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Eldritch Heritage Cheese


Pathfinder RPG General Discussion


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Aloha,
I love how Eldritch Heritage can be sooooo cheesy. Using feats to get SLAs and supernatural abilities is quirky, can add flavor, and can cause outbursts of incredulity at gaming tables.

I would like to share a couple of Eldritch Heritage Cheese recipes that I've discovered.
If you can think of any other recipes, please share!

To start, here's...

The Demonically Dazzling Displayer
## Ingredients ##
1 Human, with the Focused Study racial trait.
1 Fighter - any will do, but I prefer Vanilla because of the dramatic contrast with the finished product.
1 Starting ability score array with Charisma score of 13 or higher.

## Recipe ##
1: Focused Study - Skill Focus (Intimidate), Weapon Focus 1, Dazzling Display
2: {DDB}
3: {DDB}
4: {DDB}, +1 Charisma if CHA < 14
5: {DDB}
6: {DDB}
7: {DDB}
8: {DDB}, Focused Study - Skill Focus (Know Planes), +1 Charisma if CHA < 15
9: Eldritch Heritage - Abyssal Bloodline (claws)
10: {DDB}
11: Improved Eldritch Heritage - Abyssal Bloodline (Strength of the Abyss; +2 STR)
12: {DDB}
13: {DDB}
14: {DDB}
15: {DDB}, Strength of the Abyss adds +2 more to STR
16: {DDB}, Focused Study - Skill Focus (pick a useful skill with 10+ ranks)
17: {DDB}
18: {DDB}
19: {DDB}, Strength of the Abyss adds +2 more to STR

All the instances of {DDB} just mean that you build for Dazzling Display. Keep your Intimidate ranks maxed out. There are many feat options available, from performance combat to (my personal favorite) the Deadly Stroke. I also like to take Improved Unarmed Strike, and Weapon Focus - Unarmed Strike, so when the Monk and Brawler brags about how awesome they are naked, I can Intimidate them and then beat their CON away the next round. You could instead use your flaming demon claws if you like being flashy. You can also pick Demon Resistances (electrical resist 10, and +4 vs poison) which isn't bad for a feat. Especially if you have a friendly party member who likes using electrical damage spells and you want to be fighting away in the thick of that zappy mess.
What I like most about this is that the Charisma investment looks like a suboptimal obsession with Intimidate... until level 11. Then the muscles start a-bulging. And again at levels 15 and 19, the muscles get an additional +2. So investing Charisma to 15 ends up adding +2, 4, then 6 to Strength... it's the long game, but it's great fun. Especially if you also build for strength at the start, and drop your Human bonus into Strength as well.

Next is...
The Ghoulish Grave Ganker
## Ingredients ##
1 Human, with the Focused Study racial trait.
1 Class with Sneak Attack class feature. As you may suspect I would use a vanilla Rogue for the lulz
1 Starting ability score array with Charisma score of 13 or higher.

## Recipe ##
1: Focused Study - Skill Focus (Stealth)
2:
3: Eldritch Heritage - Ghoul Bloodline
...

and that's all you need!

Monster Codex wrote:
Ghoulish Claws (Su) : Starting at 1st level, you can grow claws as a free action. These claws are treated as natural weapons, allowing you to make two claw attacks as a full attack using your full base attack bonus. Each of these attacks deals 1d4 points of damage + your Strength modifier (1d3 if you are Small). At 5th level, creatures damaged with your claw attack are paralyzed for 1 round, as the ghoul ability (Fortitude negates). At 7th level, the duration of the paralysis increases to 1d4+1 rounds, and the claws are considered magic weapons for the purpose of overcoming DR. You can use your claws for a number of rounds per day equal to 3 + your Charisma modifier. These rounds do not need to be consecutive.

Just add 2 to all the levels there (as Eldritch Heritage makes you as a sorcerer of 2 levels lower)... So at level 7 you can paralyze for 1 round, and at level 9 your paralysis becomes 1d4+1 rounds.

Paralyzed + Sneak Attack = Deliciously effective Coup De Grace.
Plus Skill focus (stealth) isn't exactly a bad thing to have on a ganker anyway...

Anyone else got some juicy ones?

