Paizo Top Nav Branding
  • Hello, Guest! |
  • Sign In |
  • My Account |
  • Shopping Cart |
  • Help/FAQ
About Paizo Messageboards News Paizo Blog Help/FAQ
Pathfinder Roleplaying Game

Starfinder


Pathfinder Society


Pathfinder Adventure Card Game

How do I use Rich Parents to help my group?


Pathfinder RPG General Discussion


I know there are many PFS "best items" topics. However, I want to discuss a non-PFS situation: the Rich Parents trait. I'm aware that some GMs feel it's brokenly good to start with extra cash, and other GMs feel it's laughably bad because there are no retraining rules for traits, so you're just stuck with a dumb useless trait at level 5+ when you've already spent the money and can no longer gain from it.

So let's not discuss that part. Save that for another topic. Here, let's say that I've already made the smart/stupid (depending upon your POV) decision to have that trait. I now have 900 gold to spend, and I want to use it in the way that best enhances my group's chances of surviving to level 2. I'm thinking I need to have answers to as many low-level problems and dangers as possible. Without knowing what the GM is going to throw at my group during level 1, what are some purchases that make sense? What purchases have at least a maybe decent chance of being useful during level 1 (or even level 2)?

(I'll be playing a sorcerer using Words of Power if that changes your answers in any way, but I'm fine to hear general answers too.)

Liberty's Edge

Pathfinder Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber
aboyd wrote:

Without knowing what the GM is going to throw at my group during level 1, what are some purchases that make sense? What purchases have at least a maybe decent chance of being useful during level 1 (or even level 2)?

(I'll be playing a sorcerer using Words of Power if that changes your answers in any way, but I'm fine to hear general answers too.)

Hire a squad of mercenaries to 'bodyguard' the party and take the hits until you get to the next level?

Scarab Sages

STEP 1: Buy more/better things before you could normally afford them.

STEP 2: Be more effective because you've got better stuff.

STEP 3: That helps your group! Ta-da!

Most fantasy game settings don't feature the options of corporate stocks or government savings bonds (at least not for PCs), but hey, if yours does, you could invest in those for your party....


3 people marked this as a favorite.

A Wand of Cure Light Wounds, plus a few utility scrolls?


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Companion, Modules, Roleplaying Game Subscriber

I'm in the "it's laughably bad" camp myself. Very useful for 1st level, because certain items (wand of CLW) certainly can tip the balance in the beginning, but it's impact drops off geometrically with level. Maybe it allows you to go one extra encounter per day in the beginning, but it does not make a difference by 3rd level. This is also a trait that benefits your party more than yourself depending upon how you play it. I prefer traits that make my character better long-term. For a wizard, +2 to initiative, or +1 fortitude, as examples, are still worthwhile at 20th level, i.e., their relative power drops off linearly. 900 GP compared to 880k GP, however, is not.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Companion, Modules, Roleplaying Game Subscriber
I'm Hiding In Your Closet wrote:

STEP 1: Buy more/better things before you could normally afford them.

STEP 2: Be more effective because you've got better stuff.

STEP 3: That helps your group! Ta-da!

Most fantasy game settings don't feature the options of corporate stocks or government savings bonds (at least not for PCs), but hey, if yours does, you could invest in those for your party....

STEP 4: Profit!

;)


5 people marked this as a favorite.
Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Companion, Maps, Pawns, Roleplaying Game Subscriber; Starfinder Charter Superscriber

I once took the Additional Traits feat to get Rich Parents at first level. I then purchased a pair of war trained tigers with my starting funds and wrecked the campaign for a few levels. Immediately after buying the tigers, I saved up a little bit more money and retrained the feat to something more useful.

You could also afford a riding Pteranodon (750gp, CR 3) and snipe low level foes from on high. Alternatively, you can afford a riding dire bats with blindsense for three members of the party (300gp and CR 2 each) so they can join in on the fun as well. How about a Megaloceros (800gp, CR 4) to trample all of those pesky goblin encounters into the earth? A trio of combat-trained lions (300gp and CR 3 each) or a combat-trained dire lion (1,000gp, CR 5) would easily instill terror in pretty much everybody for quite a few levels to come, provided you can scrape up just a little extra dough.

