PeTA calls for a ban on Warhammer


Off-Topic Discussions

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Sovereign Court

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Fun link

I only just came across this today and I didn't see anyone talking about it in the off topic section so I thought I'd post this here as it's kind of relevant to gaming. We have fake and imaginary fur in Pathfinder. Could PeTA be coming after other RPGs next? It's a pretty ridiculous story and one that diminishes what little I've thought of PeTA, but I thought I'd share.


*facepalm*


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I've seen the full letter. It wasn't calling for the public to ban Warhammer it was asking games workshop not to model fur. Still very odd, considering the models are space Vikings. What do they expect them to wear ... Spandex. Good find on the article though.'very entertaining.

Scarab Sages

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It's kind of a lame thing for them to be concerned about, but it's consistent with what their stance has always been.

From what I hear, PETA's philosophy is that somebody has to represent the fringe of your direction in order to get movement in your direction (to say nothing of the fact that whoever is perceived as furthest out will be labeled by our Dumbf#!@ Media as "the irrational fringe" no matter how genteel they are, thereby severely punishing moderate approaches), and I can't argue with that.

Sovereign Court

The Sword wrote:
I've seen the full letter. It wasn't calling for the public to ban Warhammer it was asking games workshop not to model fur. Still very odd, considering the models are space Vikings. What do they expect them to wear ... Spandex. Good find on the article though.'very entertaining.

interesting, I haven't been looking too much into it, the link I posted was the first article I saw about it. Would you happen to have a link to the actual letter?


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Bell of Lost Souls PETA link

Whoop whoop, managed it!


What I find most weird is that the letter is quite restrained and is clearly written by someone who has at least done some research. Lol

However the coverage is froth at the mouth rabble rousing. The media makes me sick sometimes. Hack journalism.

Sovereign Court

Well I didn't see this story on any news site, just in another gaming site, but it still is pretty ridiculous. It's not real fur, it not even faux fur, it's sculpted fur on a model. Anyone ever look at a two inch model and say "I want to wear that?"

Anyways thanks for the link, it clarified things a bit. Rather then talking about banning warhammer they were asking Warhammer to ban fur from their models.


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PETA wrote:
Indeed, nothing on the bloody battlefields of Warhammer’s war-torn world could match the horrible reality that foxes, minks, rabbits and other living beings experience at the hands of the fur trade.

They obviously don't know about the Dark Eldar. Or hive worlds. Or anything outside the Tau Empire (or the Palace of Slaanesh). Or the setting in general.

The Exchange

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I'm Hiding In Your Closet wrote:

It's kind of a lame thing for them to be concerned about, but it's consistent with what their stance has always been.

From what I hear, PETA's philosophy is that somebody has to represent the fringe of your direction in order to get movement in your direction (to say nothing of the fact that whoever is perceived as furthest out will be labeled by our Dumbf%$@ Media as "the irrational fringe" no matter how genteel they are, thereby severely punishing moderate approaches), and I can't argue with that.

Here's the problem with that, though. If you try to convince me that London is the capital of England and you do it by giving me a link to a Wikipedia article, there's a fair chance I'll be convinced because your argument was reasonable and valid. If instead you would have pointed me to the wikipedia article and to a website ran by conspiracy theorists claiming that London was brought down to Earth by aliens in the 12th century as a gift to mankind, I would be far less likely to trust you on the matter. The reasonable, accurate, convincing Wikipedia article would still be there, but your credibility would be damaged so much by the weird stuff that I'd start questioning even the wiki article simply because you're the one who linked me to it.

If PETA is to convince people of anything, it has to stick to arguments that makes sense, it has to pick and choose it's battles, and it needs to rid itself of those fringe elements that alienate the only people who may otherwise have actually listened to what PETA has to say.


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Pathfinder Rulebook Subscriber

Don't let yur varmints grow up to be Chaos.

Liberty's Edge

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Pathfinder Pathfinder Accessories Subscriber; Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber

Response from Reaper Miniatures


Pathfinder Maps, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Maps, Starfinder Roleplaying Game, Starfinder Society Subscriber; Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber

I was already boycotting Warhammer because I didn't like certain of their business practices. But if PETA is boycotting them, I will have to give serious consideration to buying a Warhammer mini or two.


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I'm Hiding In Your Closet wrote:

It's kind of a lame thing for them to be concerned about, but it's consistent with what their stance has always been.

From what I hear, PETA's philosophy is that somebody has to represent the fringe of your direction in order to get movement in your direction (to say nothing of the fact that whoever is perceived as furthest out will be labeled by our Dumbf+@+ Media as "the irrational fringe" no matter how genteel they are, thereby severely punishing moderate approaches), and I can't argue with that.

The US has an entire major political party based on this idea, and it's working great for them.


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DAMMIT!!!

And to think I just built a Space Marine armour in life size, and it has some fur on it from the first demons I killed in getting the parts necessary.

It's hard to be the ultimate badass sometimes.


I wonder if PETA will protest Boba Fett about the Wookie pelts he wears. Given that he is a walking arsenal, it probably would not end well for the protesters.


