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My area has 0-1: Un-Barbarians, Bloodragers, Inquisitors (mine), Occultists, Psychics, Samurai, Shamen, Skalds, Spiritualists, Un-Summoners, Warpriests, Witches (mine); Gnomes, Aasimar
We have <3: Arcanists, Barbarians, Bards, Kineticists, Monks, Ninja
While we are blessed with a sizable minority of female gamers, all of our players are Caucasian.
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Haven't seen a thrown weapon character.
Hence I'm now theory crafting a Grippli far strike monk.
My son runs a Fighter (yeah, strait Fighter. I actually don't think it even has an Archetype...) that throws chakrams. I think the PC is 9th or 10th? level now... but he got kind of tired of him he says. Mostly he stands around until something dangerous shows up - then he shreds the monster and then goes back to being a BDF. Not a lot of personality...
My Thrown Weapon PC now, she's got personality....
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Haven't seen a thrown weapon character.
Hence I'm now theory crafting a Grippli far strike monk.
I have a thrown weapon specialist. In Core.
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kind of tired of him he says.
I have an archer that feels that way, I've tried to make him flexible (Archer archetype for ranged disarm, sentinel for a few spell-like abilities) but he is still dull from having no tactical flexibility. Hoping that having proficiency in all thrown weapons opens up more trip/net fun options, and a few more skill points should help.
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I guess. I've known a couple dozen people who've gone through it, but nobody else has one. I've actually really enjoyed not having to pick spells from those two schools.Since the conversation is on Wizards... I rarely see other Thessalonian Specialists outside of our own meta, and I see it there because a whole mess of us decided to do a group of wayang TSs. For those of us who have gotten some serious play time in with them, they've been an absolute blast of extremes in both builds and RP (I do sloth[conjuration]).Considering they are not sanctioned unless you *cough**cough**cough*, that might be the reason.
A group of us here in Michigan just went through Wardens of the Reborn Forge with a group including 4 Thassilonian Specialists, all of whom were protégés of our previous year's characters. Spellscar magic was fuuuuuun.
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The real problem with TWF is that for most builds, you're doing less damage per hit than someone with a big, two handed weapon. Against things with DR that you can't overcome, that becomes an issue. That's the real reason that two handed weapon builds are more reliable damage dealers, even though they hit less often.It also costs twice as much for your weapons. At mid and high levels, that is often an additional -1 hit and -1 damage.
TWF should work well for an Unchained Barbarian though, since the bonus is static. No halving the raging bonus on the second weapon.
I disagree that not having a positive is the same as having a negative.
And like Fromper mentioned earlier, this is why I like the double weapons. If you are not attacking TWF it then counts as a two-handed weapon. MW weapon applies to both sides and since the enhancement for MW doesn't stack with the enhancement for magic the attack bonus is the same.
Arguably TWF costs more in feats (weapon focus, weapon specialization), but again the double weapon address this (or in my case the exotic weapon version of sawtooth sabre).
My paladin is a TWF (sawtooth sabre). Divine Bond aided the time I had only one magic weapon, but really it never mattered because of smite evil.
To the OP's question: A hardcopy (or even PDF) of the ISGW at the table even when infernal healing is being employed by multiple players. :p
Venture-Agent, Texas—Houston
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The real problem with TWF is that for most builds, you're doing less damage per hit than someone with a big, two handed weapon. Against things with DR that you can't overcome, that becomes an issue. That's the real reason that two handed weapon builds are more reliable damage dealers, even though they hit less often.It also costs twice as much for your weapons. At mid and high levels, that is often an additional -1 hit and -1 damage.
TWF should work well for an Unchained Barbarian though, since the bonus is static. No halving the raging bonus on the second weapon.
I disagree that not having a positive is the same as having a negative.
And like Fromper mentioned earlier, this is why I like the double weapons. If you are not attacking TWF it then counts as a two-handed weapon. MW weapon applies to both sides and since the enhancement for MW doesn't stack with the enhancement for magic the attack bonus is the same.
Arguably TWF costs more in feats (weapon focus, weapon specialization), but again the double weapon address this (or in my case the exotic weapon version of sawtooth sabre).
My paladin is a TWF (sawtooth sabre). Divine Bond aided the time I had only one magic weapon, but really it never mattered because of smite evil.
