Neither Rain, nor Sleet, nor Snow - Messengers in your game


Pathfinder First Edition General Discussion


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One thing we take for granted in the modern world is mail and package deliveries. But in the fantasy settings used in pathfinder we often over look how long it takes for missives to get from one place to another or how letters are even delivered in the first place. With examples given in Pathfinder's Golarion setting I take a look at a few of the possibilities of how message go to and fro and what impact they might have on players in their adventures.

Have letters, missives, and notes played a role in your campaigns? If so how? Is there a dedicated messenger services?


Messengers traditionally fall over dead after delivering the letter, the final piece of information being the exact kind of arrow or bolt lodged in their back.


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I use Thurn and Taxis myself.


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I will admit ignorance and state I have no clue what Thurn and Taxis is. Having the messenger die just as he delivers the message is a tad cliche but it work sometimes.

Silver Crusade

The GPS (Golarion Postal Service) is primarily made up of druids, wizards, and rangers, who utilize animal companions/familiars to deliver the messages.


Magic


Magic is prohibitive to the common person. Most people only see a silver or so a year. Only the rich can really afford to have spells cast for them. So there needs to be a more mundane way to get messages around the world.


Well for short distances you can send couriers, they're in the hireling rules, for longer distances you use spells like whispering wind and sending.


Pathfinder Starfinder Maps, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

In our home Kingmaker game, we have set up carrier pigeons and locations for Animal Messenger's to drop off their messages. This obviously only works for short messages.

Past that we assume that the patrols drop things off when required.

In past editions of D&D, Scrying could be done on something other than a creature. This caused a player in a different campaign to come up with MageBook. Put your arcane mark on a large wood board or chalkboard. Others can scry on it. Now you just post any notes to the board and others can read them from a very long distance.

This doesn't work quite as well anymore now that you must scry on a creature. It could still be adapted (pets are creatures), but you can't leave it unmaintained.


MageBook is kinda a cool idea. Now I'm wondering as modern folk we put a lot of these ideas we have no and adapt them to the magic that is used in the time period of the game. But would the people then really have thought to use their abilities with the same applications we do because they don't have modern technology to base things off of.

Silver Crusade

Apupunchau wrote:
Magic is prohibitive to the common person. Most people only see a silver or so a year. Only the rich can really afford to have spells cast for them. So there needs to be a more mundane way to get messages around the world.

They see much more than that. As per the profession skill, untrained people make one sp a day.


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Lesser planar binding and lesser planar ally can both call creatures capable of teleportation -- probably the simplest and easiest are lantern archons, with greater teleport and truespeech. Probably going to be mostly used by either lawful/good temples, or by wizards of some skill, so not in common use, but I would be very surprised if major governments did not have some access to this. Teleporting creatures can repeat messages, and carry packages with them, so great for mail delivery. (On Golarion, I can certainly see Abadar's priests running a network like this -- after all, post offices are one of the foundations of civilization -- "neither snow, nor rain, nor hail, nor sleet, nor dragons, nor krakens, shall stay these carriers from the swift completion of their appointed rounds".)

Rangers and druids with animal messenger are more likely to be helping the common folk.

Sending spells are short (25 words per casting) but allow a reply. Again, expensive to pay for, but not impossible.


Magic is expensive, but far cheaper than the alternative once we get beyond pretty much a day or two travel time. Yes, only the rich can afford it, but generally speaking, the poor don't have transcontinental concerns.


i wana play an adventuring mail man now......


what about message journals/ journey books (sword of truth) two small books linked together what is written in one appears in the other and either side can erase the message or reply. but i would expect that they would not be in every persons hands it would a magical item that would be for adventurer parties or businesses to have to contact employees or their bosses rare to find together or hard to make it might be a side quest you find one in a dead guys hands and you can decide to complete his quest maybe they ring or flash until they are answered which could cause issues if your trying to be stealthy damn arcane cell phone!


i like how "the name of the wind" set up its mail system. you barter with a traveler pay him a price to carry your letter and he takes it as far as he is going and sells the letter to another traveler thats heading in the right direction the price of the letter goes up the more hands are required to get to the person it is going to and the person it is going to has to barter with the deliverer on a price or not get his letter. but then again you can always stab the post man in the back to get your letter for free.


