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New monk class i have built, called the Unbound Monk


Suggestions/House Rules/Homebrew

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Lady-J wrote:
wintersrage wrote:
Lady-J wrote:
wintersrage wrote:
I think i have developed this class as far as i can now, i would like a way to have dimensional agility earlier, but i don't think there are any other powers that would work with the feat.
since your going into home brew anyway make a 1st level power that is a very limited dimention dooresk spell, also side note 4th level casters get their spells starting at 4th level instead of at level 1 just thought i would give you a heads up

I understand your reasoning about the spells at level 4 instead of level 1 but i wanted them to be a full manifester and if i was to give them their powers at level 4 they would be a manifester of 17th level, i want to to be able to gain the full benefits of spells, like metaphysical weapon and the like.

I don't see how i could justify making them a full caster and only starting their spells at level 4.

Anyhow, i took a page from 5th edition and gave the class their powers at 1st level even though they are only considered to be a half caster, when determining how their spells stack for multi-casting, of in this case multi manifester.

I know this is not 5th edition, but it was the only reason i could justify giving them psionic powers at 1st level.

blood rager doesnt get spells till 4th level but gets a caster level per bloodrager level only ranger and paladin specify that they get caster level of level -3 at 4th level if you want them to be full levels in casting just dont put in the level -3 caster level part

I have fixed it to be more like the blood rager.


i also personally think they should just update the paladin and ranger and just remove the level -3 caster levels bit


Lady-J wrote:
i also personally think they should just update the paladin and ranger and just remove the level -3 caster levels bit

I completely agree.

Also what do you think of the class now.


wintersrage wrote:
Lady-J wrote:
i also personally think they should just update the paladin and ranger and just remove the level -3 caster levels bit

I completely agree.

Also what do you think of the class now.

while im still unfaliliar with psyonics it looks pretty good and probably ready for play testing


Lady-J wrote:
wintersrage wrote:
Lady-J wrote:
i also personally think they should just update the paladin and ranger and just remove the level -3 caster levels bit

I completely agree.

Also what do you think of the class now.

while im still unfaliliar with psyonics it looks pretty good and probably ready for play testing

Do you think allowing this class to add wisdom modifier to attack rolls and damage while using Flurry of blows is to Powerful?


wintersrage wrote:
Lady-J wrote:
wintersrage wrote:
Lady-J wrote:
i also personally think they should just update the paladin and ranger and just remove the level -3 caster levels bit

I completely agree.

Also what do you think of the class now.

while im still unfaliliar with psyonics it looks pretty good and probably ready for play testing
Do you think allowing this class to add wisdom modifier to attack rolls and damage while using Flurry of blows is to Powerful?

depends how you want to do it if its a power that allows you for one round to add wis to hit and damage should be manageable if its a permanent replacement for using wis instead of str you may need to find something to trade out


Lady-J wrote:
wintersrage wrote:
Lady-J wrote:
wintersrage wrote:
Lady-J wrote:
i also personally think they should just update the paladin and ranger and just remove the level -3 caster levels bit

I completely agree.

Also what do you think of the class now.

while im still unfaliliar with psyonics it looks pretty good and probably ready for play testing
Do you think allowing this class to add wisdom modifier to attack rolls and damage while using Flurry of blows is to Powerful?
depends how you want to do it if its a power that allows you for one round to add wis to hit and damage should be manageable if its a permanent replacement for using wis instead of str you may need to find something to trade out

Rogues get Dex to attack rolls and damage with 3 weapons, I would only get it during a flurry of blows. I should say that is the pathfinder unbound d rogue.


wintersrage wrote:
Lady-J wrote:
wintersrage wrote:
Lady-J wrote:
wintersrage wrote:
Lady-J wrote:
i also personally think they should just update the paladin and ranger and just remove the level -3 caster levels bit

I completely agree.