The medium's champion spirit is another nice source of damage bonuses that isn't halved for off-hand. Which leads me back to the topic at hand.
I think my quarterstaff wielding medium is the only double weapon build I've seen locally, and also the only medium I've seen aside from my second medium.
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This could be a scavenger hunt. Bonus points if you can find....
...Two seasons ago: A table without an Arcanist or Brawler...
I got into PFS right around when the ACG came out with the brawler, it was my first character. Even then I have only ever seen about 2-3 other brawlers in the wild above level 1 or 2. I really wish I saw it more around here... The class still holds a special place in my crunchy little heart.
And yeah, Ragathiel is hot (pun intended) with players. I've looked through the other lords and though lots of them were cool, but he's the only one I've seen other players follow.
I had a Thassilonian Evoker, emphasis on had...Our Wrath is... very aggressive in his playstyle. I suspect he's going to bite it first out of all of us, and die due to including himself in an AoE (the player would want it that way, though). I have been playing mine intensely though, so I'm many levels further along than the rest of our group. I think only Wrath, Lust, Sloth, and Gluttony have gotten play time (wrath, lust, and gluttony are levels 3-5 I believe, my sloth is 8 by comparison). I think Greed might have gotten a game or two in, but he just had a kid so that's not a big surprise. I don't believe the others have played theirs yet.
There are 3 Thassilonian Specialists I know of running around my area. I have a Pride (Illusion) that's my seeker character who went into Veiled Illusionist. Having 0 access to conjuration and moreso transmutation has been really tough, and I've had fun trying to work around that to keep myself viable. Lots of fun playing up the character and his style, though.
I've also seen a Gluttony and an Envy running around, we swapped spell books, it was good times. The Gluttony is largely why my Pride wizard will fall back on necromancy when something is resistant to his illusion magic.
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Hmmm, brawler is one of the few classes I don't have. I also don't have a thrown weapon character.
I also have a Ragathiel worshipper, although I'm fairly certain she's too stupid to realize who she's worshipping.
I mean, you could have just stopped at "I also have a Ragathiel worshipper"
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I mean, you could have just stopped at "I also have a Ragathiel worshipper"Hmmm, brawler is one of the few classes I don't have. I also don't have a thrown weapon character.
I also have a Ragathiel worshipper, although I'm fairly certain she's too stupid to realize who she's worshipping.
Hey, hey, hey, hey-now. Don't be mean; we don't have to be mean, cuz, remember, no matter where you go, there you are.
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Speaking of rare worshipers, I just thought of another rare PFS siting: Norgorber worshipers.They're too busy reading "the secret"
this holy text is known to keep them at bay, or at least drive them screaming from the room... on most others it just has a soporific effect...
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this holy text is known to keep them at bay, or at least drive them screaming from the room... on most others it just has a soporific effect...Speaking of rare worshipers, I just thought of another rare PFS siting: Norgorber worshipers.They're too busy reading "the secret"
Wrong Deity.
That's the sacred text of Zyphus.
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Hey, hey, hey, hey-now. Don't be mean; we don't have to be mean, cuz, remember, no matter where you go, there you are.I mean, you could have just stopped at "I also have a Ragathiel worshipper"Hmmm, brawler is one of the few classes I don't have. I also don't have a thrown weapon character.
I also have a Ragathiel worshipper, although I'm fairly certain she's too stupid to realize who she's worshipping.
I feel like you just insulted me, but I'm not really sure.
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I think I can honestly say that I've never seen a Brawler at any table ever, even including non PFS games.Two seasons ago: A table without an Arcanist or Brawler.
Mine's only level 3 or 4, but I have one. I also have plans to dip Brawler on a couple of different builds, including on what I assume will end up being another rare character... a Dhampir Strangler Brawler/Hangman Vigilante. Hangman is such a weird archetype, I can't imagine there are too many more out there.
The class had an AC issue until it was given shield proficiency. That was its biggest drawback. Now it's probably keeping up with damage.
But seriously, Martial Flexibility is just fantastic, and it makes me consider Brawler instead of Fighter anytime I'm thinking of dipping for a feat. To get MF 4/day, Improved Unarmed Strike, Brawler Unarmed Strike Damage (1d6), Brawler's Cunning, Martial Training, and strong Fort and Reflex saves out of a one level dip is amazing. To add a bonus feat and Brawler's Flurry with two levels is good, too.
