Favored Enemy (Vermin)


Rules Questions

Scarab Sages

Working on a Gnomish Bug Hunter for PFS...yeah, kinda silly, but I'm enjoying it.

Anyway, swarms are probably the most commonly encountered form of vermin, so I gotta ask, does favored enemy apply to swarms?

Obviously, it doesn't work with normal weapons due to swarm traits, so does favored enemy apply to splash weapons or splash damage?

How about damage over time effects created from alchemical substances, like alchemist's fire, or pints of oil?

Though not really a swarm related one, but while on topic, does favored enemy apply to caltrops and other traps employed by the ranger?

Also, and this one is more an advice question, other than splash weapons and spells, what are some good options for dealing with swarms? Ideally things I can apply the favored weapon bonuses to, but I think my bug hunter should know the full array of options.

Thanks.


Murdock Mudeater wrote:

Working on a Gnomish Bug Hunter for PFS...yeah, kinda silly, but I'm enjoying it.

Anyway, swarms are probably the most commonly encountered form of vermin, so I gotta ask, does favored enemy apply to swarms?

Obviously, it doesn't work with normal weapons due to swarm traits, so does favored enemy apply to splash weapons or splash damage?

How about damage over time effects created from splash weapons, like alchemist's fire, or pints of oil?

Though not really a swarm related one, but while on topic, does favored enemy apply to caltrops and other traps employed by the ranger?

Also, and this one is more an advice question, other than splash weapons and spells, what are some good options for dealing with swarms? Ideally things I can apply the favored weapon bonuses to, but I think my bug hunter should know the full array of options.

Thanks.

Light them on fire, Poison Gas or Be a Breeze-Kissed Sylph? Also can you devour a swarm?


This is not remotely rules-binding since I've never played a ranger & never looked closely at the rules, but here's my take:

Murdock Mudeater wrote:
so I gotta ask, does favored enemy apply to swarms?

This Swarm (first one I randomly googled) seems to also have the "Vermin" creature type, so unless there's some special rule the default is that it should work. I guess it depends whether the swarm has the "vermin" type ... I'd assume a lot of them do.

Murdock Mudeater wrote:
Obviously, it doesn't work with normal weapons due to swarm traits, so does favored enemy apply to splash weapons or splash damage?

The relevant section in Ranger's Favoured enemy sectoin says: "he gets a +2 bonus on weapon attack and damage rolls against them."

This seems to imply it's only weapons, although what you/your GM consider weapons could vary widely. Personally I'd consider "Splash Weapons" to be weapons, but maybe I'm just old fashioned.

Murdock Mudeater wrote:
How about damage over time effects created from alchemical substances, like alchemist's fire, or pints of oil?

Again, if you consider this weapon damage I'd apply it, but I could see arguments either way here.

Murdock Mudeater wrote:
Though not really a swarm related one, but while on topic, does favored enemy apply to caltrops and other traps employed by the ranger?

No idea, I'd probably go with no since the favoured enemy bonus is supposed to represent the fact that you've studied these creatures and know how to exploit their weaknesses better. Unless you can somehow argue that you dropped the caltrops in a special way that's somehow more dangerous to one creature than another ...?

Traps I could see working better though ... This part is honestly just speculation though. Ask someone who knows better =P

Murdock Mudeater wrote:
Also, and this one is more an advice question, other than splash weapons and spells, what are some good options for dealing with swarms? Ideally things I can apply the favored weapon bonuses to, but I think my bug hunter should know the full array of options.

Swarmbane Clasp

Swarm Suit

Vermin Repellent

Also, after reading just a few of these things this seems like a really fun character to play, so keep us posted =D


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IF it requires an attack roll you can usually apply things like favoured weapon bonus. So it will apply to your initial attack with a splash weapon, but not to the splash damage if you miss, or to damage over time effects.

It won't apply to things such as caltrops as they use their own attack bonus not yours.

Seconding the swarmbane clasp.


From the SRD:

http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/core-classes/ranger#TOC-Favored-Enemy-Ex-

Favored Enemy (Ex)

At 1st level, a ranger selects a creature type from the ranger favored enemies table. He gains a +2 bonus on Bluff, Knowledge, Perception, Sense Motive, and Survival checks against creatures of his selected type. Likewise, he gets a +2 bonus on weapon attack and damage rolls against them. A ranger may make Knowledge skill checks untrained when attempting to identify these creatures.

