Double Character


Homebrew and House Rules


I have been working on a character that has the secondary character sealed within it. They were supposed to switch when I fail a save. This lets me have two separate characters with different classes. My DM already gave me the go ahead but I don't know If I can balance this out. What are some ways I can make this work. Or should I just give it up?


I guess the big thing to consider is if you can fulfill the same role while making the characters different enough. This will be easier if you have a group of five and the vital stuff is already covered. For more details, we will need to know more about the game and your party.


Wacky.

Questions:

1) Are your two PCs two people sharing one body, or two distinct people who get swapped in and out of place?

2) How did this come about, and are they trying to change this state of affairs?

3) Are they capable of communicating? The swap sounds disorienting. If a swap happens mid-combat, will the new PC have any idea what's going on?

4) What happens if one of them dies?


Tinalles wrote:

Wacky.

Questions:

1) Are your two PCs two people sharing one body, or two distinct people who get swapped in and out of place?

2) How did this come about, and are they trying to change this state of affairs?

3) Are they capable of communicating? The swap sounds disorienting. If a swap happens mid-combat, will the new PC have any idea what's going on?

4) What happens if one of them dies?

1) They share a body

2) The monk was sealed within the first PC and the seal weakened. This makes them swap in and out against their will

3) The Bard cannot communicate with the monk but not vise versa

4) They share a body so they both die

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vigilante might work out well when the book gets released.


Nohwear wrote:
I guess the big thing to consider is if you can fulfill the same role while making the characters different enough. This will be easier if you have a group of five and the vital stuff is already covered. For more details, we will need to know more about the game and your party.

Well there are 5 others in my group. Rogue, cleric, druids, monk, and ranger. It is a new campaign and the characters are polar opposites. The normal one would be a chaotic neutral bard while the personality would be a lawful evil monk.


Cyrad wrote:
vigilante might work out well when the book gets released.

Could explain please, I'm not entirely sure what you mean.


Vigilante is a new class in the upcoming book Ultimate Intrigue, which is built around having two identities. Think Bruce Wayne/Batman, Don Domingo/Zorro, Usagi Tsukino/Sailor Moon -- any of those types of characters that have a normal identity and a secret identity. I don't think that's quite what you're going for.

So ... monk and bard, huh? Wow. Those are pretty dissimilar from one another.

I assume that since they share a single body, they also share ability scores, but have different feats/skills. What are your ability scores?


Tinalles wrote:

Vigilante is a new class in the upcoming book Ultimate Intrigue, which is built around having two identities. Think Bruce Wayne/Batman, Don Domingo/Zorro, Usagi Tsukino/Sailor Moon -- any of those types of characters that have a normal identity and a secret identity. I don't think that's quite what you're going for.

So ... monk and bard, huh? Wow. Those are pretty dissimilar from one another.

I assume that since they share a single body, they also share ability scores, but have different feats/skills. What are your ability scores?

Bard-

STR-10
DEX-11
CON-13
INT-19
WIS-13
CHA-18

Monk-
STR-13
DEX-19
CON-13
INT-11
WIS-18
CHA-10

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I once allowed a player to have a double character, but I required that they play the same class and ability scores. The fact you get totally different builds is pretty crazy!


Cyrad wrote:
I once allowed a player to have a double character, but I required that they play the same class and ability scores. The fact you get totally different builds is pretty crazy!

Yea this seems pretty cheesy, probably gonna give up scrap the character.

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If your GM allows it, then by all means.

Though, it might be more interesting if both personalities had the same ability scores but different classes/builds. Alternatively, they could have the same class/build, but different ability scores. I think some kind of limiting connection would not only make the concept feel less cheesy, but also make the concept more interesting. Otherwise, it feels like you're just swapping out completely different characters.


Cyrad wrote:

If your GM allows it, then by all means.

Though, it might be more interesting if both personalities had the same ability scores but different classes/builds. Alternatively, they could have the same class/build, but different ability scores. I think some kind of limiting connection would not only make the concept feel less cheesy, but also make the concept more interesting. Otherwise, it feels like you're just swapping out completely different characters.

How would they interact if I chose a same class/build?


Reminds me of a villain I ran in a long, long ago 2e game where the kindly NG old village apothecary would blank out and a CE necromancer would take over. It took the players a long time to figure it out, and then they had the quandary of what to do--kill the old man to stop the necromancer or let him live and let the townsfolk deal with the consequences.


alchemist has an archetype that allows you to have a dual alignment character. drink the mutagen boost your second personality while freeing it at the same time. really look at the archetypes or prestige class.i don't know how gesulting works can't find the info any where.

the prestige class for the alchemist is Master Chymist


the master chymist is also the key to a hulk build i have seen floating around.


Honestly... I'm not sure what your DM is thinking here. I agree with most that ability scores should be more or less the same, however... only physical scores. I could see mental scores being different for two people in the same body, as they are actually two different people.

(Let a player do this with a multiple personally character but he switched at random based on something else.)


I am actually playing a character like this right now. He is a Monk. He actually has a split personality that was brought on due to an injury. He has the same ability score in both personalities because switching personalities shouldn't magically change how your body works (I actually sold his Int to a 7 for the flavour of the character too as his injury kind of knocked some screws loose as it were).

As such I am having his Ki Powers and Monk bonus feats be the same in each personality but each of them have different feat chains to show their different fighting styles.

