Thor: Ragnarok trailer


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Dolph’s Punisher was pretty good too, in a bad 80s movie kind of way.


Tank girl was another early comic movie. It gets a lot of crap but I love that movie.


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Blade sort of directly preceded the current boom in Super Hero movies, unlike Howard the Duck or Dolph Punisher.


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MMCJawa wrote:
Blade sort of directly preceded the current boom in Super Hero movies, unlike Howard the Duck or Dolph Punisher.

Yeah, there can be real debate about whether Blade started the Comic movie boon or appealed to the horror/vampire crowd more.

Howard on the other hand? I think he hurt the idea of comic movies more than helped them :D

Regardless... Neither Blade nor Howard or really even Dolph's Punisher (which is underrated...) were really 'Superheroes' and the idea that big budgets and big crowds would come out for strictly SUPERHEROES without any of that cross genre stuff going on pretty much started with X-men and Spider-man.


phantom1592 wrote:
MMCJawa wrote:
Blade sort of directly preceded the current boom in Super Hero movies, unlike Howard the Duck or Dolph Punisher.

Yeah, there can be real debate about whether Blade started the Comic movie boon or appealed to the horror/vampire crowd more.

Howard on the other hand? I think he hurt the idea of comic movies more than helped them :D

Regardless... Neither Blade nor Howard or really even Dolph's Punisher (which is underrated...) were really 'Superheroes' and the idea that big budgets and big crowds would come out for strictly SUPERHEROES without any of that cross genre stuff going on pretty much started with X-men and Spider-man.

On the Marvel side, certainly.

Big crowds had come out for both the Reeves' Superman movies in the late 70s/early 80s and the Burton Batman movies in the late 80s/early 90s. Both series went downhill sharply after the first couple, but big crowds did come out for them.

Which is actually pretty much the pattern for the X-Men series and the Spider-man one.


I was going to say, as Jeff said, Superman WAS a Super Hero...just not much of the Marvel side got to the big screen. Batman too.


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phantom1592 wrote:

even Dolph's Punisher (which is underrated...)

...backs away from the clearly demented person posting in the thread...


Anyone see Gaurdians of the Galaxy v2? Ego's Kurt Russell was partly based off the Gardener, another Elder of the Universe. The visuals are precise down to the pose.


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Bill Dunn wrote:
phantom1592 wrote:

even Dolph's Punisher (which is underrated...)

...backs away from the clearly demented person posting in the thread...

Hey, It was a little cheesy, but what movies made back then aren't now days. It was a solid Punisher story that was NOT based entirely around his origin. It was punisher who had racked up a massive body count and had the criminal underworld terrified of him. Then when even WORSE criminals came into town... he took them out too, in order to rescue the innocent civilians.

Pretty much just like the comics. Back in the day, the biggest complaint about that movie... was that he didn't have the skull costume and didn't look like Punisher. Netflix just did the same thing and people love it now.

I've always said that punisher needs to get away from avenging his family. That's a been there/Done that story. Punisher is MORE than just a simple revenge action movie like 80% of all action movies... he's out to kill ALL the criminals. Even the ones who have no idea who or what a Frank Castle was years ago.

I'd love to see a Punisher movie seen from the eyes of the Mob bosses. I'd treat him like a cross between a boogeyman and the terminator. He's coming for you. He knows your secrets. You can't hide... You can't kill him... He has no mercy...

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...and he won't stop until either you or him are dead


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phantom1592 wrote:


I'd love to see a Punisher movie seen from the eyes of the Mob bosses. I'd treat him like a cross between a boogeyman and the terminator. He's coming for you. He knows your secrets. You can't hide... You can't kill him... He has no mercy...

so...John Wick?


Rathendar wrote:
phantom1592 wrote:


I'd love to see a Punisher movie seen from the eyes of the Mob bosses. I'd treat him like a cross between a boogeyman and the terminator. He's coming for you. He knows your secrets. You can't hide... You can't kill him... He has no mercy...

so...John Wick?

I haven't seen the second one yet, but the first one still fell firmly in the 'revenge' category. the people he went after directly hurt him, his family and his dog... much to their dismay.

The key with Punisher, is that Kingpin, Slug, random drug cartel #4, Spider-man... whoever he sets his sights on now are guilty of something and society didn't take of it... so HE will. His family is long dead, and everyone associated with it is long dead... and he's still fighting his war.


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i was just paralleling the 'boogeyman to the underworld'(heck the villain actually specifically calls him that early on.) there's more then revenge at the first half of the second one.

