I am in the process of building a Mooncursed Barbarian for PFS play and need some advice on feats/rage powers. I will be selecting the wolf as my animal focus and also have a few questions with how the Beast Shape spell line works.
First: Feats / Rage Powers
I want to focus on Natural Attacks, so any feat that gives me bonuses/upgrades to Bite and Claw attacks would be golden. I imagine I will be taking the Beast Totem line of Rage powers as that feels very appropriate.
But what other options are there?
Second: Beast Shape
How does Beast Shape work as far as my armor? Do I still retain the AC bonus from it, or does the armor drop to the floor in a heap and I receive no benefit from it? What about all my held items? My backpack?
Concept: A Half Orc Barbarian who was raised in a small tribe in the mountains and was attacked by a werewolf which left him as Mooncursed. Over time, he has accepted his curse and is learning to use it to his benefit. He will be silent and stealthy and work in the shadows when available to unleash full attacks with Claw/Claw/Bite, and then a Trip attempt.
your armor and most your gear melds into you and is magically gone, but magically comes back when you shape back to normal.
When you cast a polymorph spell that changes you into a creature of the animal, dragon, elemental, magical beast, plant, or vermin type, all of your gear melds into your body. Items that provide constant bonuses and do not need to be activated continue to function while melded in this way (with the exception of armor and shield bonuses, which cease to function). Items that require activation cannot be used while you maintain that form. While in such a form, you cannot cast any spells that require material components (unless you have the Eschew Materials or Natural Spell feat), and can only cast spells with somatic or verbal components if the form you choose has the capability to make such movements or speak, such as a dragon. Other polymorph spells might be subject to this restriction as well, if they change you into a form that is unlike your original form (subject to GM discretion). If your new form does not cause your equipment to meld into your form, the equipment resizes to match your new size.
Mooncursed gives you a hybrid form at 5th- keep your gear and use weapons.
Thank you...but I will lose my Armor Bonus from it. Seems I can not waste money on armor then, and focus on items that increase my AC magically (Ring/Necklace).
Any other items?
Like QuidEst says, at lv5 if you go hybrid form you keep all your gear.
The most common ways to boost AC for shape shifters is Mage Armor. Either a wand or having a friendly caster cast it on you using your pearl of power.
Well, I was wanting to focus on Natural Attacks, but at 5th level I could use the hybrid form and still gain the benefit of armor.
In any event, on the other side of things, the natural attacks... most feats that work for this are Monster Feats, which are prohibited in PFS. The next best alternative is an Amulet of Mighty Strikes.
It conflicts with an Amulet of Natural Armor, but it's worth it.
If, for whatever reason, you choose not to use a AoMS, get Eldritch Claws at some point so DR doesn't just completely neuter you.
hybrid form would still have the wolf bite and their hands would still be the claws from the rage power. There's nothing that stops you from focusing on natural attacks in hybrid form.
So there are no actual feats that a PFS legal player character can take which will increase the damage ability of natural attacks?
There will be a few Rage Powers that I can take, and the Amulet of Mighty Strikes. Is this all?
I was told about Gauntlets of Rend (i think that is the name) which will be helpful. Any other items?
I decided to switch to Tiger form as I will get Claw, Claw, Bite, and then Pounce at level 11. The Fiend Totem Rage power gives me a Gore attack at level 2.
I may choose one of the "Blood" type rage powers to gain some additional damage. There is one that adds elemental damage, and one that gives me the ability to Enlarge. I am a bit torn on which to choose.
You don't need feats that directly improve natural attacks. Combat feats that increase your static damage will apply to all attacks, and that's vastly better than Improved Natural Attack (bite).
Tiger is that best form if you don't need to swim.
Power Attack.
Fiend Totem is good as you'll now have 4 primary attacks.
I thought Enlarge was good when I was considering this build, but it wasn't for me because the large animal shapes don't get extra reach. However, my build stopped before hybrid, so maybe that puts Enlarge back on the table for you.
