Losing versus Being Denied Your Dex to AC


Rules Questions

Sovereign Court

In the Armor Class Modifiers table, they list "lose any Dexterity bonus to AC" "the defender is denied it's Dexterity bonus to Armor Class" separately. I always presumed that a flat-footed target was denied it's Dexterity bonus to Armor Class.

Why is there that distinction? Does this mean that a Rogue doesn't get a sneak attack against a flat-footed target?


Can you please link the table?

Is this something you found on d20pfsrd? They often add things and editorialize content, so this may be a case of that.

I will try to find what you are talking about on the PRD.

Regardless, there shouldn't be a difference between losing your dex bonus and being denied your dex bonus.

Edit: Found it on the PRD. It's weird. It's the same thing. I don't know why they have two different things.

Except that loses dex is based on something being wrong with the character (e.g. blinded) and denied dex is something bad happening to the character (e.g. pinned).


No difference between "loses" and "is denied"

Furthermore, Flat-footed target are denied dex-to-ac, but not everyone who is denied dex-to-ac is flat-footed.


Flat-footed does several things besides been denied your Dex bonus to AC (i.e. can't make AOOs).
And been Flat-footed is cancelled by Uncanny Dodge, but doesn't stop you losing your Dex bonus to AC to things that don't make you Flat-Footed (i.e. Feint).


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Lost Omens, Rulebook, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

Technically (really, really, REALLY technically), a rogue can't sneak attack a creature that loses its Dex bonus to AC, since the requirements are flanked or denied Dex to AC, which only happens when helpless or pinned.

By this interpretation, flat footed does not allow sneak attacks. Nor does blinded, cowering, or stunned.

For the record, absolutely nobody runs it this way, and the two are treated the same, even by the designers.

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