Spell Casting Unseen Servant


Rules Questions


Can I give my unseen servant a magic item with no stat / skill requirements like the "Quarterstaff of Entwined Serpents"?

The only stipulation I could see is that Unseen Servants can't attack. Am I correct in assuming that since Magic Missile has no attack roll it doesn't count as an attack?

Grand Lodge

DiscOH wrote:
Am I correct in assuming that since Magic Missile has no attack roll it doesn't count as an attack?

That would be incorrect. Without really looking into it, I would say that anything that breaks invisibility is off the table when it comes to an unseen servant.


It says that Unseen Servants can't attack in any way, not that they can't make attack rolls. Firing Magic Missile at someone is definitely attacking. Unseen Servants would need to be able to talk to speak the command word for a magic item.


Unseen servants aren't characters or butlers, they're animated bits of force that can do exactly what the spell description allows... nothing more than that.


In general should I be using the invisible spell to define attack? I was under the assumption that invisible had excessive restrictions above and beyond what "attacking" normally meant. Since it says "The spell ends if the subject attacks any creature. For purposes of this spell, an attack includes..."

QuidEst wrote:
It says that Unseen Servants can't attack in any way, not that they can't make attack rolls. Firing Magic Missile at someone is definitely attacking. Unseen Servants would need to be able to talk to speak the command word for a magic item.

Entwined Serpent just says "At will, the wielder can use the staff to cast magic missile". Is there a footnote somewhere that says all magic items require a command word? Where would I find that?

Drahliana Moonrunner wrote:
Unseen servants aren't characters or butlers, they're animated bits of force that can do exactly what the spell description allows... nothing more than that.

I'm totally on board with this. The spell is pretty vague though.

The only helpful rulestext unseen servant gives me is:
"It can't perform any task that requires a skill check with a DC higher than 10 or that requires a check using a skill that can't be used untrained."


CRB wrote:
The servant cannot attack in any way; it is never allowed an attack roll.
CRB wrote:
Attacks: Some spell descriptions refer to attacking. All offensive combat actions, even those that don't damage opponents, are considered attacks. Attempts to channel energy count as attacks if it would harm any creatures in the area. All spells that opponents resist with saving throws, that deal damage, or that otherwise harm or hamper subjects are attacks. Spells that summon monsters or other allies are not attacks because the spells themselves don't harm anyone.

So your Unseen Servant can't engage in any offensive combat action, not just those requiring an attack roll.


Gisher wrote:


So your Unseen Servant can't engage in any offensive combat action, not just those requiring an attack roll.

Oh, perfect.

Thanks for clearing that up.


Your servant could still be combative in roundabout ways though, similar to the summon monster exception. For instance, it could trigger a trap when enemies are in position because the trap would be doing the damage instead of the servant.


Quote:
Entwined Serpent just says "At will, the wielder can use the staff to cast magic missile". Is there a footnote somewhere that says all magic items require a command word? Where would I find that?

If the item doesn't say anything about activation, it defaults to a command-word activation.

Quote:
Command Word: If no activation method is suggested either in the magic item description or by the nature of the item, assume that a command word is needed to activate it. Command word activation means that a character speaks the word and the item activates. No other special knowledge is needed.

Nothing about the staff says or suggests any other activation type, so it is a command word activation.

Note that "at will" is not a method of activation. It just means it can be used an unlimited number of times per day.


I like to think that an Unseen Servant isn't bound by otherworldly laws preventing it from attacking, but simply lacks the coordination and intelligence to effectively attack. There are definitely combative actions that an Unseen Servant should be able to take. Such as:

* Pour lamp oil on the floor (and is an effective way to spread lamp oil)

* Carry a shield or paper with a Symbol or Explosive Rune on it.

* Light a Tindertwig in an explosive environment (such as a room covered in lamp oil)

* Load a bunch of Heavy Crossbows sitting on the ground

Of course, to get it to spread oil and light it, you would have to tell it to spread the oil and then issue a second command to light it (according to the spell).


Melkiador wrote:
Your servant could still be combative in roundabout ways though, similar to the summon monster exception. For instance, it could trigger a trap when enemies are in position because the trap would be doing the damage instead of the servant.

I don't think that is true. Summon Monster is a Summoning spell which transports and controls already existing creatures. The creatures themselves are not the spell, so their attacks don't count as using the spell to attack.

Unseen Servant, however, is a Creation spell. The Servant is actually created by the spell, and has no independent existence. It is the spell. And since it is forbidden to attack "in any way" it can not "harm or hamper" anyone. I am hard pressed to think of a trap that does not harm or hamper anyone.


Can Unseen Servants carry alchemist fire flasks?

What happens if I dispel that Unseen Servant while they are above an enemy?


_Ozy_ wrote:

Can Unseen Servants carry alchemist fire flasks?

What happens if I dispel that Unseen Servant while they are above an enemy?

If it doesn't exist then it isn't attacking, so it wouldn't violate the "no attacking" rule. But how would you get it above the enemy? It can't fly or climb.


Gisher wrote:
_Ozy_ wrote:

Can Unseen Servants carry alchemist fire flasks?

What happens if I dispel that Unseen Servant while they are above an enemy?

If it doesn't exist then it isn't attacking, so it wouldn't violate the "no attacking" rule. But how would you get it above the enemy? It can't fly or climb.

Good point, it would be hard to arrange a good vantage point. Though, dropping the flask next to a monster would still trigger splash damage.

In any case, given that the spell explicitly says that it can trigger traps, I still think indirect 'attacks' are in play. Otherwise you get into situations where you can cut the lines to a bridge...unless there is an undetected invisible creature on it...


Gisher wrote:
Melkiador wrote:
Your servant could still be combative in roundabout ways though, similar to the summon monster exception. For instance, it could trigger a trap when enemies are in position because the trap would be doing the damage instead of the servant.

I don't think that is true. Summon Monster is a Summoning spell which transports and controls already existing creatures. The creatures themselves are not the spell, so their attacks don't count as using the spell to attack.

Unseen Servant, however, is a Creation spell. The Servant is actually created by the spell, and has no independent existence. It is the spell. And since it is forbidden to attack "in any way" it can not "harm or hamper" anyone. I am hard pressed to think of a trap that does not harm or hamper anyone.

The point is that triggering a trap doesn't count as attacking as defined in the magic rules. It's the pre-existing trap that's doing the attacking. Not the servant.


Kitty Catoblepas wrote:


* Carry a shield or paper with a Symbol or Explosive Rune on it.

You have just introduced me to my new favourite explosives delivery system. Thank you!


Caltrops. Dropping caltrops doesn't directly harm or hamper anyone until they try to move thru the caltrops, which occurs after the servant has distributed them.

Community / Forums / Pathfinder / Pathfinder First Edition / Rules Questions / Spell Casting Unseen Servant All Messageboards

Want to post a reply? Sign in.