I was wondering if this possible Paladin/Antipaladin homebrew would be too powerful and break anything. Or if there would be a better/simpler way to implement these ideas in a Pathfinder framework.
Maybe a Paladin table:
Maybe a Paladin Alignment: A Paladin's alignment cannot be TN, and must be the same as her deity's if she has a deity
Hit Die: d10
Starting Wealth: 5d6 × 10 gp (average 175 gp.) In addition, each character begins play with an outfit worth 10 gp or less.
Skills: The paladin's class skills are Craft (Int), Handle Animal (Cha), Knowledge (religion) (Int), Profession (Wis), Ride (Dex), Sense Motive (Wis), and Spellcraft (Int).
Skill Ranks Per Level: 4+Int modifier
BAB: Full
Good Saves: Fort and Will
Spells per Day: As regular Paladin
1. Alignment, Aura of Alignment, Detect Alignment, Smite Opposed 1/day
2. Divine Grace, Lay on Hands/Touch of Corruption
3. Aura of Courage/Cowardice, Divine Health/Plaguebringer, Mercy/Cruelty
4. Channel Energy, Smite Opposed 2/day
5. Divine Bond
6. Mercy/Cruelty
7. Smite Opposed 3/day
8. Aura of Resolve/Aura of Despair
9. Mercy/Cruelty
10. Smite Opposed 4/day
11. Aura of Justice/Vengeance
12. Mercy/Cruelty
13. Smite Opposed 5/day
14. Aura of Faith/Sin
15. Mercy/Cruelty
16. Smite Opposed 6/day
17. Aura of Righteousness/Depravity
18. Mercy/Cruelty
19. Smite Opposed 7/day
20. Holy/Unholy Champion
Maybe a Paladin's class features:
Weapon and Armor Proficiency
Paladins are proficient with all simple and martial weapons, with all types of armor (heavy, medium, and light), and with shields (except tower shields). Paladins are also proficient with the favored weapon of their deity.
Alignment
Alignments opposite to the Paladin's on the Good/Evil axis and Law/Chaos axis are opposed alignments (Evil for Good Paladins, Law for Chaos, etc.). A Paladin may have multiple opposed alignments.
Good:
Bonus Skills: Heal, Knowledge (Nobility)
Divine Bond Properties: Holy, Disruption, Merciful
Divine Bond Template: Celestial
Evil:
Bonus Skills: Intimidate, Disguise
Divine Bond Properties: Unholy, Vicious, Wounding
Divine Bond Template: Fiendish
Law:
Bonus Skills: Diplomacy
Divine Bond Properties: Axiomatic, Defending, Brilliant Energy
Divine Bond Template: Resolute
Chaos:
Bonus Skills: Bluff, Stealth
Divine Bond Properties: Anarchic, Vorpal
Divine Bond Template: Entropic
Aura of Alignment
As a Cleric who worships a deity of her own alignment
Detect Alignment
As a regular Paladin's ability, except that it detects her opposed alignment instead of only detecting evil. If the Paladin has multiple opposed alignments, they may choose to detect only one at a time.
Smite Opposed
As a regular Paladin's ability, except that it may only target enemies of an opposed alignment, and deals double damage on the first strike to Outsiders of the opposed alignment subtype, Dragons and Paladins of the opposed alignment, and targets of multiple opposed alignments (if applicable). For Good Paladins, the extra damage also applies to Undead, for Lawful Paladins, the extra damage also applies to Fey.
Divine Grace
As a regular Paladin's ability
Lay on Hands/Touch of Corruption
This functions as either Lay on Hands or Touch of Corruption. Once this choice is made, it cannot be reversed. A Good Paladin who chooses Touch of Corruption or an Evil Paladin who choses Lay on Hands may only use it to heal herself. This decision also determines what spells the Paladin can cast.
Aura of Courage/Cowardice
For a Good Paladin, this functions as a regular Paladin's Aura of Courage. For an Evil Paladin, this functions as an Antipaladin's Aura of Cowardice. A LN or CN Paladin may choose either effect. Once this choice is made, it cannot be reversed.