For AoMF, I'd go with simple enhancement bonuses--maybe Bane for a type I knew I'd be fighting a lot.
I have a question about how the AoMF works. I understand that you can simply enchant it with Bane without first making it +1 like you would a weapon, but does that then qualify your attacks as Magical?
going against the bane target yes, otherwise no.
OK, so more specific: does placing any type of enchantment (other than +1 attack/damage)on an AoMF make your attacks count as magical against the opponent you are striking?
I used Bane as an example. But how about Keen? Vicious? Holy? Energy?
OK, so more specific: does placing any type of enchantment (other than +1 attack/damage)on an AoMF make your attacks count as magical against the opponent you are striking?
I used Bane as an example. But how about Keen? Vicious? Holy? Energy?
Nope, that is the purpose of the +1.
OK, so it would be in my best interest to first make the AoMF +1/+1, and then start adding enchantments.
Are Natural Attacks considered weapons for the purposes of enchantment? It seems obvious they should be, but I know that sometimes RAW can be debated into the wee hours of the night.
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OK, so it would be in my best interest to first make the AoMF +1/+1, and then start adding enchantments.
Are Natural Attacks considered weapons for the purposes of enchantment? It seems obvious they should be, but I know that sometimes RAW can be debated into the wee hours of the night.
Sorta. They're weapons, but not masterwork or manufactured weapons, which strongly restricts what sort of things can enhance them.
Claws, bite, and gore would qualify for melee enhancements. EDIT: on an AoMF.
I just ran across this item in Ultimate Equipment: It seems this could take the place of the AoMF and give me the same functionality while still allowing me to wear the AoNA. Am I missing something?
Bodywrap of Mighty Strikes
Price Varies; Aura faint evocation; CL 5th; Weight 1 lb.
+1 bonus 3,000 gp; +2 bonus 12,000 gp; +3 bonus 27,000 gp; +4 bonus 48,000 gp; +5 bonus 75,000 gp; +6 bonus 108,000 gp; +7 bonus 147,000 gp
This long cloth is wrapped around the chest multiple times like a bandage. Once per round, the wearer may add an enhancement bonus of +1 to +5 on one attack and damage roll for an unarmed strike or natural attack (for one specific attack, not all attacks made with an unarmed strike that round). The wearer may use this item an additional time per round when his BAB reaches +6, +11, and +16.
Choosing to enhance an unarmed strike is not an action and may occur when it is not the wearer's turn (such as when making an attack of opportunity). The wearer must decide to use the item before the attack roll is made, but does not have to expend all uses at the same time. For example, if the wearer can use the item twice per round, he can use it once on his turn when making an attack and save the second for the possibility of making an attack of opportunity.
Additionally, the bodywrap can grant melee weapon special abilities to a creature's unarmed attacks, so long as those special abilities to be added apply to unarmed attacks. Special abilities count as additional bonuses for determining the market value of the item, but do not modify attack or damage bonuses. Any special abilities are set at the time of creation. A bodywrap of mighty strikes cannot have a modified bonus (enhancement bonus plus special ability bonus equivalents) higher than +7. Unlike an amulet of mighty fists, a bodywrap needs to have a +1 enhancement bonus to grant a melee weapon special ability.
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Reread the once per round part, you don't get it on all attacks, only enough for each iterative you have
This.
It's vaguely viable for a natural attack character at high enough level, but wouldn't apply to AoO even then.
Frankly, the people that item is good for are those with a two handed weapon and a bite attack. They can make pretty decent use of it, since they only need to add to one attack at a time.
Point taken.
If I am able to get an AoMF and make it +3 (+1 Attack/Damage, Vicious, maybe Bane or Flaming) that seems like it would be useful. Maybe also pick up the Bodywrap to add +1/+1 and another effect on a single attack each round. Granted, by the time I was doing that I would be at least 6th level and be able to do it on 2 attacks per round.
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Point taken.
If I am able to get an AoMF and make it +3 (+1 Attack/Damage, Vicious, maybe Bane or Flaming) that seems like it would be useful. Maybe also pick up the Bodywrap to add +1/+1 and another effect on a single attack each round. Granted, by the time I was doing that I would be at least 6th level and be able to do it on 2 attacks per round.