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I'm surprised more people aren't seeing Brawlers. Everyone in my area saw the class ability "Pretend you have any martial feat any time you feel like it" and never looked back.
And to be fair, when I said Occult Adventures had replaced arcane casters, I should have been more specific--Kineticists have replaced arcane casters. I hear rumors that there may be other occult classes, but I can't swear to it.
As I said upthread, I don't think I've ever seen a brawler at the table. And kineticists are the most common occult class, but they haven't replaced wizards. They've just replaced most blaster type sorcerers, wizards, and bomb throwing alchemists.
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I'm surprised more people aren't seeing Brawlers. Everyone in my area saw the class ability "Pretend you have any martial feat any time you feel like it" and never looked back.
And to be fair, when I said Occult Adventures had replaced arcane casters, I should have been more specific--Kineticists have replaced arcane casters. I hear rumors that there may be other occult classes, but I can't swear to it.
Back at an old store I used to play at, their local meta was heavily tilted towards Strength based beatsticks. When the APG came out, mlmy next session had a base Brawler, a Mutagen using Brawler, and a Ranger with a Brawler dip because Martial Flexibility is just that hype. Since then, I've run into a handful, but they didn't completely replace Monks and Fighters like I initially assumed.
Kineticists haven't really taken off locally. I've seen about four and a half in the area, if you count the fact that Yoon is my go-to pregen. Aether is just so fun, though.
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I don't really see many hunters or rangers anymore around here, barring my clique that contains an archery focused Hunter, a Skirmisher Divine Tracker Ranger, and my Dragoon/Hunter (who seems to attract some ire from the older players)
And Mesmerists, no one can seem to make them good enough for our liking.
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Venture-Agent, Netherlands—Utrecht
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I don't really see many hunters or rangers anymore around here, barring my clique that contains an archery focused Hunter, a Skirmisher Divine Tracker Ranger, and my Dragoon/Hunter (who seems to attract some ire from the older players)
And Mesmerists, no one can seem to make them good enough for our liking.
For me, archery focus requires full-BAB to really work, as quite a lot of feats depend on high BAB, so a 3/4 BAB class doesn't really work, while there are also better full-BAB classes to work with than the Ranger. Ranger and Hunter fall in this category of "pretty cool, but other classes do it more efficiently."
I really want to make a Mesmerist, but I'm not a fan of shutdown tactics. I like to buff my teammates, not make it impossible for the GM to do anything.
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I don't really see many hunters or rangers anymore around here, barring my clique that contains an archery focused Hunter, a Skirmisher Divine Tracker Ranger, and my Dragoon/Hunter (who seems to attract some ire from the older players)
And Mesmerists, no one can seem to make them good enough for our liking.
For me, archery focus requires full-BAB to really work, as quite a lot of feats depend on high BAB, so a 3/4 BAB class doesn't really work, while there are also better full-BAB classes to work with than the Ranger. Ranger and Hunter fall in this category of "pretty cool, but other classes do it more efficiently."
I really want to make a Mesmerist, but I'm not a fan of shutdown tactics. I like to buff my teammates, not make it impossible for the GM to do anything.
Her Archer seems to keep up by using those free teamwork feats to boost her to-hit numbers and then using animal focus to get scent and popping off a few Pheromone Arrows in the first turn or two. Then the Ranger, her Raptor, my Roc and myself get scent too and have fun. She knows she's dropping some power for it, but she's a sylph and will be getting that feat to see through Mist and a wand of Obscuring Mist around level 5 when her BAB is lagging a bit for feats. It should be entertaining.
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Her Archer seems to keep up by using those free teamwork feats to boost her to-hit numbers and then using animal focus to get scent and popping off a few Pheromone Arrows in the first turn or two. Then the Ranger, her Raptor, my Roc and myself get scent too and have fun. She knows she's dropping some power for it, but she's a sylph and will be getting that feat to see through Mist and a wand of Obscuring Mist around level 5 when her BAB is lagging a bit for feats. It should be entertaining.I don't really see many hunters or rangers anymore around here, barring my clique that contains an archery focused Hunter, a Skirmisher Divine Tracker Ranger, and my Dragoon/Hunter (who seems to attract some ire from the older players)
And Mesmerists, no one can seem to make them good enough for our liking.