Mercy/Cruelty
This functions as either a regular Paladin's Mercy or an Antipaladin's Cruelty. Once this choice is made, it cannot be reversed. In either case, the effects modify Lay on Hands. If the Cruelty option is combined with Lay on Hands, it requires a Will save instead of a Fort save, and its effects ignore regular undead immunities.
Channel Energy
For a Good Paladin, this functions as a regular Paladin's Channel Positive Energy. For an Evil Paladin, this functions as an Antipaladin's Channel Negative energy. A LN or CN Paladin may choose either effect. Once this choice is made, it cannot be reversed. This also determines what spells can be cast.
Divine Bond
This functions as an Antipaladin's Fiendish Boon, except that the list of available weapon properties is: Flaming, Keen, Flaming Burst, and Speed, in addition to all weapon properties listed for her alignment. The creature, if chosen, must have the all Paladin's alignments as subtypes, and only those alignment subtypes, or be a creature with one of the Divine Bond templates appropriate to her alignment.
Spells
This functions as the regular Paladin's casting, with some modifications. Evil Paladins cast from the Antipaladin list instead. A LN or CN Paladin may choose which list to cast from. Once this choice is made, it cannot be reversed. If the Paladin channels positive energy, any Inflict spells are replaced with the equivalent Cure spell. If the Paladin channels negative energy, any Cure spells are replaced with the equivalent Inflict spell.
Other spell lists to be tailored by someone with a bit more time on their hands. Not sure how to word this: Protection from Evil/Good/Chaos/Law, Spear of Purity/Dread Bolt/Arrow of Law/Shard of Chaos, etc. are replaced by their alignment-appropriate counterpart.
Aura of Resolve/Despair
For a Good Paladin, this functions as a regular Paladin's Aura of Resolve. For an Evil Paladin, this functions as an Antipaladin's Aura of Despair. A LN or CN Paladin may choose either effect. Once this choice is made, it cannot be reversed.
Aura of Justice/Vengeance
This functions as a regular Paladin's Aura of Justice, except that it grants Smite Opposed, using her bonuses, and creatures of opposed alignments gain no benefit from this effect.
Aura of Faith/Sin
This functions as a regular Paladin's Aura of Faith, except it aligns attacks and weapons to all the Paladin's alignments.
Aura of Righteousness/Depravity
For a Good Paladin, this functions as a regular Paladin's Aura of Righteousness. For an Evil Paladin, this functions as an Antipaladin's Aura of Depravity. A LN or CN Paladin may choose either effect. Instead of DR/evil or DR/good, the Aura provides DR weak to one opposed alignment. Once these choices are made, they cannot be reversed.
Holy/Unholy Champion
For a Paladin who channels positive energy, this functions as Holy Champion. For a Paladin who channels negative energy, this functions as Unholy Champion. Instead of DR/evil or DR/good, the Aura provides DR weak to the alignment selected for Aura of Righteousness/Depravity. Additionally, the Smite effect does not end upon a successful or unsuccessful Banishment.
Code of Conduct
This is between you and your GM. Suggested codes are the deity-specific Paladin/Antipaladin codes. So long as the code requires you to deliberately and actively maintain your alignment and adhere to a more difficult moral (or immoral) code than a non-Paladin, your code should be fine.
Ex-Paladins
A paladin who shifts alignment or who violates the code of conduct loses all paladin spells and class features (including the service of the paladin's mount, but not weapon, armor, and shield proficiencies). She cannot thereafter gain levels as a Paladin of her god or alignment until she atones for her deeds (see the atonement spell description).
Okay, noticeable changes I can see you've made are 4 instead of 2 skill ranks per level and Detect [Alignment]/Smite Opposed.
The extra skill ranks are no problem. No class should have 2 skill ranks per level in my opinion.
The straight upgrade from the base class is the Detect/Smite [Alignment] abilities. A Lawful Good paladin will be able to smite both Chaotic and Evil enemies, correct? I haven't played with enough paladins to be able to tell just how often they can use their Smite ability, but this implement would allow them to smite someone in basically every fight.
An easy way out from this would be to limit the Detect/Smite [Alignment] abilities so that you must choose one of your opposed alignments to Detect/Smite when you take your first level of paladin. Either Lawful/Chaotic or Good/Evil.
