VampByDay |
Okay, so I've never really played a paladin before for any length of time, and I was thinking it was about time I did so, but I don't really want to play ye olde stereotypical Paladin with a great sword and strength and full plate and all that, because I enjoy finding new and interesting ways to build characters.
Then I saw the Starry grace feat and decided to try and work it out.
So paladin with high dex, probably a mithral chain shirt, and maybe celestial armor. Star toss style (if I read it correctly) works in melee, and could eventually lead to me doing a lot of damage.
Thing is I just can't get enough feats for the build to work. I need weapon finesse, focus, starry grace, point blank, (the weapon training feat, martial mastery?) startoss style. . . Just no way to do it with a paladin. I suppose I could go 5 levels of fighter, six levels of paladin. . .
Another option is a daring champion cavalier
Any other options anyone could think of?
BTW: I know someone is going to say: just go swashbuckler! Thing is, I'd really like the ability to smite evil or the equivalent. I already have a swashbuckler in society.
zauriel56 |
Probably gonna need 1 more feat too, precise shot? Technically yours works with straight paladin but comes online at 11...
Let's see for human fighter/paladin
Fighter human
1st: weapon finesse, weapon focus, point-blank shot
Paladin (divine hunter)
2nd: starry grace
3rd: free
5th: martial focus (earliest you can take it)
7th: startoss style
9th: startoss shower
11th: startoss comet
Divine hunter paladin from ultimate combat gets free precise shot at first
So theoretically you can do this with only 1 level of fighter if human or 2 if not human
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VampByDay |
Probably gonna need 1 more feat too, precise shot? Technically yours works with straight paladin but comes online at 11...
Let's see for human fighter/paladin
Fighter human
1st: weapon finesse, weapon focus, point-blank shotPaladin (divine hunter)
2nd: starry grace
3rd: free
5th: martial focus (earliest you can take it)
7th: startoss style
9th: startoss shower
11th: startoss cometDivine hunter paladin from ultimate combat gets free precise shot at first
So theoretically you can do this with only 1 level of fighter if human or 2 if not human
How do I get a feat a second level for starry grace?
Lucy_Valentine |
You want finesse + focus + starry grace ASAP. But it's not like you'll be terrible if it takes a few levels to pick up the Startoss chain.
To get starry grace at 1, you need a human and one bonus feat-equivalent. So Fighter, Daring Champion, Rogue, Swashbuckler, War Priest, Kensai Magus, or Crusader Cleric (of Desna) would do it. Can't think of any others.
But then you've PBS and three Startoss feats. I'm guessing you want those earlier than level nine?
Hmm... suppose you went Unchained Rogue with the swashbuckler archetype for three or four levels? Free Finesse, a martial proficiency you need, free Grace-equivalent, and you can get both of Focus and (any combat feat) as Rogue Talents. If you went human you could go:
1) Finesse training + PBS + Focus
2) Startoss Style (combat trick)
3) Finesse training, Startoss Comet
4) Paladin
5) Paladin, Startoss Shower.
If there's a feat missing, 4) could be rogue again with combat trick again to pick it up.
VampByDay |
@claudekennilol I already thought of that, but I already have a PFS warpriest. Plus the goal was to play a Paladin with the ability to smite evil and overcome any DR.
Theoretical build:
1) Human fighter(sensate)- weapon finesse, weapon focus, starry grace
2) fighter- point blank shot
3) Divine Hunter Paladin (oath of vengeance) (free precice shot)+startoss style
5) Martial Focus
7) Ricochet toss
9) Startoss shower
11) Startoss comet.
It comes online a little late, but at level 7 I get an impressive ability to switch hit, especially if I smite.
Lucy_Valentine |
7) Ricochet toss
Ricochet toss also requires Quick Draw.
If you take five (or more) levels of fighter (and get weapon training), you still need 3 feats for Grace, PBS, Quick Draw, and 3 Startoss. It's just about doable if you go fighter 6 and get no other feats, or fighter 5 paladin X gets you everything by 7.
Alex Mack |
Except for being a paladin :)
Really there is no point in trying to pull this off with paladin if you plan on dipping more than 2 levels up to level 11.
If you wanna do this with Paladin scratch off startoss style (It costs yu 5 feats for +1 to hit and +7 damage) and just go with Oath of Vengance. That ends up netting you more damage.
From an optimization perspective it's decent at best either way.
Or if you want to be a paladin who can do damage at range you can pick the archetype from Occult origins. It gives up a lot but makes you a perfectly viable switch hitter without too much investement.
VampByDay |
Except for being a paladin :)
Really there is no point in trying to pull this off with paladin if you plan on dipping more than 2 levels up to level 11.
If you wanna do this with Paladin scratch off startoss style (It costs yu 5 feats for +1 to hit and +7 damage) and just go with Oath of Vengance. That ends up netting you more damage.
From an optimization perspective it's decent at best either way.
Or if you want to be a paladin who can do damage at range you can pick the archetype from Occult origins. It gives up a lot but makes you a perfectly viable switch hitter without too much investement.
Like I said, I kinda wanted to try a paladin, but I didn't want to be the stereotypical 'platemail, large shield, longsword (or plate and greatsword) guy. If the build doesn't work, it doesn't work, And I accept that. I was just trying to take a character concept and see if I could run with it, make a paladin that people don't see too often.
Alex Mack |
Like I said, I kinda wanted to try a paladin, but I didn't want to be the stereotypical 'platemail, large shield, longsword (or plate and greatsword) guy. If the build doesn't work, it doesn't work, And I accept that. I was just trying to take a character concept and see if I could run with it, make a paladin that people don't see too often.
Mind Sword feels very unpaladin like. Except it's prolly best with a big two handed weapon...
VampByDay |
Had a new Idea last night that night work: Again, it isn't optimal, but it might be solvent.
1) Fighter (weapon finesse, focus, starry grace)
2) Far strike monk (point blank as bonus, quick draw)
3) Divine Hunter paladin (precice shot), startoss style
4) paladin
5) paladin, startoss comet
6) paladin,
7) paladin, startoss shower
8) paladin
9) paladin, free feat (toughness?)
10) paladin
11) paladin, free feat (piranha strike?)
The build makes use of a blinkback belt to get my starknife back. It sucks that I won't have room for a +dex belt (capping my dex at 20 if I start with an 18 and put my 4 and 8 bonuses into it) but at later levels I might be able to afford one of the expensive Ioun stones (the non-stacking ones)