Rylden |
1 person marked this as FAQ candidate. |
So Ive searched over the forums and it seems pretty split one way or the other on how Boon Companion works with the Pack Lord archetype for Druids. While people make comparisons between Pack Lords, and Beast Masters due to both having multiple animal companions the wording on each is different. The threads were old, so now with months in the difference I was hoping for a new light to be shed on this.
Pack Lord: The pack lord may have more than one animal companion, but she must divide up her effective druid level between her companions to determine the abilities of each companion. For example, a 4th-level pack lord can have one 4th-level companion, two 2nd-level companions, or one 1st-level and one 3rd-level companion.
Boon Companion: The abilities of your animal companion or familiar are calculated as though your class were 4 levels higher, to a maximum effective druid level equal to your character level. If you have more than one animal companion or familiar, choose one to receive this benefit.
Pack Lord states you divide your effective level pertaining to each animal companion so it adds up to your effective level, following the example given in the class description. Boon Companion states it effects the Animal Companion as though your effective level pertaining to it was 4 levels higher. Does this mean a lvl 8 druid, with 2 lvl 4 Animal Companions who has taken this feat twice has two "effective leveled" animal companions that are lvl 8 now?
People could argue adding the feat to one animal at lvl 4, makes one level 4, and one level 2, which exceeds your total druid lvl of 4 with them adding to 6, however the feat reads that the animal companion will match the druid level. If we were to look at it as just numbers, if you divide 4 by 2 you get 2 groups of two, together they total 4, but alone they don't. Applying this feat allows one of the groups to add up to 4 on its own, as the writing states the effective animal level cant exceed your own.
GinoA |
1 person marked this as a favorite. |
Just from reading what you've provided (no further research), a couple things spring out. I'm assuming you're quotes are accurate, word-for-word.
The text of Boon Companion does not have any text allowing you to take it more than once. So you can't take it more than once.
Just to cover it, the feat limits its benefits to a single AC, so no splitting it between your pack.
So, you can take it and apply it to one AC. That AC can never have more levels than your effective Druid level (EDL).
So, that only leaves the question of whether you can have a total number of AC levels that exceeds EDL. I'd say no. The total is capped at EDL.
This is consistent with the existing norm, that the Boon Companion feat is only useful if your EDL < character level. i.e. multi-classing or gaining an EDL from a class that has it lag behind.
fretgod99 |
1 person marked this as a favorite. |
Boon Companion states that your AC's levels are calculated based on your Effective Druid Level (EDL). It also states that the feat does not allow you to exceed your EDL.
Pack Lords use the Effective Druid Level split up between multiple ACs. However, it is still the same EDL - that part never changes.
Boon Companion does nothing for you here. Your total AC levels for a Pack Lord are capped by your EDL, which is (presumably) the same as your Character Level.
So if you are a single-class Pack Lord, level 8, you can have leveled ACs that total up to 8, but no more. This is an order of operations issue. You're trying to apply Boon Companion after you establish your AC's respective levels. You need to apply it before. Pack Lord says you can split up your EDL between ACs, so you have to know your EDL prior to splitting the levels. Boon Companion says it cannot increase your EDL beyond your character level. Thus, you're capped at character level, then you split them up for your ACs.
Paladin of Baha-who? |
The text of Boon Companion does not have any text allowing you to take it more than once. So you can't take it more than once.
Actually it does. link
KainPen |
It is made for multi class characters and single class with less then full effective level to take. Like rangers, and I think animal oracle effective level is at -3 I think Clerics with animal domain, Paladin, ect. because all of them have less then full EDL, am not sure, because I don't have book in front of me and can't look at SRDs at the moment. to verify those actual class have less a normal effective druid level. There is also a feat that will give you an AC and EDL at -3 total character level but limit the animal selection. I took it with my most recent hell knight and took up boon to make up the those 3 levels.
It is not full class druid or classes that get full class effective druid levels.
there are also lots of magic items that have a similar effect. I know there is a set of bracers or gloves that raise the effective level of laying on hands or mercies for the paladin, but I think they are limit to total character level also. but as I said I don't have books to confirm that. I could be wrong on the level limit part. but the idea of those items and feats are to help out multi class characters or character that go into presclasses.
CBDunkerson |
IMO Pack Lords, Huntmasters, and other classes that get multiple companions by splitting their effective druid level should only be able to take Boon Companion once for the 'pack' of companions granted by the class ability. If they have a separate animal companion (or familiar) they could take Boon Companion separately for that, but for the 'pack' Boon Companion should boost the total level of the pack rather than individual members.
Dallium |
IMO Pack Lords, Huntmasters, and other classes that get multiple companions by splitting their effective druid level should only be able to take Boon Companion once for the 'pack' of companions granted by the class ability.
While I agree this is probably the intent, the feat isn't worded that way. You can explicitly take it as many times as you have companions. The question is whether the additional feats have any effect. On one hand, Pack Lord and Huntmaster both talk about splitting your EDL among you ACs. OTOH, Boon Companion says the AC's abilities are "calculated as though your class were 4 levels higher, to a maximum effective druid level equal to your character level." That could really be read either as that specific AC gains an extra four levels of progression up to your CL, or you raise your EDL by 4 (up to CL) for the purposes of ACs. And actually, now that I think about it, the actual language appears to more strongly the support the former interpretation, which again, I don't personally believe is the intended use.
James Risner Owner - D20 Hobbies |
animal companion or familiar are calculated as though your class
What does more class levels limited by your character level do for the pack lord who isn't multi classed?
Nothing
You will get table variance on this issue. Some tables (like mine) will tell you by RAW that you have two feats doing nothing and you have 2x 4th level companions.
Some tables will tell you by RAW you have 2x 8th level companions.