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber; Pathfinder Comics Subscriber

Spell shot works with supercharge weapon, so one standard action for 4d6 extra damage and same type as your weapon and to shoot.


1 person marked this as a favorite.

Spellshot does not work with Supercharge Weapon because it specifies an area spell, which Supercharge Weapon is not. This is also why a sniper rifle cannot be used to fire Disintegrate from two miles away.


does harmfull spells not work on single target spells?


Jack Rift wrote:

For enternal spell I would pick Supercharge weapon (spell damage hack works with Supercharge weapon). With spell shot hack it is awesome, plus let's you Supercharge can boost teammates damage as well.

I personally like human glass cannon Technomancer. 1st two feats are longarm proficiency and weapon focus (longarms) but only have Dex at 16, same with int. Sadly, everything else is effective 10s.

Actually, the Harmful Spells magic hack does not increase the damage dealt by the Supercharge Weapon spell, because it is not an instantaneous spell that deals damage. By that, I mean that the spell's duration is listed as "see text" rather than "instantaneous," like Overheat's duration is.

Of course, you're still getting your weapon specialization damage added, since it is a spell that is empowering a weapon attack that you are making. You're just not getting the additional Harmful Spells damage on top of that.


MagicA wrote:
does harmfull spells not work on single target spells?

It doesn't work on spells that aren't instantaneous. So no Wall of Fire or Supercharge Weapon.


Away from books but can't you super charge for next s$@+ then spell shot with a different spell plus the bonus damage? Does that not work?


simplygnome wrote:
Away from books but can't you super charge for next s%~@ then spell shot with a different spell plus the bonus damage? Does that not work?

It does, it just seems very inefficient. You might as well just shoot your weapon on the Supercharge Weapon round, your average damage is probably close to the same (minimum +8 from weapon specialization at that point), you save a spell slot, and you deliver the damage earlier.

Supercharge Weapon is good at early levels and when firing from ambush (if your GM allows an out of combat casting before the surprise round, like doing Phase Shot at enemies unaware of you in a different room or building). Otherwise it's mid game trade out bait.


Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber; Pathfinder Comics Subscriber

Crap, you guys are correct.

Simplygnome, yeah you should be able to do that.

As for overheat vrs supercharge weapon (or any first lvl spell). I would rather not have to deal with energy resistance if I don't have to for my high damage rifle shots, even if it cost me a round to prepare. While it is less DPR, ignoring energy resistance/immunity is better than trying to punch it. Granted, until the monster book comes out next month we only have limited Starfinder monster to compare too, so some of these ideas people are saying for max damage ideas don't really mean much, yet.


simplygnome wrote:
Away from books but can't you super charge for next s&~% then spell shot with a different spell plus the bonus damage? Does that not work?

also away from book but I think it does.

but that still eats a whole turn just prepping for it.. okay for an opener or sniping, but less so as a semi standard sort of thing


1 person marked this as a favorite.
Jack Rift wrote:

Crap, you guys are correct.

Simplygnome, yeah you should be able to do that.

As for overheat vrs supercharge weapon (or any first lvl spell). I would rather not have to deal with energy resistance if I don't have to for my high damage rifle shots, even if it cost me a round to prepare. While it is less DPR, ignoring energy resistance/immunity is better than trying to punch it. Granted, until the monster book comes out next month we only have limited Starfinder monster to compare too, so some of these ideas people are saying for max damage ideas don't really mean much, yet.

At 11th level when Eternal Spell comes online you should never cast Supercharge Weapon in combat. Your damage from firing your weapon is weapon dice, plus 11 weapon specialization. Why not just shoot instead of waiting a round to add an a average of 14 damage to your next shot, if it hits? Spread your risk, front load your damage, and increase your damage.

Supercharge Weapon should be traded out around level 7-8 if not sooner.


I like the idea of being able to Supercharge Weapon right before combat as a nice boost, otherwise I agree, its not worth the action.

Sovereign Court

Q: Can you fuel Empowered Weapon using your Eternal Spell since you can cast it any number of times?