That being said, i see what you are saying with the rest.


All I know is Dolph's Punisher wasn't my favorite.

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phantom1592 wrote:
the biggest complaint about that movie... was that he didn't have the skull costume and didn't look like Punisher. Netflix just did the same thing and people love it now.

So, you haven't watched the Netflix series.


Wick vs. Punisher! Punisher breaks into the hotel to take out someone and thus crosses Wick.


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MannyGoblin wrote:
Wick vs. Punisher! Punisher breaks into the hotel to take out someone and thus crosses Wick.

Punisher blows up car with gangster in it, gangster who just happened to steal a car owned by John wick.


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Hmm I think Frank would take john with a sniper rifle from extra long distance. baring that I'd say John wins up close. 3rd possible scenario Neo shows up stops their bullets and beats both they asses. but is then defeated by time travel by two punk kids trying to be doctor who.


Vidmaster7 wrote:
Hmm I think Frank would take john with a sniper rifle from extra long distance. baring that I'd say John wins up close. 3rd possible scenario Neo shows up stops their bullets and beats both they asses. but is then defeated by time travel by two punk kids trying to be doctor who.

Maybe John sees the error of his ways and retires to a nice little house on the lake.


Knight who says Meh wrote:
Vidmaster7 wrote:
Hmm I think Frank would take john with a sniper rifle from extra long distance. baring that I'd say John wins up close. 3rd possible scenario Neo shows up stops their bullets and beats both they asses. but is then defeated by time travel by two punk kids trying to be doctor who.
Maybe John sees the error of his ways and retires to a nice little house on the lake.

Sounds better then getting a computer jammed in your skull and then have to rely on a cyber dolphin to get it out.

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Frank better not miss and hit the dog.


Shadow Kosh wrote:
phantom1592 wrote:
the biggest complaint about that movie... was that he didn't have the skull costume and didn't look like Punisher. Netflix just did the same thing and people love it now.
So, you haven't watched the Netflix series.

Of course I did. He retires the skull suit in the first episode and... maybe brings it back in the last one. Which is actually a better run than he had in the Daredevil season where he only put it on in the last episode.

There is a LOT of hunting and killing and revenging where he doesn't look like the punisher at all. Same as people complained about Dolph's movie.

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If memory serves he only wore the skull suit if he was actively going into a firefight or the like, because it would draw enemy fire to his chest, which was armored.

The intimidation factor was an added bonus.

If Frank was doing subtle stuff, he'd go as incognito as possible, so he couldn't be picked out from a crowd.

But I don't think Frank and Thor ever really crossed paths, did they?


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They did. kind of. wasn't much of a match. thor is one of the few where i'm like yeah frank can't do anything with that.


Do mundane firearms even do anything to Thor?

Like, I'd fully expect bullets to just pancake on him like Superman.

Comics are weird about heroes being able to take infinite amounts of bludgeoning damage but immediately going down to piercing weapons, though.


Zhangar wrote:

Do mundane firearms even do anything to Thor?

Like, I'd fully expect bullets to just pancake on him like Superman.

Comics are weird about heroes being able to take infinite amounts of bludgeoning damage but immediately going down to piercing weapons, though.

It's a question that's been debated, with no clear answer. In the comics, he's commonly spun Mjolnir to deflect bullets, which suggests he's concerned about being hit by them. I don't recall any scenes of him just standing there and bouncing bullets off his chest like Superman. They're certainly rarer, if they exist.

My take is that they'd probably hurt, but not do the kind of damage they'd do to a normal mortal. I think he's tough and hard to hurt, but not in Superman's class as far as invulnerability goes. (Though both have certainly been shown at various levels over the decades.)

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Zhangar wrote:
Do mundane firearms even do anything to Thor?

He used to spin his hammer to block bullets (and as of the eighties, was, like other Asgardians, 'three times as dense' as human flesh, making him not even as tough as wood), but in the same era, he'd get blasted full on by Celestials, or Thanos, or various other big bads who pack *way* more firepower than any gun ever fired, so it was always a bit wonky.

Safe to say, he's more or less bulletproof these days. Even Loki had bullets bouncing off of him in the first Avengers movie.

