Help Build Guts from Berserk


Advice


Hi Everyone

I been watching the new Berserk 2016 and found my self wanting to play Guts as a pathfinder PC my question is how to build him would love to see lvl by lvl brake down plz .

Sovereign Court

If your GM lets you use 3.5 rules, I'd just get Fullblade proficiency and wield a large sized one with Monkey-grip - getting the blade's damage up to 3d8. Maybe not take Monkey-grip until you want a post-craziness version when he got a bigger sword.

Guts is definitely not a spell-caster. I could see an argument of Guts being a barbarian to get him the solid saving throws he undoubtedly has,a jacked up DR, and Spell Sunder. A Slayer might fit pretty well too, though the low Will save might not fit.

Definitely give him the Sunder feat tree.


do a search there a lot of suggestions out there and lots of different opinion on how to make Gutz. A lot of close repsenations of him by the time you hit level 14 or 15 starts to look like him when he 1st met Griffith, but realistic with the current rule set based on everything Gutz does is basically impossible to make him to 100% accuracy with out going in to mythic and epic level rules and using gestalt and him being like 35 point buy character. Due to the feat system the character is more fighter then any other class then anything because you need that many feats to represent what he does. but he also has rage, proficiency with fire arms, repeating cross bow and he is actual fairly stealthy has almost some rogue qualities to him that he picked up from Juda. He is skilled in mounted combat also, has leadership feat, part of the reasone Griffith has his down fall because people start to look at Gutz the same way they used to look at him. This is shown even more so after the Black swordsman arch. He actual does not rage out as much as people think he does despite the name the show being berserk, he does a little bit when you 1st meet him in the story and then he calms down a lot and use level headed combat tactics. which others see a reckless, but it not something done out of rage. then he go on his crazy enraged careless quest of revenge in the black swordsmen arch. but even that passes in time and he shift away from that. which is where the new show is taking place currently. But both are very short periods of time. He later gets set of cursed magical armor, called berserk armor. which make him function like the 3.5 prestige class frenzied berserker.

your best bet to make him as close as possible is titan fighter/ invulnerable rager barbarin gestalt character

Sovereign Court

KainPen wrote:
do a search there a lot of suggestions out there and lots of different opinion on how to make Gutz. A lot of close repsenations of him by the time you hit level 14 or 15 starts to look like him when he 1st met Griffith,

I think that's an exaggeration. If the average troopers are level 2 warriors, Guts at level 6ish would be plenty high for him to be a badass when he first meets Griffith.

I don't think he ever really had mounted combat feats. (ranks in Ride, sure)

And I don't think that Leadership is needed to be a leader.

The skills & feats together is why I recommended Slayer.


Wow guys thanks
So with the suggested feat line of sunder and slayer/barbarian mostly for rage powers that he seems to have not that he is a rage monster.
What feats/rage powers should I focus on if starting at lvl one to try and come online by lvl 10
for example
lvl 1.?
2.? and so on
I know that is a lot to ask but I'm not vary good at flavor + optimize building.


I don't think it is, he uses improved unarmed strike against Griffith, uses the entire cleave feat tree when fighter Griffiths men, bite attack that he can use improved disarm with vs Griffith, improved grapple, improved disarm/trip, all in the 1st Griffith fight. Also improved dirty fighting as he flicks dirt and grass in griffith face. isn't there a feat that lets your armor break to avoid a critical hit. he has that uses it in the fight with the ax guy before that and not to mention sunder line on that guy. All of that in the 2nd ep.

he also more then likely has dazzling display as he intimidate Corkus and all other guys he use cleave through before they even attack them in 2nd ep. he mostly certain has the mounted combat tree, because he preforms full attacks while mounted during the raid scene when he bring up the rear line in the 3rd eps.

Power attack, most diffidently. Weapon focus and weapons sp more then likely because he spends all that time with his great sword. but those could maybe be debated away in some fashion.

This means he has those feat tax that go along feats also. seems also like he has endurance and die hard. As he sleeps in medium armor with out getting tired.

