Interest check → A world of militarized magic (Homebrew Pathfinder campaign)


Recruitment

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In this revised world, powerful magics are highly militarized. Rulers have taken measures to bring any caster who could easily sway the course of a battle under their control or neutralize the threat of magic.

Magehunter paladins and powerful clerics enforce the Light’s holy rule for the good of all in Altiendel, while advanced metalwork and techology drive a capitalist empire of travel and trade in secular, magic-wary Abbhen.


A short campaign of exploration, adventure, and some horror.

Hi there everybody,

I’m new to the forums, but I’ve been getting excited about playing out this setting idea using Pathfinder rules in a PbP game and I’d like to see what you think.

The setting focuses on two kingdoms that have manipulated spellcasters who wield powerful magics (think level 6 spells and above) to either serve the government or be cast out (or worse, it is implied). Knowledge of arcane spells and rituals of prayer is heavily restricted across the two kingdoms by Altiendel’s government, and the people in neighboring Abbhen are distrustful of magic and rely on their metalwork technology.

In this campaign, characters would be interacting with this world of regulated magic through the lens of a mystery and some extraordinary events. This campaign is intended to explore the adventures and experiences of people closer to the bottom of the social hierarchy than the top (i.e. they will not be the most skilled, famous, or revered group/people around).

The first arc would be based largely in Southtown (see cartoonish map). Being so close to the border, the party would likely have representation from both magical Altiendel and industrial Abbhen backgrounds. The world-consistent restriction on spellcasting classes will also force teamwork and party creativity in dealing with obstacles and encounters.

If you’re into world building, some details are below. The first campaign arc wouldn’t dive into this content much, but it is a good summary of common knowledge for the time and place.

Any questions or thoughts would be very welcome!

If there was enough interest to field a party of 3 (2 + 1 already interested) then I’d consider officially recruiting and giving more details for character creation. The first arc would be fairly short, maybe 6 months to play out. (Keep in mind this would be my first time GMing a game using PbP, so you’d probably have to bear with me a bit.)

Character creation:


  • For this game, please no primary spellcasters or paladins. It would be very difficult for these classes to be openly adventuring in this setting. (Low-level primary casters with innate powers we could maybe work with, but primary casters using learned or holy magic are pretty much only working for Altiendel or outcast (or dead). For non-primary casters, if you plan to use learned or holy magic, say as a magus, you’d need to explain how you gained experience with your spells.)

  • The party would start at 3rd level, as competent, trained individuals (treating 1st level as about an apprenticeship in experience).

  • No stat lower than 10 before racial modifiers. This would be a very heavy role-playing based game, so I’d ask for no min/maxing, please. Generally, the simpler and more versatile the build, the better for our purposes.

  • No evil alignment in the party, please. (There will likely already be some tension from characters’ backgrounds and countries of origin).

  • You’d start with 3000 gpc. (I was going to enforce a +10% cost to magical items for the Altiendel magic tax rate, but let’s say that’s absorbed somehow.) Don’t spend more than 25% on any single item, to mimic wealth gradual gains. Note that you’ll be starting in Southtown in winter and venturing up into the mountains. It’s gonn’ be COLD. (You would know the winter climate on the slopes is about Helsinki in February).

  • Beware, all ye who enter here: you will probably meet unfriendly NPCs that are much higher level than you. It would be most unwise to assume encounters are ‘level appropriate’ for you to start swinging swords. On that note, I might advise that having a usual speed less than 30 could be a much more serious disadvantage than you’re used to…

A cartoonish map:

Link to google slides. Let me know if you have any trouble viewing it.

A brief history:

About 300 years ago, the War of Mages raged between the kingdoms of Altiendel and Abbhen. Each country points to the other as the aggressor. Abbhen felt threatened by Altiendel's hoarding of powerful magics and spellcasters in the secretive University founded by the elves. Spurred by advances in metalworking and manufacturing made by the dwarves under the Abbhen mountains, Abbhen built a formidable army with advanced metal swords, armor, guns, cannons, and even ships to complement its own ranks of casters.

Like a match to kindling, the war is said to have begun when a border patrol was mistaken for a raid in the Abbhen mountains. The war lasted five long years -- battles ranged over rivers, throughout the Altien Bay, and in cities and towns largely on Altiendel soil. Many lives were lost.

Near the end of the war, the Abbhen general Halkion, a human who preached that great magics combined with Abbhen technology would prevail, led a large force through the mountain pass at the same time a decoy force attacked the Shining City of Altien in the north. Her forces were met in the pass by a large contingent of the Altienden army led by the charismatic human sorcerer Lyladan. These armies fought on the slopes of the towering mountain Oranis for three days and three nights, when there was a sudden, cataclysmic avalanche. There was a great loss of life on both sides; Lyladan and Halkion were among the buried.

