Nethys, Omnivision, and divine ascension.


Lost Omens Campaign Setting General Discussion


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We know that the Starstone isn't the exclusive path to divinity for mere mortals. Irori allegedly gained enlightenment (whatever that means in Pathfinder) and ascended. Nethys also purportedly pulled it off through his own machinations.

Being a sucker for all lore magica, Nethys is one of the most intriguing. His story posits that he somehow gained the ability to essentially see everywhere ehich has been characerized as "fueling" his divine ascension. So he's not omniscient but seeing everywhere has been tied to his apotheosis.

For those in the know, did Nethys become a god simply by the act of all encompassing observation? Or was that some sort of precondition, like Aroden becoming a demigod when succeeding in his Starstone encounter, only to ascend later by presumably different means.


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Dot

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Cdawg wrote:
For those in the know, did Nethys become a god simply by the act of all encompassing observation? Or was that some sort of precondition, like Aroden becoming a demigod when succeeding in his Starstone encounter, only to ascend later by presumably different means.

I'm hardly 'in the know,' but it seems that there are multiple paths to apotheosis in the Golarion-verse.

Irori, Nethys and Urgathoa bootstrapped themselves to divinity.

Arazni was sponsored.

Aroden may or may not have been divine before the Starstone, and may or may not have crossed the line after passing the Test of the Starstone.

Cayden Cailean, Iomedae and Norgorber were Starstone scions.

Shelyn and Zon-Kuthon had at least one divine parent, and inherited their divinity, as did the various children of Torag.

Asmodeus, Lamashtu and Sarenrae seem to be ascended outsiders, although it's unclear whether or not Asmodeus and Sarenrae are technically devil or angel, respectively. Lamashtu, at least, is a garden-variety demon lord, who stepped up from the rank and file when she murdered another god, Curchanos.

How Erastil, Gozreh, Abadar, Calistria, Torag, Pharasma, etc. 'became' gods, or whether or not they were 'born that way' or simply predate any sort of 'origin story' and always were, is unclear, and it's cool enough, since I don't expect that gods would respond to uppity clerics communing to ask them about their parentage, or other personal details.

I kind of like that there isn't any one road to godhood, and that different gods got there in different ways. Nethys found a way to godhood, and it broke his brain a bit, trying to know *everything,* but that's clearly not the only path, as Irori and Urgathoa also are self-made gods, and neither of them seem to have been damaged by the experience (although that's arguable in Urgathoa's case, as her state of being is generally considered unnatural).


Dot!


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I should clarify by "in the know" I mean my fellows here with perhaps a broader graap on lore, although I never turn down insights from the powers that be.

Over the years, we were given some clarity to ascension the way Paizo (or at least James Jacobs) saw it. The Starstone, for example, doesn't make someone a full stop deity. However, it has the reputation for doing such.

Nethys intrigues me in part that his ascension is linked to his purported omnivision. That could mean several different things and raises different questions.

Presuming he really did ascend the way his church believes it, as a result of seeing everything, Did becoming all seeing thrust him into a full apotheosis? Did it raise him to a demigod (much like the Starstone) and he found some other way?

Or was it knowledge? Did Nethys see something that elevated him? Or did he learn something, through the act of seeing, that elevated him?

Would anyone who became all seeing the way Nethys did automatically become a god or demigod? Or all-knowing? Was his ascension derived from perception or knowledge?

Irori may be different, in that, we don't really kmow what enlightenment means for Pathfinder. Is it a form of knowledge or a state of being? If Irori fell from grace and lost his enlightenment, would he lose his divinity as well? Or for him, is "enlightenment" the means of achieving divinity and he retains divinity regardless of what happens to his means afterwards?


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It was probably a combination of seeing all things all at once coupled with the fact that he was the first one to do it.


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In the interests of accuracy, I did see today in one of my older books that The "knowledge" Nethys gained from his all seeing period "fueled" his divinity. So... what does that mean? He saw a universal cheat code and became a god?


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Here's my guess:

Your 'typical' god can see/hear/sense far more than a mere mortal. They can track things going on throughout the planes. Nethys managed to pull off a magic that let him see everything and it drove him mad. It also pushed him to full godhood. I'm guessing that there may be some obscure universal rule that says something like 'when you attain this level of cosmic awareness, you're no longer mortal, you're a god'...and he unknowingly triggered it when he pulled that stunt off.

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