Other than that, I like the flexibility you've introduced.
With this, yes, you can smite both Chaotic and Evil enemies, and get a little extra kick smiting CE enemies. And you should be able to smite someone basically every fight if you really want to, although you might still just save it for tougher foes. Instead of 3/9 of the alignments, you cover 5/9, which is more than half. It gives a little extra incentive to be a corner alignment, since you can be any non-TN alignment.
Perhaps limiting the smite/detect alignments wouldn't hurt, although I'm sorta fond of the idea of a LG Paladin who stands against both evil and chaos, instead of either/or. Still, having the the limited smite/detect would bring this version closer to the regular Paladin, which is a good balance point.
Just a few other changes you may or may not have noticed: Proficiencies include your deity's favored weapon. Lay on Hands and Touch of Corruption can be taken by any alignment, but Lay on Hands when used by evil characters and Touch of Corruption when used by good characters can only heal yourself. This lets you have a tankier Antipaladin, similar to the Insinuator, or have a Dhampir Paladin. Mercy/Cruelty can be taken by any alignment, and Cruelties function against Undead. Aura of Justice only affects non-opposed alignments, so for an LG Paladin, it would affect fewer than the regular Paladin. Aura of Faith aligns your weapons to all your alignments. Holy Champion doesn't wear off your smite after the first hit.
What I'm most concerned about are NG, NE, LN, and CN. LG and CE will basically resemble Paladins and Antipaladins, but with a buff to who you can smite and detect. LE and CG should be more or less on par with them. However, NG and NE have only a single Smite direction, have fewer class skills, divine bond options, and aura alignments than corner alignments do. LN and CN get to pick freely between Paladin and Antipaladin class features, although they also have fewer class skills, divine bond options, and aura alignments. LN/CN could swing either way, but NG and NE might be significantly weaker than LG/CE/LE/CG. Any thoughts?
Oh, and there are feat+alignment interactions, although since this is a houserule class, there could be house ruled solutions. Feats like Desna's Shooting Star and a lot of Oracle Revelations could make a very single-attribute martial- not that single-attribute martials are bad, but Paladin is balanced enough as a multiple-attribute martial.
Aside from the 2+Int skills/level, I like the regular Paladin as a balance point. Situationally incredible, otherwise still generally useful. Has a few class choices, but not an unmanageable number (See: Rogue, Fighter). Has a defined party role, is actually good at it, and doesn't usurp other party members' jobs.
With this, yes, you can smite both Chaotic and Evil enemies, and get a little extra kick smiting CE enemies. And you should be able to smite someone basically every fight if you really want to, although you might still just save it for tougher foes. Instead of 3/9 of the alignments, you cover 5/9, which is more than half. It gives a little extra incentive to be a corner alignment, since you can be any non-TN alignment.
The classical LG paladin would be able to smite 5/9 enemies instead of 3/9, yeah. But the occurrence of good enemies is very low if you're playing a good campaign. It's more like 3/6 enemies to 4/6.
A LE paladin on the other hand, would have many chances to fight people from all over the alignment graph. There's where the 3/9 to 5/9 increase happens.
But then comes the question if a good paladin should be able to Smite a good creature.
My Self wrote:
Just a few other changes you may or may not have noticed: Proficiencies include your deity's favored weapon.
I'm surprised it wasn't already. Since other religious classes like Cleric and Warpriest are proficient it only makes sense Paladin is.
My Self wrote:
Lay on Hands and Touch of Corruption can be taken by any alignment, but Lay on Hands when used by evil characters and Touch of Corruption when used by good characters can only heal yourself. This lets you have a tankier Antipaladin, similar to the Insinuator, or have a Dhampir Paladin. Mercy/Cruelty can be taken by any alignment, and Cruelties function against Undead.
Rather than "flexibility", I think "Customization" would have been a better choice of words in my previous post. This was the stuff I was refering to.
My Self wrote:
Aura of Justice only affects non-opposed alignments, so for an LG Paladin, it would affect fewer than the regular Paladin. Aura of Faith aligns your weapons to all your alignments. Holy Champion doesn't wear off your smite after the first hit.