Also what do you think of the class now.

while im still unfaliliar with psyonics it looks pretty good and probably ready for play testing
Do you think allowing this class to add wisdom modifier to attack rolls and damage while using Flurry of blows is to Powerful?
depends how you want to do it if its a power that allows you for one round to add wis to hit and damage should be manageable if its a permanent replacement for using wis instead of str you may need to find something to trade out
Rogues get Dex to attack rolls and damage with 3 weapons, I would only get it during a flurry of blows. I should say that is the pathfinder unbound d rogue.

personally i think using str to hit and damage would be better with a power that lets you add wisdom ontop of str similar to a short duration smite


Lady-J wrote:
wintersrage wrote:
Lady-J wrote:
wintersrage wrote:
Lady-J wrote:
wintersrage wrote:
Lady-J wrote:
i also personally think they should just update the paladin and ranger and just remove the level -3 caster levels bit

I completely agree.

Also what do you think of the class now.

while im still unfaliliar with psyonics it looks pretty good and probably ready for play testing
Do you think allowing this class to add wisdom modifier to attack rolls and damage while using Flurry of blows is to Powerful?
depends how you want to do it if its a power that allows you for one round to add wis to hit and damage should be manageable if its a permanent replacement for using wis instead of str you may need to find something to trade out
Rogues get Dex to attack rolls and damage with 3 weapons, I would only get it during a flurry of blows. I should say that is the pathfinder unbound d rogue.
personally i think using str to hit and damage would be better with a power that lets you add wisdom ontop of str similar to a short duration smite

I could make a power called intuit action or something like that costing 1 power points as an immidate action you do you can add your Wisdom modifier to hit and damage for a number or rounds equal to your level, this is in addition to your strength.

How does that sound.


wintersrage wrote:
Lady-J wrote:
wintersrage wrote:
Lady-J wrote:
wintersrage wrote:
Lady-J wrote:
wintersrage wrote:
Lady-J wrote:
i also personally think they should just update the paladin and ranger and just remove the level -3 caster levels bit

I completely agree.

Also what do you think of the class now.

while im still unfaliliar with psyonics it looks pretty good and probably ready for play testing
Do you think allowing this class to add wisdom modifier to attack rolls and damage while using Flurry of blows is to Powerful?
depends how you want to do it if its a power that allows you for one round to add wis to hit and damage should be manageable if its a permanent replacement for using wis instead of str you may need to find something to trade out
Rogues get Dex to attack rolls and damage with 3 weapons, I would only get it during a flurry of blows. I should say that is the pathfinder unbound d rogue.
personally i think using str to hit and damage would be better with a power that lets you add wisdom ontop of str similar to a short duration smite

I could make a power called intuit action or something like that costing 1 power points as an immidate action you do you can add your Wisdom modifier to hit and damage for a number or rounds equal to your level, this is in addition to your strength.

How does that sound.

Here is the power

Intuition:

Intuition
Psychometabolism
Level: Unbound Monk 1
Display: visual
Manifesting Time: 1 imiditate action
Target: You
Duration: 1 round per level
Power Points: 1
Saving Throw: Will harmless, Power Resistance: no
You surround your hands in pure psionic ectoplasm. You are hitting the target with your combined physical and mental might. This allows you to add your Wisdom bonus to Attack rolls and Damage rolls as well as your strength.
Augment: If you spend 3 power points the power last for 1 minute per level.
if you spend 5 power points the power last for 10 minutes per level.
if you spend 7 power points the power lasts for 1 hour per level.
if you spend 13 power points this power lasts for 24 hours.


think it should be a swift action instead and make it a flat 3 or 5 power point cost but keep the duration at 2 rounds per level


Lady-J wrote:
think it should be a swift action instead and make it a flat 3 or 5 power point cost but keep the duration at 2 rounds per level

That would make it a second level power, i want to be able to use is as early, i could just build it into unarmed strike, that says if you spend 3 power points you can add your wisdom bonus as well as strength to hit and damage for 2 round per level.

I am going to have to change it so you gain power points for high ability score at level 1 though. but you gain no actual power points from the class.