He's also a mercenary, and I suspect he wouldn't do a great deal unless they actively interfered with his missions. XD


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John Napier 698 wrote:
I wonder if PETA will protest Boba Fett about the Wookie pelts he wears. Given that he is a walking arsenal, it probably would not end well for the protesters.

I think they'll be safe, considering that he's fictional. Just like PETA's ability to change anything.


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I prefer a different meaning of "PETA": People for the Eating of Tasty Animals.


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KahnyaGnorc wrote:
I prefer a different meaning of "PETA": People for the Eating of Tasty Animals.

I'm a card-carrying member of that organization.

Sovereign Court

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They spell it PeTA, the "ethical" part of their own acronym is in lower case, which suggests to me that being ethical isn't as important.


Guy Humual wrote:

Fun link

I only just came across this today and I didn't see anyone talking about it in the off topic section so I thought I'd post this here as it's kind of relevant to gaming. We have fake and imaginary fur in Pathfinder. Could PeTA be coming after other RPGs next? It's a pretty ridiculous story and one that diminishes what little I've thought of PeTA, but I thought I'd share.

I had to check 3 rimes to make sure this was not an article from the Onion...


5 people marked this as a favorite.
Storyteller Shadow wrote:
Guy Humual wrote:

Fun link

I only just came across this today and I didn't see anyone talking about it in the off topic section so I thought I'd post this here as it's kind of relevant to gaming. We have fake and imaginary fur in Pathfinder. Could PeTA be coming after other RPGs next? It's a pretty ridiculous story and one that diminishes what little I've thought of PeTA, but I thought I'd share.

I had to check 3 rimes to make sure this was not an article from the Onion...

Do you remember when a large volume of daily news wasn't easily mistaken for satire?

Pepperidge Farms remembers...

Lantern Lodge Customer Service Manager

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Hey folks, I find myself in a weird spot, I just had to self-moderate my own post.

Removed a post, as a moderator I think I was out of bounds participating in the way I did.

Silver Crusade

*offers hugs*


Sara Marie wrote:

Hey folks, I find myself in a weird spot, I just had to self-moderate my own post.

Removed a post, as a moderator I think I was out of bounds participating in the way I did.

:-)

That's why these boards are great, the Moderators Moderate themselves!


1 person marked this as a favorite.
Scythia wrote:
Storyteller Shadow wrote:
Guy Humual wrote:

Fun link

I only just came across this today and I didn't see anyone talking about it in the off topic section so I thought I'd post this here as it's kind of relevant to gaming. We have fake and imaginary fur in Pathfinder. Could PeTA be coming after other RPGs next? It's a pretty ridiculous story and one that diminishes what little I've thought of PeTA, but I thought I'd share.

I had to check 3 rimes to make sure this was not an article from the Onion...

Do you remember when a large volume of daily news wasn't easily mistaken for satire?

Pepperidge Farms remembers...

I had to check 3 more times to make sure you were serious...er kidding.


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Its not fur it's the hair of their enemies.

Totally civilized.


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Sara Marie wrote:

Hey folks, I find myself in a weird spot, I just had to self-moderate my own post.

Removed a post, as a moderator I think I was out of bounds participating in the way I did.

I blame Cosmo.

Sovereign Court

Sara Marie wrote:

Hey folks, I find myself in a weird spot, I just had to self-moderate my own post.

Removed a post, as a moderator I think I was out of bounds participating in the way I did.

Wow, and in my thread. Should I feel guilty or honored?


Someone should draft a completely rational letter explaining to PETA that there are no wolves on Fenris.

Also, that Fenris recently got pretty much blown up by evil space demons, so... problem solved.


Hey don't they know There are no wolfs on Fenris!
No seriously those are the mutated furs on other marines who became wolf like creatures after the warp transformed them. so technically they are not real wolf furs. Their furry people furs. soo is it cool to wear mutated people fur? also I'm quite sure there is much worse things they've done in 40k I mean they glass planets that probably kills quite a few animal in the process I would imagine.


Uncle Teddy wrote:
KahnyaGnorc wrote:
I prefer a different meaning of "PETA": People for the Eating of Tasty Animals.
I'm a card-carrying member of that organization.

Ditto. *mmmm, steak*


Vidmaster7 wrote:

Hey don't they know There are no wolfs on Fenris!

No seriously those are the mutated furs on other marines who became wolf like creatures after the warp transformed them. so technically they are not real wolf furs. Their furry people furs. soo is it cool to wear mutated people fur? also I'm quite sure there is much worse things they've done in 40k I mean they glass planets that probably kills quite a few animal in the process I would imagine.

Really, though. Some places could use a good "glassing."


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I mean don't get me wrong I'm all about them fighting Against animal cruelty. Have nothing against a vegan lifestyle and see no need to wear furs in our current world, but choose your battles deal with real animal cruelty not science fantasy super soldiers from 38 thousand years in the future. There is still real actual animal cruelty going on not make-believe.


"Won't anyone think of the Fictional Fauna?" *proceeds to move around in environmental unfriendly vehicles.*


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Nutcase Entertainment wrote:

"Won't anyone think of the Fictional Fauna?" *proceeds to move around in environmental unfriendly vehicles.*

Space Marines think about the fauna, that's why they pack so much ammo.