Between smaller villages it may literally be a paid courier. Just as often its managed (for a small price) by a trade caravan and dropped off at one of the main taverns. In those small towns, people know each other enough that it can eventually be gotten to the right person.

In my larger cities, they also have sub-divisions that operate similar to a small village. Guard post exclusive to their area of town, a mayor elected by populace in that area only, and so a similar system can suffice.

Funny enough this just came up in our last session as my PCs found a letter in a room with markings from an outpost nearly a weeks ride away and dated about 5 months prior. So there were some discussions about how mail actually would have traveled. Simple was easiest for me - it takes longer, but is cheaper. if you want prompt hand-delivered, you pay someone to make the trip and probably with a few mercenaries.


I find it odd that for players magic is always the answer yet in most world settings it is hardly ever used for such mundane things. Everyone is looking to magical means to send messages yet in every piece of lore the on Golarion the Pathfinder society sends letters from lodge to lodge not magical means of transmission. Count Jeggear (sp?)records his notes in journals and sends off copies of them even when the information is important, I never remember him sending any transmission via magic even though he himself is a caster. Even in worlds like Fearun and Kyrnn I remember most missives being sent by courier with very little use of magically transmitted messages yet most comments on this topic across many board seem to go straight to magic as the answer and not just for messages. People seem to want to use magic to solve every little problem.


I'd expect to see a lot of trained animals and vaguely intelligent monsters used as messengers. IRL we don't get anything much better than pigeons, but Golarion has a rather wider selection. The hazards are greater than IRL, of course.


Apupunchau wrote:

One thing we take for granted in the modern world is mail and package deliveries. But in the fantasy settings used in pathfinder we often over look how long it takes for missives to get from one place to another or how letters are even delivered in the first place. With examples given in Pathfinder's Golarion setting I take a look at a few of the possibilities of how message go to and fro and what impact they might have on players in their adventures.

Have letters, missives, and notes played a role in your campaigns? If so how? Is there a dedicated messenger services?

There are none. If a noble wants a message sent, that's what his flunkies are for. Pretty much the same applies to anyone with a significant amount of power.

Common folk rely on paying merchants to deliver notes and parcels if the recipient is on their route.

Needless to say, such services are far more expensive than they are now, and most folks don't have a "you got mail" as part of their routine. Distance does separate people in a way it does not today.


Ravens.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Lost Omens, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

Reasonably stable nation-states like Cheliax, Andoran, or Taldor presumably have some sort of postal system, even if it's expensive and/or inconvenient.

For basket cases like Isger or Galt, or for international mail?

Desnan priests, Abadarian road-wardens, sending stuff with trade caravans, hoping those crazy adventurers remember to deliver your letter...


zainale wrote:

i wana play an adventuring mail man now......

Emissary Cavalier archetype. That's really the only use for it...


In PFS I have a 14th level Aerokineticist with a bag of holding, all the range extension Infusions and Utility powers, and Ride the Blast. Traveling at 940 miles every 8 hours, this character makes for an effective postwoman, and charges very fair rates to transport letters and small parcels almost anywhere.


Pony express?


Ventnor wrote:
Pony express?

Fun fact...the Pony Express only lasted for 19 months.

The cost of sending a letter would be the equivalent of $130 dollars in today's money. And that is in a world far more advanced than Golarion.


Drahliana Moonrunner wrote:
Ventnor wrote:
Pony express?

Fun fact...the Pony Express only lasted for 19 months.

The cost of sending a letter would be the equivalent of $130 dollars in today's money. And that is in a world far more advanced than Golarion.

This focuses in on a key (and perhaps overlooked at times) principal of any business or service - cost/benefit. People's time and risk cost money, and if you want to benefit from their time/risk you have to pay for it.

If its government provided, that means its most often paid for from general taxes or "use" taxes. Two fantasy town examples could be guards, who's wages, weapons and guard-post are paid for from the general taxation; while a toll bridge or ferry could primarily be funded by use tax.

Whether its a monarchy, town council, or some other form of government, the risk of funding too many things from general taxes is that you'll run out of money or need to raise taxes. Even for the government there is a cost/benefit.

My thought is the average person lives and dies so close to where they were born, and either literally lives with most of their relatives, or can walk across the village. Therefore most people don't use the mail, and providing a government funded central postal system isn't cost beneficial.