For me, archery focus requires full-BAB to really work, as quite a lot of feats depend on high BAB, so a 3/4 BAB class doesn't really work, while there are also better full-BAB classes to work with than the Ranger. Ranger and Hunter fall in this category of "pretty cool, but other classes do it more efficiently."
I really want to make a Mesmerist, but I'm not a fan of shutdown tactics. I like to buff my teammates, not make it impossible for the GM to do anything.
I would recommend (from experience, no less!) grabbing the spell Bloodhound at 2nd level to save the Animal Focus minutes. Pheromone arrows are most excellent and I highly recommend them for protracted fights.
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I would recommend (from experience, no less!) grabbing the spell Bloodhound at 2nd level to save the Animal Focus minutes. Pheromone arrows are most excellent and I highly recommend them for protracted fights.Her Archer seems to keep up by using those free teamwork feats to boost her to-hit numbers and then using animal focus to get scent and popping off a few Pheromone Arrows in the first turn or two. Then the Ranger, her Raptor, my Roc and myself get scent too and have fun. She knows she's dropping some power for it, but she's a sylph and will be getting that feat to see through Mist and a wand of Obscuring Mist around level 5 when her BAB is lagging a bit for feats. It should be entertaining.I don't really see many hunters or rangers anymore around here, barring my clique that contains an archery focused Hunter, a Skirmisher Divine Tracker Ranger, and my Dragoon/Hunter (who seems to attract some ire from the older players)
And Mesmerists, no one can seem to make them good enough for our liking.
For me, archery focus requires full-BAB to really work, as quite a lot of feats depend on high BAB, so a 3/4 BAB class doesn't really work, while there are also better full-BAB classes to work with than the Ranger. Ranger and Hunter fall in this category of "pretty cool, but other classes do it more efficiently."
I really want to make a Mesmerist, but I'm not a fan of shutdown tactics. I like to buff my teammates, not make it impossible for the GM to do anything.
Bloodhound is a good idea, the duration is nice but the Animal Focus has some nice action economy and our poor Ranger hates spells so he has to use animal focus.
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Bloodhound is a good idea, the duration is nice but the Animal Focus has some nice action economy and our poor Ranger hates spells so he has to use animal focus.I would recommend (from experience, no less!) grabbing the spell Bloodhound at 2nd level to save the Animal Focus minutes. Pheromone arrows are most excellent and I highly recommend them for protracted fights.Her Archer seems to keep up by using those free teamwork feats to boost her to-hit numbers and then using animal focus to get scent and popping off a few Pheromone Arrows in the first turn or two. Then the Ranger, her Raptor, my Roc and myself get scent too and have fun. She knows she's dropping some power for it, but she's a sylph and will be getting that feat to see through Mist and a wand of Obscuring Mist around level 5 when her BAB is lagging a bit for feats. It should be entertaining.I don't really see many hunters or rangers anymore around here, barring my clique that contains an archery focused Hunter, a Skirmisher Divine Tracker Ranger, and my Dragoon/Hunter (who seems to attract some ire from the older players)
And Mesmerists, no one can seem to make them good enough for our liking.
For me, archery focus requires full-BAB to really work, as quite a lot of feats depend on high BAB, so a 3/4 BAB class doesn't really work, while there are also better full-BAB classes to work with than the Ranger. Ranger and Hunter fall in this category of "pretty cool, but other classes do it more efficiently."
I really want to make a Mesmerist, but I'm not a fan of shutdown tactics. I like to buff my teammates, not make it impossible for the GM to do anything.
Bloodhound works better for non-hunters I think. Past a certain point as a hunter you're going to have enhancement bonuses to the stats you want to use Animal Focus on, and they don't stack. So you might as well just use a minute or three of it per day on Scent most of the time. Save yourself the 4k gp you would spend on a page of spell knowledge or wand of bloodhound.
I do agree, though, pheromone arrows are fantastic.
