More than 24HD when using Greater Planar Binding?

[Flying Grayson]

Does anyone know of a way to get greater planar binding to have a HD limit of higher than 24? As of right now, all I can find is the Darkfire Adept's Darkfire Pact and the item Planar Parchment from Ultimate Intrigue. Which brings it up from a 18HD to 24HD. Can anyone think of another boost? I'm also aware that Gate is what most people use when dealing with this high of HD but Im curious about PB in particular.

[Douglas Muir 406]

The Augment Calling feat gives you another 2 HD.

You might find these threads of interest. (Warning: long, lots of reading.)

DMDM's Guide to Planar Binding, Part 1

DMDM's Guide to Planar Binding, Part 2

Things You Can Call With Greater Planar Binding, and Why

DMDM's MiniGuide to the Gate Spell

cheers,

Doug M.

[the Diviner]

From Monster Summoner's Handbook.

Augment Calling. Feat. +2 hd with one type of outsider such as demon, devil ect.

Caller's Feather. Item. +2 hd when calling an outsider. +2 insight bonus on charisma checks to influence the creature called. Crumbles when used.

From Advanced Player's Guide

Spell perfection. Feat. This will double the bonus from Augment Calling.

[avr]

That planar parchment wasn't around when your guide was written which means the max possible HD limit is 3 higher now. I wonder if that makes any difference?

[Flying Grayson]

Oh sweet, thanks guys. So that makes the max dice 26 then? Also Douglas, thank you so much for those guides! I'm playing a Diabolist right now and they will help immeasurably!

[Douglas Muir 406]

Flying Grayson wrote:

Oh sweet, thanks guys. So that makes the max dice 26 then? Also Douglas, thank you so much for those guides! I'm playing a Diabolist right now and they will help immeasurably!

Ahh, then you probably want this thread right here.

If you use any of the suggestions from that Guide -- or if you have any other tips on playing a Diabolist, based on actual game experience -- please feel free to drop me a PM and tell me. I'm always looking for actual player input for future editions.

cheers,

Doug M.

[the Diviner]

Where are you seeing that the Planar Parchment gives extra HD? My copy of Ultimate Intrigue shows no such thing.

[DM_DM]

If I ever finish the Guide to Planar Binding, I may add a note on "overclocking". If you have any two of Augment Calling, the Caller's Feather or a Darkfire Pact, that lets you call creatures of up to 4 HD higher than normally allowed -- and it's not too hard to get two of those.

But this is not always such a great idea. The more powerful creatures are harder to call (better Will saves); harder to bind (higher Cha); and are simply more powerful and dangerous. At 9th level, using Lesser Planar Binding to call a 6 HD outsider is no big thing. It's a useful servant, but no 6 HD creature is going to pose a serious threat to a 9th level character. But calling a 10 HD outsider is something else again; if it breaks loose -- and there is an irreducible 1 in 20 chance that it will do that -- then it has an excellent chance of killing you. Calling a 22 HD outsider at 15th level, same-same.

There are ways to mitigate the risk, sure -- assistants, contingency spells, teleport, what have you. But still: it's really just asking your DM to get creative. Proceed with caution.

Doug M.

[Flying Grayson]

@the Diviner Oh jeez, I have no idea how i messed that up. I probably confused a ton of people. You are absolutely right, planar parchment give the week per level or service time and the +2 to the cha check but no bonus to HD. Thanks for bringing this up.

@Douglas Muir 406 Oh awesome, had no idea that thread existed. the traits and feats will be exceedingly useful, thank you so much!

@DM_DM I am keenly aware of the repercussions of not only Overclocking planar binding but also just practicing diablery in general (My DM has made it hard for me to forget). I have many precautions in mind and a backup character ready, if I am unable to adequately protect myself from my own machinations.

Thanks everyone for the help!

[Balancer]

I can't find anything called planner parchment on the srd, has it not been updated yet?

[the Diviner]

Flying Grayson wrote:

@the Diviner Oh jeez, I have no idea how i messed that up. I probably confused a ton of people. You are absolutely right, planar parchment give the week per level or service time and the +2 to the cha check but no bonus to HD. Thanks for bringing this up.

@Douglas Muir 406 Oh awesome, had no idea that thread existed. the traits and feats will be exceedingly useful, thank you so much!

@DM_DM I am keenly aware of the repercussions of not only Overclocking planar binding but also just practicing diablery in general (My DM has made it hard for me to forget). I have many precautions in mind and a backup character ready, if I am unable to adequately protect myself from my own machinations.

Thanks everyone for the help!

No worries. But for your original question here is what I think is the most you can achieve in terms of raw number of hd on the Greater Planar Binding spell.

26 = 18 base, +2 Caller's Feather, +2 Blackfire Adept, +4 (Augment Calling doubled with Spell Perfection)

[Flying Grayson]

@Balancer: It has not been updated, but its on page 250 of ultimate Intrigue.

[DM_DM]

the Diviner wrote:

But for your original question here is what I think is the most you can achieve in terms of raw number of hd on the Greater Planar Binding spell.

26 = 18 base, +2 Caller's Feather, +2 Blackfire Adept, +4 (Augment Calling doubled with Spell Perfection)

I'm not sure there is anything to call beyond CR 24 or so? Anything over that seems to be either a unique creature or 3PP.

Doug M.

[ginganinja]

Maybe a Yamaraj Psychopomp?

That's mostly what I can find at first glance that's not unique and around 25-26HD, but then again, you wouldn't get Blackfire Adept with that. IDK what Planar Parchment does so maybe it works with that?

[Tacticslion]

Jabberwock?

It's planar acclamation makes that a little weird, and some GMs wouldn't allow it, but it hypothetically could be called. Also, I know the target says outsiders or elementals, but the jabberwock is explicitly from another plane - which the text of the spell calls out, avoiding the specific "short hand" category.

But anyway, that's pretty much all I've got.

(The spell looks at HD, not CR.)

That said, the spell doesn't prohibit you from nabbing unique creatures, so a very potent creatures can, in fact, hypothetically be bound...

[Plausible Pseudonym]

Re: Jabberwock. Lots of fey are from another plane, just like it is, but none of them are summonable with standard summoning spells. That's why Entice Fey finally showed up in Ultimate Intrigue.

[Tacticslion]

Plausible Pseudonym wrote:

Re: Jabberwock. Lots of fey are from another plane, just like it is, but none of them are summonable with standard summoning spells. That's why Entice Fey finally showed up in Ultimate Intrigue.

(Technically it's a dragon...) XD

[Flying Grayson]

I never say entice fey, thats just a super cool Druid waiting to happen. And what about summoning a Hekatonkheires Titan? They seem pretty strong.

[Tacticslion]

They are! That's a good suggestion.

Their HD is below the hypothetical 26 (or, rather, "more than 24") we're discussing above, though.

(DM_DM had asked about CR 24, but the spell goes by HD instead of CR, and the highest number was 26, hence I was looking at things within that range. Unless I misunderstood something. :D)