If so, you can basically do the following pretty much all day:
Move action: Empowered Weapon(+1/1d6)
Standard action: Spellshot
For 4d8(Acid Dart Rifle, Complex)+11 +1d6 +cone 2d8+5 for average 46.5 on a single target (average 14 on additional targets)


Firebug wrote:

Q: Can you fuel Empowered Weapon using your Eternal Spell since you can cast it any number of times?

If so, you can basically do the following pretty much all day:
Move action: Empowered Weapon(+1/1d6)
Standard action: Spellshot
For 4d8(Acid Dart Rifle, Complex)+11 +1d6 +cone 2d8+5 for average 46.5 on a single target (average 14 on additional targets)

No. Eternal Spell casts a spell without using a slot. Empowered Weapon uses up a slot to work without casting a spell.


Eternal Spell does not actually give you more spell slots, and spell slots are what Empowered Weapon and other Spell Hacks actually use. You cast an Eternal Spell at will as if it were a 0th level spell, and 0th level spells don't actually have or use spell slots.


If you are going to take a feat for longarms you could instead take a feat for Sniper Weapons. They on average do a little more damage and since you are not full attacking anyway with empower weapon or spell shot the the unwieldy property is not a problem.

Also you can shoot things really far away with a move action.

RPG Superstar 2010 Top 32

1 person marked this as a favorite.

So I put this spreadsheet together, there are probably errors so apologies in advance, is a WIP. If you let me know I'll try to correct them quickly. Also it only goes up to 4th level spells cause lazy.

Supercharge Weapon Breakdown

Put the character level in the lime green box and then scroll over to see which setup has the highest DPR. Scrolling down will show a set with Weapon Focus added into the mix, and then Weapon Specialization in the third set.

SCW = Supercharge Weapon
EPW = Empower Weapon
DA = Deadly Aim

Suggest zooming out to 75% if you can read it, its not a small spreadsheet.


I had a stupid thought (one of many): Supercharge Weapon is a spell and does not specify what kind of weapon it can enhance. If my technomancer is on a starship and casts it on the starship's weapon (which would then be fired by the group's gunner) would it

a) Not work at all because the spellcasting ability does not specify that it can work on starships (thus no spell could work on starships)

b) Provide a 2d6 damage bonus regardless of weapon type as starship weapons are big and area-y always

c) Provide the 4d6 damage bonus to weapons that target a single ship and 2d6 to any weapons that target multiple ships.

d) Something that I haven't thought of yet


a), but if it did work it would do 4d6/10, round down.

Silver Crusade

Sooo, now that we've talked about all the good stuff; What do the masses say would be a race to use a Technomancer??? I already like the way this out and would like to give it a go....


badlands122 wrote:
Sooo, now that we've talked about all the good stuff; What do the masses say would be a race to use a Technomancer??? I already like the way this out and would like to give it a go....

Anything that doesn't have a penalty to int should do you fine. Elves get a special mention for any caster becouse they get a bonus to dealing with spell resistance. If you've got alien archive Ryphorians and Witchwyrds are interesting picks for different reasons. For the most part though, the general concensus is that so long as you don't have a penalty to a stat that's important to you, you aren't going far wrong.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Companion, Maps, Pawns, Roleplaying Game Subscriber; Starfinder Charter Superscriber

Why would a penalty matter? The ability generation system is super friendly, allowing you to max out a stat even with a penalty.


It doesn't matter super much, but it makes it harder to get the spread the way you want it if you also have bonuses to things you don't care for.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Companion, Maps, Pawns, Roleplaying Game Subscriber; Starfinder Charter Superscriber
The_Defiant wrote:
It doesn't matter super much, but it makes it harder to get the spread the way you want it if you also have bonuses to things you don't care for.

So wouldn't it then be more accurate to say that the bonus placement matters, rather than the penalty placement?


I suspose both matter about equally, you don't want bonuses to a stat you want to dump or penalties to one you want to boost. A penalty to a dump stat means 2 points to put into a stat you want, while a bonus to a dump stat means 2 points you can't use somewhere you want it. Not ususally a super big deal imho, a 5% increase or decrease in your chanse to do a thing is in and of it self not a super huge deal in the vast majority of cases, but if you're looking for optimal it's worth noting.