After the disaster on Mount Oranis, the fighting quickly decayed to skirmishes and light raids. Shortly after, the two kingdoms negotiated a cease fire.

Ever since, the kingdom of Abbhen has abandoned Halkion’s teachings and proclaimed itself free of the corruption of magic. Only a few trusted types, such as healing, are widely practiced, and some Abbhen citizens openly abhor magic in all forms. The Abbhens continue to cautiously guard their northern border to this day.

After about 50 years of ceasefire had passed, historians in Altiendel claimed victory. In their view, the hostile raids initiated by their southern neighbors were unsuccessful. Altiendens now tend to dismiss southern technologies as inferior to the Light-blessed gift of magic.

The Kingdom of Altiendel:

Citizens are proud and honored to serve the Altien, God of Light. There is no higher calling than to commit one’s life to service in her name as a cleric or paladin of the Light. Highly skilled wizards and alchemists are also revered as academic scholars. Lesser magics are common, but the secrets of great magics and holy rituals are highly guarded in the University at Novadena and the Great Temple of Altien in the Shining City. Innately talented sorcerers also find praise and prestige by committing their lives to the Light.

Both elves and humans seem to coexist peacefully under their 200-year-old half-human, half-elf lady king, Ellenorah. In addition to their advanced magics, the people of Altiendel are known for their optimism and hospitality, although their military is rather booming for a time of peace and prosperity. Most have heard the ill-kept secret that an elite rank of paladins, the Order of Reclamation, will come to collect anyone who is suspected of performing high magics without authorization. Performing black magic like necromancy at any level is well known to be a swift death sentence.

Cities of Altiendel:

The Shining City of Altien - The capital city of Altiendel is the seat of power for both the high court of the kingdom and the clerics of the Light in their Great Temple. It shines under the sun, moon, and stars with large holy symbols carefully gilded on every building, wall, and street. Roughly half of the residents of Shining City worship Altien regularly at the temple, and most would agree they feel touched by her blessing. A very large portion of Altiendel’s trade comes through the Shining City, so the market on either side of the river is always overflowing and docking a boat on the river near the market costs a handsome sum.

Novadena - The grand University is the jewel of Altiendel, producing wizards and alchemists of the finest quality to serve the Light. These skilled scholars and academics tend to be highly specialized in one particular area or field of study. The hundreds of wizards and alchemists in residence at the University are welcome to offer services of lesser magics to the public for a heavily taxed fee. Novadena itself is a bustling city that benefits greatly from the influx of visitors that gather for this exchange of magical goods and services.

Teresct - The Great Hall of the paladins of the Light sits atop a large hill, where they can observe all of Altiendel from the ocean coast far to the west down to the Abbhen mountains in the south. Although paladins of the Light are often on assignment dutifully guarding the kingdom’s citizens from invaders, rogues, and monsters, the Great Hall is generally bustling with resident paladins and visitors. Folks flock from all over the kingdom to make requests and lodge complaints with these peacekeepers, including pleas for friends and relatives that have been locked away for crimes related to performing unauthorized high magics.

The Free Kingdom of Abbhen:

Citizens of Abbhen are proud of their captains of industry. They see themselves as a nation of innovators and claim to produce the finest metalworks in the world. Their technology makes solutions to problems like long distance travel and safe, affordable housing more accessible, even to those of meager means. It is also widely rumored that Abbhen has devised ingenious devices that would neutralize a magical assault.

Abbhen is home to dwarves and humans. Although the dwarves keep largely to their dwelling under the mountains, their masters of iron and steel do take human apprentices to further the craft. Metal technology is advanced; Abbhen produces guns, cannons, and very recently, large building structures framed with steel and steam engines that transport goods and passengers across the country.

The Abbhenad, the human ruler of Abbhen, incentivizes construction of great works like buildings, bridges, and roads by subsidizing their cost out of the export tax on metalwork goods. He also supports innovation in weaponry by sponsoring a series of annual contests for best sword, armor, gun, long-range cannon, marksmanship, and swordsmanship. All Abbhen citizens may participate to claim handsome prizes.

The Abbhenad entrusts most of the work of governing, policing, and training armies to governors that preside over surrounding territories from each of the major cities. The level of military readiness varies greatly from east to west. There is hardly a presence beyond a city guard in Freeport, whereas the City of Iron staffs a particularly heavy guard at the Abbhen-side mouth of the Abbhen mountain pass.

Many places in Abbhen, magic is distrusted, feared, even despised. Practical, traditional magics, particularly those that assist with industry production, antimagic enchantments, or healing, are used with caution. Some towns treat spellcasters with great disdain, especially near the mountains. Sometimes discovered high-level spellcasters disappear with a unit of guards, never to be seen again.