Sovereign Court

Mythic eldritch heritage is the best cheese.


1 person marked this as a favorite.

Orc works better than Demon for the first one. You take the trait Community Minded so the first ability works on you for when you need it to, then get the same STR bonus as the demon bloodline and with the final feat you get to super enlarge yourself.

Otherwise, fey bloodline+slayer is fantastic if you can work with the stats. First you get laughing touch, which is a nice no-save debuff to apply before retreating (assuming you are an archer of course) and then you get greater invisibility+ranged sneak attacks for later levels. Have fun murdering everything in sight. Also works for melee slayers, and all sorts of rogues. Sadly not for ninja's as they are better off with invisible blade. Protean or Ectoplasm heritage is nice for anyone with room for it, as you can never have enough tanglefoot bags.


1 person marked this as a favorite.

I wouldn't call any of this cheese (thank goodness). The first example is just good use of EH. The second may not be as good. Ghouls have a DC-13 for their claws. Who is failing a DC-13 at lvl 9?


Bladelock wrote:
Ghouls have a DC-13 for their claws. Who is failing a DC-13 at lvl 9?

DC 13?

Paralysis as a ghoul is the same as general paralysis. Here is the link directly from the Ghoul entry in the PRD:
Paizo PRD wrote:
Paralysis (Ex or Su) This special attack renders the victim immobile. Paralyzed creatures cannot move, speak, or take any physical actions. The creature is rooted to the spot, frozen and helpless. Paralysis works on the body, and a character can usually resist it with a Fortitude saving throw (DC 10 + 1/2 paralyzing creature's racial HD + paralyzing creature's Con modifier; the DC is given in the creature's description). Unlike hold person and similar effects, a paralysis effect does not allow a new save each round. A winged creature flying in the air at the time that it is paralyzed cannot flap its wings and falls. A swimmer can't swim and may drown. The duration of the paralysis varies and is included in the creature's description.

DC 10 + 1/2HD + CON bonus

It scales with level.

Grand Lodge

Nope, you missed something Malignor. It says racial hit die, not hit die. PC races don't have hit die; they get their hit die from classes.

So the DC is going to be 10 + your CON mod.

Sovereign Court

Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber, Companion, Roleplaying Game Subscriber; Pathfinder Battles Case Subscriber; Pathfinder Deluxe Comics Subscriber

I would use the DC for the sorcerer's bloodline powers, myself.


Kalindlara wrote:
I would use the DC for the sorcerer's bloodline powers, myself.

...and that would be a very sensible decision, however it would still be a houserule.

Sovereign Court

The ghoul bloodline came out in Monster Codex under Ghouls from what I remember.

It works well for ghouls since undead uses their charisma = con for hp and at the same time for sorcerer.


I was promised cheese. Get on with the intent breaking!


Well it's not super cheesy, but I thought of a way to enhance

The Demonically Dazzling Displayer
## Ingredients ##
1 Human, with the Focused Study racial trait.
1 Fighter - any will do, but I prefer Vanilla because of the dramatic contrast with the finished product.
1 Starting ability score array with Charisma score of 13 or higher.

## Recipe ##
1: Focused Study - Skill Focus (Intimidate), Weapon Focus 1, Dazzling Display
2: {DDB}
3: {DDB}
4: {DDB}, +1 Charisma if CHA < 14
5: {DDB}
6: {DDB}
7: {DDB}
8: {DDB}, Focused Study - Skill Focus (Know Planes), +1 Charisma if CHA < 15
9: Eldritch Heritage - Abyssal Bloodline (claws)
10: {DDB}
11: Improved Eldritch Heritage - Abyssal Bloodline (Strength of the Abyss; +2 STR)
12: {DDB}
13: {DDB}
14: {DDB}
15: {DDB}
16: {DDB}, Focused Study - Skill Focus Perform Oratory
17: {DDB}, Eldritch Heritage - Imperious Bloodline (student of Humanity)
18: {DDB}
19: {DDB}, Improved Eldritch Heritage - Imperious Bloodline (take your best shot)

PRD wrote:

Take Your Best Shot (Su): At 9th level, if you are targeted by a harmful spell, spell-like ability, or supernatural ability and suffer no harm from it, whether because of a successful saving throw, spell resistance, the attack missing, or some other protection, as an immediate action you can make an Intimidate check to demoralize the creature that produced the effect, but only if the creature that used the harmful effect is within 30 feet and can clearly see and hear you.