2 people marked this as a favorite.
Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Companion, Maps, Pawns, Roleplaying Game Subscriber; Starfinder Charter Superscriber

I agree that it's "worth noting." Some people on these boards talk as though it is absolutely everything though.


This logic makes no sense, how many times has anyone said “I’m totally screwed, I wanted a 10 INT but I have a 12 for absolutely no cost” ? Can you explain how having more of a stat you don’t want is somehow worse than having less of a stat you do want?

Let’s look at maximizing our favorite stat
Having no bonus to a stat you want costs 7 points with favorable theme
Having a bonus to a stat you want costs 5 points with favorable theme
Having a penalty to a favorable stat costs 9 points with favorable theme.

You can’t have a “dump stat” so if you have a bonus to something you don’t want it just means you have more than you need it doesn’t cost you anything.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Companion, Maps, Pawns, Roleplaying Game Subscriber; Starfinder Charter Superscriber

Alright, so let's run a comparison of best and worst case scenario.

Make two similar characters, one with ideal ability modifiers, with bonuses in two prime stats, and the penalty in a stat you didn't want to boost anyway; and one with with the bonuses in undesirable stats, and the penalty in its prime stat.

Let's see how different they are from one another at levels 1, 5, 10, 15, and 20 when trying for the same build.

I'm willing to bet it won't be as bad as you think.


Jodokai wrote:

This logic makes no sense, how many times has anyone said “I’m totally screwed, I wanted a 10 INT but I have a 12 for absolutely no cost” ? Can you explain how having more of a stat you don’t want is somehow worse than having less of a stat you do want?

Let’s look at maximizing our favorite stat
Having no bonus to a stat you want costs 7 points with favorable theme
Having a bonus to a stat you want costs 5 points with favorable theme
Having a penalty to a favorable stat costs 9 points with favorable theme.

You can’t have a “dump stat” so if you have a bonus to something you don’t want it just means you have more than you need it doesn’t cost you anything.

Yes it does, the amount of points you get are static, you get a total of 62 points from your race (a base 10 in each stat and a net +2 gain) on top of wich you can speand 10 points to get stats where you want them to be. Say I'm making a technomancer gunmage favoring dex and int and my race gives me +2 str, +2 cha, -2 int (the absolute worst stats I could get), I end up with a starting array that looks something like this:

Base: 12 10 10 10 8 12

Increase dex and int: 12 14 10 10 14 12.

Level 5: 12 16 12 12 16 12

Level 10: 12 18 14 14 18 12

Level 15: 12 19 16 16 19 12

Level 20: 12 20 16 16 20 12

Now, say I picked a race that gave me a +2 int, +2 dex, -2 str, wich is pretty much optimal for what I want to do.

Base: 8 12 10 10 12 10

Increase dex and int: 8 16 10 10 18 10

Level 5: 8 18 12 12 19 10

Level 10: 8 19 14 14 20 10

Level 15: 8 20 16 16 21 10

Level 20: 8 20 18 18 22 12

By picking the second race, I am far better at the two stats I care about than I would've been with the other race, so those bonuses are not 'free' becouse not all stats are equally important to you.

That being said, neither of these characters are awfull or unplayable, but if anyone asks you wich is the mechanically better pick, it'd be dishonest to say they're equal.

Edit: added level-up stat boosts becouse Ravingdork mentioned them. While the difference becomes less noteable as you go up in levels, it never goes away entirely. The biggest impact of your sub-optimal choise is definately getting up to level 5 or 10.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Companion, Maps, Pawns, Roleplaying Game Subscriber; Starfinder Charter Superscriber

EDIT: Guess I spent too much time on formatting. You beat me to it. Didn't see your post until after I finished mine.

Let's try a technomancer. Prime stats are Intelligence first, Dexterity second. None of the other stats really matter much, but those with saves associated with them will be given a higher priority.

