Honestly the best AT Ive ever seen was a rogue wizard who went full blaster caster to really make use of sneaky spells atleast 3 lvls unchained rogue for dex to hit/damage (pick up a scimitar or something similar)
"Arcane Trickster Who is mostly a Wizard"
Unchained Rogue 1/Wizard 3/Arcane Trickster 9
UnRogue: For Sneak Attack, bonus Weapon Finesse, the ability to use Sneak Attack on targets with concealment. Rogue Archetype of your choice.
Wizard: Conjuration(Teleportation), Divination(foresight) or Evocation(Admixture) specialist.
Use Accomplished Sneak Attacker to qualify.
Benefit: 6th level spells, Invisible Thief ability (much better than Vanish).
Tactics: touch attack spell + quickened touch attack spell, sneak attack on both.
1 level vivisectionist alchemist, then wizard. Take the feat to get the 2nd dice of sneak attack. Arcane trickster that is almost a full wizard and gets sneak damage - and you can keep taking that feat (Accomplished Sneak Attacker) to keep getting more dice.
A Magus ninja, which also has the ability to create his own sneak attacks withotu flank (thanks to Vanish) can deal damage three times per turn.
1. Weapon hit - can do decent damage, especially of taking a keen rapier, a crit threat range of 6 is nice! + sneak die
2. a stored spell - true, not every turn, but when you do, that, its 5d6(shocking grasp) + sneak die
3. Combat casting, unlimited Acid Splash is 1d3 + sneak (YES, i'll need to throw concentration for every spell in order to not get AoO, but at 13th level my DC for Acid Splash is 15, while my die will be at least 1d20+9+7, so i can skip the toss)
At your level, Vanishing Trick is just invisibility, not greater invisibility. You'll be visible after the first attack. And you won't have many uses per day.
Also note that while you can make a concentration check to cast acid splash defensively, the ranged attack to hit still provokes an AoO. You'd need the close range arcana to avoid that which may or may not work with acid splash (as it is not technically a "ray"), but you can fix that by using ray of frost.
I prefer snakebite striker 1/Wiz 3/AT. Gives you a couple extra hp but more importantly a point of bab over the rogue/ninja/vivi which you'll be hurting for.
If you want a melee Arcane Trickster sort of class, I personally recommend Eldritch Scoundrel Unchained Rogue from Arcane Anthologies. Just make sure you keep up Sense Vitals and your Sneak Attack damage will be strong.
Despite being an Unchained Rogue, you can use Ninja Tricks with Ki costs with spell slots, allowing you to keep your Vanishing Trick tactic.
regarding vanishing trick, i can easily get 7 times per day, (2 from Necklace of Ki Serenity, 2 from Extra Ki feat, 1 from ninja levels and at least 2 from Charisma), if not more. and the point is exactly that, invis so i can get sneak damage added without flanking (Even though we have 2 melee attackers in our party)
That should work but it does seem like a lot of investment for a few d6 worth of damage a few times per day. And that's only IF you hit in the first place. Being an AT screws your BAB pretty badly.
Im not sure what you are referring to, AFAIK there is no close ranged attack in what i described:
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3. Spell Combat - using my offhand to cast "Acid Splash" defensively, DC is 15, min throw is 16 (see above), therefor no need to toss die.please explain?
Acid Splash is a ranged attack. You need to roll an attack to hit. All ranged attacks provoke attacks of oportunity. Casting defensively makes the casting not provoke, but the attack still provokes. See this FAQ for details.
Also, as I said, you'll become visible after the first attack. So your acid splash will only deal 1d3 damage which is basically nothing at level 13.
when a wizard normally casts a spell that is a "ranged" attack, (not touch) he only suffers 1 attack of opportunity, not two, right?
If it's a spell that works at range but does not require an attack roll, this is correct.
But with acid splash - which DOES require an attack roll - he provokes twice. See the FAQ that I linked in my last post. It reads:
"Ranged Touch Attack Spells and AOOs: When you cast a spell that allows you to make a ranged touch attack (such as scorching ray), and an enemy is within reach, do you provoke two attacks of opportunity?