Special bullets may break that rule, 'though. The Exterminatrix shot Jane Foster's version of Thor (which should be no more or less bullet-resistant than the Odinson) and managed to break her skin with a special bullet, so I suspect Thor's bullet-proof-edness remains, as always, a function of plot. :)


Indeed. When Thor restarted earlier in the millenium after Ragnarok, the Odinson went to find the other Asgardians and ended up in Africa. He got in the middle of a mess between warring tribes and one group opened up on him with AK's. He stood there, letting the bullets bounce off him (I think one even bounced off his cheek) without saying a word but having that determined grumpy face he gets when annoyed before dealing with the interlopers. So his invulnerability has arguably improved, but I can't argue about plot armor and how it vanishes :)


Y'know... he's also had a few power upgrades too. I think after the Hero Returns of the late 90's he was shot, but can't remember the details.

Since then he's gained Rune powers, beat Ragnarok, gained and lost the Odin-Force a few times... and then the whole unworthy nonsense.

It seems unlikely he wouldn't be bulletproof anymore... but who can say.

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Skurge seemed to think that military rifles have a place in an Asgardian's battle dress.


Chris,

It's only because it's a homage to his ending when Ragnarok came in the comics.

As for Thor Odinson's bulletproof-ness, it's definitely more a plot FIXTURE (IE some that can be changed or removed for the plot) than it is a plot cornerstone (like Superman.)

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It's also fair to point out that the current state of Thor's bullet-resistance may or may not have anything to do with that of 'normal' Asgardians, since he's quite a bit above the curve. (Ditto Loki, for that matter, being technically a giant, not a god, and yet somehow being essentially Asgardian, not giantish in apparent strength, toughness, longevity and appearance...)

[tangent] While it's a ship long since sailed, I'd have much preferred if Asgard had only a couple dozen 'gods,' with their 'can lift 20-40 tons and assorted other super-powers' stuff, and hundreds or even thousands of Einherjar, immortal super-warriors who've spent a thousand or so years killing each other every single day and then resurrecting and partying afterwards, all as hardcore training in being the baddest of bad@$$es to fight in the inevitable Ragnarok. Fandral, Hogun and Volstagg, who've never really been 'gods' of anything in particular (God of Pretending to be Errol Flynn? God of Norse Mongols? God of Being Really Fat?) would be great choices to have been retconned into being 'only' Einherjar, with more Captain America level strength and millennia worth of fighting training (and experience hacking each other to bits and dying on the battlefield, making them essentially fearless). That way 'real' gods like Sif and Heimdall and Freya and Baldar could show up and have perhaps have unusual and unique powers, in addition to being good with weapons and kind of strong. Asgard would remain teeming with a background cast of thousands, but not every one of these faceless schlubs getting blown away by dark elves like mall cops fighting Navy SEALs would be a millennia old actual 'god.' "Oh no, the third nameless 'god' killed by that dark elven black hole grenade just happened to be the sun god! The sun goes out!" :)[/tangent]


'God' for the Marvel Asgardians obviously means 'person from Asgard'. Some have more powers than others, just like some humans have superpowers and others don't. They just bought into their own hype about divinity.

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Yup. Reminds me of the immortal Asguardian brick layer, on Agents of Shield.


Set wrote:

It's also fair to point out that the current state of Thor's bullet-resistance may or may not have anything to do with that of 'normal' Asgardians, since he's quite a bit above the curve. (Ditto Loki, for that matter, being technically a giant, not a god, and yet somehow being essentially Asgardian, not giantish in apparent strength, toughness, longevity and appearance...)

[tangent] While it's a ship long since sailed, I'd have much preferred if Asgard had only a couple dozen 'gods,' with their 'can lift 20-40 tons and assorted other super-powers' stuff, and hundreds or even thousands of Einherjar, immortal super-warriors who've spent a thousand or so years killing each other every single day and then resurrecting and partying afterwards, all as hardcore training in being the baddest of bad@$$es to fight in the inevitable Ragnarok. Fandral, Hogun and Volstagg, who've never really been 'gods' of anything in particular (God of Pretending to be Errol Flynn? God of Norse Mongols? God of Being Really Fat?) would be great choices to have been retconned into being 'only' Einherjar, with more Captain America level strength and millennia worth of fighting training (and experience hacking each other to bits and dying on the battlefield, making them essentially fearless). That way 'real' gods like Sif and Heimdall and Freya and Baldar could show up and have perhaps have unusual and unique powers, in addition to being good with weapons and kind of strong. Asgard would remain teeming with a background cast of thousands, but not every one of these faceless schlubs getting blown away by dark elves like mall cops fighting Navy SEALs would be a millennia old actual 'god.' "Oh no, the third nameless 'god' killed by that dark elven black hole grenade just happened to be the sun god! The sun goes out!" :)[/tangent]

Given that there probably are only a couple dozen named recurring Asgardian characters, not much would really change. Unless they did demote some of the most prominent ones - like the Warriors Three.