He picks up his first cohort in black swords man arch, the bar boy. I can't remember the characters name, so he most certainly has the feat, by that point. I am sure he picked it up by once he became commander of the band of the hawk raiders.

he has so many ability that pathfinder has determined to be a feat and not just function of the rule set or the requirement for said feats, he must be said level. now if you want to make power attack a non feat and just a game function, same for mounted combat, all the combat maneuvers, and remove all the feat taxes, then yeah he be around 6ish when he 1st meets Griffith. which makes more sense. but if you want to build him in pathfinder he going to be a much higher level. just because of the number of feats he uses.

not to mention his stats are going to be crazy high.

str is at least 18 to start,
dex is fairly decent at least 14 he tumble and roll around a lot the the black swords arch very graceful, and he is fairly stealthy, even though he botch his 1st assassination attempt, by getting notice after the fact his still made it all the way to the lords chambers with out being noticed.
con is at least a 16
int got to be higher then 13. just to use all the combat maneuvers. I says 14 he has lot of skill points.
wis only low score I say 8 or 9, he makes lot of stupid careless mistakes and takes him long time to learn from them
cha 12 or 14 back in the day. in the manga now his cha is almost = to Griffiths when they 1st meet. As he is inspiring so many people.

you almost have to use unchained revised action economy to bring him down in level also, and innate stat boot also and do away with magic items from the unchained book, to keep his level low. which would make a lot more sense consider how rare magic is in his world until after the eclipse.


So Kainpen your saying I should give up and not try
also the fight in the raid scene was over a long time at lest a hour so can say he was only making one attack per round + cleave also the fight with griffith all his unarmed fight could be subdual damage also lot of his combat maneuvers provoke attack of opportunity and we get leader ship for free when we hit lvl 10.
the main thing I will have to say to anyone looking at this world think almost everyone is lvl 1-3 only main PC are higher I say this because everyone of legendarily states has stories of them kill 30+ men in pathfinder that is nothing so a vary low lvl world globally

Sovereign Court

1 person marked this as a favorite.
KainPen wrote:

I don't think it is, he uses improved unarmed strike against Griffith, uses the entire cleave feat tree when fighter Griffiths men, bite attack that he can use improved disarm with vs Griffith, improved grapple, improved disarm/trip, all in the 1st Griffith fight. Also improved dirty fighting as he flicks dirt and grass in griffith face. isn't there a feat that lets your armor break to avoid a critical hit. he has that uses it in the fight with the ax guy before that and not to mention sunder line on that guy. All of that in the 2nd ep.

he also more then likely has dazzling display as he intimidate Corkus and all other guys he use cleave through before they even attack them in 2nd ep. he mostly certain has the mounted combat tree, because he preforms full attacks while mounted during the raid scene when he bring up the rear line in the 3rd eps.

I think you're worrying too much about having mechanics for every little thing. Pathfinder is a system where combat is run pretty abstractly. A lot of that stuff can happen without a mechanical justification.

Besides - once the two of them were disarmed, he could throw punches without provoking. And why did he need the entire sunder line in ep 2?

I'm dubious that his armor is medium. In Pathfinder terms it's probably a mithril breastplate.

KainPen wrote:
dex is fairly decent at least 14 he tumble and roll around a lot the the black swords arch very graceful, and he is fairly stealthy, even though he botch his 1st assassination attempt, by getting notice after the fact his still made it all the way to the lords chambers with out being noticed.

You don't need a good dex if you're just hiding from level 2 warriors, and he was already in the castle, so he didn't have to go by any heavily defended check-points. And you're right, the lord (likely actually had some levels) spotted him pretty quickly.

You don't need a good CHA to intimidate if you have max ranks and are higher level than most everyone you're intimidating. I don't remember anyone who was close to his level backing off before actually tangling with him.

Con of 14 would be plenty high if he had enough HD.

I think that you're too into the mode of thinking that all of his encounters are challenging CRs.

KainPen wrote:
He picks up his first cohort in black swords man arch, the bar boy. I can't remember the characters name, so he most certainly has the feat, by that point. I am sure he picked it up by once he became commander of the band of the hawk raiders.

Again - you don't need Leadership to have a hireling. If it were actually Leadership, the bar boy would be much more of a badass as he would (by your logic) be level 10-12. Which he pretty obviously wasn't.


Thank you Charon's Little Helper for having faith in what we are working on.

Also I have been reading past post on this question of making guts and I feel many people feel things are black and white with what some one in rage should look like everyone seems to think if you are using rage you are in blind rage unable to think or anything but I don't see that being true I see it as channeling what you are feeling to power and nothing more.