At 13th level, you can use this ability after succeeding at a saving throw to reduce the effects of an attack (if no save is allowed, you cannot use this ability).

Since it's the Dazzling Display build (such as Shatter Defenses and Deadly Stroke), it's nice to get some swift demoralizing.


2 people marked this as a favorite.

If you really want cheese... I offer you the POd.

"Poison Overdose"
1 lvl monk
10lvls of Alchemist Eldritch Poisoner
Feat: Eldritch Heritage (Serpentine Bloodline)
Discovery: Celestial Poison
Feat: FCT (Bite)
lvl 13 Feat: FCT (sting)

Flurry with your poison bite, allowing you to hit target 3 times per round with 1d4 con. Then poison them for 1d6 con per round from E.Poisoner. Doing 2 to 10 con per round.

At lvl 14 Monstrous P III for additional 1d6 con = 3 to 16 con per round.

Celestial Poison lets you poison outsiders and undead.


Magnificent.


"Control Stick"
2 lvl Monk
11 lvl Magus(Kensai) MaxInt&Dex (Wpn of Choice: 7 branched sword)(staff is main weapon)
Arcana: Maneuver Mastery
Arcana: Accurate Strike
Feat: Tripping Twirl
Feat: Combat Reflexes
Feat: Vicious Stomp
Feat:Eldritch Heritage (Aberration)
Feat:Improved Eldritch Heritage (Aberration)
Spell: Long arm

By lvl 13 everything within a 35ft diameter of this character that moves is getting hit 2 times (3 if they try to stand), and are forced to crawl through the combat.

VS single targets make target flat footed and at lvl 15 add int to damage as well.

Scarab Sages

3 people marked this as a favorite.

For a minute there I was honestly hoping this thread was going to talk about Bloodline Powers like "Hard Cheddar's Toughness," "Spicy Nacho Beam," "Casu Marzu Swarm," and "A Bit Runnier Than You Like."


Finally some good ones!
I know mine are rather amateur, so I was hoping to see what can be done.

Silver Crusade RPG Superstar 2014 Top 16

Bladelock wrote:

If you really want cheese... I offer you the POd.

"Poison Overdose"
1 lvl monk
10lvls of Alchemist Eldritch Poisoner
Feat: Eldritch Heritage (Serpentine Bloodline)
Discovery: Celestial Poison
Feat: FCT (Bite)
lvl 13 Feat: FCT (sting)

Flurry with your poison bite, allowing you to hit target 3 times per round with 1d4 con. Then poison them for 1d6 con per round from E.Poisoner. Doing 2 to 10 con per round.

At lvl 14 Monstrous P III for additional 1d6 con = 3 to 16 con per round.

Celestial Poison lets you poison outsiders and undead.

I'm in love with this one. Wish I had found it before going so far into Naga Aspirant Druid with my Nagaji PFS character. Gonna need to build this one out for sure.


Just be kind players.

It is insanely easy to throw table balance out of wack, even more so if you add some focused magic items to the party. Only whip this stuff out at powered up tables.

I have several more but I think this is enough cheese from me for one thread :)


Cheese is unintended methods and interactions, not necessarily effective ones.


Haywire build generator wrote:
Cheese is unintended methods and interactions, not necessarily effective ones.

Hrm.

I don't think I have ever heard an ineffective game application called "cheese."


I've seen it primarily for video game challenges. Sometimes the way you think of approaching a problem is pretty clearly not the way the devs wanted you to approach it (such as if you're attempting glitches), and it'd probably be way harder than the intended method, if you only knew what the intended method was.

Silver Crusade RPG Superstar 2014 Top 16

Bladelock wrote:

If you really want cheese... I offer you the POd.

"Poison Overdose"
1 lvl monk
10lvls of Alchemist Eldritch Poisoner
Feat: Eldritch Heritage (Serpentine Bloodline)
Discovery: Celestial Poison
Feat: FCT (Bite)
lvl 13 Feat: FCT (sting)

Flurry with your poison bite, allowing you to hit target 3 times per round with 1d4 con. Then poison them for 1d6 con per round from E.Poisoner. Doing 2 to 10 con per round.

