The Rising Phoenix |
In the Emerald Spire guide it states that it is designed for a party of four adventures. For six or players you should add additional monsters to increase the difficulty accordingly. How are GM's handling this with the standard PFS group size of six adventurers since we're not supposed to stray off script in society games?
Should I bump them up to a harder tier? Instead of using the first floor which is 1-2, should I go to floor 2 which is 1-3 or floor 3 which is 2-4?
GreySector RPG Superstar 2013 Top 8 |
Belafon |
I'm sorry, I should have clarified. They are six characters, all level 2.
Are you just looking for one adventure to run them through or are you planning to do the entire Spire?
If it's just one, I'd say go ahead and do Level 2.
If you want to do the whole Spire I would strongly encourage the players to stay at the bottom of the allowed level range for each floor (via strategic use of slow-tracking). I ran it for a party of six (same party, entire Spire) and there were really only 3-4 fights that challenged the party. Only two deaths total and both of those were player-caused. Six is just not much of a challenge.
Woran Venture-Captain, Netherlands |
MisterSlanky |
I would not run Spire for more than 4 players, nor most other modules.
I agree - Spire does not contain this particular why, but my reasoning is due to the nature of modules. They're designed to span multiple levels, so by the time you meet the big end boss, your character that is smack in the middle of the tiering, isn't quite where he/she was expected to be at the end boss.
Terminalmancer |
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In my experience the dungeon won't really seriously threaten a TPK versus a party of 6, but it's more than dangerous enough to kill people with a lucky crit or some poor PC tactics. I'd run 6 no problem for some parties and for some of the optimizers I'd cap it at 4. Figure out which category your group is closest to, IMO.
chris manning Venture-Captain, Isles—Online |
as there is no campaign mode - you cannot change or add any monsters.
5 or more PFS players will stomp through the higher levels in quick order without breaking a sweat. for an enjoyable challenge for the players and a satisfying GM experience limit the game to 4 players.
I ran for 5 players, and by about level 10 there was no challenge from even the hardest monster.
Jack Amy |
We're currently crushing emerald spire with 6, so if you can I'd go with 4 players. If that's not an option keeping everyone a level behind will add some extra challenge.
If everyone is currently at 3xp and you want to play all 16 floors then you'll want to slow track 4 more floors than recommended, 2 to bring them in line with the expected level, and another 2 to put them 1 level behind.
Belafon |
Yeah, when I GMed the Spire I started with a group of six local PFS players. I figured with a schedule of one session every other week it would take us over half a year to finish. So six would give us a cushion for the the inevitable loss of players over that time period.
Nope. The whole group made it all the way through. Not a particularly optimized group but they didn't have to be for the Spire. By the last level they ranged from 11-13 depending on how much they slow-tracked. The 13s were definitely too much for the NPCs.
Mind you, having the same group made for a lot of fun roleplaying. Tales of "Ollie and the Mop" still get mentioned.
John Woodford |
The PFS group I'm running now started with six, and the early levels were pretty easy until the sixth player had to bail. The next couple of levels (with five PCs) were a little harder; IIRC, the mudlord was the first thing that gave them major heartburn. Currently they're on the eighth level with a fairly optimized party of four, and doing adequately despite the ninja having taken a bunch of STR damage from serpentfolk poison.
Serisan |
I ran with a table of six relatively optimized characters. They only had problems when people had to miss, really. My favorite table as a GM by far was Tomb of Yarrix, which is the first time I've had module content cause a party to run away from the dungeon.
Expect a table of six to absolutely rickroll the content. Depending on the 5, that could be hit or miss. A table of 4 should be reasonably challenged.
Muser |
Our party consisting of a dwarf unbreakable, an elven cardcaster, a dragon disciple skald and my (melee) nagaji lifeacle had some very decent challenges throughout, but after the aforementioned Tomb of Yarrix we were so above the curve in gear that the difficulty just petered out.
We had deaths on levels 3, 5 and 11, btw.
bluesman95 |
I run it for 2 groups 1 level at the beginning of the month. A group of 6 and a group of 4.
Group of 4
TPK level 2
1 death level 6
Group of 6
1 death level 2
2 deaths level 4
1 death level 6
Both of level 6 most of the parties ran and left a player behind and trapped.
So far level 6 is as far as we have played.
YogoZuno Venture-Agent, Australia—QLD—Brisbane |
Belafon |
Woah, what did they do in Godhome to get themselves killed?
I have had a group trigger the statue watching the stairs and they barely escaped without a death. Construct traits, hardness, and grab are not fun to deal with at those levels.
Backpack |
Going to talk about many floors and encounters so just tagging my whole comment.
Belafon |
Godhome
Was this PFS? The recommended advancement pace puts a party at 5th level going in, which definitely enhances survivability.
4th level. (It's the 4th level of the Spire so if you go normal progression through the first 3 you will start Godhome at 4th level.)
I don't know the details of this particular playthrough, just answering Tineke's question about what could have caused deaths in Godhome. If I (the GM) hadn't rolled a natural 1 I probably would have killed a 4th level character one of the times I ran it.
YogoZuno Venture-Agent, Australia—QLD—Brisbane |
Woran Venture-Captain, Netherlands |
Serisan |
My main group through the spire only really had issues when the bard didn't show up. Tomb of Yarrix (floor 11) was rough for them because of that, especially the Seugathi and Bebelith rooms. I don't know that I had any kills, but I certainly had some VERY close calls as the players smartly retreated. This floor was known as "the floor where the cavalier never got to make an attack roll."
I ran a Core table of 4 through the first 7 levels, as well. I finally got a kill via the naga there, who was given ample time to buff because one of the PCs opened the door, looked in, and closed it while the rest of the party was dealing with the serpentfolk cleric. Invis + Displacement + Expeditious Retreat + Shield + Cat's Grace + Silent Image and a crapload of lightning bolts later, the druid was dead and his snake companion was nearly dead. It was a good time.