The Cities of Abbhen:

The City of Iron - The heart of Abbhen’s production of steel and iron, and famous for being built on a natural antimagic zone. Here you’ll find the Builders Guild, where engineers and makers of all manner of technologies gather to sell ideas and services to the highest bidder. The City of Iron is also home to the Abbhen dwarves, who live in a resplendent, vast cave beneath the mountains near the pass. Outside of the cave, the streets and dwellings are largely modest stone and covered in a grimy layer of soot. The governor herself is currently dwarven, and responsible for a shipping initiative that allowed the city’s iron and steel products to reach nearly anywhere in the world via the vast Abbhen river.

Abbhen City - The central Abbhen seat of government, home to the Abbhenad and the Metal Palace. Abben City is also home to the legendary Fighters Guild, where specialists in all manner of traditional weaponry, armor, and tactics gather to train and advertise their services. The Abbhen City wall features enchanted antimagic runes that are maintained by small group of special casters respectfully referred to as the Wardens. There is currently some tension between Abben City and the City of Iron over expensive modifications to Abben City bridges to enable shipping and the first signs of pollution of the Abbhen river from steel production upstream.

Sky City - This relatively young city is growing skyward. Using steel from the City of Iron, more than a third of buildings in Sky City are more than three stories tall. With subsidies from the Abbhenad, this provides cheap housing to thousands of Abbhens, who flock to the city to fill demand for labor in textiles, construction, banking, and trade. Sky City is also home to the quickly growing guild of Gunslingers, who are largely excluded by the more traditional Fighters Guild. Of the industrial cities in Abbhen, the air feels most fresh in Sky City.

Freeport - Freeport is the major center for trade on the southern part of the continent, including Altiendel. This city features a renowned dockyard equipped to repair ships and outfit them with Abben steel. Freeport is home to the Merchants Guild, which has a large amount of influence over the city, and some say the Abbhenad himself. Freeport also has the most tolerant attitude toward magic of all Abbhen cities. If you’re careful and you know where to look, you might find a trustworthy mages’ speak-easy that leads you to a spell you’re looking for.

Regions outside of the kingdoms:

The Freemage Islands - You can find independent wizard, sorcerer, and alchemist guilds scattered among the islands and in the capital, Magehaven. Knowledge of spellcraft is traded more freely here, but with no strong central authority you’re also more likely to run into pirates, bandits, and pickpockets. People speak openly about what they feel is oppression in both kingdoms throughout taverns and coffeehouses, but they are sure to bolt their windows and doors at night. Most establishments hire heavy private security.

Pirate’s Port - A sheltered harbor nested in the base of the Abbhen mountains, lined with steep, sheer cliffs and a small harbor opening. This port is well defended -- nearly impossible to take by force, it has remained independent of both kingdoms since the War of Mages. Pirate’s Port is thought to be home to guilds of mercenaries, thieves, and assassins. Here you can find drinking and brawling at all hours of the night and day. And as with just about anything that could conceivably be sold, you can also find high magic spells here, for a hefty price.

The Black Forest - In this immense, dense, and untamed forest you might find druids, fey, and all manner of creatures rare to see in the kingdoms. The druids do not care for the regulation of magic and much prefer to commune with nature in the forest. They tend to keep the monsters at bay within their woods and seldom venture outside. In return, they are largely left in peace by both governments. Any mage fleeing punishment for illicit magics in the Black Forest is not likely to find aid or kindness from the druids or other forest inhabitants.

North of Altiendel there are warmer climes: swamps, mountains, woods, deserts, great expansive lakes, and idyllic rolling hills where halflings dwell. Most folks refer to halflings, lizardfolk, half-orcs, giants, and other foreign races as from ‘The North’. It is fairly rare to meet to meet foreign races in Altiendel or Abbhen, probably due to the colder climate, but somewhat more likely in Freeport, Pirate’s Port, and the Freemage Islands.

Sailors and traders that dock in Freeport also tell tales of a great world beyond the two kingdoms; other continents full of adventure!


Sounds interesting. I'd be up to join in but wouldn't be able to put a character together until after next week due to family commitments.

PS: You need to open up permissions to let us see the cartoonish maps. :)


Fair enough, I don't think I expect an official recruitment to roll out before then.

D'oh! Should be fixed now, thanks =)


I'm interesd

Mikkel Madsenn wrote:
You’d start with 3000 gpc. Don’t spend more than 25% on any single item, to mimic wealth gradual gains.

So, no magic weapons...


interest


I'm interested.

a couple of questions:

1) What method of stat generation would you prefer?

2) What resource materials are allowed?


Would an alchemist or an investigator be appropriate in this world?

-- david


Dot. Would a Vigilante work?


@All: Hello!

@Philo Pharnyx: Indeed, no magic weapons, but you could buy 1st level wands if you like.

@Fallen_Mage: 1) the usual 20 point buy works well 2) that is a great question - I'm going to have a think on it and get back to you. Certainly all of core.

