So what is this new warlock?


Product Discussion

51 to 69 of 69 << first < prev | 1 | 2 | next > last >>
Liberty's Edge

1 person marked this as a favorite.
KarlBob wrote:
swoosh wrote:
DPR also goes up quite a bit if you can use Sense Vitals, but no one can agree on whether or not that spell works for Warlocks, so ETV.

ETV?

Exposure Time Variance?
Emergency Towing Vessel?
Environmental Technology Verification?

I'm guessing it's 'Expect Table Variation'. I've seen the phrase used before, though not, I think, the abbreviation.


Pathfinder Rulebook Subscriber

Expect Table Variance or Variation. Yes.

Basically it's up in the air right now whether or not Mystic Bolts are compatible with spells like Haste or Sense Vitals and whether or not your GM allows them can have a big impact on the damage a warlock can dish out.

Scarab Sages

Thanks. The phrase fits, but i'd never seen it abbreviated, either.


Deadmanwalking wrote:
You could also grab Weapon Finesse and just switch hit with bolts alone. You get one less attack in melee, but that's all you give up, and not that big a deal by the time you're grabbing ITWF. That keeps them all touch attacks, as well.

Very true. That may even work out better in the long run, although I am partial to the extra damage a + x conductive rapier could bring. But pure touch attacks are tempting...

Scarab Sages

Squiggit wrote:

Expect Table Variance or Variation. Yes.

Basically it's up in the air right now whether or not Mystic Bolts are compatible with spells like Haste or Sense Vitals and whether or not your GM allows them can have a big impact on the damage a warlock can dish out.

Haste absolutely works. The only question on Sense Vitals is that it requires a "manufactured" weapon, so the bolts may not qualify.


Does a warlock not manufacture their mystic bolt? I think to produce and manufacture are synonymous right?


Pathfinder Rulebook Subscriber
Imbicatus wrote:


Haste absolutely works. The only question on Sense Vitals is that it requires a "manufactured" weapon, so the bolts may not qualify.

Well, haste says "natural or manufactured weapon", so I figure it's in a similar boat.

Trogdar wrote:
Does a warlock not manufacture their mystic bolt? I think to produce and manufacture are synonymous right?

That's an argument I see a lot, that you quite literally do manufacture them, so they should count.

Some people don't like that though and there's no RAW one way or the other.


I've been playing with a build, and I'm very happy with a VMC magus build who carries multiple throwing daggers, only one of which needs to be magic. A simple Conductive weapon clinches the build.


30 foot range for life?


Pathfinder Rulebook Subscriber

http://paizo.com/paizo/faq/v5748nruor1h8#v5748eaic9uko FAQ on Mystic bolts. They aren't manufactured.

So no haste, sense vitals, etc.

Liberty's Edge

1 person marked this as a favorite.

That drops my previous estimates to 'only' 70 damage. 140 on something without all four Resistances.

Still enough to kill a marlith in 4 rounds.


1 person marked this as a favorite.
Pathfinder Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

Something possibly worth noting for when an enemy has a lot of resistances...truefrost elixir. Not necessarily something you would want to use all the time, but if you did run into someone who was stopping your damage cold (ho ho ho) via immunities or resistances, it might be worth considering having a few on hand. Wish alternate versions existed for all four main energy types, though...well, canonically. A DM might allow alternate versions to be created, after all.

Scarab Sages

1 person marked this as FAQ candidate. 1 person marked this as a favorite.
Squiggit wrote:

FAQ on Mystic bolts. They aren't manufactured.

So no haste, sense vitals, etc.

Haste works, as you substitute a mystic bolts attack in place of a weapon attack granted by haste. Sense vitals is a solid no though.


2 people marked this as a favorite.
Haste wrote:
When making a full attack action, a hasted creature may make one extra attack with one natural or manufactured weapon.

That kills an extra attack from Haste w/ Mystic Bolts.

Scarab Sages

2 people marked this as a favorite.
Zabraxis wrote:
Haste wrote:
When making a full attack action, a hasted creature may make one extra attack with one natural or manufactured weapon.
That kills an extra attack from Haste w/ Mystic Bolts.

No, it doesn't.

Warlock wrote:
Attacking with a mystic bolt takes the place of one of the warlock’s normal attacks, and she can make a full attack using mystic bolts.

Since you can make a normal attack with haste, a mystic bolt can be substituted for it.


Haste is not a normal attack it is an additional attack granted by the spell with specific limitations on the weapon used, limitations that Mystic Bolts do not meet.

Scarab Sages

Haste gives an extra attack with a natural or manufactured weapon as part of a full attack action. Warlock has a specific exception that allows a mystic bolt to replace a manufactured weapon attack during a full attack. The specific rule for mystic bolts overrules the general rule of haste.


Pathfinder Rulebook Subscriber

Mystic Bolt doesn't say "replace a manufactured weapon attack" it says "takes the place of one of the warlock's normal attacks and she can make a full attack using mystic bolts". But when you make a full attack using mystic bolts you aren't making a full attack with a natural or manufactured weapon, so it's not illegible.

I agree that's probably not the intent though.


This isn't a case of specific trumps general it's specific vs specific.

Haste grants a conditional extra attack while Mystic Bolts grants an exception for normal attacks. The additional attack from Haste is not a normal attack it is an extra attack made as part of a full attack action.

There's obviously enough disagreement on this that the FAQ needs a FAQ.

51 to 69 of 69 << first < prev | 1 | 2 | next > last >>
Community / Forums / Pathfinder / Pathfinder First Edition / Paizo Products / Product Discussion / So what is this new warlock? All Messageboards

Want to post a reply? Sign in.
Recent threads in Product Discussion