Bump

Still would like help with lvl progression


I think ill go half-giant so i get the count one size larger for weapon use and for class will be fighter/ invulnerable rager barbarin gestalt character
Dm said that will be fine


Large bastard sword with proficiency, wielded in two hands. 2d8 damage. Heavy wrist launcher. I would say most levels are barbarian, some are fighter. Maybe even some Slayer levels towards the end, for crossbow mastery. Sneak attack and deadly aim would quickly drop lowbie thugs, then you draw your sword to finish the rest. On phone, or else I'd try a more complete, actual build.


Optimization makes static bonuses the better thing to specialize in. Even if Damage Dice might be cooler and more thematic, Guts' character build wouldn't have the tools needed to really kick it off. You don't have size increasing abilities to make it shine, both virtual and actual. That's spellcaster territory; more specifically, Druids and Monks.

Large-sized Bastard Sword is the same thing as a Full Blade in 3.X. Unfortunately, -2 size penalty and needing to spend a feat to even use it at all is an issue to make effective, even with Bonus Feats. Greatsword would be a safer choice, but again, static bonuses are best, which means critical-focused weapons are better. This means 18-20/X2 multipliers with decent damage dice. The only weapon that does this is the Nodachi, which is just a giant ass sword with a big hilt; but, if your GM is willing to gestalt, I'm sure he wouldn't mind a simple weapon reflavoring.

Speaking of gestalt, while I'm not 100% sure of the rules, I suggest you pick up a different class besides Fighter. Sure, their situation improved, but honestly, Slayers are better, and do fit Guts' character better. You'll still get access to bonus feats, and in fact, can be used to better supplement Guts' other combat utilities (his grenades, Repeating Hand Crossbow, Arm Cannon, etc). There's also the matter that Guts is a cunning and devious combatant, especially when he's desperate, and has been known to use distractions to catch an enemy flat-footed (which in turn makes them open to a devastating Sneak Attack).

Race would be Human. You could go Dual Talent for the attribute increases, as you'll have plenty of skill ranks per level (4 + at the minimum), but the bonus feat isn't anything to scoff at. However, you should have plenty of feats, both bonus and otherwise, to make him able to function with most (if not all) of his weapons. The arm cannon is a gray area, and really functions as a McGuffin, because it's basically a Siege weapon shrunken down into a single mechanical forearm. I'd talk to your GM about how he would run it as, and plan accordingly. If it's a Firearm, you have it covered. If it's a Siege Weapon, well...that's more complicated.

Favored Class Bonus should go into the Human Barbarian Racial FCB.

Anywho, Basic Feat Progression:

1. Power Attack [duh]
2. Precise Shot [For the Repeating Crossbow]
3. Raging Vitality
4. Exotic Weapon Proficiency (Repeating Hand Crossbow)
5. Improved Initiative
6. Crossbow Mastery
7. Accomplished Sneak Attacker
8. Exotic Weapon Proficiency (Firearms) or Weapon Focus (Nodachi*)
9. Extra Rage Power (Lesser Beast Totem)
10. Point Blank Master
11-20. ANY

Rage Power Progression (basically cookie cutter):

2. Superstitious
4. Reckless Abandon
6. Witch Hunter
8. Spell Sunder
9. Lesser Beast Totem
10. Beast Totem
12. Greater Beast Totem
14. Guarded Stance
16. Rolling Dodge
18. Reflexive Dodge
20. Auspicious Mark?

Attributes:

Strength 20 (18 + 2)
Dexterity 12
Constitution 16 (14 + 2)
Intelligence 10
Wisdom 10
Charisma 7

Skills (6 X 20 = 120 Skill Points)

Survival MAX
Perception MAX
Intimidate MAX
Acrobatics MAX
Stealth MAX
Climb + Swim MAX (Let's just hope he never does so again in full armor)

That should about do it. Good luck, my friend.


Thank you Darksol the Painbringer
Ill spend the night looking in to the build you have place
I don't think I'm going to do the arm cannon probably stay with younger Guts because I plan on starting lvl one and let the world shape him some wile I keep the image of Gits in my mind but I do plan on using his back story of his birth and child hood.

Thank you again really happy and excite to look in to all you guys have posted : )


So for Barbarian, Im thinking Titan Mauler, this gives you the ability to wield a two-handed weapon with one hand or take less penalties from using over-sized weapons... giving you that gigantic blade action and increased damage. Armored Hulk could work as well if you wanna Rage in full plate. Invulnerable Rager is very sturdy especially with the Guarded Life rage powers doubling DR vs nonlethal making you very difficult to kill at higher levels.

