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So here's the Bard I already have. Now that elemental-kin are freely Society-legal, I've been contemplating playing this second Bard, since the Watersinger Archetype looks very interesting (and I've already got a fire-loving character, and may wind up making another); I picture it as having a refreshing "Classical Greek/seapunk" vibe. The thing is, though, I'm not sure I want to play another Bard (especially when I've also already got a Skald). I do have precedent now for having two characters of the same class (I have 2 Fighters, but they have wildly different Archetypes, as well as being wildly different in other ways - a taciturn Tiefling specializing in a simple weapon VS a charming Vishkanya specializing in an exotic weapon), so the help I am asking for here is: How could I make this new Bard more different from my first than she already is? Another Archetype would do the trick, but I don't like any of the few I've been able to spot that are compatible with the Watersinger (those would appear to be Geisha and Detective) - is the OGC site missing any recent or obscure Bard Archetypes that might fit the bill?
Failing that, what else might I do to make this character idea stand further apart from my extand Bard?
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Alternative combat to style to compliment the Watersinger...
Water flowing style rapier style - Tempted to suggest a bard of Desna with butterfly sting. Go for the full pirate seasinging style (sea shanty or siren both work) With the chance to drop into swashbuckler to give you finesse things and rapier goodness? (i believe all the water work keeps going as frees like normal BP once its in progress)
You inspire and pass cool crits out using a rapier for hits? possibly moving into flag bearer in the other hand to move around being awesome, water bending and critically useful?
Desna is a great god to link in with as the seas are so tied to the sky and the stars (tidal and open skies above the sea and all)
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:S If I wanted to multiclass, I'd play a Half-Elf - as for weapons of choice, I already decided on a gladius, which is like a dagger that trades throwability for damage. As for deity, my Illusionist already worships Desna; I'd be more inclined to go for Gozreh or Cayden Cailean with this one. Certainly, though, you bring up a valid option of being more battle-oriented. Feats and spell selection could set them apart, too, of course.
I guess I'm mainly trolling for obscure Archetypes. I'll check my books. There's plenty the OGC still hasn't integrated.
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I guess I'm mainly trolling for obscure Archetypes. I'll check my books. There's plenty the OGC still hasn't integrated.
Will keep an eye out.. I would suggest coming up with a cool combat feature you could do while BP Water form is going.. they do tend to be be split into buff-casters and combatants for design.
Songhealer is also on the list still i think but not quite on the uncommon list.
Watershaper is a cool one though.. will add it to the potentials for character plans :)
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Here's one I did (and it wasn't super easy, but it wasn't hard). Go for a heavily armored arcane duelist that acts more like a fighter than a bard. Between Arcane Strike and Inspire Courage, you'll be dishing out a good quantity of damage (even if you don't get the same full attack count as a fighter), but you'll back it up with other class abilities. The key (at least for me) was to go for only spells with no somatic component so I could be wearing plate and a shield.
YMMV, but that's my idea to toss out at you.
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Some of you are missing the point - if I'm going to be playing this character, she's going to be a Watershaper. It's the only reason I'm considering a second Bard. I'd happily choose Arcane Duelist as a second Archetype, but they're not compatible (it's that stupid partial Lore Master loss that kills a lot of the possibilities I'd otherwise like best).
@MisterSlanky: Are you familiar with the Chelish Diva Archetype? It gains the ability to freely cast spells in heavy armor 5 levels sooner than the Arcane Duelist. You get to be Madame Carlotta!
I'm hoping for a Watershaper-compatible second Archetype to more completely divorce this Bard from my Wayang, but I can find very few, and what I've found I don't like (granted, my Wayang is a Shadow Puppeteer/Dirge Bard, so I suppose one could argue that having some of the default Bard class features is departure enough).
Just don't start calling me "Arthur 'Two-Bards' Jackson."
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I've got three bards currently in society play -- that's half my active characters.
Nixie the watersinger is different than all the others because I play her as an absolute ditz. She's a fish out of water, fascinated by land customs and convinced that pigs are deadly creatures. (This happened from a stray conversation that she overhead in the Pig's Paunch in her Confirmation, when her whole party told the gullible Nixie, "Yes, pigs are deadly, deadly creatures...")
You'll have water spells. Pick aquatic adventures to play in and give your bard a different personality and it'll be treated as a totally different person.
Hmm
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So there we were... Sigridr tells this merchant, "You're so gods-damned incompetent, I'll report you to the authorities, and spread the news far and wide. I'll ruin your reputation, and make sure you're never able to do business in this town again!'
Then Nixie blinks, pats the stunned merchant on the hand, and says in a cheery voice, "But have a nice day!"
I don't know if "ditz" is the right word... but she's sweet, gullible, and has a completely fish out of water worldview. Pairing with Sigridr... Oh my. We broke the table.
Hmm
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If you can't change up the archetype, change up the style. It can be as simple as changing the weapon and feats selected.
Looking at the Con and Strength, your second Bard is not going to want to get into melee. Don't give them weapon finesse! Give them a feat that they will want to use such as Improved Initiative (in order to get that song out sooner) or Lingering Performance.
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Listen, my Monk has a natural Constitution of 8 - she's level 6 now, kicking and ki-stealing her way through the Emerald Spire, and doing just fine.
I think a 4-point surge in melee attack rolls is a fine use of a feat - it's the people who think melee is an inconceivable eventuality for their character to the point of not even picking up a godsdamned quarterstaff who are making the mistake.
@Nixie: A ditz is someone with no light in their eyes, so to speak - your character, by contrast, almost sounds more like a misunderstood bodhisattva.
It's also possible to make a very competent martial bard. Archery is amazing for a bard, actually, especially since they get their own buffs. You also can make a melee bard... the reach weapon bard is especially popular. Just have to keep in mind with a melee bard that you need some way to keep your AC up, which often bards can have trouble with (but it is by no means impossible).
Just throwing out those options. :)
It's also possible to make a very competent martial bard. Archery is amazing for a bard, actually, especially since they get their own buffs. You also can make a melee bard... the reach weapon bard is especially popular. Just have to keep in mind with a melee bard that you need some way to keep your AC up, which often bards can have trouble with (but it is by no means impossible).
Just throwing out those options. :)
Mirror image is the best AC, but eats into action economy.
Mirror image is the best AC, but eats into action economy.
All fun and games until something has Blindsight or True Seeing. :)
The more standard flag bearer bard that goes up to +6/+6 hit/damage would be different from the one there.
I think a 4-point surge in melee attack rolls is a fine use of a feat - it's the people who think melee is an inconceivable eventuality for their character to the point of not even picking up a godsdamned quarterstaff who are making the mistake.
I never said don't pick up a weapon. At the very least, you want one so you can flank and provide the bonus.
I am objecting to you putting your first feat into something offensive that you are poor at. Either use it to improve something offensive that you are good at, or something defensive you want to shore up.
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Of course, a big part of making one spontaneous caster feel different from another is picking different spells. If you didn't take "Mad Monkeys" last time, I totally endorse that pick. Your character could insist that they are "sea monkeys", even though no one would believe him.
Sound Striker (my absolute fave Bard archetype) and Arcane Healer stack for an interesting character.
If you like Starknives and the possibility of getting Charisma to attack and damage, Desna's Shooting Star in Divine Anthology would be a fun addition.