Would mostly just make it even sillier when Thor went adventuring with them, since they'd be that much weaker than him.


Well some of them, maybe Jeff, but let's be honest, do we REALLY want Hemidall running off instead of looking after his post? I mean Tyr, sure.


Nah, that Einherjar thing would make a lot of sense. Of course, all I know about Marvel Thor comes from the movies, but I'm remembering only a handful of the Asgardians (such as Thor, Heimdall (a.k.a., Mr. "I can stab a space ship to death") and Valkyrie) actually displaying truly superhuman ability. Like, Thor can trade punches with the friggin' Hulk, but most of the other Asgardians don't seem to be any stronger than Steve Rogers, at best. Most of them don't even seem to be any stronger than regular humans.

We also don't have much basis for comparison in the movies, which doesn't help. Outside of the actual Avengers and a couple episodes of Agents of SHIELD, we don't get to get to see Asgardians fighting with or against humans.

Thor going adventuring with people much weaker than him is actually right in line with Norse mythology, where Thor & Loki would go adventuring with ordinary mortals.

Granted, like 99.99999~% of the universe falls into the "weaker than Thor" category.


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Thomas Seitz wrote:
Well some of them, maybe Jeff, but let's be honest, do we REALLY want Hemidall running off instead of looking after his post? I mean Tyr, sure.

I was thinking more like the Warriors Three, who he regularly did go off around Asgard with back in the day.

He's still far more powerful and still the star, but they're not completely fragile in comparison to anything that could give him a fight.


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Zhangar wrote:

Nah, that Einherjar thing would make a lot of sense. Of course, all I know about Marvel Thor comes from the movies, but I'm remembering only a handful of the Asgardians (such as Thor, Heimdall (a.k.a., Mr. "I can stab a space ship to death") and Valkyrie) actually displaying truly superhuman ability. Like, Thor can trade punches with the friggin' Hulk, but most of the other Asgardians don't seem to be any stronger than Steve Rogers, at best. Most of them don't even seem to be any stronger than regular humans.

We also don't have much basis for comparison in the movies, which doesn't help. Outside of the actual Avengers and a couple episodes of Agents of SHIELD, we don't get to get to see Asgardians fighting with or against humans.

I think a lot of that falls into the "don't have much basis for comparison" problem. If most of what we see them fighting in/around Asgard is equally ramped up, then they all look like regular humans.

I loved "the stab a space ship to death bit" and would have loved it if the rest of the Asgardian defense was similar, rather than having lasers and things. Valkyries on flying horses hacking at them with swords and Einherjar throwing spears. A battle of higher tech vs melee weapons wielded by superhumans. The Dark Elves winning by the initial surprise, not superior technology. And losing as the Asgardians rallied.


Yeah the marvel power scales seems a lot more fluid then dc. I would say however all but the highest tech AP bullets would only annoy thor.

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Zhangar wrote:

Nah, that Einherjar thing would make a lot of sense. Of course, all I know about Marvel Thor comes from the movies, but I'm remembering only a handful of the Asgardians (such as Thor, Heimdall (a.k.a., Mr. "I can stab a space ship to death") and Valkyrie) actually displaying truly superhuman ability. Like, Thor can trade punches with the friggin' Hulk, but most of the other Asgardians don't seem to be any stronger than Steve Rogers, at best. Most of them don't even seem to be any stronger than regular humans.

We also don't have much basis for comparison in the movies, which doesn't help. Outside of the actual Avengers and a couple episodes of Agents of SHIELD, we don't get to get to see Asgardians fighting with or against humans.

Thor going adventuring with people much weaker than him is actually right in line with Norse mythology, where Thor & Loki would go adventuring with ordinary mortals.

Granted, like 99.99999~% of the universe falls into the "weaker than Thor" category.

Thor's mom was a frigging badass!

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Thomas Seitz wrote:
Well some of them, maybe Jeff, but let's be honest, do we REALLY want Hemidall running off instead of looking after his post? I mean Tyr, sure.

I guarantee you part of him his staying at his post.

Burrrrrrrrrppp


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*thinks Skoll is over doing again...*

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Also, I suspect Heimdall heading off-post would be to underscore the *seriousness* of the situation.

After all, if one's duty is to secure a location, and there is but one and one knows one's opponents are legion, one needs to be a bit more creative than the average trickster deity...

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