The true terror, however, is a heard of 12 combat trained bison (75gp and CR 4 each) that could collectively deal 24d6+144 damage with their stampede as early as level 1.

And there are GMs out there that are actually worried that a character with this trait might get a +1 to hit and -1 Armor check penalty from masterwork gear! lol!

Liberty's Edge

I second buying animals. If your GM nixes all the cool ones, just buying warhorses for a party that knows how to use them is amazing. If that's not plausible either, a stack of scrolls, potions, not-full wands if you can get them, etc. A bag of alchemical tricks, like antitoxin, antiplague, alchemists fire, etc. can be super handy, if you run into a swarm at level 2 say.

Also, why in gods name is a combat trained riding lion the same price as a horse?!?


1 person marked this as a favorite.
Ravingdork wrote:
And there are GMs out there that are actually worried that a character with this trait might get a +1 to hit and -1 Armor check penalty from masterwork gear! lol!

Yeah, when I have a player who takes this trait, I just ask "do you want me to just up the starting cash so you can afford the stuff you need to function so you can take a better trait?" If it's something they're actually using the 900 gold for where an extra 100 gp or so to buy the correct composite longbow wouldn't suffice, I would be suspicious.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

Just spread it around! Whenever you go back to town splurge so everyone can go to the "dancehall" instead of just yourself, spring for the masterwork barrister when the fighter inevitably murders their future employer.

It's the little things. :-)

Liberty's Edge

PossibleCabbage wrote:
Ravingdork wrote:
And there are GMs out there that are actually worried that a character with this trait might get a +1 to hit and -1 Armor check penalty from masterwork gear! lol!
Yeah, when I have a player who takes this trait, I just ask "do you want me to just up the starting cash so you can afford the stuff you need to function so you can take a better trait?" If it's something they're actually using the 900 gold for where an extra 100 gp or so to buy the correct composite longbow wouldn't suffice, I would be suspicious.

This is my favorite houserule when I'm running - there's no reason a bow with a stronger pull is 4-5 times as expensive!

Liberty's Edge

Pathfinder Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber
blashimov wrote:


This is my favorite houserule when I'm running - there's no reason a bow with a stronger pull is 4-5 times as expensive!

Well, you have to find someone who can *pull* it to make it, and you gotta pay for that expertise, and the construction capabilities are possibly more robust and then the hidden fees...

Silver Crusade

As long as you have a cleric, I'ld suggest a Wand of CLW and a wand of Bless, I just played a 3-7 PFS scenario, high tier, and they still made use of Bless spells from a pregen Kyra.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Companion, Maps, Pawns, Roleplaying Game Subscriber; Starfinder Charter Superscriber
Wei Ji the Learner wrote:
blashimov wrote:


This is my favorite houserule when I'm running - there's no reason a bow with a stronger pull is 4-5 times as expensive!
Well, you have to find someone who can *pull* it to make it, and you gotta pay for that expertise, and the construction capabilities are possibly more robust and then the hidden fees...

I can think of a variety of simple machines that could help a bow crafter pull a bow that is beyond their physical capabilities.


6 people marked this as a favorite.
Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

How do you use rich parents to help your group?

Easy! Wait till your parents go on vacation and then invite all your friends over for a wild party. Nothing could possibly go wrong.


Every useful first level potion you could ever use, and a mook to carry them for you.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

Agreed on the wand of cure light wounds (assuming someone in the group can use it) - I've found having enough healing at hand to be the biggest struggle with the early levels, so having that many charges of healing spell at hand is a big deal. Besides that, alchemical items are probably the best way to go. They duplicate a lot of what you do as a spellcaster (or at least imitate it), so in essence it's a way to give yourself more "spells" per day once the real ones have run out.


With the contacts rules from Ultimate Campaign, Rich Parents can become a very good life-long trait. You gain a contact (your parent or parents) who considers you the "black sheep" of the family but is still fond of you (Trust level 4 Trustworthy).

Or on second thought, maybe just 3. They do think your adventuring lifestyle is a little crazy.