Guy Humual wrote:
Sara Marie wrote:

Hey folks, I find myself in a weird spot, I just had to self-moderate my own post.

Removed a post, as a moderator I think I was out of bounds participating in the way I did.

Wow, and in my thread. Should I feel guilty or honored?

Both. :-)


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Say what you will about PETA, but I couldn't help notice that their letter to Games Workshop was respectful, and made their case with rational - if debatable - arguments.

To wit: they didn't try to paint Game Workshop as amoral, and dissolute backwards thinking perverts.

I can't help but to find that refreshing in those times.

EDIT: removed part tangential to the main argument.

Liberty's Edge

I largely agree with PETA's goals, but find many of their methods just... weird. And likely ineffective. Kinda like Sea Shepherd.


CBDunkerson wrote:
I largely agree with PETA's goals, but find many of their methods just... weird. And likely ineffective. Kinda like Sea Shepherd.

As a scientist and someone who knows a bit about marine mammals, Sea Shepherd is pretty much useless. The money invested in sabotaging Japanese whalers (who for the most part are going after minke whales, which are not in danger of extinction) could actually be invested towards helping animals that are actually in danger of extinction.


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MMCJawa wrote:
CBDunkerson wrote:
I largely agree with PETA's goals, but find many of their methods just... weird. And likely ineffective. Kinda like Sea Shepherd.
As a scientist and someone who knows a bit about marine mammals, Sea Shepherd is pretty much useless. The money invested in sabotaging Japanese whalers (who for the most part are going after minke whales, which are not in danger of extinction) could actually be invested towards helping animals that are actually in danger of extinction.

The point of saving whales is that whales are valuable because they are thinking, sentient life. Not because they were born a member of a species that is or is not endangered. If you could measure life solely on its abundance human life would have a negative value.

Liberty's Edge

Sea Shepherd also does a lot more than harass Japanese whalers. They're active all over the world with conservation of numerous marine species. The whales are just their highest profile cause. The also oppose tuna poaching, dolphin culls, shark finning, drift nets, et cetera.

They'd just be a lot more effective if they spent less time on stunts. Ditto PETA.


CBDunkerson wrote:

Sea Shepherd also does a lot more than harass Japanese whalers. They're active all over the world with conservation of numerous marine species. The whales are just their highest profile cause. The also oppose tuna poaching, dolphin culls, shark finning, drift nets, et cetera.

They'd just be a lot more effective if they spent less time on stunts. Ditto PETA.

Would you have heard of them at all if not for the stunts?

Liberty's Edge

BigNorseWolf wrote:
Would you have heard of them at all if not for the stunts?

Given that I've heard of their less publicized / less stunt driven work? Yes.

For example, I've read articles on their work with local governments in the Galapagos to fight poaching.

They might get less donation money without the stunts... but they'd also burn through a lot less of it.


BigNorseWolf wrote:
MMCJawa wrote:
CBDunkerson wrote:
I largely agree with PETA's goals, but find many of their methods just... weird. And likely ineffective. Kinda like Sea Shepherd.
As a scientist and someone who knows a bit about marine mammals, Sea Shepherd is pretty much useless. The money invested in sabotaging Japanese whalers (who for the most part are going after minke whales, which are not in danger of extinction) could actually be invested towards helping animals that are actually in danger of extinction.

The point of saving whales is that whales are valuable because they are thinking, sentient life. Not because they were born a member of a species that is or is not endangered. If you could measure life solely on its abundance human life would have a negative value.

The point isn't that whales of all types are not worth saving, it's that their are only finite resources available for conservation, and every time a celebrity donates a million dollars for them to harass some whaling ship in the Southern Ocean, that's a million dollars that is not being spent on helping out more imperiled ecosystems elsewhere in the world. There are entire species slipping away into oblivion every year, many of which could be saved if some effort was put into reinforcing existing anti-logging/similar rules, investment of captive breeding programs, and local community support. It's hard for me to cheer Sea Shepard on when entire ecosystems and faunas in Brazil, The Philippines, Hawaii, and Madagascar are teetering on the brink of collapse.


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MMCJawa wrote:


The point isn't that whales of all types are not worth saving, it's that their are only finite resources available for conservation, and every time a celebrity donates a million dollars for them to harass some whaling ship in the Southern Ocean, that's a million dollars that is not being spent on helping out more imperiled ecosystems elsewhere in the world.

But if it weren't for the highly visible and easy to understand flashy tactics of(literal) showboating, would that million dollars be going towards anything but another car or private jet?

Quote:
There are entire species slipping away into oblivion every year, many of which could be saved if some effort was put into reinforcing existing anti-logging/similar rules, investment of captive breeding programs, and local community support. It's hard for me to cheer Sea Shepard on when entire ecosystems and faunas in Brazil, The Philippines, Hawaii, and Madagascar are teetering on the brink of collapse.

Those are billion dollar problems, at a minimum. Even then it's a billion dollars to bribe a local government into acting better...


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*finds it amusing that BigNorseWolf is in this thread about Spacewolfs*

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