Actually how about a flat 1 point and make it so it lasts 1 minute flat, no increase over level, just 1 minute.


As a swift action an unbound monk can spend 1 power point to add their wisdom modifier to attack rolls and damage rolls in addition to strength for 1 minute.


post the new one so i can take a look


1 person marked this as a favorite.
Lady-J wrote:
post the new one so i can take a look

I made it part of unarmed strike, it is the last line of unarmed strike, i will like the class again.

I also gave him 1 power point at first through third levels as he will neeed power points to activate the ability.

Unbound Monk


EDIT: I wrote comments on the wrong version of the document.


Ciaran Barnes wrote:
EDIT: I wrote comments on the wrong version of the document.

That's o'kay what was your comment?


Mostly comments on stuff that is gone from the newest version. I will try again this weekend.


Ciaran Barnes wrote:
Mostly comments on stuff that is gone from the newest version. I will try again this weekend.

Ok and thanks for the input


1 person marked this as a favorite.

I'm looking at the section with for skill points. Is this meant to be a Pathfinder class?


Ciaran Barnes wrote:
I'm looking at the section with for skill points. Is this meant to be a Pathfinder class?

Yes it i, if you read the Psionics unchained book, you will notice Autohypnosis, and Knowledge psionics, this is a book is written by Dreamscarred press for pathfinder.


1 person marked this as a favorite.

"Skill Points at 1st Level: (4 + Int modifier) × 4."

You've also left Concentration as a skill. Pathdinfer did away with that.


1 person marked this as a favorite.
Ciaran Barnes wrote:

"Skill Points at 1st Level: (4 + Int modifier) × 4."

You've also left Concentration as a skill. Pathdinfer did away with that.

I will fix that.


1 person marked this as a favorite.

That is fixed.


Alignment
Its really not a big deal at all, because I'd rather have minimal alignment restrictions in the game, but I think that all monks in the past have had a lawful alignment requirement.

Skills
Jump and Search are not skills in the Pathfinder system. There is no need to say how many skill points are given at 1st level, and then again at each additional level. Take a look at any class in a Paizo book. There is a format that is used on every class. See if you can follow it. The number of class skills you have is a little thin. I think adding one Charisma-based skill and one more Knowledge skill would be a good thing.

Powers Known
The class feature description does not match what appears on the table. One say you get a power each level, the other says that you get your first two powers at 4th level.

Ascetic's Path
Why is a bonus class skill listed here instead of in the class skills? All unbound monks gain it at 1st level after all. I don't see the purpose of putting three full fledged class features as a subset of this one class feature. Improved Unarmed Strike, Flurry of Blows, and Sixth Sense are important enough that they should just be 1st level class features and appear on the table. The only reason I can think of to not do this is if there is some other path to follow.

Expanded Path
Not only have you squeezed three features into one, but you there is another 3rd level feature that is squeezed into Ascetic's Path.

Martial Power
I'm unclear how this works because it's vague, but if it works the way it appears to then at 6th level I can use one full-round action to make three attacks and to use three psionic powers. Was that your intent? Seems too good.

I feel like you have crammed an awful lot into the class. This was present in your previous drafts, but not the class table shows fewer of them. My opinion is that you should put everything on the table so you can see how much is there, and then go through and remove some of the less important stuff.


Ciaran Barnes wrote:

Alignment

Its really not a big deal at all, because I'd rather have minimal alignment restrictions in the game, but I think that all monks in the past have had a lawful alignment requirement.

Skills
Jump and Search are not skills in the Pathfinder system. There is no need to say how many skill points are given at 1st level, and then again at each additional level. Take a look at any class in a Paizo book. There is a format that is used on every class. See if you can follow it. The number of class skills you have is a little thin. I think adding one Charisma-based skill and one more Knowledge skill would be a good thing.

Powers Known
The class feature description does not match what appears on the table. One say you get a power each level, the other says that you get your first two powers at 4th level.