@Papa-DRB:
An alchemist no (these are also educated in the University)
An investigator yes (not primarily an alchemist so not constrained to within the University/government, but you'd need to explain experience with alchemy outside of the University. Family-run minor potions shop, mentor in the woods, etc.)

@Doomkitten: A vigilante would work well (and would be really fun!) where there's less attention from the guards and things are a bit more wild. Sky City maybe, probably Freeport, definitely Pirate's Port and the Freemage Islands. The first arc will be in Altiendel, where the guards (paladins, clerics, etc) wouldn't take kindly to vigilante justice; a vigilante character wouldn't be able take full advantage of useful talents like renown and recognition, and it might make a strained relationship with any lawful member of the party. I'd avoid for this arc, but say hell yes if we have another arc out west.


Clarification: 20 point buy gets you to first level, then you'd follow the character advancement rules to 3rd.

You could multi-class, if you like.


It's just that the Vigilante has so many opportunities for neat combat styles, as opposed to the standard "roll a d20, roll for damage" each round.


What races are there? Deities? It sounds like a gunslinger would be ok maybe from Abbhen. Assume 2 traits, any drawbacks?

I like the concept, similar to Dragon Age in a sense.


MANY questions! Mostly because I figure that since this is just an interest check you haven't fleshed out restrictions and such. First, I've been dying to play this guy somewhere. I don't know if it's right here, and the class itself is a 3rd party published class, but no harm in asking if you would be okay with it!

This also leads me to my next question. I can play a completely serious dark, epic style character (a la Lord of the Rings movie) or a more light-hearted comedy oriented character (a la Hobbit movie). What are your thoughts on comic relief and/or improvisational problem solving? I have a lot of different characters I could submit for this campaign, and for me crunch is secondary. My love of the characters is all about their backstory, so when I submit it's based on that more than anything else. I was just hoping I could get an idea of how you envision this?

Lastly, do you allow problem solving that is a little more out of the box? I.E. a character who's dice rolls are predominately featured around improvisational stuff (crushing chalk and blowing it at an enemy for a Dirty Trick maneuver, using MANY vials of oil in unusual ways to screw up enemy plans, etc.).


Ooo, shiny. Dot for interest, with a preliminary character as soon as I read through the relevant materials.

Edit: Very interesting. And I will make a character, but I'm going to hold off until the creation rules are finalized.


Personally i have a few ideas ranging from an assassin to a tactician type wants to conquer the world character to a Kungfu scruffy cranky doctor


Pretty interesting to me, I'd be into it! I've had a couple of characters I'd be itching to play, but just out of curiosity, would a kineticist work? Alternatively, I've also been wanting to play a brawler-dragon disciple for a while (focus on martial stuff). How are dragons viewed in society? Probably not well.


Most definite dot for interest!


I'll dot this! Out of curiosity how would lower level caster (hunters, bloodragers, and other class work where the primary ability is magic in origin, but not casting be treated?


Oh wow, lots of good questions! Here are a couple answers (the rest in a bit)

@Doomkitten: what aspects of vigilante combat style are you most interested in? Maybe we can brainstorm ways to incorporate them, or something similar. The first arc would be pretty short, you probably wouldn't get to more than two vigilante talents total before the end of your time in Southtown.

@GM-Gathrix:

  • Races: All core races exist in the world, but only elves, dwarves and humans are native to the two kingdoms. Many city-dwellers may have seen halfling, half-orc, and gnome travelers or immigrants. Featured and uncommon races would be much more exotic and harder to work in.
  • Deities: There is one major deity in Altiendel (Altien, god of Light). Her influence doesn't extend to Abbhen for reasons you'll find out a little more about by the end of the arc (related to the natural antimagic zone the City of Iron is built on). Other deities definitely do exist in the world, and a small percent of residents of the two kingdoms do worship foreign gods. (Although Altiendel would not tolerate open worship of a god that was not known to be good.) I don't have a fleshed out list yet, but I can work on that.
  • Gunslingers are not uncommon in Abbhen, indeed. (There's even a gunslinger guild now in Sky City.)
  • Yes, two traits. Not all of them will mesh with this world, some regional traits and religion traits in particular, so there may be some back-and-forth there. If you're really keen on a campaign trait from a Paizo AP I'd be open to discussing that too. At the moment I'd say no drawbacks, in keeping with the 'simpler is better' theme.


Toyer Pepwinnhans wrote:
MANY questions! Mostly because I figure that since this is just an interest check you haven't fleshed out restrictions and such. First, I've been dying to play this guy somewhere. I don't know if it's right here, and the class itself is a 3rd party published class, but no harm in asking if you would be okay with it!

I do owe a concrete answer in terms of what resource materials are allowed.

Right now I'm leaning toward no third party and nothing unchained.

Toyer Pepwinnhans is awesome (and the party could certainly use luck where they are headed) but I'd want to be able to commit to being familiar with all the relevant rules and I don't think I'd be able to confidently do that with third party materials (or unchained, which I have zero experience with).

