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Mind thrust spells on incorporeal creatures.


Rules Questions


So I was recently playing a psychic and I fought a ghost. I had the will of the dead feature which allows mind affecting affects able to affect undead. But once that happens what kind of damage does mind thrust do? Is it force damage so it doesn't get halted or does it get halved? This question of for any incorporeal creature how much and what kind of damage would it do?

RPG Superstar 2014 Top 32

Mind Thrust does "untyped" damage, so the Ghost would take half damage, and receive a will save to cut that in half again.


Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

Should be in rules forum. Grumpus is correct.


Does Mind Thrust have to be taken again as a 2cd lvl spell or just cast as a 2cd lvl spell automatically known from first lvl? If so, does it count as a known 2cd lvl spell?

Silver Crusade

Adventure Path Charter Subscriber; Pathfinder Campaign Setting, Companion, Modules, Roleplaying Game, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber; Pathfinder Comics Subscriber

*Thread necromancy has been cast*

The moment you gain higher level spell slots, you automatically have the higher level version as known (and count as spell known), but at the same time 'forget' the lower level version (and also don't count it anymore as spell known).

In addition you can cast the lower level version using the appropriate spell slot, if you know any higher level version.

RPG Superstar 2014 Top 32

Franz Lunzer wrote:

*Thread necromancy has been cast*

The moment you gain higher level spell slots, you automatically have the higher level version as known (and count as spell known), but at the same time 'forget' the lower level version (and also don't count it anymore as spell known).

In addition you can cast the lower level version using the appropriate spell slot, if you know any higher level version.

I don't think that is quite right. The way I understand it, you have to select Mind Thrust II as a 2nd level spell known, but this will immediately 'free-up' a 1st level spell known in place of Mind Thrust I.

The rules on undercasting on the PRD states: Whenever a spontaneous spellcaster adds a spell to his list of spells known that can be undercast, he can immediately learn a spell in place of each lower-level version of that spell he knows. In essence, he loses each earlier version and can replace it with another spell of the same level that is on his spell list.


Grumpus wrote:
Franz Lunzer wrote:

*Thread necromancy has been cast*

The moment you gain higher level spell slots, you automatically have the higher level version as known (and count as spell known), but at the same time 'forget' the lower level version (and also don't count it anymore as spell known).

In addition you can cast the lower level version using the appropriate spell slot, if you know any higher level version.

I don't think that is quite right. The way I understand it, you have to select Mind Thrust II as a 2nd level spell known, but this will immediately 'free-up' a 1st level spell known in place of Mind Thrust I.

The rules on undercasting on the PRD states: Whenever a spontaneous spellcaster adds a spell to his list of spells known that can be undercast, he can immediately learn a spell in place of each lower-level version of that spell he knows. In essence, he loses each earlier version and can replace it with another spell of the same level that is on his spell list.

You are correct. Under Frank Lunzer's description you would be forced to take the higher level version, but that isn't correct.

Silver Crusade

Adventure Path Charter Subscriber; Pathfinder Campaign Setting, Companion, Modules, Roleplaying Game, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber; Pathfinder Comics Subscriber
Gisher wrote:
Grumpus wrote:
Franz Lunzer wrote:

*Thread necromancy has been cast*

The moment you gain higher level spell slots, you automatically have the higher level version as known (and count as spell known), but at the same time 'forget' the lower level version (and also don't count it anymore as spell known).

In addition you can cast the lower level version using the appropriate spell slot, if you know any higher level version.

I don't think that is quite right. The way I understand it, you have to select Mind Thrust II as a 2nd level spell known, but this will immediately 'free-up' a 1st level spell known in place of Mind Thrust I.

The rules on undercasting on the PRD states: Whenever a spontaneous spellcaster adds a spell to his list of spells known that can be undercast, he can immediately learn a spell in place of each lower-level version of that spell he knows. In essence, he loses each earlier version and can replace it with another spell of the same level that is on his spell list.

You are correct. Under Frank Lunzer's description you would be forced to take the higher level version, but that isn't correct.

Huh... right. Hmm... I do remember reading that paragraph, but in a slightly different form.

Silver Crusade

You read the psychic bloodline for the sorcerer, probably. ;)

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