Ascetic's Path
Why is a bonus class skill listed here instead of in the class skills? All unbound monks gain it at 1st level after all. I don't see the purpose of putting three full fledged class features as a subset of this one class feature. Improved Unarmed Strike, Flurry of Blows, and Sixth Sense are important enough that they should just be 1st level class features and appear on the table. The only reason I can think of to not do this is if there is some other path to follow.

Expanded Path
Not only have you squeezed three features into one, but you there is another 3rd level feature that is squeezed into Ascetic's Path.

Martial Power
I'm unclear how this works because it's vague, but if it works the way it appears to then at 6th level I can use one full-round action to make three attacks and to use three psionic powers. Was that your intent? Seems too good.

I feel like you have crammed an awful lot into the class. This was present in your previous drafts, but not the class table shows fewer of them. My opinion is that you should put everything on the table so you can see how much is there, and then go through and remove some of the less important stuff.

alignment restrictions are garbage only time it should be a thing is if something has to be with in x of the deity they worship else there should be no alignment restrictions


Ciaran Barnes wrote:

Alignment

Its really not a big deal at all, because I'd rather have minimal alignment restrictions in the game, but I think that all monks in the past have had a lawful alignment requirement.

Skills
Jump and Search are not skills in the Pathfinder system. There is no need to say how many skill points are given at 1st level, and then again at each additional level. Take a look at any class in a Paizo book. There is a format that is used on every class. See if you can follow it. The number of class skills you have is a little thin. I think adding one Charisma-based skill and one more Knowledge skill would be a good thing.

Powers Known
The class feature description does not match what appears on the table. One say you get a power each level, the other says that you get your first two powers at 4th level.

Ascetic's Path
Why is a bonus class skill listed here instead of in the class skills? All unbound monks gain it at 1st level after all. I don't see the purpose of putting three full fledged class features as a subset of this one class feature. Improved Unarmed Strike, Flurry of Blows, and Sixth Sense are important enough that they should just be 1st level class features and appear on the table. The only reason I can think of to not do this is if there is some other path to follow.

Expanded Path
Not only have you squeezed three features into one, but you there is another 3rd level feature that is squeezed into Ascetic's Path.

Martial Power
I'm unclear how this works because it's vague, but if it works the way it appears to then at 6th level I can use one full-round action to make three attacks and to use three psionic powers. Was that your intent? Seems too good.

I feel like you have crammed an awful lot into the class. This was present in your previous drafts, but not the class table shows fewer of them. My opinion is that you should put everything on the table so you can see how much is there, and then go through and remove some of the less important stuff.

I did it that way so that the class chart would fit one the page and be readable, as well you might think I was trying to hide some of the abilities but I was not.

I did fix the other issues you noticed.

The martial Power ability was only supposed to be used once per turn, I think I might create a limited list of powers it will work with as well.

Looking at monk he gains all these abilities of the ascetic path at first level, expanded Path on the other hand he gains 1 additional power, it just gives him some flexibility in if he wants an armor bonus or dodge bonus to AC, I'm going to change it from a competence bonus to armor bonus.


1 person marked this as a favorite.

This is not a justification for the class I just want to let you know a monk gets 33 different abilities as he levels up, the unbound monk get 26 that is taking into account of his psionic casting ability.


I don't know how powerful the psionics are, but I do know that spellcasting is more than just a class feature. Its more like getting a new class feature every 2-3 levels. Its why the wizard and cleric have a bunch of dead levels. I understand that the unbound monk is more like a spontaneous caster than a prepared caster, but these powers should still be seen as a series of class features rather than just one.

Maybe Martial Power should work like the magus's spell combat?

And Athletics is not a skill in Pathfinder.


Ciaran Barnes wrote:
And Athletics is not a skill in Pathfinder.

...Unless you're using the Grouped Skills rules from Pathfinder Unchained.


Ciaran Barnes wrote:

I don't know how powerful the psionics are, but I do know that spellcasting is more than just a class feature. Its more like getting a new class feature every 2-3 levels. Its why the wizard and cleric have a bunch of dead levels. I understand that the unbound monk is more like a spontaneous caster than a prepared caster, but these powers should still be seen as a series of class features rather than just one.