Toyer Pepwinnhans wrote:


This also leads me to my next question. I can play a completely serious dark, epic style character (a la Lord of the Rings movie) or a more light-hearted comedy oriented character (a la Hobbit movie). What are your thoughts on comic relief and/or improvisational problem solving? I have a lot of different characters I could submit for this campaign, and for me crunch is secondary. My love of the characters is all about their backstory, so when I submit it's based on that more than anything else. I was just hoping I could get an idea of how you envision this?

Ah yes, I was recently lurking on your untitled campaign recruitment page. It made me laugh =)

I think one of the strengths of great stories is being able to intertwine lightness and humor with tension. (Joss Whedon does it really well.)

This campaign will definitely not be 'only you can save us from the end of times, chosen heroes!' It would certainly be within any party character's right to wonder, 'how the hell did I end up involved in and/or responsible for this shit? I am very sure this should be someone else's job' (not unlike, say, some elements of Firefly).

So, to comic relief and particularly banter, absolutely yes. Slapstick may be a bit out of place when things get creepy, but if you make it work that could be a nice element. We will fear for these characters; it will definitely be possible to make a bad choice where PC death is a consequence. Ideally, I'd like to see them growing strong bonds and working together. (Good backstory is usually quite useful in making hooks for party development.)

Toyer Pepwinnhans wrote:


Lastly, do you allow problem solving that is a little more out of the box? I.E. a character who's dice rolls are predominately featured around improvisational stuff (crushing chalk and blowing it at an enemy for a Dirty Trick maneuver, using MANY vials of oil in unusual ways to screw up enemy plans, etc.).

Creative problem solving is definitely a plus, and I'm a big fan of improvisation. As long as you can afford them and are reasonably within your carrying capacity, you are welcome to carry as much chalk and as many vials of oil (or other tricks) as you would like, and attempt to use them however you like. (Without giving too much away, this strategy may not always be practical in combat, but I can certainly see in coming in handy.)

I should maybe warn supplies could be somewhat hard to come by in a small town near the mountains.


You are only looking for 2 players right?


The only rule from Unchained that I'd lobby hard for is the inclusion of Background Skills.


Mikkel Madsenn wrote:


The stuff you said

Thanks for the answers! I have plenty of options I can throw in, I just am a strong believer in "reading the room" before I make a submission. I hear you on dealing with unfamiliar rules, and honestly, the Luckbringer is really a requirement of that knowledge because of how many abilities screw with the rules. Totally fair to nix him.

I'll parrot a previously asked question (that may have been answered and I missed it), are Occult classes in? Specifically Kineticist? I could have some fun with this guy (also pending race approval).

Cel Runil

Or fun with this one

Mingledash Toecruncher

I swear, I can make legitimate characters too! I just want to see what you're envisioning via characters a bit :D


@Sam C.: That's certainly fair enough. My WAG (wild-ass-guess) for an official recruitment thread with finalized creation rules is about two weeks from now, but you're very welcome to check back here to see how things develop.
(And I see your comment about Background Skills. Okay, I will look into it.)

@Ammon:
There will be a good hook for an assassin being in Southtown and staying with the party (at the start of game you'd have reason to believe there are resources here that could allow you to find anyone, perhaps even track them).
It'd be harder to find a reason for someone ambitious to be adventuring in Southtown instead of making a name for themselves in the military (unless perhaps they are also looking for something or someone).
There is something about 'kungfu scruffy cranky doctor' that I find delightful, and probably not just because I worry a little about the party healing up with no cleric.

@Isthill:
A hydrokineticist would be badass in the snow (granted, you wouldn't spend all your time in the snow). That is a good question... innate powers are much harder to regulate. Usually a well-paid, prestigious career is enough of a carrot (combined with harsh penalties for performing high level spells without authorization) to attract sorcerers to the military in Altiendel, and the same for other innate primary magic users like oracles and kineticists (although they are fewer in number). And there's disincentive to publicly use powers in Abbhen, so we'd need to explain the backstory for a kineticist.
I'll need to think on when kineticist powers equate to roughly 6th level spells (i.e. when you'd be asking for serious trouble using them publicly in either country), but you should be safe at level 3.
A dragon disciple prestige class would be tricky... I'm not sure how you would get to 5 arcana knowledge ranks without taking primary spellcaster classes like sorcerer (if you planned to do it at level 3).


Well I was probably more interested in a kineticist anyway... And a water-based one at that! I could definitely go along with some practicing in secret, and a big lack of experience regarding her abilities, not understanding what's going on with water around her, wanting to figure out more about herself and her affinity for water while wanting to remain unweaponized, or trying to monetize her abilities as a rare commodity, etc. a lot of interesting directions I could go with this! Put me down as definitely interested (though I won't work too much on character until there's a little more detail about the campaign)!


might be a good time to try out a monk or brawler, question though. What is defined as a primary spell caster? a class with 9 levels of casting? Seeing what i have for options, right now the character's focus is with the heal skill cause doctor, but real healing is going to be difficult.