Favored enemy damage bonus applies to any damage from an attack your character rolls. Thus, for example, if you were to throw a flask of alchemist's fire, you would roll 1d6+2 damage if you hit your favored enemy, since you've made an attack roll. You wouldn't add +2 damage to the splash from the same flask however, since splash damage isn't an attack roll. You also wouldn't add +2 damage to the burn damage in the next round, since this doesn't include an attack roll.

Caltrops don't add favored enemy bonus damage, as these roll their own attack at +0. Traps likewise are making their own attack roll, using your ranger level plus wisdom bonus as their attack modifier, though most are simply a saving throw.

In order to deal with swarms, aside from the obvious use of area of effect spells and splash weapons, don't forget the rules regarding wind. Gust of Wind and Hurricane Blast deals swarms nonlethal damage, no save. Wind Wall blocks them from moving, and you can contain them in a specific location by shaping it into a circle. Not probably useful to your Ranger unless you've invested into UMD, but handy to remember if you're faced with a tricky swarm, such as templated creatures that are immune to most types of energy damage.

Scarab Sages

dragonhunterq wrote:

IF it requires an attack roll you can usually apply things like favoured weapon bonus. So it will apply to your initial attack with a splash weapon, but not to the splash damage if you miss, or to damage over time effects.

It won't apply to things such as caltrops as they use their own attack bonus not yours.

Seconding the swarmbane clasp.

I can work with that. Thanks. And that swarmbane clasp that MrCharisma linked (and you seconded) looks amazing when I get to a high enough Fame to acquire one.

MrCharisma wrote:
Also, after reading just a few of these things this seems like a really fun character to play, so keep us posted =D

Haven't gotten a chance to use it, but the class is mostly built.

Spoiler:

Advanced Race Guide has the "Warden of Nature" race trait option for the Gnome race, which replaces hatred and defensive training with +1 trait bonus to attack and +2 dodge to AC vs Vermin, Oozes, and aberations. So the plan is to start with Vermin for my favored enemy, then Oozes, then Aberrations. Entire concept started with that.

There's also a trait in People of the Sands, "Vermin Wrangler" which adds +2 save vs the Ex abilities of vermin and +2 to ID vermin with knowledge checks.

For the ranger, I found this nifty feat in ultimate combat:

Quote:

Shapeshifting Hunter

You blend your knowledge of foes and your shapeshifting abilities together.

Prerequisites: Favored enemy class feature, wild shape class feature.

Benefit: Your levels of druid stack with your ranger levels for determining when you select your next favored enemy. Also, your ranger levels stack with your druid levels in determining the number of times per day you can use your wild shape class feature, up to a maximum of eight times per day.

So my PC is actually going to be a druid, I'm just dipping my first level into the ranger to get the favored enemy. First level ranger also means more starting HP, BAB and weapon/armor access.

I got this cool gnome model from Reaper miniatures, which has a Gnome in a beetle shaped "suit" of armor. I'll add my own touches too. I'm going with Bone Breastplate, for this PC, which will work well with the druid to be acquired later. Under the bone material description, says it can be shell instead, so it's Vermin Shell armor. I think the armor will be painted as a ladybug. Should be cute and very gnomish.

Scarab Sages

JDLPF wrote:
Favored enemy damage bonus applies to any damage from an attack your character rolls.

Any clue where they got that? It's not in my rulebook, nor on the PRD, nor Archives of Nethys.


PFSRD wrote:
[The Ranger] gains a +2 bonus on Bluff, Knowledge, Perception, Sense Motive, and Survival checks against creatures of his selected type. Likewise, he gets a +2 bonus on weapon attack and damage rolls against them

So not any damage, weapon damage. Alchemist fire is a thrown weapon so you'd get the bonus to hit and damage for the direct hit but not the slash damage.

Scarab Sages

So looks like Throw Anything is my 1st level feat, as splash weapons are my main option against Vermin Swarms at 1st level. That swarmbane clasp will be perfect for higher levels.

I had major trouble finding anything along the lines of poisoned clouds via search functions. Suggestions of cloud/area attacks which are non-magical in nature remain welcome.

There is the Jetcaster, which is a pretty solid option and PFS legal, though I've never seen them used in play.

Anyway, thanks for the help.

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