Archery is all about stacking bonuses on top of bonuses... 3/4 bab classes need to have some sort of extra bonus to make up for the missing BAB, but most of them do. Pheromone arrows are part of the answer for the hunter, and you can rely on spells and companions and teamwork feats for the rest; bards have performance (or even better, Archaeologist's Luck), Inquisitors have both Judgments and Bane, and so on and so forth. Most of the martial 3/4 bab classes have bonuses to offset the missing quarter bab, if you look hard enough.
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Bloodhound works better for non-hunters I think. Past a certain point as a hunter you're going to have enhancement bonuses to the stats you want to use Animal Focus on, and they don't stack. So you might as well...
My Hunter 13/Medium 1 archer could afford the +6 dex belt because I lean on spending my minutes on STR/CON, or on Planar Focus options. That's even without a pet. I would imagine that this is something that shifts after character level 15, where you can reasonably afford a +6/+6 belt, but that's a long time to opt out of a 2nd level spell.
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My Hunter 13/Medium 1 archer could afford the +6 dex belt because I lean on spending my minutes on STR/CON, or on Planar Focus options. That's even without a pet. I would imagine that this is something that shifts after character level 15, where you can reasonably afford a +6/+6 belt, but that's a long time to opt out of a 2nd level spell.
Bloodhound works better for non-hunters I think. Past a certain point as a hunter you're going to have enhancement bonuses to the stats you want to use Animal Focus on, and they don't stack. So you might as well...
I've mostly played hunters in PFS, so essentially all lower levels than that. So I couldn't tell you how it plays out at high levels. Second-level spell slots (or 4k gp) is a big investment at lower levels, so a class ability that does basically the same thing seems like a pretty good deal.
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I've mostly played hunters in PFS, so essentially all lower levels than that. So I couldn't tell you how it plays out at high levels. Second-level spell slots (or 4k gp) is a big investment at lower levels, so a class ability that does basically the same thing seems like a pretty good deal.My Hunter 13/Medium 1 archer could afford the +6 dex belt because I lean on spending my minutes on STR/CON, or on Planar Focus options. That's even without a pet. I would imagine that this is something that shifts after character level 15, where you can reasonably afford a +6/+6 belt, but that's a long time to opt out of a 2nd level spell.
Bloodhound works better for non-hunters I think. Past a certain point as a hunter you're going to have enhancement bonuses to the stats you want to use Animal Focus on, and they don't stack. So you might as well...
Mine is PFS with minimal GM credit (he's in the middle of Feast of Dust right now). I think I refused to do any GM credit until 5 or 6. Once I had a lesser extend rod, Bloodhound was an all-day buff. I understand where you're coming from, though.
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Mine is PFS with minimal GM credit (he's in the middle of Feast of Dust right now). I think I refused to do any GM credit until 5 or 6. Once I had a lesser extend rod, Bloodhound was an all-day buff. I understand where you're coming from, though.I've mostly played hunters in PFS, so essentially all lower levels than that. So I couldn't tell you how it plays out at high levels. Second-level spell slots (or 4k gp) is a big investment at lower levels, so a class ability that does basically the same thing seems like a pretty good deal.My Hunter 13/Medium 1 archer could afford the +6 dex belt because I lean on spending my minutes on STR/CON, or on Planar Focus options. That's even without a pet. I would imagine that this is something that shifts after character level 15, where you can reasonably afford a +6/+6 belt, but that's a long time to opt out of a 2nd level spell.
Bloodhound works better for non-hunters I think. Past a certain point as a hunter you're going to have enhancement bonuses to the stats you want to use Animal Focus on, and they don't stack. So you might as well...
I think there's a few different ways to focus the build. Hunter companions are so powerful that I probably overinvest in them as opposed to the hunter, leaving the PC a little more GP-starved than someone's average hunter. I also enjoy multiclassing to do weird things, so my take on spell selection and animal focus power might be a little skewed.
I actually had an all-human party the last time I played, which surprised the heck out of me. I've had several no-human groups, but an all-human table (with five or six players, as I recall) was pretty surprising.
Barbarian/Alchemist
Swashbuckler
Unchained Rogue
Cleric
Cleric/Skald
I've never seen a lot of classes - our region is fairly basic. Only one or two of the Occult classes, and no Vigilantes at all. I've never seen a druid, oracle, inquisitor, witch, ninja, samurai, bloodrager, brawler, hunter, or shaman either. Generally not too much out of the ACG, really, except for stuff I've played.