The Kung fu doctor idea can work thematically still but with monk i'm not a Lawful fan so that leaves martial artist, and Brawler i just don't like how it only does beatstick.

It's gonna be some time before i can work out a good idea


@Hawksw0rd:
Lower level casters are still encouraged to join the military in Altiendel. (Picture parents, significant others, teachers pushing you to get "a real job that matches your skills", but instead of a lawyer, doctor, or businessperson it is some magical unit of the military: active duty, or research and development at the University, etc.) Only those relying on restricted access to spell knowledge and/or prayer rituals (i.e. a magus, warpriest) really feel a squeeze to join up. Outside of the military they're respected for their skills, but generally not bothered by the government as long as they stay within the law.

In Abbhen, you'd probably want to avoid showing off your skills if you didn't trust who was with you, particularly in the west (nearer to the mountains). You'd also need to be careful of the antimagic fields in the City of Iron and around Abbhen City. There are special, respected roles for mages, like the Wardens in Abbhen City, as well as healers, and some weapons enchanters. You might get away with a bluff that you belong to this class if you get caught casting and you're a stranger. Attitudes are a little more laid back in the east, where you might find like-minded company at a mage's speak easy in Freeport.

@Monkeygod: I wasn't sure if this would get interest - my minimum to make an official recruitment was 2, but I think we've safely passed this. I think I will take up to 4 players (for a total of 5).


Ammon Knight of Ragathiel wrote:
The Kung fu doctor idea can work thematically still but with monk i'm not a Lawful fan so that leaves martial artist, and Brawler i just don't like how it only does beatstick.

My first thought was Monk as well. I don't suppose doctor + aide/extra hands would be something you would be willing to throw in on?


Toyer Pepwinnhans wrote:


I'll parrot a previously asked question (that may have been answered and I missed it), are Occult classes in? Specifically Kineticist? I could have some fun with this guy (also pending race approval).

Cel Runil

Or fun with this one

Mingledash Toecruncher

Yes, kineticists I think will work well. I did a little mental math after Isthill's question and came to the conclusion that they probably wouldn't be in any danger of pursuit by the Order of Reclamation until something like Level 16 (and if we ever made it there it would be a very different kind of story). So yes, kineticists are in.

I think the only occult class that wouldn't work is psychic.

For Cel, I think the aerokineticist idea would but great. I don't think the sylph race (or any of the featured or uncommon races) would work in this game, in part because the RP system is easy to min/max, whereas I'm hoping to promote some stat balance. And also because it'd be hard to fit a race that would be viewed as completely foreign in this setting (sylph we could maybe get away with in a good disguise aside from the RP issue, but some other featured races definitely not).

Mingledash's crunch looks good, but I think the backstory wouldn't fit. Both kingdoms are well-regulated societies where people would be horrified if someone was crushed, and they'd certainly see justice done (at least if there were witnesses). Even if that's not the case where he came from, he'd probably pick up on that pretty quickly with a 13 int, and then what is keeping him there instead of say, Pirate's Port?

Toyer Pepwinnhans wrote:


I swear, I can make legitimate characters too! I just want to see what you're envisioning via characters a bit :D

I'm going to take the liberty of reading into this question as: what kinds of characters am I likely to choose for the party? Which is a fair question.

I recently participated in a recruitment by GM Niles which recruited players instead of characters and I liked that idea a lot. I think ideally I'd want to put together a group of players invested in telling a great story who would work well together, and they'd roll up a complementary party together as a group.

I'm still not solid on what figures of merit I'd choose to actually do this. Perhaps up to 3 un-fleshed character ideas (race, class, a little backstory or motivation), what your availability/commitment level could be, a short blurb on why you'd like to join the game, and some thoughts on why you'd be a good fit (to borrow heavily from GM Niles). I will keep you posted =)

@All: That being said, I am loving these character ideas and questions, so keep them coming!


@Isthill: I really like that idea, and sounds good!

@Ammon: Yes indeed. Primary spell caster = a class with 9 levels of casting. (I'll post some more specific examples in a bit.) And that's fair enough; If you want to propose an alternative, I'd certainly consider it.

@Me'mori: I think you're asking if I'd consider giving at least one character an extra aid/lay on hands spell per day or so? At the moment I'd lean more toward offering a free wand of cure light wounds to the party for the arc. If it turns out the party is making good choices and still in a lot of trouble healing-wise, then I'll arrange some other relief. Otherwise, it's not a bad storytelling mechanic for there to be extra incentive to not do daft, dangerous things.

Woo! All caught up. Thanks a lot for all the excellent comments and questions all, this is really helpful for finalizing the rules.


