Witch rules discussion. Cackle / white witch / and more!

[penguinrage]

Backstory: 4 friends and myself are going to be progressing through pathfinder society all starting off as different flavors of witch.

Rules question 1: is cackle a burst effect that increases the duration of all hexes (fortune , evil eye **not slumber** ect) in range? Or is it the hex is keyed to the witch who cast it and only his cackle will work on it.

Rules question 2: can you use a five foot step (free action), shoot bow (standard action), cackle (move action)? Wording can go either way.

Rules question 3: misfortune hex and ill omen spell if they stack how do the dice fall?

General question 1: besides stacking int, is there any way make slumber hex harder to resist?

Thank you guys a head of time for your response and time wasted :)

[thejeff]

1)

Cackle wrote:

Any creature that is within 30 feet that is under the effects of an agony hex, charm hex, evil eye hex, fortune hex, or misfortune hex caused by the witch has the duration of that hex extended by 1 round.

I'd say that's pretty clear that cackle works on that witch's hexes.

2) Don't see why this wouldn't work. You can take a 5' step if you don't perform any other kind of movement. Cackle is a move action, but not movement, so you can step.

3) I don't know of an official ruling on this, but I'd rule that they do stack, making them take the least of 3 rolls for any rolls affected by both. Expect table variation in PFS.

1) Not as far as I know, other than the various debuffs the witch already has: Evil Eye, Misfortune, etc.

[Covert Operator]

g1: Ability Focus is a feat for +2 DC. I'm not sure it's legal for PFS since you can find it in Bestiary 1

[Fruian Thistlefoot]

rq1: Your Cackle works on your Hexes

rq2: Yes

Rq3: Why would you do this anyways? If one hits don't waste the other.

Gq1: Ability Focus...But it is NOT PFS legal.
Going Elf with the Alternate Racial DreamSpeaker
Using the Trait: Honeyed Words
The Item Corset of Dire Witchcraft (Dunno if PFS legal or not)

Boosting INT is the best method tho because it increases many other things: More skills, More spells, Spell DC.

[thejeff]

Rq3: It's often unclear to me why you'd want to use Misfortune or Ill Omen on most things - at least to reduce saves. They need to fail a save for them to work, so if the Misfortune/Ill Omen works, the Slumber would have to.

Obviously somethings Slumber won't work on, but still...

[BadBird]

Going Witch/ Eldritch Knight with the Strength Patron can make a pretty interesting 'battle witch' - you just use Hexes for utility purposes and focus on Divine Favor combat and spell use. Going dex-based Fencing Grace works great, and even a strength-based Witch using Artful Dodge to go Two-Weapon sword-and-shield with intelligence instead of dexterity can work out well. Divine Favor, Barkskin and Heroism is a pretty heady buffing package, and Dual Talent Human can easily start out 17/17 on stats.

thejeff wrote:

Rq3: It's often unclear to me why you'd want to use Misfortune or Ill Omen on most things - at least to reduce saves. They need to fail a save for them to work, so if the Misfortune/Ill Omen works, the Slumber would have to.

Ill Omen is no-save. It's also available as a level 4 Quickened spell...

[penguinrage]

Thank you guys.

[Derklord]

Fruian Thistlefoot wrote:

Gq1: Ability Focus...But it is NOT PFS legal.

Going Elf with the Alternate Racial DreamSpeaker
Using the Trait: Honeyed Words
The Item Corset of Dire Witchcraft (Dunno if PFS legal or not)

Boosting INT is the best method tho because it increases many other things: More skills, More spells, Spell DC.

The Mediator trait does the same as Honeyed Words without the dwarf-part.

Hexing Runes can add another +1, as does the Amplified Hex feat.

Of course, the biggest boost is being pre-change Scarred Witch Doctor.
Witch19/Alchemist1, 20 Starting Con, +5 from level increases, +5 from Manual of Bodily Health, +8 from Heart of the Mammoth, +6 from VMC: Barbarian's Greater Rage, +2 from Raging Vitality, +8 from Form of the Dragon III, and +4 from Mutagen equals a CON mod of +24. Add Ability Focus, Corset, Hexing Runes, Mediator, and Amplified Hex for a total Slumber DC of 51. Don't forget Rod of Abrupt Hexes in combination with Accursed Hex for a second try in the same turn (or a swift action Evil Eye beforehand for a -4 to the target's saving throw)!

[penguinrage]

I didn't even see amplified hex. Could that work with cackle?

[thejeff]

penguinrage wrote:

I didn't even see amplified hex. Could that work with cackle?

I'd say no. Cackle doesn't have a save. Nor does it really have a duration or a range. It extends durations and has a radius.

Though using it to extend the original duration of something Cackle worked on would give you a grace period to get Cackle going.

Remember that durations end at the start of your round, so if you want to extend Misfortune or a saved against Evil Eye, you need to Cackle the same round you apply the hex.

[Derklord]

Crackle does not have a range, the 30 ft are the area of effect. Thusly, you can't expand it with any means as far as I know. Not Rod of Grasping Hexes, not Barrow Haze...

[Harleequin]

I was in a game where a guy was playing a witch and he had this infinite duration cackle thing going on !?!?

[Fruian Thistlefoot]

Harleequin wrote:

I was in a game where a guy was playing a witch and he had this infinite duration cackle thing going on !?!?

They probably were abusing RaW interpretation that you can put fortune on someone and just keep cackling all day long. It is possible but very abusive way at looking at the rules.

I highly suggest not trying this. Some GMs will plain hate you while others will use it against you. Because your cackling and making all that noise you pull more rooms of the dungeon, you alert them to your presence. But I do not see how a GM will look kindly on this interpretation and use of the ability.

[Tormsskull]

Derklord wrote:

Crackle does not have a range...

No, but if you also take the Snap and Pop hexes, the combination is positively delicious.

[thejeff]

Fruian Thistlefoot wrote:

Harleequin wrote:

I was in a game where a guy was playing a witch and he had this infinite duration cackle thing going on !?!?

They probably were abusing RaW interpretation that you can put fortune on someone and just keep cackling all day long. It is possible but very abusive way at looking at the rules.

I highly suggest not trying this. Some GMs will plain hate you while others will use it against you. Because your cackling and making all that noise you pull more rooms of the dungeon, you alert them to your presence. But I do not see how a GM will look kindly on this interpretation and use of the ability.

A FAQ has clarified that you can only Cackle once per round to cut down on this abuse. You can no longer build up hours of Cackle extended fortune before entering the dungeon.