Yes, you provoke two attacks of opportunity: one for casting the spell and one for making a ranged attack, since these are two separate events."
If you must roll to hit someone at range (as with acid splash) than it's a ranged attack. Ranged attacks provoke, no matter if it's a bow, a spell or something else. And no, it doesn't matter if the target is right next to you. It's still a ranged attack.
so you can't consider the magus' spell BOTH a ranged attack AND a spell, that would mean he should gets TWO AoO.
But that's exactly what they are. They are TWO different actions. It's that way for all touch spells, ranged or melee. Casting the spell basically charges your hand with its energy, and then you need another (usually free) action to actually use that energy. If that free action is a ranged attack, it provokes, just like any other ranged attack in the game.
ALSO - note that the texts especially mentions casting defensibly and concentration, this would not be mentioned if you could not avoid taking an AoO, it would be a moot point.
No, it's not moot. You CAN make a concentration check to avoid provoking while casting the spell defensively.
However you CAN'T make a concentration check to avoid the AoO for using a ranged attack.Spell combat is just not meant to be used with ranged touch attacks, not without risk, anyway. Use a melee touch or any other spell and you won't provoke if you succeed at the concentration check. Or get the close range arcana to turn those ranged touch spells into melee touch spells.
2nd, your point for the invisibility does make sense now that i think about it. i should have thought of that, it DOES make the 2nd spell useless. Unless of course i can obtain Flank.
Well, going into flanking position would still be a good use for invisibility and allow you to sneak more often. :)
For the record, Accomplished Sneak Attacker can only be taken once.
I don't have the book it's from (Dirty Tricks Toolbox), so I was going from the description on d20pfsrd & Archives of Nethys.
While it does not state it can be taken multiple times, it also doesn't say it can't - unless there is additional information in the book?
The default is not always set in stone, and I'd ask my GM how he/she wants to run it.
I personally would only take it once, to qualify for AT, since I'd mainly play such a character as mainly a wizard and take wizardy feats.
This matter is unimportant for this thread, since it sounds like the OP should simply play a magus...
However, an Arcane Trickster would be excellent in Way of the Wicked. I'm playing in this AP at the moment and we have only one PC who is good at sneaky things and an AT would be very useful.
Curious, How is everyone going Arcane Trickster with only one level of Rogue, Ninja or vivisectionist?
Isnt the requirement for the class 2d6 Sneak Attack damage?
While it does not state it can be taken multiple times, it also doesn't say it can't - unless there is additional information in the book?
In the feats chapter of the core rules it states that no feats can be taken multiple times unless they explicitly say they can.
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Curious, How is everyone going Arcane Trickster with only one level of Rogue, Ninja or vivisectionist?
Isnt the requirement for the class 2d6 Sneak Attack damage?
The feat "Accomplished Sneak Attacker" raises your sneak attack by 1d6. So one level of a sneak-attack-granting class and this feat qualifies that part of the requirement.
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While it does not state it can be taken multiple times, it also doesn't say it can't - unless there is additional information in the book?In the feats chapter of the core rules it states that no feats can be taken multiple times unless they explicitly say they can.
This.
Feats can only be taken once unless they specify otherwise.
While it does not state it can be taken multiple times, it also doesn't say it can't - unless there is additional information in the book?In the feats chapter of the core rules it states that no feats can be taken multiple times unless they explicitly say they can.This.
Feats can only be taken once unless they specify otherwise.
Thank you. However, as I wrote in my previous post, these general rules can be over ruled by the GM and, if this were important to my character concept, I'd ask since it has a built in limit and (in my opinion) wouldn’t be unbalancing.
If this were the rules forum I wouldn't be suggesting it.
Design Manager
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Has anyone mentioned the Trickster base class from Kobold Press? It basically lets you play an arcane trickster type character from 1-20 without multiclassing and is excellently written and balanced.