Rage Powers:
Animal Fury- adds a bite attack while raging
Smasher- for amazing sundering
Clear Mind-8- reroll failed Will save
Fearless Rage-12- immune to shaken and frightened
Mighty Swing-12-auto confirm a critical
Renewed Vigor-4- Heal yourself
Renewed Vitality-4- Ignore ability damage
Roused Anger- Enter rage even when Fatigued
Unexpected Strike-8- Free attack
Improved Damage Reduction

Levels in Fighter will help with all the bonus feats but if you're thinking of only a couple levels then check out the Unbreakable archetype, it gives you Endurance and Diehard at level 1.

Feats:
-Power Attack, Cleave, Greater Cleave
-Weapon Focus, Dazzling Display, Gory Finish
-Improved Sunder, Greater Sunder
-Vital Strike, Improved Vital Strike, Greater Vital Strike, Furious Finish
-Improved Critical
-Critical Focus, Bleeding Critical
-Combat Expertise, Stalwart, Improved Stalwart (amazing with Invulnerable Rager)


I am not saying his impossible to build, I am just say don't expect him to be just like Gutz by until around upper levels of the game.

you all must not read the manga The bar kid does be come a little bad ass, they are just introducing him now in the show. He is a bit of clown and written as comic relief.

you all keep saying also that he is fighting level 2 warriors, but level 2 warriors can't afford or never have full plate, just about everyone he fights has full plate, + other gear. so most people he fights are around level 3- 5. I would say most of the band of the hawk are this level with few exceptions being higher. around 8 or 9, then you Gutz and Griffith where are clearly well above the rest. Gutz beats them with easily.

Lizard king has a good setup up, but look at what level you have to be to get the rage power he has.

This is the problem with trying to recreated fantasy novel hero in a game system does not work because these character grow at exponential rates and do things even the most bad ass in there world can not do. Conan is another good example of this back when 3rd edition came out they made a Conan supplement, Conan had 18 int, because in the books he described as genius and master linguist. he was also level like 26. fighter barb rouge.

these character are written to be be larger than life, this is why they must be built as Gestalt Mythic characters if you want to recreate them accurately. because that what they are. So if you just looking for a feel, don't expect character to feel mechanically like him until upper levels, the feat system and action economy kill the ability to do that.

Gestalt, fighter/barb level 8 1 or 2 mythic tiers and you have early guts, post eclipse he is level 20 with at least 3 teirs

Sovereign Court

KainPen wrote:


you all keep saying also that he is fighting level 2 warriors, but level 2 warriors can't afford or never have full plate, just about everyone he fights has full plate, + other gear.

No way are most troopers wearing full plate. Either a breastplate (Pathfinder armor 'breastplate' is more than just a breastplate) or maybe half plate. Both of which are affordable by level 2-3 warriors. (There are far too many gaps in their armor to be full plate.) Even a level 3 warrior in half plate isn't much of a threat to a well built level 8 heroic martial, and with 14-18hp, they're easily killable in a single swing by a two-hander.

The knights are probably in full plate and are a bit higher level, but Guts actually has trouble with most of them. (Other than the knights in ep 2 of the current show which are specifically called out for being rich spoiled brats/weaklings - so standard WBL doesn't apply. They probably had Aristocrat levels.)


Here are two other threads that could help you:
http://paizo.com/threads/rzs2shzw?Trying-to-make-Guts#1
http://paizo.com/threads/rzs2q28k?Tips-on-how-to-build-Guts-the-Black-Sword sman#1

In a way most pathfinder martials end up feeling a lot like Guts at high level. Slashing some oversized monster with a two handed weapon, while tanking enormous amounts of damage is all they do.

If I was you, I would try to focus on one aspect and build accordingly.

Personally I would do something like this:

Race: Human
Class: Barbarian Hateful Rager(ignoring the fact this is for Orcs/Halforcs or make him a very human looking half orc)

Fitting Feats: Power Attack, Improved Sunder, Ferocious Tenacity(if allowed the non-nerved version)
Fitting Rage Powers: Superstittious --> Ghost Rager, Rolling Dodge, Raging Leaper--> Raging flier, Animal Fury Line, Internal Fortitude
Strong Rage powers: Come and Get Me, Witchhunter, Animal Totem Line,

Community / Forums / Pathfinder / Pathfinder First Edition / Advice / Help Build Guts from Berserk All Messageboards

Want to post a reply? Sign in.