1 person marked this as a favorite.
PossibleCabbage wrote:
Ravingdork wrote:
And there are GMs out there that are actually worried that a character with this trait might get a +1 to hit and -1 Armor check penalty from masterwork gear! lol!
Yeah, when I have a player who takes this trait, I just ask "do you want me to just up the starting cash so you can afford the stuff you need to function so you can take a better trait?" If it's something they're actually using the 900 gold for where an extra 100 gp or so to buy the correct composite longbow wouldn't suffice, I would be suspicious.

Every alchemist I play takes this to buy a portable alchemist lab and a bunch of alchemical supplies. I also take the "Black Sheep Apothecary Aliver Pillbug"to get poisons at level 1 and a place to buy them.


1 person marked this as a favorite.

Have your rich parents buy a sweet gaming table, copies of all the books, and a big collection of painted miniatures for your group. Oh, and one of those little fridges stocked with drinks.

Oh, the trait? I got nothin for ya.

Liberty's Edge

You don't. You help your group by taking a better trait that has legs past 3rd. (Unless this is a game where your level is hard-fixed at googoogaga forever.)


Ravingdork wrote:

I once took the Additional Traits feat to get Rich Parents at first level. I then purchased a pair of war trained tigers with my starting funds and wrecked the campaign for a few levels. Immediately after buying the tigers, I saved up a little bit more money and retrained the feat to something more useful.

You may want to check with your GM before attempting this one. While by RAW it's legal, it feels very much like a loophole so your gm may not allow it.


1 person marked this as a favorite.

For non joke advice, a lot of people are going to tell you it's not very good, and is a dead spot on your sheet after level 2 or 3 and they're not wrong, but my advice is that if it makes playing at level 1 - 3 more enjoyable for you, then go for it.

Buy an Ioun Torch, a traveler's any-tool, 100 feet of silk rope (pre knot one of the ropes for climbing), and a Sleeves of Many Garments.

For a total of 545 gold you have a hands free light source that works under water, the masterwork mundane tool your party will need for any situation, rope, and the perfect outfit for your wealthy high charisma sorcerer to take the lead in any social situation that your grubby charisma dumping adventuring cohorts find themselves in.

These are cheaper items that can be helpful for your entire career but probably won't find in a treasure hoard. And you still have gold left over to pick up some scrolls or whatever.

If you're going to be in a location where you'll be capable of buying things you need, just keep it in coin and spend it on what you need when you need it.


1 person marked this as a favorite.
Pathfinder Companion, Maps, Modules, Roleplaying Game Subscriber; Starfinder Charter Superscriber
Flamephoenix182 wrote:
Ravingdork wrote:

I once took the Additional Traits feat to get Rich Parents at first level. I then purchased a pair of war trained tigers with my starting funds and wrecked the campaign for a few levels. Immediately after buying the tigers, I saved up a little bit more money and retrained the feat to something more useful.

You may want to check with your GM before attempting this one. While by RAW it's legal, it feels very much like a loophole so your gm may not allow it.

The easiest way to close that loophole is to add the money lost (900 GP in this case) to the cost of retraining.


1 person marked this as a favorite.
Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Companion, Modules, Roleplaying Game Subscriber
Flamephoenix182 wrote:
You may want to check with your GM before attempting this one. While by RAW it's legal, it feels very much like a loophole so your gm may not allow it.

I won't allow retraining traits. It's specifically NOT listed as RAW (racial traits are), and I'm pretty sure it's not RAI, either. It doesn't make sense, either: "just kidding, my parents weren't actually rich, instead I was..."


Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

It was actually the feat he retrained (RAW legal), which made him, by incident, lose the extra traits - he didn't technically retrain the traits themselves into other traits.

I can totally see how some take it as a dubious in-character choice, and it's a valid concern, but having that transition in-character can also be a nifty RP thing, too. It all depends on how it's played out at the table and what the individual groups are okay with.