At lvl 14 Monstrous P III for additional 1d6 con = 3 to 16 con per round.

Celestial Poison lets you poison outsiders and undead.

Just curious how the action economy works for this one? Is there any way to create your Arcanotoxin, apply it to your teeth or another weapon, and flurry with your teeth all in the same round? It seems as if making and applying the Arcanotoxin at best is going to be a Move action, leaving you with only a single attack as opposed to a flurry.

Also, where are you getting the sting attack from? is that from Monstrous Physique?


By lvl 14 you will have 3 attacks (4 with haste) with your flurry. 4(5) at 15. You can flurry with both your bite and your sting, or use a Toxic of Injecting monk weapon, all in the same round. Once a save is failed, move to the next poison attack. If you need more than the injection weapon can hold, Alchemist can apply poison as a swift action.

Yes, the sting will come from Monstrous P. III. That is when poison becomes an option.

Anything with a low fort (and con) will have all 3 poisons on them in the first round. Tougher fort saves may take 2 or 3 rounds. However each missed save makes the next poison easier to land.

Takes a while for all this to come online, but you are an int/con based alchemist. You will be fine until then.


Haywire build generator wrote:
Cheese is unintended methods and interactions, not necessarily effective ones.

I guess the cheesy part is that you bite multiple times with one round of the bloodline power. I can't tell if that was foreseen ahead of time but it is called out in FCT.

Grand Lodge

Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber, Campaign Setting, Card Game, Cards, Class Deck, Companion, Modules, Roleplaying Game, Tales Subscriber; Pathfinder Battles Case Subscriber; Pathfinder Deluxe Comics Subscriber

for the poison cheese, don't forget that poison don't stack for damage !

they only increase DC & duration.
so if you claw 5x in the same round, you'll still only inflict 1D4 ability dama/Round


Poisoning as a shtick works best against multiple targets. You hit a target per round with as many doses as you can. If your DC is good enough, they will die or go unconscious ... eventually, one by one. While the poison is eating away at them, your buddies are hopefully targeting whatever ability score your poison does. Dex in many ways is ideal (lowers AC and Reflex saves) as it plays to almost everyone's strengths. Dex and Con are pretty much the super sweet spot.

The best poisons are ones that either make them take a nap immediately or otherwise disable the target out of the gate. Not sure if arcanotoxins have that capacity.

Silver Crusade

Vrischika111 wrote:

for the poison cheese, don't forget that poison don't stack for damage !

they only increase DC & duration.
so if you claw 5x in the same round, you'll still only inflict 1D4 ability dama/Round

I think the build is (eventually) using three separate poisons in a full attack routine: bite, weapon, and sting.


Vrischika111 wrote:

for the poison cheese, don't forget that poison don't stack for damage !

they only increase DC & duration.
so if you claw 5x in the same round, you'll still only inflict 1D4 ability dama/Round

Against tough save targets it sometimes takes more than one hit to get the poison to land and prevent them from recovering, so it may take 2 rounds to fully poison them. Against a soft target 1 round is all you need to apply all 3 poisons.


Bladelock wrote:
Kalindlara wrote:
I would use the DC for the sorcerer's bloodline powers, myself.
...and that would be a very sensible decision, however it would still be a houserule.

Cool, it looks like the Ghoul ability is an exception to the normal rule of bloodline DCs being 10+ 1/2 lvl + Cha. The claws power specifically calls out as per the ghoul ability instead to the typically listed DC calculation. It even allows Ghoul sorcerers to stack their sorcerer level on top of their racial HD.


Maybe not cheese, but Eldritch Heritage (Arcane) + a Valet familiar is great on a divine caster. Familiar can deliver all sorts of touch spells and then return with special deliver touch spells ability and return the the caster in the same round to rinse and repeat. Made good use of Heal, Breath of Life, Curse, and Plane Shift like this.


What does "FCT" mean? (from the poisoner build specs)


feral combat training (a feat for using unarmed stuff with natural attacks)

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