Businesses and a small portion of the populace may transmit information and goods between tows or across town, so these types of services fit better into either a government "use" funded system that could perhaps be piggybacked on something they're already paying for out of the general fund; or they're a business in and of themselves (FEDEX). That being the case, you could in nearly any world pay to have something either teleported by itself or on someone if you really had the gold and desire, but the normal methods would be more mundane purely because of cost/benefit.


GM 1990 wrote:
Drahliana Moonrunner wrote:
Ventnor wrote:
Pony express?

Fun fact...the Pony Express only lasted for 19 months.

The cost of sending a letter would be the equivalent of $130 dollars in today's money. And that is in a world far more advanced than Golarion.

This focuses in on a key (and perhaps overlooked at times) principal of any business or service - cost/benefit. People's time and risk cost money, and if you want to benefit from their time/risk you have to pay for it.

The Express Riders were paid about $100 per month in 1860 currency. Average wage back then was about sixty cents per day.


Wait, this is a fantasy world.

Hippogriff Express.


Ventnor wrote:

Wait, this is a fantasy world.

Hippogriff Express.

One thing that's true about most "fantasy adventurers." They still expect commensurate pay for their activities and their stature. Neither hippogriffs, nor their riders grow on trees. And for a service to exist you need consistent demand to meet their prices.

This means for most folk, casual letters, casualc communication isn't a thing.


Drahliana Moonrunner wrote:
Ventnor wrote:

Wait, this is a fantasy world.

Hippogriff Express.

One thing that's true about most "fantasy adventurers." They still expect commensurate pay for their activities and their stature. Neither hippogriffs, nor their riders grow on trees. And for a service to exist you need consistent demand to meet their prices.

This means for most folk, casual letters, casualc communication isn't a thing.

Well, maybe you don't have Hippogriff trees in your setting.

Neither did I until 5 seconds ago.


Ventnor wrote:
Drahliana Moonrunner wrote:
Ventnor wrote:

Wait, this is a fantasy world.

Hippogriff Express.

One thing that's true about most "fantasy adventurers." They still expect commensurate pay for their activities and their stature. Neither hippogriffs, nor their riders grow on trees. And for a service to exist you need consistent demand to meet their prices.

This means for most folk, casual letters, casualc communication isn't a thing.

Well, maybe you don't have Hippogriff trees in your setting.

Neither did I until 5 seconds ago.

YOU can go harvest them. :)


Poor people don't send long distance messages.
Common folk often rely on gossip to relay messages.
Common business folk that send messages can usually send it via the merchants they deal with.
Caravans and ships routinely carried mail.
Letters that went between cities usually were being sent to someone well known, so delivery was not usually an issue.

Most messages did not require immediate delivery. Nor was such expected. When it was needed, it cost more.

One notable message system was the Semaphore Line that was available in the late middle ages. It connected two points across vast distance, and could be networked.

With the spell Whispering Wind, it costs 10 gp/mile to send 25 words.
Minor Dream costs 60 gp, limit 20 words, and while it has no range limit, if the recipient is not sleeping, the spell fails.
Sending costs 280 gp for 25 words with reply, no distance limit.
Dream costs 450 gp, no word limit, no range limit, and can wait for the recipient to sleep.

I prefer this one:
Irrisen Mirror Sight costs 150 gp, lasts 1 minute/level, and visual only. Otherwise, it is very flexible, and can be used to contact roaming people. My character has a network with this spell, and use Lip Reading* to hold conversations. You can also prepare written messages to hold in view for reading/copying.

/cevah

*Lip Reading is a language per the linguistics skill. Invest a point and you can read any language you speak.


I only use Andoran Teleport and Telepath, but the Iliadari Dream Network is competitive.


Ahem...

Messaging Escrow Service (M.E.S)

You pay gold to the Service, then you or the Service hires a courier.

Then you continue your adventures...

The service holds the payment in escrow until the courier accomplishes the job and provides evidence to the Service that the message was delivered.

You do not have to wait around to get confirmation the message was delivered from the courier himself, you can adventure, travel, do whatever and check back to the MES anytime you want to see when the escrow payment was made. If payment has not been made, the message has not been delivered yet.

When payment is recorded, THEN you know the message was delivered.


Since all dead people know each other:

The Medium Communication Agency.
We are neither too big nor too small for your needs.
We are just right for you.

Our couriers are rather spirited about delivering your message.

/cevah

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