The third enhancement, and maybe the first you get, should be Furious. Furious is amazing.
Are magical tattoos allowed? You could tattoo the amulet of natural armor and still wear the amulet of mighty fists.
So, a raging barbarian who picked up an AoMF and put Furious on it would basically be adding +2 Attack/+2 Damage on all attacks....at the cost of 5000 gold. Then, he could continue to enchant it with additional effects up to a total of +5.
Seems fairly awesome. Furious it is!
Oh, and can someone explain the progression of magical enchants and breaking DR. I think I have heard someone mention that a +1 weapon was treated as Cold Iron or something like that. How does this work?
+1 = Cold Iron?
+5 = Adamantine?
There is a new rage power in the Villain Codex that is perfect for a mooncursed barbarian.
Atavism Totem, Lesser (Su): The barbarian gains a bite
attack; if she already has a bite attack, it deals damage as if
the barbarian were one size larger.
Especially if you a tiger mooncursed barbarian. As a medium tiger you get large bite damage, so with this rage power your bite damage would be in the huge category. So 2d6.
A medium tiger has a medium bite. Below lvl11, Atavism Totem would increase the damage of the bite from 1d8 to 2d6, or +2.5 damage. Which sounds good, but it's only 1/3 of the barb's attacks (I'd say hybrid form still has claws - basically, what you get is opposable thumbs).
What are the followup feats? I mean, Mooncursed is nice in that one can actually take totem rage powers that aren't named "beast".
Wild is a +3 Armor/Shield Property that lets you keep your Armor/Shield bonus to AC (including the Enhancement bonus) while wildshaped. It specifically says wildshape, which isn't exactly what the Mooncursed Barb does, but they're so similar, it'd be worth asking your GM if you could use it.
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A medium tiger has a medium bite. Below lvl11, Atavism Totem would increase the damage of the bite from 1d8 to 2d6, or +2.5 damage. Which sounds good, but it's only 1/3 of the barb's attacks (I'd say hybrid form still has claws - basically, what you get is opposable thumbs).
What are the followup feats? I mean, Mooncursed is nice in that one can actually take totem rage powers that aren't named "beast".
Not sure that would be right. There is no medium, so you have to downsize a large tiger, which has the damage dice of a huge bite. If you downsize the tiger from large to medium, it would down size the bite damage to large. Unless you know of text that says otherwise.
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Wild is a +3 Armor/Shield Property that lets you keep your Armor/Shield bonus to AC (including the Enhancement bonus) while wildshaped. It specifically says wildshape, which isn't exactly what the Mooncursed Barb does, but they're so similar, it'd be worth asking your GM if you could use it.
Says its for PFS, so yeah... Expect table variation with this.
(Personally I feel it SHOULD work, but I wouldn't be surprised if others disallow it)
Not sure that would be right. There is no medium, so you have to downsize a large tiger, which has the damage dice of a huge bite. If you downsize the tiger from large to medium, it would down size the bite damage to large.
Now I understand what you mean.
What I said: A normal tiger is large, therefore his bite is large. Decreasing the damage from large to normal we end up at 1d8.
What you said: According to the table for natural attacks, a tiger's bite has damage dice that would fite a huge bite. Decreasing the damage dice one step we end up at 1d8.
It's the same result, It's just that your terms are a bit confusing. The natural attacks table is meant to be a fallback in case some natural attack is for some reason lacking a listed damage dice. A tiger's bite is not a huge bite, it's simply the bite of a large creature that does 2d6 damage. Again, we mean the same thing, but you terminology becomes confusing once we add size changes (real or virtual), and basically doesn't work for some creatures (like Carnivorous Crystal - what would you call his 7d8?).
Regarding armor: In this thread, we came to the conclusion that Hybrid Rage imitates the hybrid form of lycantropes, which overrule the normal "you armor ceases to work" part of the polymorph rules.