I'd like to build a character that focuses on the combination of the "Sliding Axe Throw" and "Relentless Shot" feats, but I'm not sure the best way to go about it.
I'm leaning toward Lore-Warden for the CMB bonus and extra feats, right now. Are there any other good options for something like this?
You're basically required to be a fighter to successfully build a thrown weapon character. Well, at the very least you need something that gets the fighters Weapon Training so you can take advanced weapon training.
You need to build a thrown weapon character, and then customize it for what you want to do.
Have a look here and here for some general advice on how to make a thrown weapon build.
It's very very feat intensive, so to make it work decently you need a class that has a lot of feats which is why classes like fighter or warpriest are the best suited to do it.
I haven't tried making a Vigilante thrown weapon build yet, but I think it might have potential. The Returning Weapon Talent seems great. Finding a way to get your weapons back is one of the biggest hurdles for a thrown weapon build, and this is available at 2nd level!
Taking TWF instead of Rapid Shot would give you an extra attack for both melee and ranged attacks, and you could add Lethal Grace to make your melee attacks decent. If you went Stalker, then I think the Sniper Talent might be nice.
Anyway, I think it's worth taking a look at the Vigilante.
Lore Warden is pretty good for this. Get Ricochet Shot and everything else you may need.
Design Manager
|
Divine Hunter Paladin is generally good for thrown builds, and gets some good benefits from Divine Bond. May be tight on feats, but throwing Smites around is fun.
Brawler or Warpriest could potentially be really solid options as well. Brawler can use his MF feats to adapt to melee or ranged tactics, and Warpriest can use Sacred Weapon to improve the generally crappy base damage of thrown weapons.
I wonder if the Startoss style would be of any benefit? At least the 2nd in the line give you a semi-cleave as a standard action could be nice for hit'n run tactics.
I haven't tried making a Vigilante thrown weapon build yet, but I think it might have potential. The Returning Weapon Talent seems great. Finding a way to get your weapons back is one of the biggest hurdles for a thrown weapon build, and this is available at 2nd level!
Taking TWF instead of Rapid Shot would give you an extra attack for both melee and ranged attacks, and you could add Lethal Grace to make your melee attacks decent. If you went Stalker, then I think the Sniper Talent might be nice.
Anyway, I think it's worth taking a look at the Vigilante.
Returning Weapon talent doesn't actually work that well.
It adds the returning property to your weapon, which means it doesn't return until right before your next turn. And if you moved it lands in the square you were in when you threw it, not where you are now. It's not until 14th level where the ability is actually usable, as it is only then it will enable you to make full attack actions. So no, unfortunately Vigilante just isn't really feasible unless your starting at very high levels.
Ricochet toss is basically required here to make a throwing build work.
It's also worth noting a fighter can get sacred weapon damage dice scaling through the use of Advanced Weapon Training making up for poor damage dice.
Personally I'm a fan of the Molthuni Arsenal Chaplain which grants you Weapon Training (and enables you to pick up Advanced Weapon Training as a feat) combined with the other perks of being a Warpriest. You get swift action self buffing and 6th levels spells off the cleric spell list. With Divine Favor/Divine power you can easily buff yourself into the same damage range as a dedicated fighter, but you have slightly more options thanks to spells.
Barbarian is a good choice for throwing. You can pump your dex a bit higher for your to-hit roll, and get the Str back from the trade-off with Rage.
Far Strike Monk enables you to pick up a lot of the required feats pretty fast.
The best advice provided up until now is likely that by Claxon.
To make a thrower work you really need fighter levels so that you can get ricochet toss (Weapon Master will get you there with only a 3 level dip). Alternatively you can rely on a blink back belt but that means no stat boosting item for you which is a big hit to any character.
Also fighter is kinda required as you need a gazzilion feats to make throwing viable. (Quick Draw, PBS, Rapid Shot, Precise Shot, Ricochet Toss and in your instance Sliding Axe Throw and Relentless Shot as well as Combat Reflexes).
Considering that you seem intent on debuffing with your ranged attacks the startoss line of feats might actually work for this (instead of rapidshot and quickdraw).
Quick Draw is required for Ricochet Toss so it's non negotiable.
Thanks very much for all the advice everyone! Definitely got a lot to consider now.
Maybe just use a melee weapon with the Sharding enchantment. It's not real throwing, but it's in the realm of fantasy rpgs and mmos.
I haven't tried making a Vigilante thrown weapon build yet, but I think it might have potential. The Returning Weapon Talent seems great. Finding a way to get your weapons back is one of the biggest hurdles for a thrown weapon build, and this is available at 2nd level!
Taking TWF instead of Rapid Shot would give you an extra attack for both melee and ranged attacks, and you could add Lethal Grace to make your melee attacks decent. If you went Stalker, then I think the Sniper Talent might be nice.
Anyway, I think it's worth taking a look at the Vigilante.
Returning Weapon talent doesn't actually work that well.
It adds the returning property to your weapon, which means it doesn't return until right before your next turn. And if you moved it lands in the square you were in when you threw it, not where you are now. It's not until 14th level where the ability is actually usable, as it is only then it will enable you to make full attack actions. So no, unfortunately Vigilante just isn't really feasible unless your starting at very high levels.
...
Good points. It sounds like Returning Weapon is better for adding a small ranged option to a Dex-based melee build.
Quick Draw is required for Ricochet Toss so it's non negotiable.
Well assuming you rely on startoss and use your standard action to attack multiple foes you actually don't need Ricochet toss. Not saying this is super optimal but consider that you are getting -2 hit from sliding axe and you can't make multiple attacks against single foes you've tripped (due to the +4 to AC from prone) this would work fairly well for a vigilante who gets returning on his weapons.
If you make your character a Human of Ulfen ethnicity, they can take the Weapon Training trait from Inner Sea Races. It gets you +1 damage with a Throwing Axe (and also with any Bastard Sword, Battleaxe, Greataxe, Greatsword, Handaxe, Light Hammer, Longbow, Longsword, Shortbow, Short Sword, and Warhammer). I think a Half-Elf or Half-Orc of Ulfen ethnicity can also take this trait.
I'm definitely taking a level of Far Strike Monk for the multiple helpful feats, and basic flurry.
Vigilante is interesting. Avenger specialization gets the Combat Skill talent, which can give out nearly as many feats as a fighter. Most of the other talents are worth multiple feats on their own, too.
If you go with Far Strike Monk it's prolly best to go either 2 or 4 levels as anything up to 4th does not cost you BAB, improves your saves, gives you more AC and eventually a Ki-Pool.
Sadly that one point of BAB lost really hurts. Monk 4 Weapon MAster Fighter 3 would get you Ricochet Toss at 7.
No point in diluting class imho. Full Far Strike, full Fighter, full Vigilante, all of these are better than multiclassing.
If your building to 20 that might be the case. For the PFS level range I wholeheartedly disagree.
And the Farstrike monk in particular really starts to dry up after 4th level. The throw and move abilities are snazy and all but honestly that's not what you want to do with a dedicated thrower anyhow.
I'm playing a Warpiest/Evangelist of Pharasma in Carrion Crown and Startoss Style has helped me do a fair bit of damage. I had to 'cleric nova' against a boss type creature and got up to 1d8+13+2d4(holy ice weapon) and pretty much handle the frontline as well. Just need to get my daggers [agile] and grab Pirahna Strike/Deadly Aim now and I'll be set.
Sometimes I even switch over to my Throwing Hammers to deal with skeletons and skeletal champions.