Less Ideal:

Vesk icon technomancer 1
Str 12 Dex 12 Con 12 Int 16 Wis 10 Cha 11

Vesk icon technomancer 5
Str 12 Dex 14 Con 14 Int 20 Wis 12 Cha 11 - augmentations (Intelligence I)

Vesk icon technomancer 10
Str 12 Dex 18 Con 16 Int 23 Wis 14 Cha 11 - augmentations (Intelligence II, Dexterity I)

Vesk icon technomancer 15
Str 12 Dex 22 Con 20 Int 26 Wis 16 Cha 11 - augmentations (Intelligence III, Dexterity II, Constitution I)

Vesk icon technomancer 20
Str 14 Dex 22 Con 20 Int 27 Wis 18 Cha 13 - score focus changes at this level to avoid "useless" odd scores

More Ideal:

Ysoki scholar technomancer 1
Str 8 Dex 16 Con 12 Int 16 Wis 11 Cha 10

Ysoki scholar technomancer 5
Str 8 Dex 18 Con 14 Int 20 Wis 13 Cha 10 - augmentations (Intelligence I)

Ysoki scholar technomancer 10
Str 8 Dex 21 Con 16 Int 23 Wis 15 Cha 10 - augmentations (Intelligence II, Dexterity I)

Ysoki scholar technomancer 15
Str 8 Dex 24 Con 20 Int 26 Wis 17 Cha 10 - augmentations (Intelligence III, Dexterity II, Constitution I)

Ysoki scholar technomancer 20
Str 10 Dex 24 Con 20 Int 27 Wis 18 Cha 12 - score focus changes at this level to avoid "useless" odd scores

Difference in Ability Modifiers:

Level 1
Str 2 Dex 2 Con 0 Int 0 Wis 0 Cha 0

Level 5
Str 2 Dex 2 Con 0 Int 0 Wis 0 Cha 0

Level 10
Str 2 Dex 1 Con 0 Int 0 Wis 0 Cha 0

Level 15
Str 2 Dex 1 Con 0 Int 0 Wis 0 Cha 0

Level 20
Str 2 Dex 1 Con 0 Int 0 Wis 0 Cha 0

So unless I made a misstep in my math somewhere, early on it's a +2 modifier difference in a secondary stat, and one other far less important stat. By the time you get to higher levels though, all that fussing only accounts for a +1 modifier difference in a secondary stat, and a +2 modifier difference in a stat we weren't concerned about anyways.

Sure, the optimal choices are better, but the differences are so slight, that I don't feel it's worth the amount of importance people seem to be attributing to it. Optimizing in Starfinder just isn't as much a priority as in Pathfinder--and that's a good thing--the game was designed for that to be the case.


I just realise I completely forgot about theme bonuses, but otherwise it would appear we're mostly in agreement. It's not a super big deal, but it'll be noticeable on occasion.

1 to 50 of 58 << first < prev | 1 | 2 | next > last >>
Paizo / Messageboards / Paizo / Starfinder® / Advice / Guns and Magitech: How to build a damage dealing Technomancer All Messageboards

Want to post a reply? Sign in.

©2002-2017 Paizo Inc.® | Privacy Policy | Contact Us
Need help? Email customer.service@paizo.com or call 425-250-0800 during our business hours, Monday through Friday, 10:00 AM to 5:00 PM Pacific time.

Paizo Inc., Paizo, the Paizo golem logo, Pathfinder, the Pathfinder logo, Pathfinder Society, Starfinder, the Starfinder logo, GameMastery, and Planet Stories are registered trademarks of Paizo Inc. The Pathfinder Roleplaying Game, Pathfinder Campaign Setting, Pathfinder Adventure Path, Pathfinder Adventure Card Game, Pathfinder Player Companion, Pathfinder Modules, Pathfinder Tales, Pathfinder Battles, Pathfinder Legends, Pathfinder Online, Starfinder Adventure Path, PaizoCon, RPG Superstar, The Golem's Got It, Titanic Games, the Titanic logo, and the Planet Stories planet logo are trademarks of Paizo Inc. Dungeons & Dragons, Dragon, Dungeon, and Polyhedron are registered trademarks of Wizards of the Coast, Inc., a subsidiary of Hasbro, Inc., and have been used by Paizo Inc. under license. Most product names are trademarks owned or used under license by the companies that publish those products; use of such names without mention of trademark status should not be construed as a challenge to such status.