Oh, I missed the Aura of Justice nerf. From 6/9 to 4/9. Good way to emphasize on that the paladin strives to be both parts of their alignments, not only good/evil.
My Self wrote:
What I'm most concerned about are NG, NE, LN, and CN. LG and CE will basically resemble Paladins and Antipaladins, but with a buff to who you can smite and detect. LE and CG should be more or less on par with them. However, NG and NE have only a single Smite direction, have fewer class skills, divine bond options, and aura alignments than corner alignments do. LN and CN get to pick freely between Paladin and Antipaladin class features, although they also have fewer class skills, divine bond options, and aura alignments. LN/CN could swing either way, but NG and NE might be significantly weaker than LG/CE/LE/CG. Any thoughts?
If a Lawful Good paladin strives to be the embodiment of both Lawful and Good, then should she be able to Smite a Good creature? Should she be able to Smite a Lawful creature?
If a paladin's power is expressed by both parts of their alignment, then smiting a target with which you share some part of your alignment with is strange. A LG paladin shouldn't be played as a Lawful and a Good paladin. A LG paladin should be played as a LG paladin. If not, then you're playing a gestalt LN and NG paladin.
So I propose, as a way to keep the power level between the corner alignments and the neutral ones, that a LG paladin can't smite LE or CG creatures.
I.E. a LG paladin would only be able to Smite NE, CE and CN (3/9).
The neutral paladins could also be able to choose one of the class skills and weapon enchantments from the choices they are missing out on. But the weapon enchantments available wouldn't be any of the alignment-based.
I ran something very similar for several years. My exact implementation differed from yours on a number of points (for instance the resolve/despair aura was determined by your law/chaos alignment in my implementation) but in principle the idea was the same. You might need to fine-tweak a few things, but it shouldn't be a problem.
For me, the biggest issue is the change in the Antipaladin's concept. His ideological opposition to good isn't about wanting to destroy good people, but rather in seeing good as a weakness that he himself must avoid. In that light, a Smite Good class feature doesn't even make sense for him. My solution was to create two versions of Smite. Good Paladins (and neutral ones that choose the "good" ethos) get the traditional smite evil. Evil Paladins (and neutral ones that choose the "evil" ethos) get the smite foe feature, which works without any alignment restrictions but provides only offensive benefits and no defensive ones. Overall it worked fairly well.
The classical LG paladin would be able to smite 5/9 enemies instead of 3/9, yeah. But the occurrence of good enemies is very low if you're playing a good campaign. It's more like 3/6 enemies to 4/6.
A LE paladin on the other hand, would have many chances to fight people from all over the alignment graph. There's where the 3/9 to 5/9 increase happens.
But then comes the question if a good paladin should be able to Smite a good creature.
I'm surprised it wasn't already. Since other religious classes like Cleric and Warpriest are proficient it only makes sense Paladin is.
Rather than "flexibility", I think "Customization" would have been a better choice of words in my previous post. This was the stuff I was refering to.
Oh, I missed the Aura of Justice nerf. From 6/9 to 4/9. Good way to emphasize on that the paladin strives to be both parts of their alignments, not only good/evil.
If a Lawful Good paladin strives to be the embodiment of both Lawful and Good, then should she be able to Smite a Good creature? Should she be able to Smite a Lawful creature?
If a paladin's power is expressed by both parts of their alignment, then smiting a target with which you share some part of your alignment with is strange. A LG paladin shouldn't be played as a Lawful and a Good paladin. A LG paladin should be played as a LG paladin. If not, then you're playing a gestalt LN and NG paladin.
So I propose, as a way to keep the power level between the corner alignments and the neutral ones, that a LG paladin can't smite LE or CG creatures.
I.E. a LG paladin would only be able to Smite NE, CE and CN (3/9).
The neutral paladins could also be able to choose one of the class skills and weapon enchantments from the choices they are missing out on. But the weapon enchantments available wouldn't be any of the alignment-based.
I like the 3/9 corner smite idea, although I'd somewhat miss being able to smite devils and unjust tyrants. Still, being able to knock the stuffing out of the party murderhobobarian sounds like a reasonable trade.