One is a brawler type monk, just attacking with his unarmed strikes while the other is a grapple character.

The thing I had trigger his switches is just a 20% chance upon being hit with any sort of physical damage, or force spells. Our game doesn't run called shots so I figured a 20% chance of being hit hard enough to trigger a switch was pretty good and my DM was cool with that.

We just got to level 6 too and I got a sweet ability because of this character. As long as I spend 8 hours meditating each week the personalities are beginning to come together and understand each other because of an NPC we met and now I can switch personalities as a standard action for 4 Ki points and taking damage can no longer cause him to switch.

The character has been super fun to play and I get the added bonus of freaking out NPCs now that I can switch personalities.


Watch the anime "Birdy the Mighty" for a good 2 personalities sharing one body. Could also search for other similar live-action/anime for inspiration.


Xelaaredn wrote:

Honestly... I'm not sure what your DM is thinking here. I agree with most that ability scores should be more or less the same, however... only physical scores. I could see mental scores being different for two people in the same body, as they are actually two different people.

(Let a player do this with a multiple personally character but he switched at random based on something else.)

an alchemist can answer that problem their mutagens change the players mental and physical stats. and it would only take seven lvls to get the master chymist prestige class. more if your wanting to dual class so your alternate personality can have a class of its own. until then you can roleplay the slow division of your character personality. once you get the prestige keep playing a normal alchemist until your get hit and or a Fortitude for the first time with a will save of 25 to keep your normal form. Upon changing for the first time your new personalty / body can insult your character for his in capability to do any thing right. and going back to the hulk references "PUNY WEAK BANNER!!!!! HULK IS STRONGEST!!!!!" you get a different body, personality, and alignment, with the master chymist.

or watch the hulk.


zainale wrote:

an alchemist can answer that problem their mutagens change the players mental and physical stats. and it would only take seven lvls to get the master chymist prestige class. more if your wanting to dual class so your alternate personality can have a class of its own. until then you can roleplay the slow division of your character personality. once you get the prestige keep playing a normal alchemist until your get hit and or a Fortitude for the first time with a will save of 25 to keep your normal form. Upon changing for the first time your new personalty / body can insult your character for his in capability to do any thing right. and going back to the hulk references "PUNY WEAK BANNER!!!!! HULK IS STRONGEST!!!!!" you get a different body, personality, and alignment, with the master chymist.

or watch the hulk.

Except that's not what OP is trying to do. He already got the go ahead to have two separate characters. All I'm adding to the table on "suggestions on how to do this" is have that one body have static physical stats rather than dynamic, seeing as the body is not physically changing in any way.


I've heard of it done before in a group where two players took turns being the DM. They said it was two distinct personalities in the same body. One a druid the other a barbarian. I suppose it would be fine unless there is a loophole that allows you to "game" the system. As long as you don't usually know when the change will occur then give it a try.


It seems weird that they share the same body, but have different physical ability scores. Mental scores, I could see being different, but the physical abilities being different doesn't really "mesh" with the concept of sharing a body; unless it's some kind of transmutation magic going on that actually "morphs" you into a different form with the switch. There are rules under mental afflictions regarding multiple personality disorder, but that only seems to partially address the motif you're going for. One possibility is to take a page out of the Synthesist Summoner's book, except swap the physical/mental priorities. Whereas the Synthesist keeps his mental scores and uses the physical scores of the fused Eidolon, you might keep your physical scores and use the mental scores of the "fused" Monk personality, along with his class abilities, feats, skills, etc.


i was giving a means to the how. you all are debating why the OP is being allowed to play this character. sounds like he is making a master chymist. don't give it up! don't listen to the negative Nancies.

here check out the link to the master chymist. give it a look.

http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/prestige-classes/other-paizo/i-m/master-chy mist

also check out the alchemists mutagen ability. it will change your stats there are also discoveries that will change your stats even more.


astralscorpion wrote:
I have been working on a character that has the secondary character sealed within it. They were supposed to switch when I fail a save. This lets me have two separate characters with different classes. My DM already gave me the go ahead but I don't know If I can balance this out. What are some ways I can make this work. Or should I just give it up?

You're getting two character sheets for the price of one. There's no balancing it.


zainale wrote:

i was giving a means to the how. you all are debating why the OP is being allowed to play this character. sounds like he is making a master chymist. don't give it up! don't listen to the negative Nancies.

here check out the link to the master chymist. give it a look.

http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/prestige-classes/other-paizo/i-m/master-chy mist

also check out the alchemists mutagen ability. it will change your stats there are also discoveries that will change your stats even more.

No, we are discussing the way to attempt to "balance" this character. He has already decided on what to play as, and yet for some reason you keep trying to shove a prestige class down his throat as a way to (using the system rules) make a character that can kind of do what he wants.

Obviously this is houserule area, he's already been told he can make two characters in one body with two different classes and sheets. So again, you aren't helping by suggesting he waste levels to become a master chemist and then waste more levels by taking master chemist.

He doesn't need to be some weird amalgamation of bard/monk/alchemist/master chemist when his DM is already on board with the idea...


I don't think you should have two completely different ability scores unless the body itself is switching when they switch.

Run it kind of like possession, where the body's physical scores stay the same but the mental scores change depending on which mind is in control.


just play two different characters then.

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