For character ideas, I'm leaning towards two that I've shopped around to other recruitments (really want to play these, as they seem interesting).

The first is a kitsune oracle. For this campaign, I think his backstory will be a foreigner in search of something stolen, magical of course, from his people, with evidence pointing to Southtown as a place to start his search.

The other is a tengu ranger who's looking into the disappearance of a party of tengu swordsmiths. Hired by Abbhen for their legendary blade-crafting prowess, the smiths and their guards were returning home at the end of their contract (much to Abbhen's strong objections) but never arrived. Indeed, evidence uncovered by investigators attached to the tengu emissaries who've recently arrived in Abbhen looking for their missing smiths, suggests that the smiths and their guards traveled to the vicinity of Southtown for some inexplicable reason.


Here's a list of those who have explicitly stated or dotted interest (my apologies if I missed any in my scan):

Roster of interest:
Hymenopterix
Philo Pharynx
Ammon Knight of Ragathiel
Fallen_Mage
The Doomkitten
Sam C.
Isthill
Ailill MacMata
Hawksw0rd

I think all being on this list buys you is I'll give you a ping when the official recruitment begins on the order of a couple weeks from now. (And if you'd prefer not, let me know.)

Other expressions of interest, comments, suggestions, and questions are still very welcome.


And finally, to recap...

Definition of 'primary spell caster' for this game is any class with 9 levels of spells.

Restricted classes for this game


  • Primary spell casters (for example: wizards, sorcerers, clerics, oracles, summoners, psychics, druids,..)
  • Paladins (all working for Altiendel)
  • Alchemists (all working for Altiendel)

Races in this setting


  • Allowed: all core races
  • Restricted: featured and uncommon races

Resource materials not in use


  • Third party material
  • Unchained rules (Background skills under review)


@Sam C: Sorry to be late with my recap! Some of this was probably lost in wall-of-text discussions above.

A kitsune oracle is out of both allowed class and race, but a foreigner searching for something would work well.

I really like the ranger idea. Tengu is out of race scope as things stand, but the rest works really well. Right now I have the annual smithing competition down as Abbhen citizens only, but I can easily change that to have them get lost in the bustle if that's more realistically confounding for your ranger.

The one party member already committed is also thinking about a ranger (Hey Thaago). Solid choice however that works out - the party's going to benefit a lot from a ranger.

I really need to get you all the adventure prompt. It is very solid (and Southtown will be a prime location for people looking to find things) but not written up yet. I can work on that.


To play devil's advocate for Sam C, a kitsune can pass for human pretty easily. Oracle is obviously right out.

But onto my other question - what gods exist beyond Altien? It might help if anybody is thinking of playing divine?


@GM: what about skinwalkers? They can pass for humans quite easily :)


It's no class specifically, i was just asking so i could see my options. right now i'm looking at Monk and or Hunter(The feral hunter Archetype). the character while he is a Doctor is also kind of crazy and more of a back alley doctor who happens to be really good at his job


Rats! No Spheres of Power!


(This is Toyer)

Thank you for the answers! I'll probably go ahead and make this one my submission with adjusted crunch when you finalize the rules.


I'm also interested in what the hook might be for the first arc - since you're restricting spellcasters that much, it definitely feels like we won't necessarily be inline with either kingdom's goals, which is where I'm getting the "hide my powers from the government" vibe for my possible hydrokineticist's background. I've also been interested in playing kind of a warmage-y character and it seems like this would be a really fun campaign to play in if we were to get that far (definitely more of a high-level thing, but a character who could ride around on a warhorse throwing balls of death at people would be an endgame fantasy), and kineticist scratches that itch.

Another character concept I was thinking about was a detective sort of character! How are... alternative acts of justice viewed? A private Eye, hard-boiled Noire type of character is something I've been interested in playing for a while (either a Bard, Investigator, or Occultist class, probably). Somebody that wants to solve problems for people who can't go to the town guards, and says "I'll take the case!" a lot.


Morning all,

I see your excellent questions. Here's a heads up that you may not see answers until evening your time (unless you are on the US/Canadian Pacific coast, like I am), or perhaps tomorrow.

But I will answer! Keep them coming =)


I have an inquiry about Abbhen City. Is there any sort of fighting ring/gladiatorial arena scene there?


Howdy! (this is MacMata)
@GM: Are there weapon/equipment restrictions, i.e. no Eastern weapons or no, I don't know, forbidden equipment, etc.?


Out of curiosity, what are the restrictions on summoner? I had a character in mind that could benefit fluff wise from a one to two level dip.


I put together some crunch stuff for a hydrokineticist named Hlynn Coombs. Nothings definite, obviously, and I couldn't find what stat generation you wanted so I just put down 20. Background is being worked over, probably not going to get finished until the recruitment thread comes out, though. PLUS she ended up with about 1000gp extra, without any real magical items she doesn't need much, I just ended up with a bunch of potions. I'm also not sure where half-elves fit in to your universe, so that effects the backstory, too.