Maybe Martial Power should work like the magus's spell combat?

And Athletics is not a skill in Pathfinder.

I like the idea of the spell combat, I will incorporate it into the class in place of what I have for the martial Power.


1 person marked this as a favorite.
Ciaran Barnes wrote:

I don't know how powerful the psionics are, but I do know that spellcasting is more than just a class feature. Its more like getting a new class feature every 2-3 levels. Its why the wizard and cleric have a bunch of dead levels. I understand that the unbound monk is more like a spontaneous caster than a prepared caster, but these powers should still be seen as a series of class features rather than just one.

Maybe Martial Power should work like the magus's spell combat?

And Athletics is not a skill in Pathfinder.

How is this and feel free to change any of the wording for it to make more sense, but please post the changes here.

Martial Power:
Martial Power(Su): At 6st level, unbound monk learns to manifest psionic powers and make unarmed strikes at the same time. This functions much like his flurry of blows, but one of his unarmed strikes can be made with the psionic power. To use this ability, the unbound monk must have one hand free (even if the spell being cast does not have somatic components), while make an unarmed strike with his other attacks. As a full-round action, he can make all of his attacks with his unarmed strike and can also manifest any power from the unbound monks psionic power list with a manifest time of 1 standard action (any attack roll made as part of this spell uses the base attack of the unarmed strike it is replacing as part of the flurry of blows). If he manifest this power defensively, he can decide to take an additional penalty on his attack rolls, up to his wisdom bonus, and add the same amount as a circumstance bonus on his concentration check. If the check fails, the power is wasted, but the attacks still take the penalty. An unbound monk can choose to manifest the power first or make the weapon attacks first, but if he has more than one attack, he cannot cast the spell between weapon attacks.


In the case of athletics I think you mean consolidated skills. But your list of class skills is not using consolidated or grouped skills. You have a mixture. Why would someone put skill points into both swim and athletics? If you are writing a class then you should use the standard skills. Consolidated and group skills are alternate rules.

The psionic spell combat looks fine, but some of the language is clunky.


1 person marked this as a favorite.
Ciaran Barnes wrote:

In the case of athletics I think you mean consolidated skills. But your list of class skills is not using consolidated or grouped skills. You have a mixture. Why would someone put skill points into both swim and athletics? If you are writing a class then you should use the standard skills. Consolidated and group skills are alternate rules.

The psionic spell combat looks fine, but some of the language is clunky.

How does it look now.

Martial Power:
Martial Power(Su): At 6st level, unbound monk learns to manifest psionic powers and make unarmed strikes at the same time. This functions much like his flurry of blows, but one of his unarmed strikes can be made with the psionic power. To use this ability, the unbound monk must have one hand free (even if the power being manifested does not have somatic components), while he makes an unarmed strike with his other attacks. As a full-round action, he can make all of his attacks with his unarmed strike and can also manifest any power from the unbound monks psionic power list with a manifest time of 1 standard action (any attack roll made as part of this power uses his highest base attack and made as part of the flurry of blows). If he manifest this power defensively, he can decide to take an additional penalty on his attack rolls, up to his wisdom bonus, and add the same amount as a circumstance bonus on his concentration check. If the check fails, the power is wasted, but the attacks still take the penalty. An unbound monk can choose to manifest the power first or make the weapon attacks first, but if he has more than one attack, he cannot cast the spell between weapon attacks.


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I fixed the skills as well.


1 person marked this as a favorite.
Ciaran Barnes wrote:

In the case of athletics I think you mean consolidated skills. But your list of class skills is not using consolidated or grouped skills. You have a mixture. Why would someone put skill points into both swim and athletics? If you are writing a class then you should use the standard skills. Consolidated and group skills are alternate rules.

The psionic spell combat looks fine, but some of the language is clunky.

Argh, of course I'd get them mixed up. At least they both bundle skills into somewhat sensible packages. :/


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Here is a new link for the newest updates.

