Sentinel's Aligned Strike (Su) question


Rules Questions

Scarab Sages

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From the Sentinel Prestige class:

Quote:

Aligned Strike (Su): The sentinel’s righteous fervor allows him to cut through certain types of damage reduction. At 5th level, the sentinel gains the ability to bypass a specific type of damage reduction when wielding his deity’s favored weapon. The type of damage reduction his weapon bypasses is based on his chosen deity’s alignment. The sentinel chooses this type of damage reduction when he gains this ability and this choice can’t be changed. He can choose only one of the aligned weapon types regardless of how many options he has based on his deity’s alignment. For example, a sentinel of Iomedae can treat his weapon as axiomatic or holy, but not both. The choices are as follows.

Lawful: The sentinel can treat his weapon as axiomatic if his deity is lawful.
Chaotic: The sentinel can treat his weapon as anarchic if his deity is chaotic.
Good: The sentinel can treat his weapon as holy if his deity is good.
Evil: The sentinel can treat his weapon as unholy if his deity is evil.
Neutral: The sentinel can choose one of the four other weapon alignment types if his deity is neutral.

Seems like the description is slightly different from the examples.

Does the Sentinel's weapon gain the Axiomatic/Anarchic/Holy/Unholy weapon property, or do they just count as an alignment for the purposes of DR?

It will be a bit before this comes up for my character, but always nice to plan ahead.


It looks like they gain the property, although its very hard to tell.

Normally things that only bypass the DR/alignment just give the weapon "treated as lawful" (from unchained monk ki strike),
"treated as good-aligned" (from paladin aura of faith)
"Align weapon makes a weapon chaotic, evil, good, or lawful, as you choose." (from the align weapon spell).

There appears to be a fairly clear convention for bypassing alignment dr, and so Aligned Strike is doing something different from just alignment bypass.

Although what the first part describes the ability as does not match the final choices, it seems to be the flavour description of what is happening. The choice list is pretty explicit in what you treat your weapon as, so it appears that your weapon is treated as having one of those properties.

Scarab Sages

Yeah, agree that the weapon certainly bypasses an alignment. That isn't really disputable within the text.

But, it's a pretty big difference between that and being able to also deal 2d6 additional damage to those of the opposing alignment.

I guess the main question, is should I save up for Axiomatic/Anarchic/Holy/Unholy property on my weapon, or will this ability make such a choice redundant?
It's a very useful property, but as a +2 magic item cost, it's a spendy upgrade if you'll be getting it for free later.


I think the RAI is that you only overcome DR, given that everything is phrased that way. But then they drop the RAW that you treat your weapon as that feature, and don't restrict it to DR only. And given how overpowered the Evangelist class is compared to other prestige classes, maybe it was even intended.


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The person who wrote it probably forgot that axiomatic etc give you that +2d6, frankly. But they put "axiomatic" there, and the editor didn't take it out, so you get axiomatic, regardless of the earlier general description. Don't save up.


It would be an underpowered ability, considering when you get it, if it only allowed you to bypass alignment-based DR. Getting the additional damage is just about right.

Scarab Sages

Fuzzy-Wuzzy wrote:
The person who wrote it probably forgot that axiomatic etc give you that +2d6, frankly. But they put "axiomatic" there, and the editor didn't take it out, so you get axiomatic, regardless of the earlier general description. Don't save up.

A fair point that it wasn't edited out when they added other fixes to the class for PFS.

Paladin of Baha-who? wrote:
It would be an underpowered ability, considering when you get it, if it only allowed you to bypass alignment-based DR. Getting the additional damage is just about right.

In my opinion, most of the prestige classes are a bit underpowered when compared to just added a level of a new class.

But, regarding this prestige class, it costs almost nothing for a fighter (3 ranks religion and 1 general feat). The fighter should already have the other requirements and all the abilities seamlessly fit with existing fighter abilities.

I will note the class also gains this (below) at the same level:

Quote:


Stalwart (Su): At 5th level, the sentinel gains mental fortitude through his constant meditation and adherence to religious tenets. He gains a +2 sacred or profane bonus on saving throws to resist divine spells.

As well as the normal fighter skill points, hit die, +1 BAB, +1 will, +1 reflex, and +1 fortitude.


Bumping this question for some FAQ love.


DM Livgin wrote:
Bumping this question for some FAQ love.

Me too


Is there really no love for this question?
:-(


1 person marked this as a favorite.

Wow, they screwed that one up when they let it hit production. Oh well, mistakes happen.

A "good aligned" weapon bypasses DR/good. A "holy" weapon has the holy property, with all the awesomeness that brings. They may or may not have meant the former, but all precedent points to the latter.


The way I read it you "treat your weapon as holy" for the purposes of overcoming damage reduction. Your weapon isn't actually a holy weapon, it just bypasses the same DR that a holy weapon does (DR: good).
As far as I can tell there's nothing in the description that says you get the ability, just that you treat it as that for the purposes of overcoming DR. This is almost certainly RAI, and if you read the grammar the same way I do the RAI and RAW match up.
Having said all that, it's really not worded as clearly as it could be, so I understand if people read it differently.

TLDR: It only overcomes DR, and - although not clearly written - that is actually what it says.


Excellent, two post with opposing interpretations :-)

At least one thing is clear, the original wording is not.


Which option makes the game better, if we ignore RAI and RAW and house rule it for your own game? I'm concerned that having a holy weapon for free is ahead of the power curve. But I also lose my entire prestige class if I don't plant a tree every day (In my game group not being able to complete a deific obedience is something that does happen rarely).


Eh, I wouldn't call it ahead of the power curve. It requires five levels in an otherwise lackluster prestige class. Powerwise, it'd be further ahead of the curve for LG/CE-types to just go (anti-)paladin and get (un-)holy and other stuff on demand a few times a day along with all the other phenomenal cosmic powers those classes get. But you're right in that keeping to the DR-only interpretation is more in line with the general power level of prestige classes--kinda "meh".


On the flip side, the level 7 practiced combatant ability does nothing. (Doesn't stack with Symbolic Weapon.)

Go paladin and get sucked into code of conduct arguments? I'd rather play a prestige class with editing mistakes.


DM Livgin wrote:
On the flip side, the level 7 practiced combatant ability does nothing. (Doesn't stack with Symbolic Weapon.)

Hahahaha. Whoops.

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