Evenin' all.

@Philo Pharynx (@Sam C):
There were two motivations for limiting races to core: one was ease of blending into society and the other was to get a good power balance in the party by enforcing similar effective race points.

It's still much easier for me to say 'only core' rather than 'has to be able to blend in with core races, must have 8-11 RP, and please avoid 3rd party materials'. But I will think on it some more.

As for your other question: there are definitely other deities in the world aside from Altien, and there is a small fraction of citizens in both kingdoms that worship foreign gods. I still owe you all a list of those (on my to-do).

@Archlich: As long as party races are core-only, skinwalkers are a firm no. (Fair question though.)

@Ammon: Crazy back-alley doctor sounds like a lot of fun!

@Anderlorn: No spheres of power for this game, but it looks really nice. In the longer-term future I'd be game to try it.

@Amathelah/Toyer: Sounds good!

(More later!)


Mikkel Madsenn wrote:

Evenin' all.

@Philo Pharynx (@Sam C):
There were two motivations for limiting races to core: one was ease of blending into society and the other was to get a good power balance in the party by enforcing similar effective race points.

It's still much easier for me to say 'only core' rather than 'has to be able to blend in with core races, must have 8-11 RP, and please avoid 3rd party materials'. But I will think on it some more.

A fair enough point, and the only counter I can reasonably offer is that kitsune can appear human from the outset, while tengu can pick up a similar ability early on.


@Isthill:
Great question. I'm going to defer an answer for now; I want to spend some time drafting a response that does some justice to your ideas in this setting.

Hlynn looks wonderful to me (she would be badass on a snowy/icy mountain, and I'm glad to see she packed that cold weather outfit).
Yes, 20 point buy to first level.
Half-elves certainly have a place in Altiendel society (the lady king Ellenorah is herself a half-elf). Her powers would fit in there as well. More on both of these points when we get back to your first question.

@Fallen_Mage:
Nice question! Part of the Abbhenad's annual contest in Abbhen City is a swordfighting competition (in addition to archery and shooting), so they certainly have facilities for spectators to watch fights.

Abbhen City is also home to the Fighter's Guild, so it would be very natural for them to make use of these facilities year-round. Any official bouts in the fighting ring would be well regulated and focused on skill and tactics (think along the lines of hits in fencing or how boxing matches are scored). Definitely not to the death, gladiatorial-style.

@Moors/MacMata: As long as it's Paizo and you can afford it, I say go for it. I can't think of anything I'd want to exclude that you could buy for 750gp. Anything that might seem out of place in style I'm sure we could creatively explain.

@Hawksw0rd:
Summoner is indeed allowed (not a primary caster by the 9th-level-spell-track definition). I see I marked that incorrectly above (apologies!)

I'd agree with your intuition that a summoner may not be as fun to play straight in this campaign as something where you could spread out more in specialties and skills.

This also brings up the slightly more general question: is multi-classing to the restricted classes allowed?

In case anyone is curious, the answer is yes, with two caveats:
1) Paladin and cleric would need explain how/why they left the military. Wizard and alchemist would need to explain how they acquired their knowledge or how/why they left the University.
2) I'm debating between the requirement for multi-classing to restricted classes being you need to have 1 non-restricted class level for every 1 restricted class level (1:1), or you'd need to have 1 non-restricted class level for every 2 restricted class levels (1:2). The latter to me seems a bit more in line with hybrid classes like magus, which are also allowed.
Concrete ruling to come.

All caught up! Thanks for the wonderful questions all, this is great.


@Sam C: Hello! I didn't see your question there.

Tengu is a little bit out of RP scope relative to the core races (at 13 RP), and trusty PSFRD is failing me in terms of listing effective RPs for a subset of the uncommon races (including kitsune). Some of my motivation to exclude comes down to my being disinclined (ahem, too lazy) to calculate it myself for the 8 unlisted uncommon races.


Updated recap! (One correction and a few new FAQs.)

General character creation

  • Definition of 'primary spell caster' for this game is any class with 9 levels of spells
  • 20 point buy to first level, then advance to level 3

Restricted classes for this game

  • Primary spell casters (for example: wizards, sorcerers, clerics, oracles, psychics, druids,..)
  • Paladins (all working for Altiendel)
  • Alchemists (all working for Altiendel)
  • You may multi-class to a restricted class level (the ratio of restricted to unrestricted classes doesn't matter for the 3rd level, but concrete ruling to come soon)

Races for this campaign

  • Allowed: all core races
  • Restricted: featured and uncommon races

Resource materials not in use

  • Third party material
  • Unchained rules (Background skills under review)

Things I'm working on writing up for you

  • Deities in the world
  • Prompt for Southtown adventure (with two hooks!)
  • Better description of the setting day-to-day, to complement to the broad view from above

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