Perhaps an alignment category for characters with a neutral alignment component? No opposed alignment, but they get enhancement options and maybe another class skill.
Dasrak wrote:
I ran something very similar for several years. My exact implementation differed from yours on a number of points (for instance the resolve/despair aura was determined by your law/chaos alignment in my implementation) but in principle the idea was the same. You might need to fine-tweak a few things, but it shouldn't be a problem.
For me, the biggest issue is the change in the Antipaladin's concept. His ideological opposition to good isn't about wanting to destroy good people, but rather in seeing good as a weakness that he himself must avoid. In that light, a Smite Good class feature doesn't even make sense for him. My solution was to create two versions of Smite. Good Paladins (and neutral ones that choose the "good" ethos) get the traditional smite evil. Evil Paladins (and neutral ones that choose the "evil" ethos) get the smite foe feature, which works without any alignment restrictions but provides only offensive benefits and no defensive ones. Overall it worked fairly well.
For resolve/despair, it feels like more of an alignment-slanted thing:
LG | NG | CG LN | TN | CN
LE | NE | CE
Perhaps people within a step of LG would get Resolve, people within a step of CE would get Despair, and CG/LE people would get to choose. Maybe that should be true of other auras and options in this homebrew?
I feel that the Antipaladin reserves a special place in his twisted heart that hates Good- whether it is because he things Good is weak and weakens people, or because he was formerly Good and is trying to prove himself. It's not just like Rage, which you can use on anybody, anywhere, any time. It's a distinctly inimical relationship.
Smite should probably be changed to affect Clerics of opposed alignments as well.
I should probably change the Divine Bond so that you have the choice between the Antipaladin or Paladin option (Perma-summoned creature, or mount animal companion).
Just another thought that popped up- For regular Paladins, Detect Evil functions also as Detect Smitable, but not Detect Exact Alignment. I'd like to be able to preserve that if the Paladin is only able to smite enemies of opposed alignments that you do not share.
Some changes:
Detect Alignment (Maybe Detect Opposed?) detects targets who are of an opposed alignment and do not share an alignment component with the Paladin. (For LG, this is NE, CE, and CN. For NG, this is LE, NE, and CE.)
Smite Evil affects targets who are of an opposed alignment and do not share an alignment component with the Paladin. It also affects Clerics of a deity of who qualifies, even if the Cleric does not qualify for smiting. (e.g. A LG Paladin could smite an LE Cleric of an NE deity.) Clerics take extra damage on the first hit, like aligned Outsiders and Dragons.
Auras that function one way for a Good Paladin and function another for an Evil Paladin instead function for a Paladin within one step of LG and a Paladin within one step of CE, respectively. Instead of LN and CN characters being able to choose which effect they prefer, LE and CG can choose.
Some fixes/pre-problem clarifications:
Abilities listed should be replaceable by archetypes. To replace a class feature with an archetype's ability, you first need to qualify to have it. Your alignment (and class skills from that alignment) would be factored into what class skills and other features you get before they get altered by the archetype, not after. Thus a CE Paladin could not pick an archetype that replaces Aura of Resolve, since they have the Aura of Despair part because they are evil, not Aura of Resolve.
Smite Opposed and Detect Alignment would qualify as Smite Evil and Detect Evil if the Paladin could use it to Smite or Detect multiple different Evil alignments; i.e, the Paladin must have Evil as an opposed alignment. This functions the same for Smite/Detect Good and Smite/Detect Chaos.
Divine Grace counts as Fiendish Resilience for replacement purposes.
Archetypes that would increase the Paladin's skill points to 4+Int/level instead increase it to 6+Int/level.
If the Paladin's Deity's favored weapon is Unarmed Strike, the Paladin gets Improved Unarmed Strike as a bonus feat.
looks good but i would make them choose one detect and one smite at level 1 either good,evil,law or chaos. also would they be able to choose aura of courage or aura of cowardice/mercy and cruelty or is it pre selected based on alignment? also add perception as a class skill it should really be a class skill for every class it is the most used skill in the game after all