1 person marked this as a favorite.
Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Companion, Modules, Roleplaying Game Subscriber

That's right. I wouldn't allow that, either, for the same reasons. ;)


1 person marked this as a favorite.
Pathfinder Companion, Maps, Modules, Roleplaying Game Subscriber; Starfinder Charter Superscriber

Losing the Rich Parents trait can definitely reflect a change in your PC's relationship with his parents or guardians. Previously, he was so favored by them that they gave him extra money to start his career. Now, he has lost that favor and they probably want that money back.


6 people marked this as a favorite.
Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Companion, Maps, Pawns, Roleplaying Game Subscriber; Starfinder Charter Superscriber
David knott 242 wrote:

Losing the Rich Parents trait can definitely reflect a change in your PC's relationship with his parents or guardians.

You bought WHAT!!!??

:-D

The Exchange

1 person marked this as a favorite.
Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber
David knott 242 wrote:
Losing the Rich Parents trait can definitely reflect a change in your PC's relationship with his parents or guardians. Previously, he was so favored by them that they gave him extra money to start his career. Now, he has lost that favor and they probably want that money back.

In my games, it's often the fluff part of the traits that's way more important than what they actually do mechanically. Regarding the Rich Parents trait, your parents are still rich even if you have spent the 900 gp. I'm not saying that you can cheat the system and get more money out of them later on, but depending on your parents professional and social status, that trait can come with all kind of indirect boons aka roleplaying opportunities (like using their social contacts, getting help if you're in a tight spot, and so on).

So I'm not sure if I wouldn't allow for retraining, if that can be made sense of storywise, but the player needs to be aware that he would not only lose those 900 gp, but probably also all those boons that come with the trait (the favor part you were speaking of).


1 person marked this as a favorite.

In an on-going campaign, having rich, or more importantly CONNECTED, parents and family is a rich (har har) source of plot potential.


1 person marked this as a favorite.

Kidnap them and then ransom them to themselves. You'll get way more than 900gp, plus you start out with a suh-weeeet reputation.


1 person marked this as a favorite.

Maybe I'm an over-simplistic idiot, but...get three masterwork weapons for the group? You'll end up getting them anyway, and a +1 on all your attacks can make a big difference at low levels when enemy AC is only 14 anyway. Functionally, you're probably looking at hitting 10% more often. But again, I'm new enough that I've never gotten past level 3-4 in a campaign.


1 person marked this as a favorite.

Ensure they take you to see a play on the bad side of town. When they die during a robbery use the motivation to become Batman.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Companion, Modules, Roleplaying Game Subscriber

The notion of the extra traits feat is somewhat silly to me, regardless of the problems associated with retraining it. Certainly I allow it, but that doesn't mean it makes sense. Somewhere along the line in life, after you've already grown up and have been adventuring, you suddenly uncover some new aspect of your childhood and gain a benefit from it. "Oh yeah, I never realized I had been training with an Aldori Swordlord since my early years!" or "Wow, all this time I've been able to drink potions really fast but was completely unaware."


1 person marked this as a favorite.
taks wrote:
Somewhere along the line in life, after you've already grown up and have been adventuring, you suddenly uncover some new aspect of your childhood and gain a benefit from it. "Oh yeah, I never realized I had been training with an Aldori Swordlord since my early years!" or "Wow, all this time I've been able to drink potions really fast but was completely unaware."

It's not totally different from how they handle backstory in comic books though, you just invent the thing that happened in a character's past that explains what they're doing now. For 65+ years nary a Batman comic mentioned Bruce Wayne's childhood friend Tommy Elliot, and at first people chaffed at the idea a la "if it was so important, why wasn't it mentioned before" but by now pretty much everybody is comfortable with the idea of the Hush character.

Background details of RPGs should, IMO, be every bit as flexible to serve the purpose they need to serve as those of comic books.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Companion, Modules, Roleplaying Game Subscriber

a) Pathfinder isn't a comic.
b) The fact that they do this in comics is annoying (and part of the reason I don't read them).
c) Doing this is really an exploit meant to game the system and gain power the character shouldn't otherwise have. In a comic, it doesn't have any consequences other than the story suddenly changed and people like me get annoyed.
d) As a result of the above, I see no reason Pathfinder characters should be expected to be flexible in the same way.