I made it so you can make suggestions directly in the document.

I also changed the name of the class to the Ascetic Psychic, it made sense based on the Ascetic path they get at first level.

Ascetic Psychic


Do you guys think the class is balanced enough, or does it require more balancing.

By the way it is the psionic rules from psionic unleashed book from dreamscared press.


What is the bonus type for sixth sense?


Ciaran Barnes wrote:
What is the bonus type for sixth sense?

Well I went off of the monk wisdom bonus to ac and it is untyped, I could make it luck bonus or maybe dodge bonus, but just based off of monk it is untyped.


Ciaran Barnes wrote:
What is the bonus type for sixth sense?

I just made it an insight bonus to ac as insight makes sense for sixth sense.


it should remain untyped so it wont stack with wis to ac from a normal monk


Lady-J wrote:
it should remain untyped so it wont stack with wis to ac from a normal monk

I changed it back to untyped.


So 6th sense applies to touch attacks and when he is flanked? That needs to be defined better. Does it apply to any other attacks? What if he is immobilized or helpless? Is armor a factor?


Ciaran Barnes wrote:
So 6th sense applies to touch attacks and when he is flanked? That needs to be defined better. Does it apply to any other attacks? What if he is immobilized or helpless? Is armor a factor?

How does Sixth sense look now.


Ciaran Barnes wrote:
So 6th sense applies to touch attacks and when he is flanked? That needs to be defined better. Does it apply to any other attacks? What if he is immobilized or helpless? Is armor a factor?

Sorry for wording it that way, i was tired when i wrote it, but it should make more sense now.


What you have now:
Sixth Sense (Ex): When unarmored and unencumbered, an ascetic psychic adds his Wisdom bonus (if any) to his AC and CMD in addition to his dexterity.

This bonus to AC apply even against touch attacks or when the monk is flat-footed. She loses these bonuses when she is immobilized or helpless, when she wears any armor, when she carries a shield, or when she carries a medium or heavy load. Also the Ascetic psychic needs to maintain psionic focus for this bonus to be applied.

***

Your document have a lot of blank lines in between sentences, as though they are new paragraphs. In many cases I find it distracting. In the case of Sixth Sense, I see no reason for the blank line. The original monk feature has a blank line, but then again the monk feature has two more sentences.


Ciaran Barnes wrote:

What you have now:

Sixth Sense (Ex): When unarmored and unencumbered, an ascetic psychic adds his Wisdom bonus (if any) to his AC and CMD in addition to his dexterity.

This bonus to AC apply even against touch attacks or when the monk is flat-footed. She loses these bonuses when she is immobilized or helpless, when she wears any armor, when she carries a shield, or when she carries a medium or heavy load. Also the Ascetic psychic needs to maintain psionic focus for this bonus to be applied.

***

Your document have a lot of blank lines in between sentences, as though they are new paragraphs. In many cases I find it distracting. In the case of Sixth Sense, I see no reason for the blank line. The original monk feature has a blank line, but then again the monk feature has two more sentences.

Should I just remove all the blank lines, I think if I did it would make it look jumbled. I will remove the blank lines and see what it looks like.


Ciaran Barnes wrote:

What you have now:

Sixth Sense (Ex): When unarmored and unencumbered, an ascetic psychic adds his Wisdom bonus (if any) to his AC and CMD in addition to his dexterity.

This bonus to AC apply even against touch attacks or when the monk is flat-footed. She loses these bonuses when she is immobilized or helpless, when she wears any armor, when she carries a shield, or when she carries a medium or heavy load. Also the Ascetic psychic needs to maintain psionic focus for this bonus to be applied.

***

Your document have a lot of blank lines in between sentences, as though they are new paragraphs. In many cases I find it distracting. In the case of Sixth Sense, I see no reason for the blank line. The original monk feature has a blank line, but then again the monk feature has two more sentences.

I have removed all the blank lines in the same ability, does it read better now.


Looks better. There is a weird space in the middle of unarmed strike.

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