2 people marked this as a favorite.

Invest the money in businesses and turn it into a hell of a lot more money down the road. 900 gold isn't that great 100,000 gold on the other hand goes a long way.


3 people marked this as a favorite.
taks wrote:
The notion of the extra traits feat is somewhat silly to me, regardless of the problems associated with retraining it. Certainly I allow it, but that doesn't mean it makes sense. Somewhere along the line in life, after you've already grown up and have been adventuring, you suddenly uncover some new aspect of your childhood and gain a benefit from it. "Oh yeah, I never realized I had been training with an Aldori Swordlord since my early years!" or "Wow, all this time I've been able to drink potions really fast but was completely unaware."

“There’s something I ought to tell you. I’m not left-handed either.”


1 person marked this as a favorite.
Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Companion, Modules, Roleplaying Game Subscriber

Lol!


1 person marked this as a favorite.
Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

I will say, as a real-life example, I seem to have suddenly developed a much-more-powerful (and faster) than expected kick in TKD, somehow. To date, I've stung one master's hand until it half-glowed (like my foot was doing) in a pulsing red-and-white kind of way, and I've broken one of those bungee things we were supposed to be using to train muscles.

This seems very trait-like, as it doesn't correspond to my general unarmed strikes, strength, or other similar abilities.

Caveats about applying in-game logic to real life, etc., etc.

So... I can see discovering minor traits about yourself that you never knew about before, because the only come about under certain circumstances, even in a manner that is different from leveling over-all.

But I can also see opposition to the concept. It can certainly feel un-intuitive, in many ways, at times, and can be used to "game" the, uh, game, I suppose.


1 person marked this as a favorite.
Starfinder Charter Superscriber

Knowing it would be a "dead trait" later, I still took the rich parents trait for my noblewoman PC because I wanted her to start the campaign looking (and being able to act) the role. First impressions are important in role-playing, just like life :)

The Exchange

1 person marked this as a favorite.
Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber
Tacticslion wrote:
So... I can see discovering minor traits about yourself that you never knew about before, because the only come about under certain circumstances, even in a manner that is different from leveling over-all.

I'll add to that point that it might be possible, that a trait establishes only later on because at the start of the campaign, your expertise might just not have been high enough. Might depend on the trait in question of course. But especially if you plan this from the beginning, it's quite easy to play to a certain trait you might not want to use but later on.

You're a Deft Dodger? Great, but only when your life was really in danger, because you started adventuring, it honed your Reflexes so that you got that +1 bonus. You have a Birthmark? And only now you find out that you're especially resiliant against charm and compulsion effects? Great mystery for the GM to make use of. And so on.

Paizo / Messageboards / Paizo / Pathfinder® / Pathfinder RPG / General Discussion / How do I use Rich Parents to help my group? All Messageboards

Want to post a reply? Sign in.

©2002-2017 Paizo Inc.® | Privacy Policy | Contact Us
Need help? Email customer.service@paizo.com or call 425-250-0800 during our business hours, Monday through Friday, 10:00 AM to 5:00 PM Pacific time.

Paizo Inc., Paizo, the Paizo golem logo, Pathfinder, the Pathfinder logo, Pathfinder Society, Starfinder, the Starfinder logo, GameMastery, and Planet Stories are registered trademarks of Paizo Inc. The Pathfinder Roleplaying Game, Pathfinder Campaign Setting, Pathfinder Adventure Path, Pathfinder Adventure Card Game, Pathfinder Player Companion, Pathfinder Modules, Pathfinder Tales, Pathfinder Battles, Pathfinder Legends, Pathfinder Online, Starfinder Adventure Path, PaizoCon, RPG Superstar, The Golem's Got It, Titanic Games, the Titanic logo, and the Planet Stories planet logo are trademarks of Paizo Inc. Dungeons & Dragons, Dragon, Dungeon, and Polyhedron are registered trademarks of Wizards of the Coast, Inc., a subsidiary of Hasbro, Inc., and have been used by Paizo Inc. under license. Most product names are trademarks owned or used under license by the companies that publish those products; use of such names without mention of trademark status should not be construed as a challenge to such status.